Which bike is safest to ride in icy conditions?

[dave r]

So what do people think about toe clips and straps in the snow and ice? The golden mean of control and allowing you to use grippy(ish) shoes, or the worst of both options?

Worst of all.  They are slow and unreliable to clip out of. You are better off using spd and strapping something round your instep to prevent slipping when walking.

I've used clips and straps for about 25 years, I've got clips and straps on the fixed I commute on and clipless on my summer best geared bike, theres nothing wrong with clips and straps.

[mrcharly-YHT]

I've used clips and straps a lot - but IMHO, they are inferior to spd. The sole advantage (sic) they have is that you can easily use ordinary shoes with them.

[dave r]

So what do people think about toe clips and straps in the snow and ice? The golden mean of control and allowing you to use grippy(ish) shoes, or the worst of both options?

Worst of all.  They are slow and unreliable to clip out of. You are better off using spd and strapping something round your instep to prevent slipping when walking.

I've used clips and straps for about 25 years, I've got clips and straps on the fixed I commute on and clipless on my summer best geared bike, theres nothing wrong with clips and straps.

I've used clips and straps a lot - but IMHO, they are inferior to spd. The sole advantage (sic) they have is that you can easily use ordinary shoes with them.

As I said in my earlier post I'm running both at the moment, Theres very little difference between the two.

[David Martin]

I used clipless in summer and early winter. When it got below -10 I used clips and straps as I was then wearing hiking bokts instead of bike shoes. Both are fine, but you don't do the clips and straps up tight.

[Kim]

Powergrips and hiking boots would be a reasonable option (much less faff than clips and straps, has a SPD-like release, works with sensible footwear) but I'll probably just stick with SPDs.  I don't see myself doing a lot of riding in icy conditions anyway.

[Cudzoziemiec]

I've been using clips and straps all this year anyway. I converted to SPDs maybe two years ago, but my jet-set lifestyle has left me with SPD shoes here and pedals on the MTB elsewhere.  Hopefully not for too much longer. Anywayz we'll see what the winter brings down here.

[GruB]

I shall get the MTB out on the weekend and fit the winter tyres then, as mentioned above - it is guaranteed to be ice and snow free for ages 

[Cunobelin]

On typing this question I have suddenly thought of a tricycle, however as I don't own one I have not included it as an option at this time.  I think it would win hands down for stability but in many other ways it would make the journey slower due to the width for heavy traffic and the lack of passing opportunities on the busy roads I now find myself on.

This is a common misconception.... Trikes are not much wider!




The widest part of a cyclist is their shoulders, and in my case my width on the trikes is only a few cms greater than on an upright or two wheel recumbent

The only thing is expense as you really need three snow tyres. The rear allows drive, and the front allow braking

[Wendy]

Even in this London I wouldn't miss too many filtering opportunities on a trike, and those I did miss mostly wouldn't slow me down too much. Admittedly my commute is one of the freer flowing ones...

[tatanab]

Trikes are not much wider!

Riding uprights, when people say they are wider I reply "the widest part of me is my elbows.  Normal riding posture that is about 20".  Trike is 28" over hubs, that is 4" either side.  If 4" is too much then you are trying to overtake far too closely anyway, and how far do car mirrors stick out?"

For filtering the width is no problem for the same reason, I can easily judge the gaps, but mostly I cannot be bothered (small town and rural riding).

These comments are for upright machines - I have little problem with traction using two wheel drive, the problem is always at the front.  Sheet ice and the wheel will drift down the camber regardless of where you point it.  Rutted and ice and snow are very difficult but you can at least make slow progress.  Fresh snow more than a couple of inches deep is ok except on steep hills.  I could have got up the 1 in 7 in a very narrow lane but it was quicker and far easier to walk - I could have ridden down the other side but would have had no control at all.  These circumstances have only occurred a couple of times.  One wheel drive on snow and ice is very difficult because you find you have to keep weight on the drive just to keep moving - it's easier by bike.  Last winter I fitted a lightly treaded cyclo cross tyre to the front and removed the mudguard.  This was better.  City riders probably do not have to deal with many of the scenarios described.  Yes, they will get sheets of compacted rutted snow/ice but probbaly nothing like as much as those of us in areas that get no snow clearance other than on A roads.   If people have any thought of "a trike (upright) might be good for the winter" they really should understand that they need some experience first - learn the basics of riding before you find yourself in tricky winter conditions.

[orienteer]

An option not included in the poll - small wheeled bikes!

I can catch a front wheel slipping sideways on my Moultons simply because they are so responsive compared to a big wheeler. And I'm well past bus pass entitlement, when reaction times are supposed to be poor. 

Would be interesting to try the Moulton tandem conversion - only had it since summer. It could take studded tyres too!

