Trikes and Mondeos (joining the dark side)

[drossall]

OK, so I have been offered an (upright) trike and I have always fancied one. The TA site talks about putting it in the boot with the wheels off - must be a bigger boot than any I have ever had, but has anyone tried a Mondeo saloon with the seats down? Looks as though it should fit, tape measure says yes, but the seller sounded worried and I'm going to look soooo stupid if it doesn't and I have to do an extra round trip of hundreds of miles.

I do have roof bars, but I'd have to scrounge round the club for three upright bike carriers, and it just seems easier to take the machine to bits.

Photos of trikes being carried would be beyond the call of duty.

And while I'm at it, I read somewhere that you use a crank extractor to get the wheels off. Is that true or is it just a matter of unbolting them? The seller will know all this of course but there is no harm in going prepared...

[tatanab]

It should be no problem, I've had two in a smaller vehicle.

Will it go in on its side?  Benefit is not taking wheels off.

Otherwise, taking wheels off depends on the axle.  A modern Longstaff has recessed bolts, like on a cotterless chainset, so you need something to remove the end caps (allen key or big screwdriver depending on type - if any fitted), then a box spanner to undo the bolt.  You should then be able to tap the wheel with your hand and it should slide off.  It may take a bit more than a tap.  Older frames like Ken Rogers, Higgins, Bob Jackson etc have external nuts .  Remove them and the wheels are probably fairly firmly in place.  Yes you can make a dedicated remover, a puller of sorts, but until you get the to see them the wheels should be removable with a lever (big screwdriver) acting between the hub and the bearing housing.  If you're talking Pashley etc I have no idea.

With all wheels off, the trike should now fit easily in the back of the car.  I have seen one in a Peugeot 106, so a Mondeo should be very easy.

[drossall]

Sorry - I should have been more explicit. It's a Rogers - I'm expecting 20+ years old, as it has 27" wheels rather than 700Cs, but not a 1950s model as the seller himself had it built by replacing the triangle on a solo bicycle.

I do have a gear puller that I use when crank threads strip, but my guess is that that would either foul the spokes or else have hooks too short to get around the back of the hubs without damaging the flanges?

Thanks for the advice. Hadn't considered the on-its-side option. So as long as the wheels aren't irrevocably stuck, I'm fine, and if they are I still have a plan!

[Mr Larrington]

Another way of removing a stubborn wheel is, once the nut has been removed, to hold the machine off the ground by the wheel and clout tap the end of the axle with a hammer.

[harrumph]

Another way of removing a stubborn wheel is, once the nut has been removed, to hold the machine off the ground by the wheel and clout tap the end of the axle with a hammer.

Oooooo, with a mallet, if you really must....

Rogers hubs and stub axles, while perfectly serviceable, are not exactly precision engineering. I used to use what I believe is called a bearing splitter - a wedge shaped doobrie with a slot down the middle of it to fit it over the stub. You tap its handle until it separates stub and hub. Cheap and easy. A visit to Halfords may equip you with one.

...the seller himself had it built by replacing the triangle on a solo bicycle...

May exhibit "challenging behaviour" 

[resus1uk]

My upright fits onto a towball rack with restraining straps upto the roof bars to stop any risk of it slipping.

[alan]

Log onto "Gallery" on the ICE website for some usefull ideas.Afraid I don't know how to post a link.

[TimO]

Hmm, depending on how much you are worried about your paint job, could you not just put the wheels on the roof itself, and just use the bars to hold it firmly in place.  Surely a rooftop bike carrier is generally as much about stopping the bike from falling over as anything else, and this shouldn't be a problem with a trike.  Of course, any little bits of grit in the tyres could scratch the paint work, hence my comment above, but you could always put something between the wheels and the car (old dusters?) to protect the paint.

[drossall]

May exhibit "challenging behaviour" 

Thanks all for the further comments. Is this a general problem with trikes rebuilt from bikes? If so, why? The front end is not obviously any different between the two, and I know Longstaff do similar conversions. Rogers did the work - you didn't misread it as a home-spun job? NB proper trike not bolt-on axle (if it were that I'd just unbolt the axle to get it in the car...)

