Post by: willpom gwraudax on 28 November, 2022, 02:17:51 pm
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/o7wz2tuhz1ysu9x/BCMsocial.jpg?raw=1) (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/)
Old discussions can be found here (https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=104545.msg2761712#new).
Post by: TomAplomb on 28 November, 2022, 05:09:06 pm
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 01 December, 2022, 09:22:48 am
Post by: Ian H on 01 December, 2022, 10:34:17 am
entered, and I didn't have to go hunting round the house for a chequebook
Where's the fun in that?
Post by: Ajax Bay on 04 February, 2023, 10:13:50 pm
Entries will open on 1st December - click image for details and entry."600km cycling event starting from Chepstow. Controls at Bronllys, Llangurig, Dolgellau, Menai Bridge, Dolgellau, Aberdyfi and Chepstow, plus 2 information controls."
Old discussions can be found here (https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=104545.msg2761712#new).
https://www.audax.uk/event-details/10222-bryan_chapman_memorial
https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/
"This long distance cycling event is a journey the length of Wales from Chepstow to Menai Bridge and back."
NW and up Usk Valley; left-flanking round the Black Mountains; N to Staylittle via Llangurig;over the Machynlleth Mountain Road and N to Dolgellau (Kings YH for food); across Barmouth Bridge N through Harlech into Snowdonia. From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis to Menai Bridge 'half way' control (food).
West of Snowdon and in darkness back to Kings YH - sleep options either here or at the next control at Aberdyfi; E to Newtown; then an easy climb up and over to Knighton and Presteigne and SE then S to the Wye: great finish passing Tintern Abbey back to Chepstow.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 05 February, 2023, 02:02:57 pm
From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis
???
Post by: Lightning Phil on 05 February, 2023, 02:15:23 pm
Post by: tonyh on 05 February, 2023, 02:46:59 pm
There also be those rather vicious stone walls...
...and the Cromlech Boulders might spring out at you if you were hallucinating.
Post by: mattc on 05 February, 2023, 06:56:43 pm
There be dragons 🐉…If Wycombewheeler didn't see them, he was probably asleep. A lucky escape, I hope he thanks the gods (/dragons) the next time he passes through.
Post by: Hot Flatus on 05 February, 2023, 07:34:41 pm
From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis
???
That's not the scary one.
The scary one is the plummet on day 2 to Dinas Mawdddy
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 06 February, 2023, 01:01:57 am
maybe they were disguised as sheep, very cunning.There be dragons 🐉…If Wycombewheeler didn't see them, he was probably asleep. A lucky escape, I hope he thanks the gods (/dragons) the next time he passes through.
Post by: Jasmine on 08 February, 2023, 08:42:53 am
From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis
???
That's not the scary one.
The scary one is the plummet on day 2 to Dinas Mawdddy
Looks like the new route won't go down that one. From Dolgellau the return leg now goes to the coast at Aberdyfi (which is a really lovely route if the weather is kind).
Coming down that road from Cross Foxes to Dinas Mawddwy is the fastest I've ever been on a bike - 67mph on a tandem. I'd agree that is a scarier descent than down Pen y Pass, except that PyP has an s-bend over a bridge in the middle of the descent, which is extremely hairy at speed on a tandem.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 08 February, 2023, 10:13:38 am
Judging by my past experience of cycling in Wales (2xBCM, 2x brevet Cymru, lakes and snowdon, Dragon Ride, acme grand) suncream will be in more demand than rain jackets*, so I'll look forward to that. Also, living far from the sea, any road by the coast is a treat.
Looks like the new route won't go down that one. From Dolgellau the return leg now goes to the coast at Aberdyfi (which is a really lovely route if the weather is kind).
*heavy rain sometimes occurs, but majority of rides are warm and sunny. I remember being drenched on the last climb of BCM, only to descend into chepstow to find the roads bone dry and locals cycling in short sleeves.
Post by: Ian H on 08 February, 2023, 10:41:31 am
Judging by my past experience of cycling in Wales (2xBCM, 2x brevet Cymru, lakes and snowdon, Dragon Ride, acme grand) suncream will be in more demand than rain jackets*, so I'll look forward to that. Also, living far from the sea, any road by the coast is a treat.
Looks like the new route won't go down that one. From Dolgellau the return leg now goes to the coast at Aberdyfi (which is a really lovely route if the weather is kind).
*heavy rain sometimes occurs, but majority of rides are warm and sunny. I remember being drenched on the last climb of BCM, only to descend into chepstow to find the roads bone dry and locals cycling in short sleeves.
There's usually more than one kind of weather on a long event.
Post by: Nuncio on 08 February, 2023, 01:09:00 pm
Bikey-Mikey came a-cropper coming down there 12 or so years ago, and was hospitalized. Can't remember the cause.From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis???
And I remember a Devon rider's brakes becoming ineffective in the wet, and her riding partner (Richard from Cardiff?) having to catch up with her to pull her to slow her down before that bend/bridge. I can't remember her name now. Ian H probably can.
To state the obvious, it's a different descent in the gloom (or dark) when you might be beginning to tire, than it is in the light and dry, or when you're refreshed (after two hours fitful sleep on the floor of the YH common room, lungs full of fart vapour). It's been a while, but I think I used to be able to let myself go down the Dinas Mawddy descent in a way which I couldn't on the other. Never got anywhere 67mph but I remember one occasion a strong gust through a gap in a hedge forced a sudden re-appraisal of my optimum speed.
Post by: Bairdy on 27 February, 2023, 08:44:00 pm
Bikey-Mikey came a-cropper coming down there 12 or so years ago, and was hospitalized. Can't remember the cause.From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis???
He never got to the bottom of the cause, it wasn't on the descent it was beyond that nearer to the Vaynol Arms.
I was up there on a walking holiday a week later and there were road works along that section, so it was quite narrow in places. I think it was 2012.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 21 April, 2023, 03:21:28 pm
Entries will open on 1st December - click image for details and entry.
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/o7wz2tuhz1ysu9x/BCMsocial.jpg?raw=1) (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/)
Old discussions can be found here (https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=104545.msg2761712#new).
25 spaces remain on the Bryan Chapman Memorial 600 BRM. Entries close evening of Sunday 7th May. Once full I'll run a waiting list with the same criteria I've used before: you join the waiting list as if you enter; if someone drops out you are automatically added in order of joining; if a space becomes available after the Wednesday before the event I'll contact you to check first and if not pass it on to the next; a full refund will be given to all that don't get a space from the waiting list.
