NiceWay Code

[Pingu]

Launched today: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-23492079

This got a tremendous panning from cyclists on Twitter yesterday.

[Cudzoziemiec]

It sounds a bit naff, but it does identify the root problem.

[hellymedic]

@nicewaycodeGB is more fun to follow...

[Kim]

It sounds a bit naff, but it does identify the root problem.

The problem with telling people to be nice to each other is that it's only going to make a difference to those who were likely to be nice anyway.  Put people on the road and make them late for something, and it all goes out the window.

While there's some merit in, for example, explaining to non-cyclists why cyclists might ride in the middle of the road, this does seem like money which could be better spent on infrastructure improvements or policing.

I'll suspend judgement on the naffness, for all we know that might turn out to make it more effective.

It's still less pointless than - to pick an example completely at random - sticking correx signs along cycle routes to encourage people to cycle.

[sojournermike]

Quote
Sally Hinchcliffe, an organiser of POP, said: "While we don't disagree that behaviour needs to improve between road users, simply asking us all to be nice to one another without backing it up with real changes and enforcement is a waste of taxpayers' money.

"Most drivers don't set out to harm anyone, whether they're cyclists or not. True enough, but many don't take appropriate care of what they're doing

"It's the way our roads are designed and policed that put drivers and people on bikes into conflict.   Not so sure about this. Whilst road design plays a part, I was always given to understand that I should drive my vehicle appropriately to the conditions and not my view of potential police engagement. Conflict usually arises because people are selfish, impatient and ignorant and making that unacceptable behaviour could achieve a lot. Better infrastructure and useful transportation cycling routes would be nice too, of course. 

[Gareth Rees]

There's an official blog here. It's pitiful stuff: they spent the better part of £500,000 and all they have is some useless slogans. They could have built 5 km of cycle path for that sum.

[Cudzoziemiec]

It sounds a bit naff, but it does identify the root problem.

The problem with telling people to be nice to each other is that it's only going to make a difference to those who were likely to be nice anyway.  Put people on the road and make them late for something, and it all goes out the window.

I don't quite agree with that. I think there's a large body of middling people who are quite malleable - give them a few pointers to being considerate and they will be. It's just like school really. They'll flick bogies at the swots if they get the idea that's cool but they'll give up their seat on the bus to the little old lady if it makes them feel virtuous. This mass of swayers is how we end up with royal babies and Simon Cowell, after all.

[Regulator]

There's an official blog here. It's pitiful stuff: they spent the better part of £500,000 and all they have is some useless slogans. They could have built 5 km of cycle path for that sum.

Some PR person has created a few nice photo opportunities for Keith Brown and is now laughing all the way to the bank...

A colossal waste of money.

[TimO]

Whilst a lot of people are malleable, you generally need something more than slogans, pamphlets and signs.

There's also the contention that both carrot and stick have some place in providing an incentive to people, which is why strict liability in relation to road traffic is a compelling argument.

I can't see this making much difference, and at a cost of £½million it's a bit of an outrageous expenditure, which was never going to provide much value.

[hellymedic]

It is a sop to the 'Something Must Be Done' brigade.

The reality is that Nothing has been done and there is no desire to Do Anything.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Yes, the best tool to malleate (apparently this is a real word) people is other people. Slogans and pamphlets tend to count even less if they are seen as official and worthy.

[Andrij]

Yes, the best tool to malleate (apparently this is a real word) people is other people. Slogans and pamphlets tend to count even less if they are seen as official and worthy.

I thought that was a hammer / clue-by-four / shuvel / plod / blunt instrument of choice.

[clarion]

Isn't it a hammer by definition?

[sojournermike]

There's a blog post just up on the research. It's a bit thin, but as part of a strategy combining influence, action (I'd like to see presumed liability and more effective policing/court action) you can change public behaviour. Consider that I grew up when driving with a belly full of beer was normal and compare to today. Perhaps a harder hitting advertising campaign would help, but equally that would frighten people away from cycling at all.

It seems expensive, but capitalism encourages people and businesses to take supernormal profits for as long as they can, but at least someone is trying.

Mike (typically a cynic)

[hellymedic]

Drink-driving became unacceptable when there was publicity backed up by effective enforcement of the legislation.
Publicity alone did not achieve this.

[hellymedic]

@nicewaycodeGB is more fun to follow...

But appears to have been suspended.
Wot's wrong with a spoof account?

[Regulator]

Drink-driving became unacceptable when there was publicity backed up by effective enforcement of the legislation.
Publicity alone did not achieve this.

Yep.  Drink-driving became unacceptable when the courts started taking it seriously, e.g. jailing people over Christmas for D&D.  Our local magistrates court was the first to do this is the early 80s and it caused absolute uproar... but D&D dropped dramatically.

[sojournermike]

Drink-driving became unacceptable when there was publicity backed up by effective enforcement of the legislation.
Publicity alone did not achieve this.

Yep, that's what I said:) Both are required

[RJ]

There's an official blog here. It's pitiful stuff: they spent the better part of £500,000 and all they have is some useless slogans. They could have built 5 km of cycle path for that sum.

Some PR person has created a few nice photo opportunities for Keith Brown and is now laughing all the way to the bank...

A colossal waste of money.

a bit like Keith Brown ...

[her_welshness]

Have been following this blog post and its comments from the last two days:

http://beyondthekerb.wordpress.com/2013/07/31/the-car-and-the-kitten/

I just love the comments from 2 members of the niceway team, totally arrogant and 'oh you guys are just being soooo negative'. Can you blame us?

[spindrift]

That's an interesting read.

[Pedaldog.]

Quote "Even if we take it as read that the ideal solution is physical separation of modes of transport (which is what we should be striving for in urban and suburban environments), the secondary pragmatic issue is still not one of niceness. It is one of poor driving standards."

The ideal solution is Precisely NOT "Physical segregation of modes of transport" and I nominate this bloke for the "We might be self important twats but we know what's best for you" Gold award of 2013

[Regulator]

Their campaign has been launched on YouTube

[Deano]

 

It's easy to take the piss, but...

Actually, I can't think of any more sensible response than taking the piss. Have another one of these:

 

[HTFB]

There's also the contention that both carrot and stick have some place in providing an incentive to people, which is why strict liability in relation to road traffic is a compelling argument.

The courts are less compelled. Here's a brand-new ruling by the Supreme Court rowing away from strict liability for uninsured drivers who cause death.