Author Topic: How to break a Rohloff - contains profanities (Read 3384 times)

Wowbagger · « **on:** April 16, 2012, 02:03:27 PM »

Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck!

It's sprocket removal time and I have the bits and sprocket removal tool, I've done the job before but not for about 10000 miles. Last time I put it in a vice at the LBS but this time I invested in a Park Very Long Chain Whip (arrived this morning), I watched the videos and got on with it. Then there was a crunch. The sprocket hadn't shifted but the removal tool had broken the corners off its seating.

I've spoken to the man at SJS. He reckons I hadn't done the QR skewer up tight enough and he's probably right. I've got to send the wheel back to Thorn's and he reckons he can fix it for me. It all Really Pisses Me Off.

Fuck.

andrewc · « **Reply #1 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:08:01 PM »

Oh dear! I've never done this on my Rohloff and was thinking about getting the bits together to do it.

Chris S · « **Reply #2 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:09:44 PM »

Ouch. What a PITA.

You know, there have been several times when I have been crashing and scrunching my way through the gears on the tandem, that fboab and I have pondered on the positives of the Gears-in-a-can concept. Over time, you seem to have single-handedly populated the "Cons" column of our pros/cons list.

Hope you get it fixed quickly.

delthebike · « **Reply #3 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:10:33 PM »

Doh!
It doesn't look too expensive! Did SJS say what needs to be done?

andrewc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLnR_QgpvhY may be some help. Contains relaxing music too.

Wowbagger · « **Reply #4 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:21:06 PM »

I watched that.

Polar Bear · « **Reply #5 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:27:53 PM »

I have to admit that Wowbagger's Rohloff exploits have successfully kept me in the derailleur camp.

Wowbagger · « **Reply #6 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:30:20 PM »

Quote from: delthebike on April 16, 2012, 02:10:33 PM

Doh!
It doesn't look too expensive! Did SJS say what needs to be done?

andrewc: may be some help. Contains relaxing music too.

I spoke to a chap called Dave who seemed familiar with the problem and said he had all the parts available to fix it.

delthebike · « **Reply #7 on:** April 16, 2012, 02:56:05 PM »

Quote from: Wowbagger on April 16, 2012, 02:21:06 PM

I watched that.

Nice, relaxing, music isn't it?

Oh look! Unicorns.

Paul Metcalfe · « **Reply #8 on:** April 19, 2012, 05:33:59 PM »

Quote from: Wowbagger on April 16, 2012, 02:30:20 PM

Quote from: delthebike on April 16, 2012, 02:10:33 PM
Doh!
It doesn't look too expensive! Did SJS say what needs to be done?

andrewc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLnR_QgpvhY may be some help. Contains relaxing music too.

I spoke to a chap called Dave who seemed familiar with the problem and said he had all the parts available to fix it.

Now THAT'S a chain whip.

rogerzilla · « **Reply #9 on:** April 19, 2012, 05:36:47 PM »

It's unnecessarily long. The optimum length for a chainwhip is the size of the wheel, plus a bit of space to grip the handle. Any longer, and you're limited by the torque you can apply to the wheel rim instead.

Kim · « **Reply #10 on:** April 19, 2012, 05:42:49 PM »

Surely that's only true if you're removing a screw-on freewheel? If you're using a lockring tool as in the video, the wheel is just the fulcrum and the chainwhip and spanner are the levers and can be of any length...

Wowbagger · « **Reply #11 on:** April 19, 2012, 05:49:45 PM »

The wheel just gets in the way when trying to remove the Rohloff sprocket. I was seriously considering buying a 24" adjustable wrench.

Chris S · « **Reply #12 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:01:51 PM »

Isn't it like getting a fixed sprocket off - i.e, really hard? Say goodbye to your knuckle skin

Jurek · « **Reply #13 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:04:01 PM »

Quote from: rogerzilla on April 19, 2012, 05:36:47 PM

It's unnecessarily long. The optimum length for a chainwhip is the size of the wheel, plus a bit of space to grip the handle. Any longer, and you're limited by the torque you can apply to the wheel rim instead.

Indeed, I struggled using both arms, two knees and a brick wall, to resist the torque delivered by Nicknack's mighty tool.

