The Grumble Thread - No energy for a full on rant.

[arabella]

(Assume I quoted all the other posts on this subject just beforehand)

I disagree with the notion that flashing front lights do not help with safety.

There's nothing like a bright flashing front light to get attention from drivers, particularly those waiting to pull out from sideboards. I use one all the time now because I think they are more visible than bright clothing.

Rear flashers too. I'm not particularly sold on the ability to judge distance as being that important. Its far more important that a driver sees you from as far away as possible so that they can factor you into their calculations. As I driver, I appreciate it when cyclists have bright flashing lights.

I agree that bright lights on cycleways are both unnecessary and annoying. Less so on the road, particularly the sort of rural/urban commuting I do where Im unlikely to have anyone on my wheel. I wouldn't use a flashing rear in a group ride at night of any sort, and on the basis of having a group of front lights I tend to turn the front flash off at night on group rides.

I completely agree with every single part of this^
I'll add that I'm confident flashing lights will be seen illuminating hedges & trees far more reliably than a static light alerting oncoming drivers when you are still obscured round a bend.  My flasher is always on my head not on the bars and I look down as soon as the oncoming driver dips their lights.

I did a load of research into this earlier in the year for AUK AGM purposes.   
Anyone in AUK can see it on the AUK forum (log into AUK, scroll down to the bottom and clicky on the forum link, look for this year's AGM resolution 1 - of course you will have done so already in the run up to the AGM, but there are further comments since)
Anyone else let me know.
TLDR: minimal/no evidence that flashing lights are "safer", plenty of stuff to say that flashing lights cause problems for a number of people - including motorists.

Please only use lights in steady mode, wherever you are (and make sure they're pointing in a sensible direction for your fellow cyclists).

[SoreTween]

OK, will do.  Always open to the possibility of being wrong.

[Kim]

I very occasionally consider it appropriate to use a flashing front light to make it clearer that I'm a cyclist.  Usually this involves  a) daylight  2) apocalyptic rain/snow/fog  iii) not being in a group.  Sometimes I even have a light that's capable of flashing available (my preferred dynamo lighting doesn't).

I'll use a flashing rear as a supplemental light when riding alone in urban conditions, but mainly on the two-is-one-one-is-none principle.  You don't need that in a group when there's someone who can tell you that your rear light is b0rked, and they're more likely to be helpful if you're not dazzling them.

I've no idea why anyone would think that a flashing front light in the dark is a safety benefit.  The most likely outcome is that you faceplant into some unseen kerb/pothole/bin/bollard/badger because you're seeing the world in strobe-o-vision.

[JonBuoy]

I use the cheap LED front lamp on my shopping bike in steady mode although I would possibly use it in flashing mode in busy urban situations.  I cannot perceive any flicker but it obviously does as at certain speeds my front wheel appears to stop and even go backwards.  I find this fascinating and while I am watching this I am indeed more likely to run into a kerb/pothole/bin/bollard/badger 

[Hot Flatus]

Please only use lights in steady mode, wherever you are

No.

[MattH]

My preferred has been steady on the front, steady on the rear, with backup capable of flashing, more because it's a battery LED that just does. In poor conditions I'd have the flashing on at the same time as the steady. But I'll read Arabella's stuff with interest. I've only once had real problems following a flashing light; it was a forumite (who shall remain nameless, because it really doesn't matter) on a dark part of Mille Cymru in the rain and low cloud. In the conditions I became unable to actually see the road, with glare from the water on my glasses starbursting the really bright flash and had to drop a long way back so I had a clear view again.

The other time I've had issues with someone's lighting was a steady front. The lad I was riding with had brigher-than-the-sun mountain bike lighting on his bike, and it meant I was riding in my own shadow, and didn't see a road feature so hit the kerb hard, taking out a tyre.

[Hot Flatus]

Again, it's of little advantage to have flashing lights in a group and the potential disadvantages outweigh the potential benefits. 

I remember jwo asking me to turn off the flashing light on Mille Cymru. I didn't object...I had hundreds of miles in my legs, was knackered, and appreciative of having my attention drawn to it. It ought be be part of the culture where a polite request is treated as such.

I haven't read Arabella's posts on what research she has read. I might later. It is something I have looked into previously and found research to be scant and flawed.  It tends to be undergraduate of postgraduate projects. Inconclusive at best. The lack of research does not support either side of the debate.

[Regulator]

Are we going to have to have a Lights sub-section to go with the Helmet sub-section...?

[The Family Cyclist]

Are we going to have to have a Lights sub-section to go with the Helmet sub-section...?

