Author Topic: Woodburning camp stoves  (Read 76898 times)

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #200 on: 05 September, 2013, 10:27:40 am »
How much heat radiates downwards?

A lot of campsites won't allow disposable bbqs or stoves that sit on the ground, due to scorching of the grass.  I do like my kelly kettle but it has the problem of burning the ground.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #201 on: 05 September, 2013, 10:56:21 am »
An officious French campsite manager gave me a right shouting at for "destroying the beauty of the campsite" years ago for using a bbq that sat on the ground. If we had had it on grass I could have understood but this was on Mont Blanc and I had the bbq resting on a a slab of igneous rock that must have weighed 200 tonnes, no way was a disposable BBQ going to make any impression on that. Indeed next morning when we chuck the bbq in the bin there wasn't a mark on the rock. We had however bent most f our tent pegs trying to get the tents even slightly fastened down.
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #202 on: 05 September, 2013, 11:22:24 am »
Camping and bushwalking in WA gave me a profound preference for tents that don't require pegs; the soil in the Darling Scarp is often only a few inches deep over solid rock.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Charlotte

  • Dissolute libertine
  • Here's to ol' D.H. Lawrence...
    • charlottebarnes.co.uk
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #203 on: 05 September, 2013, 11:30:24 am »
How much heat radiates downwards?

A lot of campsites won't allow disposable bbqs or stoves that sit on the ground, due to scorching of the grass.  I do like my kelly kettle but it has the problem of burning the ground.

I have one of these:



It's a small glass fibre heat resistant mat, made for plumbers to use to shield floor joists and the like when soldering pipes together with a blow lamp.  It rolls up and goes in with the stove kit and makes sure that you don't scorch the grass.
Commercial, Editorial and PR Photographer - www.charlottebarnes.co.uk

clarion

  • Tyke
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #204 on: 05 September, 2013, 12:05:02 pm »
I always use a plumbers mat for my stoves.  Not sure how a woodburning stove differs - good or bad - from a gas one in this respect.
Getting there...

Vince

  • Can't climb; won't climb
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #205 on: 05 September, 2013, 12:13:05 pm »
Camping and bushwalking in WA gave me a profound preference for tents that don't require pegs; the soil in the Darling Scarp is often only a few inches deep over solid rock.

Sounds just like the Kent Show Ground

Back OT. Am I right in thinking that the air rising in the jacket is pulling air down through the bottom of the burning pot? Therefore the ratio of size/quantity of the holes around the bottom of the outer jacket compared to those in the base of the burning pot is critical and closing off the holes in the outer will increase the air draft down through the fire?
216km from Marsh Gibbon

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #206 on: 05 September, 2013, 01:10:10 pm »
Am I right in thinking that the air rising in the jacket is pulling air down through the bottom of the burning pot?

That's how many people describe the process, but I don't see how that can possibly happen without some sort of fan; the hot air in the burning pot (which is never going to be cooler than that in the jacket) will rise, and draw air in through the bottom, as well as through the secondary combustion holes at the top.  I don't believe the jacket is essential to the process, except perhaps by pre-heating the air for the secondary burn.  It does cool the outer wall somewhat, which is handy.

Thought experiment: if the air is being pulled downwards through the fuel, where is it coming from?  Which way are the smoke and flames going?

Vince

  • Can't climb; won't climb
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #207 on: 05 September, 2013, 01:48:08 pm »
I would like to think the smoke is being pulled down into the hotter part of the fire and combusted, making it cleaner.
Thinking about the jacket and simplifying the model by losing the holes in the outer jacket. The air in the jacket is being warmed and will expand, becoming lighter than the air outside the jacket so will exit the jacket at the top. This leaves a low pressure area which can only be filled by air either coming back down the jacket or being drawn throught the fire. The former I suspect would pulse, the later give the draw down effect described.
Of course this is buggered up by the big holes in the outer jacket which will allow air to be drawn from the outside up through both the jacket and the fire.

(My experience of fires is limited to setting scouts alight helping scouts light fires on camp!)
216km from Marsh Gibbon

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #208 on: 05 September, 2013, 03:57:29 pm »
I would like to think the smoke is being pulled down into the hotter part of the fire and combusted, making it cleaner.

The smoke is mixed with fresh air above the fire and combusted, making it cleaner.  You can see it happening.


Quote
Thinking about the jacket and simplifying the model by losing the holes in the outer jacket. The air in the jacket is being warmed and will expand, becoming lighter than the air outside the jacket so will exit the jacket at the top. This leaves a low pressure area which can only be filled by air either coming back down the jacket or being drawn throught the fire. The former I suspect would pulse, the later give the draw down effect described.

Yeahbut:

The air in the pot is being warmed *more* and will expand *more* and rise, this leaves a low pressure area which can only be filled by by air coming back down the jacket.  This air will contain rather a lot of combustion products, and it will either reach a smouldery equilibrium or go out (indeed, you'd have the same problem if it were being drawn down through the fire).


Quote
Of course this is buggered up by the big holes in the outer jacket which will allow air to be drawn from the outside up through both the jacket and the fire.

Which is how they seem to work in practice.  The experiments to do are to try running one without the jacket in place, and to draw off a sample of the air inside the jacket and test for combustible gasses.

