Author Topic: Cross Training: Running (Read 421180 times)

DrMekon · « **Reply #700 on:** 17 April, 2012, 04:55:24 pm »

Loving running atm. Pass for Midhurst 600 got rescinded due to family stuff, so thinking of entering the FV Spartans 50km challenge instead. Coping with upping the weekly mileage to 40-50 mils a week, but not getting much in the way of long runs in. Haven't done anything over 15 miles yet, so may be silly.

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #701 on:** 17 April, 2012, 04:59:19 pm »

Thats a nice run the 50k. You can always enter it and I'm sure they'd let you change to the marathon, or even the 17 mile run on the day depending on what you fancy at the time.

Lov that event, and great BBQ at the end

DrMekon · « **Reply #702 on:** 28 April, 2012, 10:05:36 pm »

update - started getting worse. Was starting to wake up with it in pain, and pain just from walking. Had NHS physio appointment on Friday. She said I've got very tight calf muscles and hamstrings (cycling's fault), and weak ankles (wearing my stiff soled SPDs as my shoes at work the cause?). She said that the combination of those with my mid / forefoot strike running is the cause of the problem. She's said no running at all for the mo', and has got me using a theraband to strengthen my ankle (rotating it left and right when it's tied to a table with a big rubber band), and doing calf and hamstring stretches. She also said that when I come back in two weeks, she wants me to bring my trainers and running shorts (she had me running up and down the ward in my pants), and she's going to work on my gait. She was saying that I should be heel striking.

FWIW, the ankle lifts she had me doing to show how weak my ankles are was a real eye opener. I can barely balance at all on one foot, and my leg was shaking all over the place.

My trainer at work fully admits she's out qualified by the physio (albeit she's got a related MSc, an unrelated PhD, and a shed load of fitness/pt qualifications), and shouldn't contradict her. That said, whilst she agreed tightness was an issue, she's suggested some different exercises, and has been doing pressure point release on my calf - hurts like a bastard, but can feel the difference in my foot immediately. She thinks short runs in my vivobarefoots would be good for strengthening my ankle, and doesn't see heel strike as a good idea.

So, on one hand I have a chartered physio saying no running and return to heel strike, and on the other, a PT saying stick with the midfoot/forefoot and go for short runs. It's going to be hard not to hit the trails at lunchtime.

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #703 on:** 28 April, 2012, 10:12:43 pm »

I am totally shocked that a physio has told you to heel strike. Were they drunk?!?!?!

mattc · « **Reply #704 on:** 29 April, 2012, 08:21:04 am »

Heel-strike creates no problem at all for many many runners. It maybe that NHS Physios are more concerned with bigger issues (like mending broken bones, or dealing with massive assymetries, dodgy hips etc etc ...); so they stick with what they know - heel strike - and then assess/fix the other problems.

I'm just guessing here, mind! And I do think that the bulk of research does NOT say heel strike is any healthier than landing further forward. Probably the opposite, but there doesn't seem to be much consensus.

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #705 on:** 29 April, 2012, 08:55:06 pm »

My other half is a big heel striker, and a 2.30 marathon runner- if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Many people can get away with heel striking.

I can't believe anyone would actively encourage it tho- mid/forefoot running creates a million less problems. Plus the fact it's loads more efficient- elites don't heel strike.

I'm not a physio though. But as a PT specialising in rehab, I have dealt with many runners and injuries, the heel strikers have loads more of the problems.

NikW · « **Reply #706 on:** 30 April, 2012, 08:34:07 am »

Good to see you out supporting at the MK Marathon yesterday Rich, you'll have noticed I'd reverted to the trail runners tactic of walking up the humpback bridge and running down the other side by that stage

On target 2 hour first half dissolved into a 4hr 30 finish. It was a truly horrible day, as bad as last time I went to Milton Keynes but twice as long. Support along the route was great though.

As I was adding to the congestion in the queue for Furzton Lake ~~mud bath~~ car park before the start I spotted Teethgrinder pedalling to the start.

Guess this sort of sums it up:

RichForrest · « **Reply #707 on:** 30 April, 2012, 11:16:48 am »

I think most had the same tactic for the bridges. I was out on that bridge marshaling from 10.30 until 16.00. Was a good day.
Looking forward to Abingdon now

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #708 on:** 30 April, 2012, 12:07:28 pm »

I'll hopefully be in for Abingdon too. Been injured so long my GFA time has run out so I'll be looking to get a championship start time for London as I've had to enter the ballot for the first time in forever this morning. Not happy about that!!!

NikW · « **Reply #709 on:** 30 April, 2012, 12:53:30 pm »

Quote from: Lady Cavendish on 30 April, 2012, 12:07:28 pm

I'll hopefully be in for Abingdon too. Been injured so long my GFA time has run out so I'll be looking to get a championship start time for London as I've had to enter the ballot for the first time in forever this morning. Not happy about that!!!

Hope you've got your entry in - they filled up ridiculously quickly this year!

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #710 on:** 30 April, 2012, 01:45:28 pm »

Ballot entry done yes, but there is until December to get a championship time done and sent off. They'd just better fix the bl**dy foot!!

