Author Topic: Wiggins/Sutton Down  (Read 26100 times)

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #50 on: 08 November, 2012, 10:35:24 am »
They are using phrases like 'he probably came out of nowhere and was going very fast'...

Yep, I'd probably expect him to do that myself. He is a pro racer out training after all. And I can see how the driver might not have anticipated this speed (I've had several discussions with motorcyclists who's view is that any accident with a car is the drivers fault, never mind that the bike was doing 120 not 70 and it's approach speed might be misjudged). I'm wondering why on earth he was doing it in the dark, in rush hour, close to a major motorway junction?  Too many media commitments in daylight perhaps?

We have absolutely no idea how the accident happened. Innocent until proben guilty and all that - and that goes for both parties.

The BBC has it that the car was a Vauxhall Astra Envoy (Envoy being, I think, a trim level) driven by a local woman. So not your typical WVM.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

spindrift

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #51 on: 08 November, 2012, 10:35:40 am »
BBC still saying he "collided with a car".

Cudzoziemiec

  • Ride adventurously and stop for a brew.
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #52 on: 08 November, 2012, 10:40:51 am »
I heard a van driver pulled out from a petrol station into his path. That very much implies the van driver should have given way to Wiggins, and everyone else of course, on the road.
Riding a concrete path through the nebulous and chaotic future.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #53 on: 08 November, 2012, 10:44:37 am »
In 2007 I held up two riders who went on to do 30mph TTs. One was Wiggins in a club 10, and the other was Jason Mc'Intyre in the National 25. Mc'Intyre had a fatal collision with a van here, while out training.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=carrs+corner+fort+william&hl=en&ll=56.837025,-5.072991&spn=0.004173,0.012542&hnear=Carrs+Corner,+Fort+William+PH33+6TL,+United+Kingdom&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=56.837147,-5.072845&panoid=Is084btigzJRCwohhdNI5g&cbp=12,57.53,,0,3

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_MacIntyre

I always look at where these incidents occur, as I don't want to be involved in one. A lot of them seem to be from difficult side turnings where gaps in the traffic flow are infrequent.

Euan Uzami

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #54 on: 08 November, 2012, 10:52:03 am »
It's a bit of a confusing junction that. The van  might have been coming out from where the orange van is going in.
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Crow+Orchard+Road&hl=en&ll=53.5906,-2.697023&spn=0.000006,0.006271&hq=Crow+Orchard+Road&hnear=Bolton,+United+Kingdom&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=53.5906,-2.697023&panoid=wqCFbSGcbx5nOwafzBfAQQ&cbp=12,92.03,,0,-2.39
It's on one of a number of good circuits, the road he's turning into is essentially slightly downhill to where he lives. Bradley seems to like to call it Wigan to put people off the scent of him living in a fairly well off part of Lancashire, with a Preston post code.

That junction looks like the sort that people would just steam out of the garage towards the motorway - the intention is to accelerate down the slip road, but people put their foot down too early.

TimC

  • Old blerk sometimes onabike.
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #55 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:09:19 am »
Did he have the incident at the exit on the minor road, or the one on the main road? As the local paper says it was on, "Crow Orchard Road, close to the junction with Mossy Lea Road", I presume it's not the exit you show in your StreetView link?

Cudzoziemiec

  • Ride adventurously and stop for a brew.
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #56 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:10:07 am »
Apparently he was on his mountain bike.
Riding a concrete path through the nebulous and chaotic future.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #57 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:13:10 am »
It's a bit of a confusing junction that. The van  might have been coming out from where the orange van is going in.
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Crow+Orchard+Road&hl=en&ll=53.5906,-2.697023&spn=0.000006,0.006271&hq=Crow+Orchard+Road&hnear=Bolton,+United+Kingdom&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=53.5906,-2.697023&panoid=wqCFbSGcbx5nOwafzBfAQQ&cbp=12,92.03,,0,-2.39
It's on one of a number of good circuits, the road he's turning into is essentially slightly downhill to where he lives. Bradley seems to like to call it Wigan to put people off the scent of him living in a fairly well off part of Lancashire, with a Preston post code.

That junction looks like the sort that people would just steam out of the garage towards the motorway - the intention is to accelerate down the slip road, but people put their foot down too early.

It's supposed to be a one way system, traffic has to turn into the B road to enter the forecourt, and exit onto the A road, but it's frequently difficult to get out onto the A road because of the bend, traffic also comes off the other carriageway across the A road to go down the B road or to access the garage. It's all a bit of a nightmare. I also wonder what lights Bradley might have had on his bike.

It's possible to pan round and move about in Google Maps, that whole junction arrangement is a real dog's breakfast.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #58 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:39:27 am »
One of the eyewitnesses said he had a buckled front wheel which suggests:

1. Charlotte or I should build his wheels instead
2. He may well have run into the car.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #59 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:43:56 am »
Which would make the "collided with" phrase used in news reports correct - though obviously the fault still remains with the car/van if it was where it shouldn't have been (e.g. pulling out giving him no chance to avoid).

spindrift

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #60 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:45:28 am »
BBC now saying "knocked off his bike", dunno if they got complaints.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #61 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:47:25 am »
They are using phrases like 'he probably came out of nowhere and was going very fast'...

