Grammar that makes you cringe

[Cudzoziemiec]

A BBC reporter has just said that if Greece defaults on its loans, it could "spread contagion" throughout the Eurozone.

[Gareth Rees]

A BBC reporter has just said that if Greece defaults on its loans, it could "spread contagion" throughout the Eurozone.

The OED has this as sense 4a, "fig. Hurtful, defiling, or corrupting contact; infecting influence." Citations include Chaucer and Gibbon.

I used to have to teach it to junior school children

I'm surprised by this: did you really have no choice in the matter? Who or what prevented you from choosing something better?

[rogerzilla]

http://www.happyplace.com/3645/the-best-obnoxious-responses-to-misspellings-on-facebook

This forum is a paragon of tolerance compared to Facebook 

[Wowbagger]

A BBC reporter has just said that if Greece defaults on its loans, it could "spread contagion" throughout the Eurozone.

The OED has this as sense 4a, "fig. Hurtful, defiling, or corrupting contact; infecting influence." Citations include Chaucer and Gibbon.

I used to have to teach it to junior school children

I'm surprised by this: did you really have no choice in the matter? Who or what prevented you from choosing something better?

Other staff, who requested rubbish like this for their assemblies. I would have quite happily torn up the BBC Book of pseudo-religious doggerel with bad tunes.

[rogerzilla]

The all-time worst example is the Children's Society carol for Christingle services.  Ther words are banal and don't scan properly, the tune is nicked straight from "The Holly and the Ivy" and the whole thing is contrived.

[mattc]

Today I read an example of Punctuation Mattering:

"
Youd made no effort to see it until one day it was shown on British television. He said later that he settled down with a glass of whisky to watch it, but was upstairs in bed by the end of the first commercial break.
"

On first reading, it made no sense. Then I realised it was written about John Christopher (Christopher Samuel Youd), science-fiction writer and children's novelist.

[Ian H]

Today I read an example of Punctuation Mattering:

I'm none the wiser. How does one matter punctuation?

[mattc]

Maybe I meant muttering. I can't remember.

[clarion]

Wasn't it 'smattering'?

[drossall]

BBC News tonight: "Having left school at 16, the economic down-turn has left her..."

What was the economic down-turn doing at school in the first place?

[toontra]

Saw this guy last week - some witty observations on youth "grammar" (slightly NSFW):

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/kLKlgLG6jfI&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/kLKlgLG6jfI&rel=1</a>

[Wowbagger]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/16954576

What is a "retiral"?

I thought the BBC was supposed to set a standard for others to aspire to.

[Peter]

That is really awful, isn't it?  (And the story's not very nice, either.)

[Gareth Rees]

What is a "retiral"?

According to the OED, it's a Scottish word meaning "retirement". So it's not surprising to see it in a report from BBC Scotland.

[Peter]

It's the first time I've heard it and I'm OLD.  But I'm not Scots, though of Scots (and Welsh) descent.  I wonder if any Scots could tell us if it's common?

[Wowbagger]

Same for me. I worked for 9 years for HMCE, which had loads of Scots working there and I never heard the word "retiral".

[hellymedic]

It's the first time I've heard it and I'm OLD.  But I'm not Scots, though of Scots (and Welsh) descent.  I wonder if any Scots could tell us if it's common?

Used lots when I worked in Glasgow. Also outwith, clerkess and other usages eschewed by the English.

[Gareth Rees]

It's the first time I've heard it and I'm OLD.  But I'm not Scots, though of Scots (and Welsh) descent.  I wonder if any Scots could tell us if it's common?

It's easy to research this kind of question yourself. Google for "site:bbc.co.uk retiral", and what do you get? 246 results, and on the first page:

• "On the Retiral of John McLeod, Senior Guardsman, Wick Railway Station"
• "Scottish referee Kenny Clark talks to BBC Scotland's Liam McLeod about the controversial retiral of referee Dougie McDonald."
• "Scotland Vogts shrugs off Weir 'retiral'"
• "MS forces [Dundee midfielder] Artero retiral"
• "The retiral of [Scottish player] Chris Paterson from international rugby"
• "Donald Stewart [MP, Western Isles, held] on to the seat until his retiral in 1987"

So this word appears regularly in BBC headlines and articles by Scottish writers on Scottish subjects.

I worked for 9 years for HMCE, which had loads of Scots working there and I never heard the word "retiral".

English is a big language, as I'm sure you know, with many dialects. You can speak it all your life and still learn new words every day.* So maybe a bit of research would be appropriate before condemning an unfamiliar usage as a mistake?

* Today I learned the word coffle.

[Peter]

Thank you Gareth, obviously I have a lot to learn.

[Wowbagger]

Well, my research went a far as asking my Scottish son in law and he'd never heard it either.

[citoyen]

Chambers dictionary is a good point of reference for things like this - it takes a liberal approach to spelling and dialect (hence it's the dictionary of choice for crossword compilers and Scrabble players). Plus it's Scottish. I don't have my copy to hand but I wouldn't be surprised if "retiral" were in it.

d.

[Ian H]

Chambers dictionary is a good point of reference for things like this - it takes a liberal approach to spelling and dialect (hence it's the dictionary of choice for crossword compilers and Scrabble players). Plus it's Scottish. I don't have my copy to hand but I wouldn't be surprised if "retiral" were in it.

d.

It is, and it's in the Oxford.

[drossall]

Following up stories on The Times' safety campaign, I did enjoy the comment in this story from a councillor, who apparently has a white plastic car with keep left markings on it.

[Peter]

Following up stories on The Times' safety campaign, I did enjoy the comment in this story from a councillor, who apparently has a white plastic car with keep left markings on it.

That made me smile, too!  However, in fairness to the councillor, it's more likely to be the work of the demon sub-editor than a grammatical slip.  They've probably just chopped out his previous sentence.  From my experience of our local paper, he may well not have said anything at all - or even exist!

[drossall]

Yes, agreed, but does read oddly