**UPDATE** Innage Farm (for the start)
Camping Friday night: £7 tent - £10 van
Parking Saturday & Sunday: £5
Post by: vorsprung on 21 April, 2023, 09:48:42 pm
Bikey-Mikey came a-cropper coming down there 12 or so years ago, and was hospitalized. Can't remember the cause.From Pen y Pass the scary descent to/past Llanberis???
I was there and I don't think anyone knows the cause. It is a fast descent and there are often odd lumps of stone in the road. Just take it easy and it's fast and fun
Post by: vorsprung on 21 April, 2023, 09:51:48 pm
Looks like the new route won't go down that one. From Dolgellau the return leg now goes to the coast at Aberdyfi (which is a really lovely route if the weather is kind).
Judging by my past experience of cycling in Wales (2xBCM, 2x brevet Cymru, lakes and snowdon, Dragon Ride, acme grand) suncream will be in more demand than rain jackets
HAHAHA
Post by: Hot Flatus on 21 April, 2023, 09:55:07 pm
Unlikely to be wall to wall sunshine.
Post by: TomAplomb on 22 April, 2023, 10:25:24 am
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 22 April, 2023, 10:48:34 am
Final checks will be done on the helpers ride 2 weeks prior and any amendments made. Everyone who has signed up will then have access to GPX route with control WPs, fully curated route notes in PDF & CSV, through RWGPS Event (even with a free subscription) you'll also get all premium features so FIT, TCX, KML, PDF notes+map inserts, ability to sync with other devices, use of the RWGPS app with offline maps & voice nav etc etc.
Post by: vorsprung on 22 April, 2023, 04:31:43 pm
Does anyone have a rough route?
I had a look at it earlier but the route over view isn't there atm
My vague impression which might be wrong is that the route follows the old 2004 route to Abergavenny, Talgath, Builth Wells, Rhayder mainly on A roads. At the RBT near Llangurig it goes R inland to Llanidoes and we are off the classic route. Machynlleth then I guess it goes N past the renewable energy place over the top to Cross Foxes. Then down to Kings YHA.
Then there is a loop to Menai
Outbound it's Penrhyndeudraeth, Beddgelert, Llanberis. Coming back via the A4085 to Beddgelert, then Penrhyndeudraeth but back via the A470 to Dolgellau
Then you have a kip at Kings YHA
Getting back to Chepstow is slightly different to other routes because there is the novel use of the coast road to Aberdyfi. Then it goes back to Machynlleth, then Newtown and cuts towards just below Hereford.
I would imagine that this section will be a bit difficult.
The road it joins near Hereford is a series of large hills going to Monmouth which sounds grim but it's really nice.
Can't remember how it goes after Monmouth but there are various nice routes back to Chepstow including along the A road and past the race course
It's an new route but I think it could be a good one, if a little hillier than some :)
Post by: Graeme on 22 April, 2023, 05:02:01 pm
https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/
Post by: mattc on 22 April, 2023, 07:26:58 pm
The outline is on the event page. https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/ (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/)Good stuff!
Final checks will be done on the helpers ride 2 weeks prior and any amendments made. Everyone who has signed up will then have access to GPX route with control WPs, fully curated route notes in PDF & CSV, through RWGPS Event (even with a free subscription) you'll also get all premium features so FIT, TCX, KML, PDF notes+map inserts, ability to sync with other devices, use of the RWGPS app with offline maps & voice nav etc etc.
Can you please explain how you expect to run the Start Time Allocation? (4am-6am is mentioned). I've been dead honest with my estimated riding speed, it would be nice to plan with actual start time in mind - 4am is very different to 6am! :P
(This may start an LEL-style gamification of the system ... )
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 22 April, 2023, 11:35:41 pm
It's an new route but I think it could be a good one, if a little hillier than some :)
No hillier than Ritchie's iteration as you get the easy coast road to Aberdyfi.
The outline is on the event page. https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/ (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/)Good stuff!
Final checks will be done on the helpers ride 2 weeks prior and any amendments made. Everyone who has signed up will then have access to GPX route with control WPs, fully curated route notes in PDF & CSV, through RWGPS Event (even with a free subscription) you'll also get all premium features so FIT, TCX, KML, PDF notes+map inserts, ability to sync with other devices, use of the RWGPS app with offline maps & voice nav etc etc.
Can you please explain how you expect to run the Start Time Allocation? (4am-6am is mentioned). I've been dead honest with my estimated riding speed, it would be nice to plan with actual start time in mind - 4am is very different to 6am! :P
(This may start an LEL-style gamification of the system ... )
Those with the fasted av speed will set off at 4am, slowest at 6am. I'm working on a bit of trust as by doing this the field spreads out and everyone (should) get a bed rather than on top of bags, between armchairs etc at Kings. So if you selected a lantern rouge (Bill's Easton Connection spring to mind ;) ) speed it'll be 6am - unless everyone else selects lantern rouge speed too....
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 23 April, 2023, 11:24:45 pm
Those with the fasted av speed will set off at 4am,
makes sense, no time for breakfast if you set off at 4 ;D
what's the sleeping arrangement at Aberdyfi? Deciding between organising my own B&B either at Machynleth (ambitious) or Penrhyndeudraeth* (early start to make Kings by 06:52) or sleeping at Aberdyfi, looking to get a least 4 hours, as I find that any less means a series of roadside naps, no time saving and less safe. Previously at Kings I wasn't allowed so much.
*A BnB at a place we visit twice allows checking in northbound, allowing for late arrival on the southbound leg, this frees up bed capacity at the controls for others.
Don't remember putting an average speed down, so will await to see my allocated start time.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 24 April, 2023, 10:59:20 am
Airbeds & blankets at Aberdyfi. Going to be about 90 sleeping spaces in total between here and Kings so the plan is to allow everyone to get a better kip. Pushing the first faster riders on to Aberdyfi as they'll be arriving earlier at Kings earlier anyway, then fill Kings and as Aberdyfi empties push the later mid cohort on to their so the slower riders get a bed at Kings as the first awake.
Post by: tonyh on 24 April, 2023, 12:17:15 pm
Looks excellent, Will! Wishing you and everyone well for that Weekend.
(And, speaking from experience, the really slow riders don't need a bed anywhere anyway.)
Post by: WillR35 on 26 April, 2023, 04:07:43 pm
Parking - says it is at the local farm; do you just turn up at (5am), pay your £5 and off you go.
Registration - is it all on teh Sat am or wil there be a FRiday night option?