Yep, I'd probably expect him to do that myself. He is a pro racer out training after all. And I can see how the driver might not have anticipated this speed (I've had several discussions with motorcyclists who's view is that any accident with a car is the drivers fault, never mind that the bike was doing 120 not 70 and it's approach speed might be misjudged). I'm wondering why on earth he was doing it in the dark, in rush hour, close to a major motorway junction?  Too many media commitments in daylight perhaps?

We have absolutely no idea how the accident happened. Innocent until proben guilty and all that - and that goes for both parties.

The BBC has it that the car was a Vauxhall Astra Envoy (Envoy being, I think, a trim level) driven by a local woman. So not your typical WVM.

Which is why as far as I'm concerned, she's not a 'poor poor woman' unless she's blameless for some reason. Which none of us know as yet. I do take issue with the phrase 'appeared out of nowhere' unless he's some sort of magician, though, or was completely unlit or something.

Anyway, the thread on my other place has now escalated onto a tirade about bloody cyclists on the road and they should be on cycle paths yada yada...I should probably take a step back.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #62 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:48:38 am »
Lets all vote for Brad to win the BBC Sports Personality of the Year award next month to show our support to one of UK's best ever sports stars.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #63 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:49:10 am »
He was also being followed by a Sky car.  Bike light invisible against bluish HID headlamps?
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #64 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:52:33 am »
Going by a post on BR, I see that Jeremy "ignorant fucking gobshite troll" Vine has opened his mouth wide enough to put both feet in.  ::-)
"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." ~ Freidrich Neitzsche

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #65 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:58:15 am »
The Sky report interview with the garage staff shows the level of traffic through the garage.
http://news.sky.com/story/1008509/bradley-wiggins-in-hospital-after-bike-crash

Toady

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #66 on: 08 November, 2012, 11:59:30 am »
They are using phrases like 'he probably came out of nowhere and was going very fast'...

Yep, I'd probably expect him to do that myself. He is a pro racer out training after all. And I can see how the driver might not have anticipated this speed (I've had several discussions with motorcyclists who's view is that any accident with a car is the drivers fault, never mind that the bike was doing 120 not 70 and it's approach speed might be misjudged). I'm wondering why on earth he was doing it in the dark, in rush hour, close to a major motorway junction?   Too many media commitments in daylight perhaps?

We have absolutely no idea how the accident happened. Innocent until proben guilty and all that - and that goes for both parties.

The BBC has it that the car was a Vauxhall Astra Envoy (Envoy being, I think, a trim level) driven by a local woman. So not your typical WVM.
Why on earth he was doing what?  Riding his bike?  I have to own up that I sometimes ride my bike in the dark, in the rush hour (although admittedly not close to motorway junctions, as I don't live near one).  Should I not be doing that?

As you say, we have absolutely no idea.  He may have been TTing along like a rocket in his teardrop helmet on a wisp of carbon fibre, or he may have been to the shops to get a pint of milk on a humungous old bike with an oil bath chain case and a wicker basket on the front.  Or, more probably, something in between.

The van driver was a hit man employed by Cadel Evans!
I'm thinking that Lance was probably behind it all.  I've not invented a reason for this ... yet.

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #67 on: 08 November, 2012, 12:02:51 pm »


They are using phrases like 'he probably came out of nowhere and was going very fast'...
Chris Evans said similar on Radio 2 show this morning.
Lots of talk about 'elite cyclists' going 'faster than you expect'.

mcshroom

  • Mushroom
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #68 on: 08 November, 2012, 12:05:04 pm »
He was apparently on his Mountain bike so I'd be surprised if he was going that quickly (though I'd bet he was moving much faster than I do)
Climbs like a sprinter, sprints like a climber!

Si_Co

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #69 on: 08 November, 2012, 12:06:51 pm »
The junction is CR*P. I've ridden that way several times going a doglegged straight on into back lane and have always ended up dismounting to do it, otherwise you have to go all the way round the motorway roundabout

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #70 on: 08 November, 2012, 12:30:50 pm »
The junction is CR*P. I've ridden that way several times going a doglegged straight on into back lane and have always ended up dismounting to do it, otherwise you have to go all the way round the motorway roundabout

Back Lane adds a whole level of complication. Bradley seems to have been coming from Parbold way. He's been known to go to a cafe near Rufford, so he might have been coming back from there. This Sky support car thing is interesting, they had an interview with the woman at the garage in what looked like last night or first thing this morning. Were they filming for something?

Oscar's dad

  • aka Septimus Fitzwilliam Beauregard Partridge
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #71 on: 08 November, 2012, 12:55:50 pm »
According to The Sun Brad got knocked off cos he recently shaved off his lucky sideburns. Seems fair.

Toady

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #72 on: 08 November, 2012, 12:59:44 pm »
According to The Sun Brad got knocked off cos he recently shaved off his lucky sideburns. Seems fair.
At last! Some good honest sense! 

Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #73 on: 08 November, 2012, 01:40:55 pm »

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Wiggins Down
« Reply #74 on: 08 November, 2012, 01:57:27 pm »
Lets all vote for Brad to win the BBC Sports Personality of the Year award next month to show our support to one of UK's best ever sports stars.
Hmmm. This could be the silver lining in this incident.

(assuming Brad recovers OK, and there is no prosecution)
Has never ridden RAAM
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