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #711 on:** 30 April, 2012, 01:46:18 pm »

Ohhhhhh sorry, Abingdon, yes. Got that in when it opened

Always fills up stupidly fast.

NikW · « **Reply #712 on:** 30 April, 2012, 02:54:58 pm »

Quote from: Lady Cavendish on 30 April, 2012, 01:46:18 pm

Ohhhhhh sorry, Abingdon, yes. Got that in when it opened Always fills up stupidly fast.

That's proper planning, could easily have blinked and missed it! I do hope they fix your foot OK - it'll be downright embarrassing if you hop past me when I'm going flat out

teethgrinder · « **Reply #713 on:** 02 May, 2012, 12:09:19 am »

Quote from: NikW on 30 April, 2012, 08:34:07 am

As I was adding to the congestion in the queue for Furzton Lake ~~mud bath~~ car park before the start I spotted Teethgrinder pedalling to the start.

I never knew you were running it too. That was my first marathon. I decided that the best way to train was to not bother doing too much running and go cycling instead.

It was my first run in over 2 weeks and my longest run by 12 miles. The last two weeks of cycling 400 miles each weekend did lose me 5kg of blubber and I think it did make a difference.
1st 6.5 miles done in about an hour very comfortably and I wasn't breathing hard, I chatted to a few runners. I was even surprised how fast I was going because it felt so easy. I felt my legs start to get tired after that and they just got more tired as I went on and my speed kept dropping through the rest of the run. I never tried to force the pace up because I knew that I hadn't done enough running to build the strength in my legs and wouldn't be able to keep it up for another 3 hours, so I just let my speed drop until I was going really slow at the end. I only managed 4:38, so with my first quarter in about an hour, I must have got really slow at the end.
I prefered the uphills at the finish and hated the downhills. My hip flexors and thighs are tight as it is but they tightened up even more in the last 3-4 miles and downhills got pretty uncomfortable.
I found it easier than the MK half, but I might have been a bit ill that day and did push the pace because I knew that I could for a half.
I thought that the winning time of 2:41 was a bit slow for a winning time. Were all the big boys recovering from London or was it really that hard? I didn't mind the weather myself.
My legs are still stiff, but I think that when they are recovered I'll really feel the new strength in my legs from the marathon and want to go running a bit more than I did before the marathon. (I like doing things the wrong way around

)
I intend to get out and do some more regular running and hopefully build up to ultras. It'd be nice to actually go somewhere and see stuff instead of Milton Keynes in the pissing rain! Anyone reccommend any good Ultras for a non dedicated runner to aim for?
I'm thinking of doing some of the SW Coastal Path this Christmas too. I'll just be travelling on foot, whether running or walking. Just to see the views and see how far I get.

I never knew you were a runner Lady Cavendish. I wondered where you got all that fitness from when I rode a few miles with you on The Dean 300, now I know.
Good luck with the op, but only if it doesn't mean you'll stop cycling.

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #714 on:** 02 May, 2012, 06:52:13 am »

Very well done TG. And yup running means the world to me.

I've only been cycling as I'm injured so will probably stop it tbh....

I have loads of good ultra suggestions- that's my bag, PM me and let me know how far u wanna run.

2.41 is indeed a v slow time for a win- I think the 'big boys' were either recovering from VLM or Brighton, or otherwise were at Manchester or Shakespeare on Sunday which are higher profile (although Shakespeare was actually reduced to a half 5 mins before the start due to flooding)

Now can I interest you in joining my running club, the 100 marathon club? You only have 99 to go and it's full of people like you!!! You even get a nice blue vest.....

mattc · « **Reply #715 on:** 02 May, 2012, 09:16:09 am »

Quote from: teethgrinder on 02 May, 2012, 12:09:19 am

I intend to get out and do some more regular running and hopefully build up to ultras. It'd be nice to actually go somewhere and see stuff

This is what I love about cycling. The only plus* for running is easier access to remote areas.

Only the talented (and dedicated) top level of runners can cover a decent distance across 'interesting' terrain - whilst a natural snail like me can ride something like the Dean in a day. Oxford to Wales and back. Or L-E-L in 5 days. Mostly without injury!

(There are other logistical things, like cheaper/simpler gear).

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #716 on:** 02 May, 2012, 09:27:48 am »

For me, running is mainly for racing anyway. But in terms of 'seeing stuff', ultras are perrrrfect for that. And no talent required fortunately

South Downs Way 103 mile race is beautiful, (and North Downs 100) as is the Ridgeway 85, West Highland Way 95 (Or Highland Fling 54 on some of route), some fab runs in Wales, Brecon Beacons 45 etc, and for those who don't want to run so far, there are still some fantastic trail marathons in great places. But nope, its not like riding to Wales and back in a day, which was quite cool!