Cheers
Post by: Ajax Bay on 26 April, 2023, 05:05:47 pm
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/42677419
233km +2766m, to complement 376km getting there.
Of course for those starting at 4am and riding keenly, this will be all over with a (new)moonless night between sunset (2113) and sunrise (0510).
https://app.photoephemeris.com/?center=52.730471%2C-3.933792&ch=0&cw=100&dt=20230520040700%200100&ll=52.725689%2C-3.950958&sh=1.524&sw=100&z=13
https://app.photoephemeris.com/?center=51.632403%2C-2.673454&ch=0&cw=100&dt=20230521040700%200100&ll=51.628034%2C-2.676029&sh=1.524&sw=100&z=13
Post by: TomAplomb on 03 May, 2023, 11:08:13 am
Post by: iscunonove on 03 May, 2023, 12:12:07 pm
Do we know if it's alright to leave a bag at the start at Bulwark community centre?I'm pretty sure it is... it says there is secur(ish) luggage storage on the Audax UK webpage and I left a bag last year. Wouldn't leave valuables though.
Post by: vorsprung on 06 May, 2023, 06:00:14 pm
Do we know if it's alright to leave a bag at the start at Bulwark community centre?
I doubt it as that isn't the start
Post by: mattc on 06 May, 2023, 06:03:26 pm
Reaally? That's frustrfating ... the event page I'm seeing says this under Start/FinishDo we know if it's alright to leave a bag at the start at Bulwark community centre?
I doubt it as that isn't the start
START:
Please arrive at least 10 minutes before the depart time to collect your brevet card.
Bulwark Community Centre - opens new tab for map.
Laburnam Way, Bulwark, Chepstow, Monmouthshire, NP16 5RF, Wales
Post by: Bikeabilityman on 06 May, 2023, 06:41:35 pm
Post by: vorsprung on 06 May, 2023, 07:48:26 pm
Reaally? That's frustrfating ... the event page I'm seeing says this under Start/Finish
START:
Please arrive at least 10 minutes before the depart time to collect your brevet card.
Bulwark Community Centre - opens new tab for map.
Laburnam Way, Bulwark, Chepstow, Monmouthshire, NP16 5RF, Wales
I could be wrong, but I get the impression that the start will be the campsite that they have hired.
The hall is back in action this weekend for coronation nonsense, so probably whatever stopped the Brevet Cymru doesn't apply
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 07 May, 2023, 08:20:42 am
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/41370398?privacy_code=EE2wG4547YcVH7xo
as is the GWR event page
https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 07 May, 2023, 11:12:43 am
Bags can be left at the hall.
There will be bag drops to Kings, Menai & Aberdyfi; although I'd highly recommend anyone doing PBP to not use this facility to test your kit setup (other than any sleeping stuff if you want to bed down at Menai or camp at Kings). Bags will be returned to Bulwark once I get back in the van which in all likelihood will be mid afternoonish.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 10 May, 2023, 12:58:24 am
Entries from Tuesday 10th onwards are a 05:00 start.
All the specifics will be updated on the event page (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/) over the next few days, you need to log in to view.
Post by: Hot Flatus on 10 May, 2023, 07:12:20 am
Post by: vorsprung on 10 May, 2023, 08:46:15 am
Which is good because it's unlikely i would be starting any earlier. The earliest I ever finished the BCM was at 6pm so I am not a fast person
This is my 11th or 12th BCM though so never mind the quality, feel the width
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 10 May, 2023, 09:11:00 am
I'm surprised I am not in the 6am group with my slow performance on Will's other rides (Chalke and cheese and full fat festive 500), still improves my chances of making Menai before sunset.
Sunrise is 5:11 in Chepstow on the 20th.
sunset in Menai is 21:17
Looking forward to some new roads after Kings, got to be better than following a line of red lights disappearing into the sky
Email states to use the side gate not the vehicle entrance from Laburnum Way. presumably either this alleyway from Channel View?
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.6285104,-2.6762606,3a,90y,175.62h,74.72t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1skrlNz_mTyvstm3zHhIek_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
or this passage from Cromwell Road
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.6275048,-2.6758498,3a,75y,333.04h,94.56t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDFzFslzY2MLvuUuyCINxqA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Post by: haywire on 10 May, 2023, 11:58:26 am
Post by: Byronius Maximus on 10 May, 2023, 01:12:45 pm
Looking forward to it. My only other riding of the BCM was in 2013 and I thoroughly enjoyed it. Fingers crossed the weather isn't too Welsh.
Post by: Flatlander on 10 May, 2023, 08:52:08 pm
Makes Sunday more relaxing as well, GWR failed to get me a bike reservation home leaving Bristol after 16:55 so I was slightly worried about Sunday finish timing but with a 4am start, no problem.
Happy ;D and looking forward to it. Wonder if there's going to be a hail storm at the top of a hill somewhere? ::-)
Post by: Ian H on 10 May, 2023, 11:40:45 pm
6am start time for me, must be a fast field (though it's not a race of course)...I can't remember what average speed estimation I put but I'm surprised it was as low as that would imply. I must have been having a negative day or something. Still, it means I get a "lie in" at least.
Looking forward to it. My only other riding of the BCM was in 2013 and I thoroughly enjoyed it. Fingers crossed the weather isn't too Welsh.
My first time was 1993. It seems like quite a long time ago.
Post by: N0rb3rt on 15 May, 2023, 01:25:50 am
Post by: thing1 on 15 May, 2023, 12:39:19 pm
Silly question - BCM'23 is an ADVISORY route event isn't it?
(I was surprised for find BC400 was mandatory. Surprised in the sense that I would have thought I'd have noticed before week of event, not in the sense of being disappointed, I really don't mind either way just like to be sure I know before I set off! --- I think the AUK website could use an update to add "Route: [Advisory | Mandatory]" to the "Event Information" on all events. Right now I can't see where this would be displayed on https://www.audax.uk/event-details/10222-bryan_chapman_memorial nor https://www.audax.uk/event-details/9914-brevet_cymru so it's a bit adhoc where to look to find this info)
Post by: bhoot on 15 May, 2023, 01:11:54 pm
Post by: JonB on 15 May, 2023, 01:29:16 pm
'The route is advisory - you just have to visit the controls and gain proof of passage within time limits where specified; there may be parts that you'd like to take a different route and that is entirely up to you; the time limits for the controls don't change!'
