LEL GPS File(s)

[tkatzir]

The published gps files consists of several tracks.
I was wondering whether anyone already processed it in any way.

Personally, I like to have both track and a (routable) route.
Before I do it from scratch, I'd like to know whether someone already started it.

I haven't studied the files too deeply yet.
They range in size from 252 to 500 points, but I'm sure not all points are needed.
Hopefully reduce the number of files, so there will be one thing less to faff about in each control.


Then, I guess, there'll be need to add all the POIs from all the threads (controls, garages, cafes, pubs, last-water-for-X-miles(!), top-of-Yad-Moss, etc.)

Edit:
Link to instructions.
The files will be updated every few days as new data becomes available.

Tal.

[Jan]

I expect to start looking at the files during the weekend - if nobody beats me to it and publishes routes and tracks, that is    

I agree:  Autoroutable routes as well as tracks wouild be nice - but that is no problem as routes easily can be converted into tracks and vice-versa.

Usually I make a route / track for each leg in the brevet - this way I make sure, that I don't bypass a control without noticing 

I'm not sure how many waterhole-POIs I'll have time to pinpoint, so any help in this area would be appreciated.

/Jan

[Greenbank]

For those with an ancient GPS (basic eTrex) I'll be doing a series of sparse GPX routes with one routepoint per routesheet instruction named with a simplified version of the instruction (i.e. "01 L", "02 R", "03 SO", "04 E3").

One route per stage, so 18 routes (the old Garmins can take 20 routes).

Note that these will probably not work as routeable routes in modern GPS devices, nor will there be tracks, and I can't guarantee they'll be completely error free

I'll probably start work on them next weekend and post them somewhere here when I'm done.

[tkatzir]

I've created a Garmin map from OSM that covers the whole LEL route, and some Km from either side, for those who like to "explore surrounding areas", or those that 1405Km in 116H40m isn't enough for them...
I included London as well, for the tourists who'd like to sightsee before/after LEL.

There are 2 files:
1) gmapsupp.img to be installed on the Garmin
2) tiles files, to be installed in MapSource.

Each is about 50Mb.
I do not have online space to upload it to, so if anyone is willing to donate theirs - I'll be happy to upload, with installation instructions.

If you have Andy's maps - you might not need these files.

Tal.

[HenkV]

I plan to import the available files as garmin crs via gpsies.com. That way I have some height info available when riding.

How do you all foresee to charge as the organisation does not provide outlet points?

[Greenbank]

Each is about 50Mb.
I do not have online space to upload it to, so if anyone is willing to donate theirs - I'll be happy to upload, with installation instructions.

Tal, I will forward upload instructions tomorrow (if I remember, if I don't please remind me!).

I have easily enough storage space available (20GB quote and I'm using under 1GB of it) and, more importantly, unmetered bandwidth.

[tkatzir]

Each is about 50Mb.
I do not have online space to upload it to, so if anyone is willing to donate theirs - I'll be happy to upload, with installation instructions.

Tal, I will forward upload instructions tomorrow (if I remember, if I don't please remind me!).

I have easily enough storage space available (20GB quote and I'm using under 1GB of it) and, more importantly, unmetered bandwidth.

Thanks!

Checking today, the generated map produces errors when trying to create a route between the start and finish (just a test, don't worry!)

<Geek Code>
I used Mkgmap Splitter, which apparently breaks cross-tile-routing.
I will try to use Osmosis, which, hopefully, keeps cross-tile-routing capabilities.
</Geek Code>

Nevertheless, I will upload what I have, so people could play with it, and comment.
e.g. "please widen the area around the route a bit near point X", or "can narrow that bit there", etc.

One more thing to note: I'm not using andygates' Munky style, but the default one.
This saves space, and makes the maps draw faster.


Leg1 can be covered with less than 20 waypoints, which means that there's hope for only 2 routes (North/South) to cover the whole LEL.


The tracks are the same except for Leg4, which means that one can make do with only 10 tracks on the GPS.

Tal.

[tkatzir]

Checking today, the generated map produces errors when trying to create a route between the start and finish (just a test, don't worry!)

The Good News: I got the whole route (and at least 5km from each side - Don't go off course for too far!) in one tile, so one routable route with 2 points (start, finish) can cover the whole LEL, with the caveats below.

The Bad News: Some roads are missing in OSM.
e.g. in legs 8/11, road B709 between Langholm (intersection of A7 and B7068) and Eskdalemuir (intersection with B723)

There are some roads in Langholm, but there's no name node for it.

I'm not sure if this is the best thread to put this, but I hope someone could map this area a little.
If not, maybe it could be sketch by hand, with "note=unwayed, from yahoo" tag?