Well obviously as all this stupid talk around battery lights isn't necessary as you should all have a nice dynamo light with a lovely beam pattern fitted and corresponding dynamo lit rear light

[Regulator]

Are we going to have to have a Lights sub-section to go with the Helmet sub-section...?

Well obviously as all this stupid talk around battery lights isn't necessary as you should all have a nice dynamo light with a lovely beam pattern fitted and corresponding dynamo lit rear light

Ah - I see the representative for the Judean Peoples Front has turned up...

[Mr Larrington]

“Oh bother!” exclaimed Mr Larrington.  “I fear my Perfectly Good Gentleman’s Mountain Bicycling shoes have passed beyond the ability of commercially-available adhesives to repair!”

[T42]

MrsT proved by involuntary demonstration yesterday that her phone was not shockproof.  To furnish a new one, Orange required order confirmation by text message via her inoperable phone. Cue muggins surrendering a pint of blood to Amazon for a new one. Heigh ho.

[PhilO]

MrsT proved by involuntary demonstration yesterday that her phone was not shockproof.  To furnish a new one, Orange required order confirmation by text message via her inoperable phone. Cue muggins surrendering a pint of blood to Amazon for a new one. Heigh ho.

Shirley that just requires the sim from the defunct phone to be inserted into A.N.Other device?  Or am I missing something (entirely possible!)?

[Cudzoziemiec]

When I first got a Hope Vision 1 (which I still have, in fact), I experimented with using it in flash mode. I found the mere reflection of the flash on an overcast day disorienting. In fact, possibly worse than looking at it from the front. So I didn't use it in that mode again.

As for flashing rear, I'll use one when I have to ride on a fast, busy road. It's never occurred to me to use it in an urban area; and there are enough cyclists riding around town with no lights at all, or with just a rear light or just front, or a red light at the front, or various other unorthodox combos, and somehow everyone sees them.

[hellymedic]

David’s rear tyre has deflated, for reasons as yet unknown.

Removing the rear wheel and changing the tube will be a PITA, given there are disc brakes and hub gears.

Expect frustration. Imagine tube has failed.

Await events...

[Beardy]

I’ve used a small flashing rear in conjunction with a larger stead rear when I’ve cycled on country roads. I’ve never felt the urge to try a flashing front though.

[T42]

MrsT proved by involuntary demonstration yesterday that her phone was not shockproof.  To furnish a new one, Orange required order confirmation by text message via her inoperable phone. Cue muggins surrendering a pint of blood to Amazon for a new one. Heigh ho.

Shirley that just requires the sim from the defunct phone to be inserted into A.N.Other device?  Or am I missing something (entirely possible!)?

No, you're right.  Given the right adapter.

[Mr Larrington]

So.  Farewell then… by Mr Larrington, on Flickr

[T42]

MrsT proved by involuntary demonstration yesterday that her phone was not shockproof.  To furnish a new one, Orange required order confirmation by text message via her inoperable phone. Cue muggins surrendering a pint of blood to Amazon for a new one. Heigh ho.

Shirley that just requires the sim from the defunct phone to be inserted into A.N.Other device?  Or am I missing something (entirely possible!)?

No, you're right.  Given the right adapter.

And new phone had the right size "slot" in the tray.  Job done.

[Kim]

So.  Farewell then… by Mr Larrington, on Flickr

Well that's a rubbish.  And what's more, have you seen the state of modern mountain bicycling shoes?  They've all turned into plastic roadie nonsense.

[Paul]

So.  Farewell then… by Mr Larrington, on Flickr

Well that's a rubbish.  And what's more, have you seen the state of modern mountain bicycling shoes?  They've all turned into plastic roadie nonsense.

I blame the soleless corporations.

[robgul]

So.  Farewell then… by Mr Larrington, on Flickr

Think up a hard-luck/tear-jerker story and take them to the Repair Shop - the cobbler guy will get them back to look like new!

[Canardly]

Spread soil out on groundsheet to dry so can use riddle. And then it rains.......again and again and ag....

[rower40]

So.  Farewell then… by Mr Larrington, on Flickr

Think up a hard-luck/tear-jerker story and take them to the Repair Shop - the cobbler guy will get them back to look like new!

I suggest you get several quotes for repair, and post them here. Everyone here likes reading through a load of old cobblers.

[T42]

Spread soil out on groundsheet to dry so can use riddle. And then it rains.......again and again and ag....

Meteo Blue gives you handy animated rain maps and also works in Englandshire.

https://www.meteoblue.com