Post by: thing1 on 15 May, 2023, 02:05:44 pm
Will's GWR website has the route as advisory with the following text under 'type and validation'
'The route is advisory - you just have to visit the controls and gain proof of passage within time limits where specified; there may be parts that you'd like to take a different route and that is entirely up to you; the time limits for the controls don't change!'
Thank you! I was searching under Details->General and Details->Route but didn't spot it on Overview. (Why I generally prefer one big webpage I can Ctrl-F on over having many sub-tabs to dig through)
Post by: thing1 on 15 May, 2023, 02:07:15 pm
There is a way to display it on the events if it is marked correctly in the database - I will check why it wasn't showing for BC400 in case we have missed something.
Sounds good!
Just to clarify my suggestion: this should be displayed on all events (inc Advisory routes too), not just mandatory ones, to make it clear and avoid any incorrect assumption in the case of no-information being displayed.
Post by: bhoot on 15 May, 2023, 02:39:47 pm
I guess we have never shown specific wording for advisory as that is the "norm" in the UK so we have only flagged by exception. We can certainly look at always providing information in future (we have a new events planner in development so it could be tied into that).
Post by: Ian H on 15 May, 2023, 03:07:05 pm
There is a way to display it on the events if it is marked correctly in the database - I will check why it wasn't showing for BC400 in case we have missed something.
It wasn't marked as mandatory in the organiser's event page.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 15 May, 2023, 04:04:15 pm
There is a way to display it on the events if it is marked correctly in the database - I will check why it wasn't showing for BC400 in case we have missed something.
Sounds good!
Just to clarify my suggestion: this should be displayed on all events (inc Advisory routes too), not just mandatory ones, to make it clear and avoid any incorrect assumption in the case of no-information being displayed.
agree, I would suggest in the event information box a heading Route followed by "mandatory" or "advisory" as appropriate
Post by: αdαmsκι on 15 May, 2023, 10:16:15 pm
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 16 May, 2023, 11:19:34 am
An easier solution would be to make all AUK calendar events mandatory routing :demon:
But we can't be trusted not to cheat, so this would need secret controls on every event, at cost of volunteers time.
Also there would be a backlash from those that think they can improve the route (often by smashing along busy main roads).
But mandatory routing on all events would be great if it meant no more requirement for over distance rides.
Post by: TomAplomb on 16 May, 2023, 11:47:09 am
I've got a 4am start, so hopefully will get to Aberdyfi for a few hours sleep.
It's tempting to try and push on through the night, but it will probably won't be far off zero degrees in the rural valleys near Newtown...
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 16 May, 2023, 02:40:17 pm
Weather looking good.
I've got a 4am start, so hopefully will get to Aberdyfi for a few hours sleep.
It's tempting to try and push on through the night, but it will probably won't be far off zero degrees in the rural valleys near Newtown...
Unless there is a 24 hour garage in Newtown, that's a long way between resupply as well. The route out of Newtown towards Knighton is pretty remote, start at 4, arrive at Aberdyfi around midnight, without a sleep, that's potentially 6.5 hours before being able to buy supplies, potentially at Weobly at 530km.
Post by: Byronius Maximus on 16 May, 2023, 03:08:14 pm
Post by: Ian H on 16 May, 2023, 03:13:10 pm
An easier solution would be to make all AUK calendar events mandatory routing :demon:
But we can't be trusted not to cheat, so this would need secret controls on every event, at cost of volunteers time.
Also there would be a backlash from those that think they can improve the route (often by smashing along busy main roads).
But mandatory routing on all events would be great if it meant no more requirement for over distance rides.
Mandatory routing would not give you the freedom to draw wiggly lines all over the map. Shortest sensible/safe distance between controls would still apply.
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 16 May, 2023, 03:13:46 pm
Post by: stuartm9999 on 16 May, 2023, 08:06:19 pm
Why? Other countries can mandate a longer (than the shortest) route between controls.
Most countries use ACP/BRM rules. Article 8 says follow the route. https://www.audax-club-parisien.com/en/our-organizations/brm-world/#rules
Post by: Ian H on 16 May, 2023, 10:20:23 pm
Why? Other countries can mandate a longer (than the shortest) route between controls.
This is the relevant rule -
Quote
Les contrôles doivent être judicieusement placés, par exemple aux changements de direction, avec trajet
à peu près direct entre deux contrôles.
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 16 May, 2023, 10:40:33 pm
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 16 May, 2023, 10:56:05 pm
This is the relevant rule -QuoteLes contrôles doivent être judicieusement placés, par exemple aux changements de direction, avec trajet
à peu près direct entre deux contrôles.
almost direct =/= the shortest possible route between controls.
so if the route is 201km, but it is possible to visit the controls in 195km by riding on a 70mph dual carriageway, this would not breach the text your quoted, but would not comply with AUK requirements. So we end up with routes that are often 207km or more, but no extra time for that extra distance under BRM rules because BRMs would not be expected to be significantly over distance.
Indeed you can get from Brest to Rambouillet visiting all the controls in significantly less than 600km (google maps walking), but that doesn't mater as the route is mandatory. Even setting to google maps cycling still comes up under distance. (Rambouilet to Brest would be shorter still due to not needing to visit Dreux (Or Mortagne au Perche))
There is a huge gap between drawing wiggly lines over the map and a rigorous application of shortest possible distance, especially using route measurement by walking which often includes footpaths across fields
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 17 May, 2023, 06:20:49 am
Post by: Hot Flatus on 17 May, 2023, 06:29:19 am
It never changes
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 17 May, 2023, 09:59:14 am
Perhaps a new thread is needed to discuss the rules and regs of mandatory routes and over distance.
sorry, back on topic
With the request not to park in Bulwark, I shall be parking in passage road in Aust, in a throwback to Severn bridge toll times,
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 17 May, 2023, 10:29:24 am
Perhaps a new thread is needed to discuss the rules and regs of mandatory routes and over distance.
You can ask the mods to separate out those posts from this thread.
Post by: vorsprung on 17 May, 2023, 11:17:29 am
;D ;D ;D
It never changes
BCM used to run with different routes, on the same day. You picked one
I remember one year there was an alternate route on the BCM that went right into Anglesea to "make up the distance". Only trouble was that it didn't need too make up any distance so it ended up somewhat over
Post by: Ivan on 17 May, 2023, 11:40:16 am
Post by: Hot Flatus on 17 May, 2023, 11:41:34 am
Post by: thing1 on 17 May, 2023, 11:51:13 am
https://mywindsock.com/uploads/10553940/?&plid=26527&share_time=1684548000#forecast=1684551600
55% tailwind, no rain.