This is the most notable missing data.
I guess other data might be missing as well, like place names, intersecting roads, etc.


File size is about 20Mb.

Tal.

[tkatzir]

Some roads are missing in OSM.

I added all the missing roads.
Some roads (existing and new) are missing ref.

And some of the places (villages, hamlets?) are missing names as well.

Tal.

[Jan]

I have now made the routes for my Garmin GPS.  I have done it by tracing the gpx-files found for download on the LEL-website and checking these against the Route Sheet.

I have found a couple of discrepancies – some of which might be caused by me misreading the Route Sheet.

 In Ashwell – after 48,2 km and the same place going back – the gpx-file calls for a left turn some 2 or 300 meters before that of the Route Sheet.

 Going back from Washingborough the gpx-file traces the outbound route whereas the Route Sheet calls for some 500 meters of backtracking  the homeward bound route before taking a left turn.
 
 In Yafforth (?) after 442 km the Route Sheet calls for a shortcut through East Lane and Dolly Lane whereas the gpx-file leads you straight forward to a more sharp left turn.

 Approaching Stillington after 398 km the gpx-file takes a shortcut compared to the Route Sheet.  I can’t make the km-table fit no matter what way I trace the route, but coming back it is clear that you should go into Stillington and not bypass it. This could cause some confusion going North.


The First three differences will probably not cause any trouble but the last might because of the wrong distances listed on the Route Sheet.

I might, however, be completely mistaken – something, that is not unknown to me – in which case I excuse the trouble I might cause.

I tried to post pics here of the four different places, but that seems to something way above my abilities...

I have the Garmin routes ready for loading onto a suitable Garmin device - if you would like them, PM me with your email adress and I'll mail it to you.

/Jan

[simonp]

For those with an ancient GPS (basic eTrex) I'll be doing a series of sparse GPX routes with one routepoint per routesheet instruction named with a simplified version of the instruction (i.e. "01 L", "02 R", "03 SO", "04 E3").

One route per stage, so 18 routes (the old Garmins can take 20 routes).

Note that these will probably not work as routeable routes in modern GPS devices, nor will there be tracks, and I can't guarantee they'll be completely error free

I'll probably start work on them next weekend and post them somewhere here when I'm done.

You don't need an ancient GPS to want to work that way.  Mine is modern enough to auto route and I prefer that kind of route.

If you want, we could split the work up.

[Greenbank]

If you want, we could split the work up.

Nah, as witnessed on the MSG it's better for me if I do it all as I'll have more of an idea where to go on the road. Similar things happened on the Dun Run as I used someone elses route with minimal replotting.

Sorry Tal, haven't had a chance to setup the account today but definitely have time tomorrow. Will PM you the details.

[Manotea]

Presumeably Greenbank will need to create separate north and south routes for each leg for his steam powered gps. I'll be making up some routes to overlay the supplied tracks for my Vista/Metroguide combo. My style is simply to add waypoints on the intermediate villages along the way and let the GPS take care of the details. This means the routes can simply be reversed as required (except for the stage which has an extra control on the way north) but I won't get round tuit until the week before the off.

[Greenbank]

Yes, mainly because addled brain needs the L and R transposing and sometimes junctions don't need to be marked going one way, but will do another, or look slightly different. Exit numbers of roundabouts also become tricky.

I was using my single Dun Run route in reverse for the way back this weekend. Happily reading L for R and vice versa until I got to the "LiR" instruction for "Left immediately Right" which, when going the other way, is still "Left immediately Right" (if they'd been separate instructions they'd have been in the reverse order).

[frankly frankie]

I honestly wouldn't recommend using somebody else's Route unless you're incredibly lazy.  Much better to fettle your own.

Using the Track as a basis for route planning is another matter.  The downloadable tracks are derived directly from the Google maps, so should be exactly the same as what you see on the maps.

? In Ashwell – after 48,2 km and the same place going back – the gpx-file calls for a left turn some 2 or 300 meters before that of the Route Sheet.

Fairly insignificant error on the Track.  Either will work, and less than 100m difference in distance.

? Going back from Washingborough the gpx-file traces the outbound route whereas the Route Sheet calls for some 500 meters of backtracking  the homeward bound route before taking a left turn.

Ditto.  This time its a minor error on the routesheet.  The GPS track is probably the better option here, but no big deal either way.

? In Yafforth (?) after 442 km the Route Sheet calls for a shortcut through East Lane and Dolly Lane whereas the gpx-file leads you straight forward to a more sharp left turn.

Ditto, insignificant error on the Track.

? Approaching Stillington after 398 km the gpx-file takes a shortcut compared to the Route Sheet.  I can’t make the km-table fit no matter what way I trace the route, but coming back it is clear that you should go into Stillington and not bypass it. This could cause some confusion going North.