Kim · « **Reply #14 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:08:25 PM »

I wrote off a 20" BSO wheel trying to get the freewheel off using the bench vice method. By the time four spokes had snapped and it showed no sign of budging, I decided I probably ought to buy a real bike...

Jurek · « **Reply #15 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:13:39 PM »

Quote from: Kim on April 19, 2012, 06:08:25 PM

I wrote off a 20" BSO wheel trying to get the freewheel off using the bench vice method. By the time four spokes had snapped and it showed no sign of budging, I decided I probably ought to buy a real bike...

Remind me to never put myself in a position where I might be at risk of being on the receiving end of a half-nelson from you.

Wowbagger · « **Reply #16 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:19:20 PM »

When I did the job before, as I say, I went to the LBS and put it in their vice. As it was something they had never previously been involved in they were quite interested and didn't seem to mind when, on my success, all the Rohloff oil spilled out all over their work bench and floor.

I don't have a work bench in my Seekrit Bunker but I'm contemplating investing in a "Workmate" type device for the future. I think I'd need to line the wood with metal plates in order to achieve the necessary force though.

rogerzilla · « **Reply #17 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:22:45 PM »

Quote from: Kim on April 19, 2012, 05:42:49 PM

Surely that's only true if you're removing a screw-on freewheel? If you're using a lockring tool as in the video, the wheel is just the fulcrum and the chainwhip and spanner are the levers and can be of any length...

Agreed - if you're using two tools in opposite directions, then you're only limited by the length of the shortest tool. I only normally use a chainwhip to remove fixie sprockets.

I once tried to remove a Shimano BB by putting it in a Workmate and putting the Workmate against the garage wall to stop it rotating. I reckon I got 500Nm of torque on it before the tool stripped its splines

loadsabikes · « **Reply #18 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:26:13 PM »

Wow, don,t get a workmate, they are made of cheese.
If you have not got the room for a permanent bench ( and I am quite happy to build you a small unit ) get a set of Supajaws made by Triton
I use a set when welding on the barges.

Jurek · « **Reply #19 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:34:52 PM »

Quote from: Wowbagger on April 19, 2012, 06:19:20 PM

I don't have a work bench in my Seekrit Bunker but I'm contemplating investing in a "Workmate" type device for the future. I think I'd need to line the wood with metal plates in order to achieve the necessary force though.

Hmmmm...... Workmates are good if you're on the move and need a (sort of) stable surface / job gripping feature. I'm pretty sure (having tried my Workmate for similar tasks) it'd not be up for the task we're talking about here.
You'd be better off acquiring a s/h metal filing cabinet, or similar, (a proper one, as opposed to one which originated from IKEA) bolting a decent sized vice to the top, and filling the drawers with bricks / railway ballast / or bags of sand from the Thames Estuary.
My current workbench (since 1992) consists of a kitchen worktop spanning a brace of metal plan chests, the drawers of which are almost entirely filled with tools.
It feels like it is bolted to the core of the earth.
Sometimes I worry a little about my floor joists......

EDIT: Crosspost of sorts with loadsabikes.....

loadsabikes · « **Reply #20 on:** April 19, 2012, 06:51:35 PM »

google triton tools

Jurek · « **Reply #21 on:** April 19, 2012, 07:13:06 PM »

Quote from: loadsabikes on April 19, 2012, 06:51:35 PM

google triton tools

Nice.

Canardly · « **Reply #22 on:** April 19, 2012, 08:37:33 PM »

Loadsa does your repertoire know no bounds.....barges.....

Must admit I quite fancy something along the lines of this..

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cwb1205p-5-drawer-workbench?da=1&TC=SRC-workbench

loadsabikes · « **Reply #23 on:** April 19, 2012, 09:50:33 PM »

Thats not bad value. Stick a decent engineers vice on that and you could handle most jobs bicycle.
Bespoke steel benches are my speciality

Most off the peg benches are just not heavy enough.

arvid · « **Reply #24 on:** April 20, 2012, 06:37:26 AM »

Hm, I have done this quite often as I have run through some (obviously) low quality chains. I also don't have a workbench.
My chain whip is nothing special (10 quid at LBS or smth). I do however have invested in a very nice 32?mm wrench that is indeed about half as long as the diameter of the wheel. I put my weight(and that's not much) on both ends and that usually does the job pretty well. I could record that next time, I will have to get the sprocket off to turn it around in the next few weeks anyway.