Post by: TomAplomb on 17 May, 2023, 12:27:23 pm
Weather looking good.
I've got a 4am start, so hopefully will get to Aberdyfi for a few hours sleep.
It's tempting to try and push on through the night, but it will probably won't be far off zero degrees in the rural valleys near Newtown...
Unless there is a 24 hour garage in Newtown, that's a long way between resupply as well. The route out of Newtown towards Knighton is pretty remote, start at 4, arrive at Aberdyfi around midnight, without a sleep, that's potentially 6.5 hours before being able to buy supplies, potentially at Weobly at 530km.
That's what puts me off going through the night tbh.
There appears to be a 24 hour garage at Newtown, but not guaranteed. There's also a McDonalds that opens at 6am in Newtown, so it probably best to sleep a bit and then aim to get to breakfast there.
Post by: javier on 17 May, 2023, 12:56:23 pm
Also according to Google Maps none of the garages are 24hr
Post by: Philip D on 17 May, 2023, 01:13:56 pm
I only rode this event once but have fond memories.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 17 May, 2023, 01:23:05 pm
According to Google Maps (https://goo.gl/maps/3vKZVfas4LELe92v9) the McDonald's in Newton opens 24h on Saturday and from 5am to 11pm on Sunday.That is interesting. as long as they are properly open, and not only open for selling to people in cars.
Also according to Google Maps none of the garages are 24hr
Post by: stuartm9999 on 17 May, 2023, 03:27:54 pm
Be nice to get the status of this verified.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 17 May, 2023, 03:28:07 pm
That is interesting. as long as they are properly open, and not only open for selling to people in cars.I've just called them and they are open from 05:00 for sit in.
Strangely the shop and drive - which apears to be the same thing - https://www.google.com/maps/place/Shop'n'Drive/@52.5147417,-3.3075933,18z/data=!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x486ffdbac915ef5d:0xf85baad9a57d1b31!2sShop'n'Drive!8m2!3d52.5147417!4d-3.306499!10e5!16s%2Fg%2F11fklf7mvw!3m5!1s0x486ffdbac915ef5d:0xf85baad9a57d1b31!8m2!3d52.5147417!4d-3.306499!16s%2Fg%2F11fklf7mvw is marked as 24 hours and a reviewer comments that it is 24 hours 4 months ago.Just called them, it is verified. Shop open 24hr serving from the window, can do coffee etc.
Be nice to get the status of this verified.
I'm trying to get hold of JDs Cafe in Knighton as Google implies they are open from 06:00. Will update if I get a response.
Post by: stuartm9999 on 17 May, 2023, 04:02:44 pm
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 17 May, 2023, 04:07:39 pm
Nice to know pushing straight through is an option, depending on arriving at the start not being sleep deprived.
Forecast for clear skies on Saturday evening and Sunday morning makes for minimal hours of really dark conditions. although likely cold in the night.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 17 May, 2023, 06:34:56 pm
Post by: mattc on 17 May, 2023, 07:06:57 pm
UPDATE sent regarding Menai Bridge control, please check you email.2h after I push everything onto my GPS...
:facepalm:
Post by: N0rb3rt on 17 May, 2023, 07:58:36 pm
(...)
I'm planning to sleep at Aberdyfi.
#1: What kind of sleeping facilities will be available there?
#2: Do I have to bring my own mattress ?
#3: Do I have to bring my own duvet and sheet?
#4: Will be there showering available? If not can I use a tap in the garden to take a shower?
Thanks for the answer.
Post by: Halloween on 17 May, 2023, 10:21:57 pm
Post by: αdαmsκι on 17 May, 2023, 10:33:05 pm
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 17 May, 2023, 11:32:27 pm
but best bet is probably circle line from liverpool street to paddington as Adamski says, bikes are allowed because it is not a deep line, but obviously rush hour crowds would prevent this.
Post by: rogerzilla on 18 May, 2023, 07:57:36 am
You can, but it's a thankless task and we don't have an active board moderator. Would anyone like to volunteer?Perhaps a new thread is needed to discuss the rules and regs of mandatory routes and over distance.
You can ask the mods to separate out those posts from this thread.
Post by: mattc on 18 May, 2023, 10:05:58 am
So can I ask about chain lube for Snowdonia here?You can, but it's a thankless task and we don't have an active board moderator. Would anyone like to volunteer?Perhaps a new thread is needed to discuss the rules and regs of mandatory routes and over distance.
You can ask the mods to separate out those posts from this thread.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 18 May, 2023, 10:26:15 am
Post by: rogerzilla on 18 May, 2023, 10:50:45 am
You can ask about sex lube for Babylonia if you like, but we know where you live ;DSo can I ask about chain lube for Snowdonia here?You can, but it's a thankless task and we don't have an active board moderator. Would anyone like to volunteer?Perhaps a new thread is needed to discuss the rules and regs of mandatory routes and over distance.
You can ask the mods to separate out those posts from this thread.
Post by: Krad on 18 May, 2023, 11:19:39 am
but best bet is probably circle line from liverpool street to paddington as Adamski says, bikes are allowed because it is not a deep line, but obviously rush hour crowds would prevent this.
London on Friday is no longer that busy. Most people wfh, I guess?
Here is a route from station to station.
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/course/161908503
Post by: Halloween on 18 May, 2023, 03:16:42 pm
but best bet is probably circle line from liverpool street to paddington as Adamski says, bikes are allowed because it is not a deep line, but obviously rush hour crowds would prevent this.
London on Friday is no longer that busy. Most people wfh, I guess?
Here is a route from station to station.
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/course/161908503
Thanks for this, does it work in the opposite direction too?
Post by: Krad on 18 May, 2023, 03:58:14 pm
but best bet is probably circle line from liverpool street to paddington as Adamski says, bikes are allowed because it is not a deep line, but obviously rush hour crowds would prevent this.
London on Friday is no longer that busy. Most people wfh, I guess?
Here is a route from station to station.
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/course/161908503
Thanks for this, does it work in the opposite direction too?
In Garmin just edit and flip the route. On the Edge i think you can say Flip or return to start and let it auto calculate. If you follow the track on eTrex you might hit some one ways. But its London and most one ways allow bikes so should not be an issue.
Or get the Elizabeth (cross rail) which is a big train and should have no issue with a bike on it.
Post by: mattc on 18 May, 2023, 06:16:34 pm
I see the official route back to Kings cuts off "Level Crossing corner" by going over a funking great hill.