Yes the Track does take a short cut compared with the route here.  I don't see any problem with either option, in either direction, unless you really want to visit Stillington (village shop maybe?)

There may also be the occasional 1-way-system oddity on the return half which the Track (which has only been traced northwards) doesn't recognise on the way back.

[tkatzir]

My style is simply to add waypoints on the intermediate villages along the way and let the GPS take care of the details.

I do a similar thing.
I have the track that goes the exact way,
and a route with the minimum number of waypoints that is still enough for the GPS to follow the track.

The printed route, with all the various SO:X (TL) will be close by should the need arise...


Since I saw the route on an OSM map already, I know that there aren't many places to go wrong.
I mean - I guess that on the road there are MANY places to "explore", but OSM data doesn't have them all.

I might add waypoints where the route turns away from a road that keeps going straight.

I honestly wouldn't recommend using somebody else's Route

+1

I would be happy if we could share the POIs, or have some database of them all, as suggested in my original post.

Tal.

[frankly frankie]

All I know is:

51.70308,-0.02227, "Lea Valley"  ** nearest mapped road
52.15208,-0.19074, "Gamlingay"
52.73999,-0.37975, "Thurlby"
53.22339,-0.46562, "Washingborough"  ** not guaranteed correct
53.28716,-0.30317, "Wragby"
53.61336,-0.95165, "Thorne"
54.18869,-1.18035, "Coxwold"   ** not guaranteed correct
54.44911,-1.65306, "Middleton Tyas"
54.78606,-2.42708, "Alston"
55.28288,-3.18864, "Eskdalemuir"   ** not guaranteed correct
55.60112,-3.06386, "Traquair"  ** approximate location only
55.89231,-3.07347, "Dalkeith"  ** approximate location only

** Its amazingly difficult to get precise locations out of the organisers and controllers - they tend to take the view that "there will be signs up when you get there".

[yello]

You guys are freaking me.  I was just going to load the routes from the web links to my Edge and push play come the day. But I now think I'll just use it to record and use the route sheet for directions!

[frankly frankie]

Pinpointing a control location usually starts with a conversation that goes something like
"Where is this control?"
"Take the 3rd exit at the roundabout and its along there on the right."
"Have you got an address?"
"Yes, its in the High Street."
"Grid reference?"
"[no reply]"

The 'definite' locations are ones that can then be readily identified from an aerial survey (usually Google Maps) because they are the only building of sufficient size to be usable as a control, in that vicinity.

'Approximate' locations are where its hard to tell which of 2 or more buildings might be the one. 
Dalkeith Rugby clubhouse for example - I can clearly identify the pitch and the goalposts but I don't see any building nearby that looks much like a clubhouse.  Of course, if I'd ridden a previous LEL, I'd know where the clubhouse is - and there must be loads of people who do know exactly where it is - but no-one seems to be able to articulate this beyond the "3rd exit and its just past the van hire place" sort of level, which is fine on the road if you are a cyclist or a travelling rugby team, but not so useful when planning and mapping. _{(And yes I have visited the rugby club website)}

[Greenbank]

My favourite is something like:

"3rd exit of the roundabout and it's on the left hand side. If you see a bright yellow house on the right then you've gone about half a mile too far."

[tkatzir]

I got the whole route (and at least 5km from each side - Don't go off course for too far!) in one tile, so one routable route with 2 points (start, finish) can cover the whole LEL.

Thanks to Greenbank, I've uploaded the the MapSource files, and a preliminary gpx file.
I've created a page with instructions and all, here.

I'll edit the OP, so the link is easier to find.

Please comment here or in pm.
It would be great if you could update OSM with any missing data.
I'll update the MapSource files every few days.

Tal.

[Cyclops]

The location for Dalkeith rugby club is 55.891398,-3.075487

[frankly frankie]

Thanks, I can update a couple of things with that info.

[tkatzir]

Thanks, I can update a couple of things with that info.

There are many road names missing, compared to the route sheet.
Maybe we could divide the work among us, and each one would go over the route sheet, and update the OSM data with missing road names.

Tal.

[tkatzir]

Thanks to Greenbank, I've uploaded the the MapSource files, and a preliminary gpx file.
I've created a page with instructions and all, here.

I've just uploaded an updated version of the Garmin map.
I've added some data in OSM, and fixed some unconnected roads.

OSM is still missing road names (compared to the route sheet.)


I've also uploaded an updated version of the gpx file, with some waypoints.
I've used direct-routing, to save disk space.
You'll need to right-click on the route in MapSource, and select "recalculate"

On the Garmin device it should happen when you select follow-road.

Tal.