[Biggsy]

[pendant] The poll is Which bike, not What bike.  Grubsup doesn't have an unlimited choice of bikes. [/pendant]

[perpetual dan]

MTB with studded tyres, as others have said. Last year I used hiking boots on flats as there were patches of snow that needed pushing through. If it is properly icy (rather than just the odd patch catching out those on two wheels) then add a route that avoids motorists without studs sliding about on the ice.

[Palinurus]

A dual-suspension bike bought from argos with a rusty chain and really, really soft tyres.

They can manage just fine when I can barely walk on the pavements.

[Kim]

That does appear to be the case.  I remember several icy treks up to the hand clinic with barakta last winter where we were dodged by pavement-cycling BSOists.  Overlooking the fact that the road itself was well-gritted and clear, I was impressed that they were managing to manoeuvre around obstructions (ie. pedestrians) in conditions were walking was distinctly hazardous.

Wide cheesy tyres running at about 10psi (and no brakes to speak of) seems to be the secret.


Anyway, this thread needs ^_SCIENCE - I propose an assortment of well-padded YACFers with increasingly inappropriate steeds and an icy carpark for round 1.  Then we can have a ford with frozen approach roads to wipe the smug grin off whoever brought the recumbent trike.  Guaranteed Youtube hit.

[GruB]

The thread does need science - I agree.

It does not need helpful and enticing comments about trikes.  I can't afford one 

[Cudzoziemiec]

The thread does need science - I agree.

It does not need helpful and enticing comments about trikes.  I can't afford one 

Seconded. I have neither the space nor the money for a recumbent tadpole trike and I've got no interest in such a thing at all, oh no, none whatsoever, really, zilch, nada, I tell you, honestly...

[rogerzilla]

If it gets to the point of sheet ice everywhere, it's time to get an extra wheel or get off the bike entirely.  Trust me on this one.

I dunno - I've ridden on roads that were like polished glass and Nutty has some photos of similar roads he's used.  With studded tyres the bike wasn't going to fall over, although due to the particular configuration of my homebrew studs, drive was a bit of a problem and I should have run with a lower pressure to get the side studs in better contact with the ice.

I'm not saying it was relaxing and confidence-inspiring on studs, but walking was actually more difficult.

[David Martin]

Sheet ice is fine with studs. Rippled frozen ruts is a nightmare.

[tonycollinet]

I did find conditions where studs were defeated (I think) last winter. Snow - melt to watery slush - refreeze to glass at -15 (so HARD glass). No salt, because it was an off road leisure path. The surface was completely devoid of any texture at all.

Walking was impossible. Riding, even with studs was not feasible.

[Palinurus]

Wide cheesy tyres running at about 10psi (and no brakes to speak of) seems to be the secret.

It is essential to have the plastic V-brakes flopping out sideways and the rusty cable tied to the bars. Wheel braking (as opposed to foot-braking) is a major cause of problems when riding on ice.

My preferences for snow and ice riding are the following. Proper ice is something else, but never encountered on my regular commute in over 20 years riding.

'cross bike, with regular mud tyres run soft. Pretty secure-feeling on compacted snow, but maybe I've been lucky. Don't touch front brake.

'cross bike with studded tyres. Obviously.

Brompton. Drop saddle real low and use feet as outriggers on descents. Platform pedals allow for rapid foot-dab response in likely case of small-wheels squirming all over the place in snowy ruts. Not far to fall, can also bail out and get train. Don't touch front brake.

MTB with soft kobblies, drop saddle as above. Best you can do if you don't have a BSO of your own (why not? snow bike for the price of a saddle). Don't touch front brake.

[Palinurus]

I, also, do not like riding fixed in wintry conditions. Even in nice fresh, undriven-upon, snow.

[CrinklyLion]

I found out today that a colleague had a proper nasty off on the ice, on an untreated cycle path AFAIK, earlier in the week.  Lots of bruising, very nasty cut on head, broken finger and elbow 

[The Seldom Killer]

Anyway, this thread needs ^_SCIENCE - I propose an assortment of well-padded YACFers with increasingly inappropriate steeds and an icy carpark for round 1.  Then we can have a ford with frozen approach roads to wipe the smug grin off whoever brought the recumbent trike.  Guaranteed Youtube hit.

This is the sort of ^_SCIENCE that is good ^_SCIENCE and I am foolhardy enough to attempt to ride any bike on ice. In fact if someone can freeze a folded Brompton into a solid cube of ice I will attempt to ride this as well.

[GruB]

I found out today that a colleague had a proper nasty off on the ice, on an untreated cycle path AFAIK, earlier in the week.  Lots of bruising, very nasty cut on head, broken finger and elbow 

Yeah but what sort of bike were they on