The BCM Classic went the Long Way*; I'm inclined to do the same, with tired legs and sleep head!
Is that silly?
*i.e. thru Phenrincannotbespelled.
Post by: Hot Flatus on 18 May, 2023, 06:21:15 pm
Post by: Ian H on 18 May, 2023, 06:29:06 pm
(Sorry, nothing to do with London:)
I see the official route back to Kings cuts off "Level Crossing corner" by going over a funking great hill.
The BCM Classic went the Long Way*; I'm inclined to do the same, with tired legs and sleep head!
Is that silly?
*i.e. thru Phenrincannotbespelled.
That route has been explored by Dave Lewis, me, and others. It is substantially slower.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 18 May, 2023, 08:17:29 pm
Post by: thing1 on 18 May, 2023, 08:41:23 pm
(Sorry, nothing to do with London:)
I see the official route back to Kings cuts off "Level Crossing corner" by going over a funking great hill.
The BCM Classic went the Long Way*; I'm inclined to do the same, with tired legs and sleep head!
Is that silly?
*i.e. thru Phenrincannotbespelled.
That route has been explored by Dave Lewis, me, and others. It is substantially slower.
I'm struggling to keep up at the back. By That route, are you saying the longer route or the hillier route is the slower one?
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 18 May, 2023, 09:11:11 pm
(Sorry, nothing to do with London:)
I see the official route back to Kings cuts off "Level Crossing corner" by going over a funking great hill.
The BCM Classic went the Long Way*; I'm inclined to do the same, with tired legs and sleep head!
Is that silly?
*i.e. thru Phenrincannotbespelled.
That route has been explored by Dave Lewis, me, and others. It is substantially slower.
I'm struggling to keep up at the back. By That route, are you saying the longer route or the hillier route is the slower one?
In my experience they are about the same time wise though I can't compare on the same event.
2015 it took me 23 mins the longer way with an overall moving av for the whole route of 23kph. 2 weeks ago it took Banksy 25 mins on the hillier route with an overall av for the whole route of 21.5kph.
If you do the longer watch out for the dodgy oblique poorly marked level crossing in the dark when you are tired round a bend just as you start to descend. Why I've excluded it in that direction.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 18 May, 2023, 09:20:32 pm
Take your pick, time wise probably not much in it. those additional kms will take at least 6 minutes, 100m of climb probably costs about the same, but then much faster on the long downhill.
However, there is a spar shop in Penrhyn~ that is open until 11, likely the last open shop until Newtown for many people. If I got to the junction after 11, I would definitely go over the hill. If I got there before 11 and wanted to buy snacks for the 66km from Aberdyfi to Newtown then I would accept the longer route and the time lost.
Post by: Ajax Bay on 18 May, 2023, 11:00:33 pm
Having spent last Sunday early morning (0152-0438) inside the Newtown McDs, they stay fully open all Saturday night ie all the dark hours, inside and 'drive thru'. The staff kindly came round about 0230 to warn us to expect a swarm of merry people (they called them 'drunks') to descend about 0300 and to think about our bikes. And the rabble duly arrived.According to Google Maps the McDonald's in Newton opens 24h on Saturday and from 5am to 11pm on Sunday.That is interesting. as long as they are properly open, and not only open for selling to people in cars.
The staff were great.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 19 May, 2023, 09:18:24 am
https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/forecast/gcm8dtd3q#?date=2023-05-20
Post by: vorsprung on 19 May, 2023, 09:30:37 am
(...)
I'm planning to sleep at Aberdyfi.
#1: What kind of sleeping facilities will be available there?
#2: Do I have to bring my own mattress ?
#3: Do I have to bring my own duvet and sheet?
#4: Will be there showering available? If not can I use a tap in the garden to take a shower?
Thanks for the answer.
See email subject "ACB | Bryan Chapman Memorial 600 | Bags, Bag Drops & Sleeping Arrangements"
Post by: ransos on 19 May, 2023, 09:47:34 am
Don't forget the suncream
https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/forecast/gcm8dtd3q#?date=2023-05-20
Wow. I'm still going to bring my waterproof!
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 19 May, 2023, 10:39:39 am
of course, always bring both to any ride in Wales. and not just because a waterproof is a lightweight extra layer for keeping warm at night.Don't forget the suncream
https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/forecast/gcm8dtd3q#?date=2023-05-20
Wow. I'm still going to bring my waterproof!
Post by: JonB on 19 May, 2023, 11:25:09 am
. 2 weeks ago it took Banksy 25 mins on the hillier route with an overall av for the whole route of 21.5kph.It was a pig of a climb but you also have to go uphill into the village with the long name on the longer route, I was cursing at the time but I guess it was made up for by the directness. I was on gears but for those on fixed I'd take the longer route.
Post by: TomAplomb on 19 May, 2023, 02:50:20 pm
After checking streetview, it looks like some audaxers outside ;D ;D
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.9541485,-4.066746,3a,75y,50.73h,79.03t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sE2GEJOxCc5-7hQIfnrOcuQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
Post by: N0rb3rt on 19 May, 2023, 05:49:33 pm
Update sent about bags, bag drops and sleeping arrangement - check your email.
Hi Will,
"Showers:I'll update at the start if Aberdyfi's local football club can open theirs"
Any news about this? I'll pack my drop off bags differently based on this option is available or not. Knowing it at the start is too late.
Thanks.
Post by: N0rb3rt on 19 May, 2023, 05:52:34 pm
(...)See email subject "ACB | Bryan Chapman Memorial 600 | Bags, Bag Drops & Sleeping Arrangements"(...)
I've asked that at 7:58pm, email about this arrived at 9:54pm. Thanks.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 19 May, 2023, 08:54:05 pm
At the left turn in Garreg, before the aforementioned climb, there's apparently a little shop open until 10pm.
After checking streetview, it looks like some audaxers outside ;D ;D
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.9541485,-4.066746,3a,75y,50.73h,79.03t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sE2GEJOxCc5-7hQIfnrOcuQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
If I'm there by 10, I'll be chuffed
Post by: mattc on 19 May, 2023, 09:25:32 pm
Thanks.(Sorry, nothing to do with London:)
I see the official route back to Kings cuts off "Level Crossing corner" by going over a funking great hill.
The BCM Classic went the Long Way*; I'm inclined to do the same, with tired legs and sleep head!
Is that silly?
*i.e. thru Phenrincannotbespelled.
That route has been explored by Dave Lewis, me, and others. It is substantially slower.