[drossall]

My upright fits onto a towball rack with restraining straps upto the roof bars to stop any risk of it slipping.

Crossed my mind. I've got a Pendle TA4 rack that mounts not onto the towball but onto the bracket.

[tatanab]

Is this a general problem with trikes rebuilt from bikes? If so, why?

It should be perfectly ok provided the basic frame was not from something extreme like a 75 parallel, fag packet clearance tt bike.

Rogers built custom frames, but he also built many frames where he simply chopped the back of a trade produced frame and fitted new stays and the axle.  I have one which is fine.  To be picky, this leaves the bottom bracket height the same as on the donor machine, whereas a custom frame will usually have a lower bottom bracket to drop the centre of gravity - you don't need to lean the frame in a corner so can do this.  The issue with using a conversion set is that old style ones fit inside the rear triangle, so lowering the back of the frame and giving a less upright front end.  Yes, that handles differently but not enough for a novice to notice.

So, fret not, it will be ok I am sure.

[harrumph]

...Is this a general problem with trikes rebuilt from bikes?

I defer to tatanab's greater experience 

However, I have a friend who had such a trike, and it was a right handful which he never really mastered in years of trying!

Could have been something to do with his BEER intake, though...

[drossall]

Thanks harrumph. I'm encouraged by tatanab, who is clearly one of the darkest dark-siders here but also by the seller's frank description of what sounds like a very nice machine. May be able to post photos soon, who knows

[ABlipInContinuity]

If in doubt, could you hire a van or people carrier for the day?

[Sigurd Mudtracker]

I can get mine on the roof rack with one standard (Thule) carrier - front end clamps to wheel tray, down tube held by clamping arm (not strictly necessary, two back wheels attach to roof bars with toe straps.

It's a darn sight easier putting it up on the roof than the tandem! 

[drossall]

ABIC - yes, but only at substantial cost, especially as I am going to look at it on the way back from a long weekend somewhere else. The replies here have been really helpful and I am confident that putting it in the car or on the towbar rack will both work. I have roofbars but my bike carriers are the ones that take bikes upside down, so I don't think I'll bother with the third option.

[harrumph]

We look forward to hearing about the test ride on Monday! 

[drossall]

Pretty much what you'd expect really

I wobbled off down the road. Sometimes I steered left and went left. Sometimes I steered left and went right. Same when steering right. Once or twice ended up on wrong side of (very quiet) road

Definitely my fault not the trike, so bought same and will practice in earnest as soon as time, weather and light allow. Transported trike successfully on Pendle towbar rack.

Once again, thanks for the advice. I think I'll be needing more. For one thing, the trike is fine, except that the Weinmann sidepull doesn't seem very effective. If I look at a newer sidepull, what are my options to go on the standard "pole" that is used to get two brakes on the front of a trike? Can you get a dual-pivot on one of those with a custom pivot bolt or something?

[tatanab]

Can you get a dual-pivot on one of those with a custom pivot bolt or something?

Yes you can.  I have done just that on my old Rogers.  Send me an email and I'll reply with some photos and description of how it is done.  It does not need any custom parts, and is probably mounted in a similar way to the sidepull you already have.

[drossall]

More questions

I've put my cantilever problem in The Knowledge as it seemed of wider relevance.

[drossall]

Picture as promised. Beastie still not broken in

[Sigurd Mudtracker]

I think you might find it breaks you in, not vice-versa 

[drossall]

Had a go in our road (it's a Close so not much traffic) this afternoon. Straight lines fine. Braked down to 0.5mph for corners. This may not be the most practicable approach long term

[border-rider]

You'll get there

I didn't keep at it very hard and it took me months.  Once I committed to riding it every day It came right (ish)

I do have the greatest respect for those who can master them fully.

You have the same chainset as I do - I couldn't see that I'd ever really need a big chainring

[drossall]

I may increase the chainring size. I have a spare lying around. However, there's not much point on current speed

Was definitely going in straighter lines today than last time. Hit kerb once though

May actually venture out onto real roads next week.

Went back onto my bike later this afternoon and wobbled like crazy