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #209 on: 06 September, 2013, 12:25:31 am »
"I would like to think the smoke is being pulled down into the hotter part of the fire and combusted, making it cleaner."
I think this is correct - and is an important feature when larger versions are used in peoples' homes in developing countries. That and the reduced amount of fuel they require.
I find that the lower part of my stove stays surprisingly cool. I cook on top of a collection of pie dishes, I'm much more likely to scorch grass with the bottom of my pan than from the wood  gas stove.

clarion

  • Tyke
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #210 on: 06 September, 2013, 08:14:09 am »
That's true.  At Mildenhall, there was just a pie dish (no pie) between Turista's stove and a wooden picnic table.  I thought there might be some scorching, but there were no marks.
Getting there...

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #211 on: 06 September, 2013, 04:17:37 pm »
You can put water in the pie dish if you want to be double plus careful. I have a little pile of the pie dishes (collective noun needed!) - I really ought to keep one out to put the hot saucepan onto, then I wouldn't scorch the grass!

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #212 on: 01 August, 2020, 08:14:59 pm »
Not exactly a camp stove, but Colin Furze has used the wood gassification to fuel a lawnmower!  :o :o :o

https://youtu.be/FK2qK-NCQH8
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is...

Wowbagger

  • Former Sylph
    • Stuff mostly about weather
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #213 on: 01 July, 2021, 10:13:06 pm »
Not exactly a camp stove, but Colin Furze has used the wood gassification to fuel a lawnmower!  :o :o :o

https://youtu.be/FK2qK-NCQH8

I've only just seen that. The man's bonkers, but brilliant!
Quote from: Dez
It doesn’t matter where you start. Just start.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #214 on: 02 July, 2021, 12:10:10 am »
Not exactly a camp stove, but Colin Furze has used the wood gassification to fuel a lawnmower!  :o :o :o

https://youtu.be/FK2qK-NCQH8

I've only just seen that. The man's bonkers, but brilliant!

Excellent thread necromany. Congrats!

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #215 on: 02 July, 2021, 12:30:41 am »
Thanks for reviving this thread, Colin Furze is indeed brilliant (and bonkers). I remember reading accounts of people adapting cars and trucks to run on wood gas during WWII, but I never appreciated the effort involved until I saw this.

Moving into the 21st century, Patagonia has done an interesting job of adapting JetBoil/Windburner technology to woodburning stoves:
https://www.patagonia.com/product/wood-burning-backcountry-stove/49550.html?dwvar_49550_color=SNL&cgid=luggage-water-bottles
https://www.patagonia.com/product/quantumiir-pot/O2005.html?dwvar_O2005_color=SNL&cgid=root

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #216 on: 02 July, 2021, 12:42:52 pm »
I see that the BioLite stove is still available, in its newer CampStove 2+ version, with lots of LEDs and an integrated 3.2 Ah battery now.

They're quoting a peak electrical power output of 4W, which would be enough to put a significant charge into a phone, albeit you may need to feed in wood just to power the electrical output. I guess a normal cooking session could also provide enough power to allow light use of the phone, just not an extended period of web browsing (and posting to YACF! ;D ).

I watched a YouTube Video where the reviewer did justify its weight, compared to a more traditional camping arrangement with gas canisters, as well as USB powerpack and solar panels. Interestingly he also used wood pellets, and I guess a small quantity of those could be carried as a backup to finding dry fuel.

It's definitely not as cheap as Charlotte's homemade version, even allowing for the cost of drill bits worn out, but for longer trips with dry conditions, it's probably easier and cheaper than having to procure gas canisters or white fuel. You can find it online for around £150, but with a bit of hunting you can get that price a but closer to £125.
Actually, it is rocket science.
 

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #217 on: 06 July, 2021, 12:34:45 pm »
Surprised no one has mentioned Vargo, brilliant for little camping pots or large mugs. Have the Ti one, best feature is it folds flat so easy to pack.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Ride adventurously and stop for a brew.
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #218 on: 07 July, 2021, 12:46:41 pm »
Not exactly a camp stove, but Colin Furze has used the wood gassification to fuel a lawnmower!  :o :o :o

https://youtu.be/FK2qK-NCQH8

I've only just seen that. The man's bonkers, but brilliant!
Totally!
Riding a concrete path through the nebulous and chaotic future.

Vince

  • Can't climb; won't climb
Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #219 on: 13 July, 2021, 04:55:00 pm »
Not exactly a camp stove, but Colin Furze has used the wood gassification to fuel a lawnmower!  :o :o :o

https://youtu.be/FK2qK-NCQH8

I've only just seen that. The man's bonkers, but brilliant!
But would you want him to live next door to you?

Totally!
216km from Marsh Gibbon

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #220 on: 13 July, 2021, 07:23:20 pm »



I've only just seen that. The man's bonkers, but brilliant!
But would you want him to live next door to you?

As he has recently been excavating tunnels connecting his house, workshop and his underground bunker - NO!  :o https://youtu.be/WIe5GKyLPek
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is...

Re: Woodburning camp stoves
« Reply #221 on: 03 September, 2021, 01:11:51 pm »
The weather is perfect for the woodburning stoves, been dry for ages no shortage of dry fuel. Round the Katrine , cafe at top end closed so the backup cafe gear was used. Need to remember to look out a couple of old tent pegs for a better support.