I'm struggling to keep up at the back. By That route, are you saying the longer route or the hillier route is the slower one?
In my experience they are about the same time wise though I can't compare on the same event.
2015 it took me 23 mins the longer way with an overall moving av for the whole route of 23kph. 2 weeks ago it took Banksy 25 mins on the hillier route with an overall av for the whole route of 21.5kph.
If you do the longer watch out for the dodgy oblique poorly marked level crossing in the dark when you are tired round a bend just as you start to descend. Why I've excluded it in that direction.
I'm extremely relaxed about level crossings - plus I know about this one from previous editions- but I can understand an organiser taking the opposite view.
(Especially as I know riders have come off on this one in years past!)
I reckon I can make it by 11pm ...... ... if I set off now ...
Post by: Hot Flatus on 21 May, 2023, 07:42:08 am
Weather looks utterly brilliant, bright sunshine but not too hot.
Post by: vorsprung on 22 May, 2023, 08:45:28 am
I finished at 9pm so not quick for me despite the great weather. I need to get 10 years younger to put in a better time
The best bit of the new route was the B4404 going towards Newtown from (just north of) Mach, loverly road
Post by: Tom on 22 May, 2023, 08:55:45 am
Post by: Phil Hears A Who on 22 May, 2023, 12:04:34 pm
Very slick organisation all round, especially RE the diversion round the motorbike accident. I was sat at Kings when the news came in about the closure and it was all sorted very calmly and quickly. Kudos to the volunteer team there and at Aberdyfi. I took the detour which I reckon cost about an hour*, but there seemed to be a shortcut through a field organised with a farmer next to the road not long after we went the long way, so couldn't help but feel a little hard-done-by when I arrived at Aberdyfi at the same time as some riders who had taken the shortcut. But all wounds healed with careful application of sausages and beans and a few hours kip.
Big thanks to Will and team.
*Whoever named that road Happy Valley got it all wrong - definitely Grumpy Valley at 1am....
Post by: thing1 on 22 May, 2023, 12:56:02 pm
Quote
but there seemed to be a shortcut through a field organised with a farmer next to the road not long after we went the long way, so couldn't help but feel a little hard-done-by when I arrived at Aberdyfi at the same time as some riders who had taken the shortcut.
I was in the group trying to arrange this shortcut, we stood around for 40+mins with all involved but in the end the police shut it down. AFAIK nobody actually used that shortcut so don't feel too hard done by. With the benefit of hindsight just cracking on with the long way around was the right call. I arrived at sleep control about 1am, almost 2 hours later than I'd expected when I left kings (which was just before news got there)
Anyway excellent weather, route and support all around. I found it tougher than any other ride this season, but that was all circumstances issues of my own making. Plenty of learning for next time I do multiday riding solo
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 22 May, 2023, 03:43:19 pm
The police were currently doing their forensic rad examination at the time.
Organisation was fantastic, really enjoyed the route, even the new tougher section between Newton and Weobley, I'm convinced this is much harder than the old return route via Bonllys/Crickhowell/Abergaveny. the coast road seemed nice it would have been great to go though in daylight, the section from Aberdyfi to Newtown was a definite improvement.
Post by: thing1 on 22 May, 2023, 05:02:29 pm
I left kings at 02:00 due to lack of beds, and promise of available beds at Aberdyfi. There was a diversion of approximately 500m walking through fields, took about 10 minutes, much better than 17km and an hour by the official road diversion.
The police were currently doing their forensic rad examination at the time.
Ah this was the route we were trying to get opened up at 11pm. We walked most of it but got turned back . I guess the helicopter parked in the field had gone by 3am? When we were there the pilot said it'd be over an hour before he was going everywhere.
All very sad, so can't get myself worked up about the delay
Post by: Ajax Bay on 23 May, 2023, 07:29:59 pm
Organisation was fantastic, really enjoyed the route, even the new tougher section between Newton and Weobley, I'm convinced this is much harder than the old return route via Bonllys/Crickhowell/Abergaveny. The coast road seemed nice it would have been great to go though in daylight,Carrying on up and over after Dolfor and returning via Presteigne rather than Talgarth (the latter retracing the route out for the last 95km(!)) is a few miles shorter but 200m more climb compared to the "old return route" (148km + 1694m). Going round the Tywyn peninsula offers a quiet road with great views (and the additional sleep stop capacity at Aberdovey) and also adds enough miles to make sure the ride is at least 600km long.
Wasn't it you 4 years ago soliloquizing that you were minded to return from Llandrindod Wells over Gospel Pass rather than retrace your outward journey?
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 23 May, 2023, 08:05:41 pm
Organisation was fantastic, really enjoyed the route, even the new tougher section between Newton and Weobley, I'm convinced this is much harder than the old return route via Bonllys/Crickhowell/Abergaveny. The coast road seemed nice it would have been great to go though in daylight,Carrying on up and over after Dolfor and returning via Presteigne rather than Talgarth (the latter retracing the route out for the last 95km(!)) is a few miles shorter but 200m more climb compared to the "old return route" (148km + 1694m). Going round the Tywyn peninsula offers a quiet road with great views (and the additional sleep stop capacity at Aberdovey) and also adds enough miles to make sure the ride is at least 600km long.
Wasn't it you 4 years ago soliloquizing that you were minded to return from Llandrindod Wells over Gospel Pass rather than retrace your outward journey?
that's a long time ago so I can't remember, it's possible I said that and certainly returning on different roads is preferable
I was definitely fitter in 2019,and the Gospel pass is worth the extra 300m, I think the descent from the gospel pass was quick, not so much now since the landslip.
But did take me 4 hours to ride from Newtown to Weobley a distance of 60 miles, probably why I ended up slightly out of time when I left Weobley. I did stop at one shop on he way but not for very lon.
Post by: Ian H on 23 May, 2023, 10:45:45 pm
Post by: Hot Flatus on 24 May, 2023, 06:00:07 am
Post by: Ian H on 24 May, 2023, 10:03:44 am
Still had a nice time, though?
I wasn't grumpy or miserable for a substantial portion of the event. Of course, I didn't have you to complain to.
Post by: mattc on 24 May, 2023, 04:30:32 pm
We need a "Scenic" option again!