Typical for me that just as I might be getting my foot back I'll need time out as I'll be too fat to run, but at least I'll hopefully be properly fixed when I'm ready to get back running. And I reckon I can still cycle for a while with a big belly.

mattc · « **Reply #717 on:** 02 May, 2012, 09:31:02 am »

Quote from: Lady Cavendish on 02 May, 2012, 09:27:48 am

For me, running is mainly for racing anyway. But in terms of 'seeing stuff', ultras are perrrrfect for that. And no talent required fortunately

Modesty is always admirable, but in this context it may undermine your argument somewhat!

NikW · « **Reply #718 on:** 02 May, 2012, 09:37:14 am »

Hmmm - glad to hear about the no talent bit as, like a rash adolescent on the rebound, I've just entered the Northants Ultra. It just looked like a nice day out and the Marlborough Downs 20 I was considering seems to be full.

I plan to walk run from the very start and will DNS if the weather looks crap, 7hrs 30m will do me fine. Seemed to me that I've just done most of the training and a 26 mile long 'run'

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #719 on:** 02 May, 2012, 09:54:48 am »

Good choice Nik, those organisers are good guys and its a nice run (although I think I got a bit lost- no change there!!) A fairly easy course, so you'll be absolutely fine. Jealous!!

All this talk is really making me want to go for a run! I'm coaching some people but just desperate to do it myself.

Cycling is an ok alterative though I spose grrrr. Although with morning sickness not so much.

So who else has got any races planned?

RichForrest · « **Reply #720 on:** 02 May, 2012, 04:40:12 pm »

I have a few shorter ones planned.
5 mile at Sulgrave on Monday, Greensand ridge relay in June.
St Albans half, MK half (July), maybe Robin Hood half and Abingdon marathon in Oct.
That's to start with anyway

teethgrinder · « **Reply #721 on:** 02 May, 2012, 06:23:56 pm »

Quote from: Lady Cavendish on 02 May, 2012, 06:52:13 am

Now can I interest you in joining my running club, the 100 marathon club? You only have 99 to go and it's full of people like you!!! You even get a nice blue vest.....

No.
Why would I want to join a bunch of nutters who are just like me?

I'll definitely do more marathons, better still, ultras. But only as a side project from cycling. I can run places I can't cycle, such as long distance footpaths, and would like to just go wild with a tent and sleeping bag on my back as well as doing events. I've sometimes been cycling in the Welsh mountains and thought it would be nice to cycle to a Youth Hostel one day, spend the next day or two on foot in the mountains, then cycling back home again. I sort of do that on my mountain bike now though. Trouble is there is too much that I want to do in cycling as well and that's just road cycling. I like my mountain bike too. I might keep running as a winter sport. Bikes take a hammering in the winter and ice is a problem. That's why I'm thinking of doing a Christmas holiday on foot this year. Days are shorter in winter too. I have a week off over Christmas and I always end up spending a lot of time cycling in the dark on Christmas tours. 8 hours a day on a bike isn't very much for me, but 8 hours on foot would be quite a lot as I won't be used to being on foot.
I also thought that doing some running would give me stronger legs for standing up all day at work. When I come home after a week or so of cycling, I will have spent hardly any time at all on my feet during that tour and when I get back to work and have to stand up all day, I notice it. I think that if I develop stronger legs for just standing up, I will feel less tired after work and more inclined to go for a bike ride as I will be feeling fresher. It does seem to be working.
Plus I think it may help fend off knee injuries from cycling. I've known a few long distance cyclists who have ended up with knee trouble, but I never have. I wonder if it's because I stand up at work all day and that it develops other muscles in my legs to counteract my cycling muscles.
I couldn't go to a gym, I have to enjoy it or I won't bother, so it has to be running for me. Walking takes too long. Plus my heart and lungs can get a workout with running.
It'd take me a long time to run 100 marathons, if I ever do. If I went for that, I'd want to do it in under a year and even then, I doubt I'd think it that much of a challenge.

mattc · « **Reply #722 on:** 02 May, 2012, 07:10:44 pm »

Quote from: teethgrinder on 02 May, 2012, 06:23:56 pm

It'd take me a long time to run 100 marathons, if I ever do. If I went for that, I'd want to do it in under a year and even then, I doubt I'd think it that much of a challenge.

Only toothy could write that!

teethgrinder · « **Reply #723 on:** 02 May, 2012, 07:28:28 pm »

Quote from: mattc on 02 May, 2012, 07:10:44 pm

Quote from: teethgrinder on 02 May, 2012, 06:23:56 pm
It'd take me a long time to run 100 marathons, if I ever do. If I went for that, I'd want to do it in under a year and even then, I doubt I'd think it that much of a challenge.

Only toothy could write that!

I think quite a lot of people could say the same if they had the free time.

Lady Cavendish · « **Reply #724 on:** 02 May, 2012, 07:28:49 pm »

It would be a challenge as it's very hard to find that many in a year. The record was recently 87 until last year, involving obviously lots of travel. I think Travis Wilcox has just broken it. Basically you need to be selected for the Brathay 10 in 10 days, because it's almost impossible to find them Sat and Sun all year round, which is almost what you need to do. 100 has certainly never been done in a year before.

There are a couple of 3 in 3 day events to help but finding 100 in a year would be v v hard to do. It might just be possible with the amount of events starting up but I'm still not sure it is.