Post by: Hot Flatus on 24 May, 2023, 05:18:08 pm
Post by: Ajax Bay on 24 May, 2023, 06:38:43 pm
Gospel Pass you say?Besides the Pendle/Tan Hill 600 no UK calendar 600 has the 8000m of climbing (per Openrunner) needed for ACP's revised 10000 award (replacing an SR600). BCM is the nearest one and heading north over Gospel Pass (info at Llanthony, control at Drovers) would come close to achieving that 8000m. Unrealistic to ask riders to go that way going south after 500km imho. The other scenic 600 not run for a few years but maybe in 2024 is the Kernow and SW 600: watch this space (well, another thread anyway).
We need a "Scenic" option again!
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 24 May, 2023, 06:50:16 pm
where do ACP say it needs to be assessed per openrunnner? Openrunner was Sophie Matters preference, but ACP have shown they want to do things their own way.Gospel Pass you say?Besides the Tan Hill 600 no UK calendar 600 has the 8000m of climbing (per Openrunner) needed for ACP's revised 10000 award (replacing an SR600). BCM is the nearest one and heading north over Gospel Pass (info at Llanthony, control at Drovers) would come close to achieving that 8000m. Unrealistic to ask riders to go that way going south after 500km imho. The other scenic 600 not run for a few years but maybe in 2024 is the Kernow and SW 600: watch this space (well, another thread anyway).
We need a "Scenic" option again!
According to this page https://www.audax-club-parisien.com/en/our-organizations/brm-world/#calendar, and setting filter to R10000 qualifying then BCM is adequate.
Post by: Tom on 24 May, 2023, 11:33:18 pm
Quote from: mattc
link=topic=124547.msg2812741#msg2812741 date=1684942232Gospel Pass you say?Besides the Pendle/Tan Hill 600 no UK calendar 600 has the 8000m of climbing (per Openrunner) needed for ACP's revised 10000 award (replacing an SR600). BCM is the nearest one and heading north over Gospel Pass (info at Llanthony, control at Drovers) would come close to achieving that 8000m. Unrealistic to ask riders to go that way going south after 500km imho. The other scenic 600 not run for a few years but maybe in 2024 is the Kernow and SW 600: watch this space (well, another thread anyway).
We need a "Scenic" option again!
According to the organisers (and the auk website) this year's BCM had 8450m climbing?
Edit - sorry, just seen the openrunner bit. What does that measure the climbing to be?
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 25 May, 2023, 12:11:42 am
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 25 May, 2023, 01:02:25 pm
I'm assuming as it is registering in the ACP filter then it does actually qualify.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 25 May, 2023, 01:55:21 pm
https://www.audax-club-parisien.com/en/our-organizations/brm-world/#calendar (just had a heart attack that someone had removed it in response to this discussion, before remembering to adjust the start date into the past)
It seems to me that 8,000m can be very different on smooth roads at sensible gradients (as typically found in Europe) than it is on steep climbs and descents and dubious surfaces as typically found in the UK.
Post by: mattc on 25 May, 2023, 05:49:48 pm
No we don't. What we need is a non-scenic version:-*
:P
Post by: Ajax Bay on 26 May, 2023, 10:59:21 am
It seems to me that 8,000m can be very different on smooth roads at sensible gradients (as typically found in Europe) than it is on steep climbs and descents and dubious surfaces as typically found in the UK.Seemed to me that this and previous years' Bryan Chapman Memorial almost exclusively followed "smooth roads at sensible gradients" (excluding the two pulls up to King's and down again, and maybe the roller coaster to Staylittle).
For what is, effectively, an international standard, it makes sense to have one route/climb algorithm used to determine how scenic a ride is. Has ACP gripped this yet?
Post by: Ivan on 26 May, 2023, 11:51:40 am
As AAA assessments (in Great Britain at least) use a more accurate data source based off OS physical terrain measurements, as opposed to the generally available satellite-sensed elevation models used globally, it's tricky to reconcile this into a single, global algorithm, not least because seemingly every routing service (RwGPS, Komoot, Strava, OpenRunner, Garmin) all produce differing results from the same sources. There's probably a PhD's worth of research to be done here if anyone is looking for GIS doctorate ideas.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 26 May, 2023, 01:38:40 pm
My understanding from speaking to the AUK chair (& ACP rep) over breakfast at the AGM is that ACP have tentatively agreed to accept our overall climbing amount for the purposes of the R10000 award, hence BCMs likely inclusion.
:thumbsup:
I know for RM your AUK AAA tool was accepted for the amount of climb.
Post by: mattc on 22 June, 2023, 07:06:20 am
;D
:thumbsup:
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 22 June, 2023, 10:01:02 am
So who's had their card back in the post?an innovative approach. I approve.
;D
:thumbsup:
Post by: αdαmsκι on 22 June, 2023, 07:03:14 pm
an innovative approach. I approve.
I didn't ride the BCM but am curious what this "innovative approach". Please tell me more
Post by: thing1 on 22 June, 2023, 07:36:37 pm
Post by: αdαmsκι on 22 June, 2023, 07:48:54 pm
Post by: mattc on 23 June, 2023, 10:22:46 am
No spoilers please! I'm currently away so won't get to see mine until MondayEven more exciting than waiting for Arrivée!
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 23 June, 2023, 12:05:28 pm
At Wycombewheeler just needs to include it in a spoiler tag :)Although I have messaged Adamski, others may be interested
(click to show/hide)
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 23 June, 2023, 06:06:16 pm
At Wycombewheeler just needs to include it in a spoiler tag :)Although I have messaged Adamski, others may be interested(click to show/hide)
(click to show/hide)
Post by: postie on 24 June, 2023, 08:11:09 pm
Post by: Ian H on 26 June, 2023, 03:24:34 pm
Yes royal mail is amazing ;D
I gather it is in some parts of Portsmouth.
Post by: thing1 on 27 June, 2023, 08:00:32 am
Post by: ransos on 19 September, 2023, 04:46:02 pm
Gospel Pass you say?
We need a "Scenic" option again!
You might want to look at Will's plan for 2024: https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/
Post by: vorsprung on 19 September, 2023, 09:05:43 pm
Matt.No we don't. What we need is a non-scenic version:-*
:P
Dearest.
Did you ever actually do the scenic version?
Post by: vorsprung on 19 September, 2023, 09:13:26 pm
Gospel Pass you say?
We need a "Scenic" option again!
You might want to look at Will's plan for 2024: https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/
sounds nice!
Post by: mattc on 28 September, 2023, 06:52:51 am
Well who'da thought?!Gospel Pass you say?
We need a "Scenic" option again!
You might want to look at Will's plan for 2024: https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/
;D :thumbsup:
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 30 September, 2023, 03:59:47 pm
Entries are open for 2024's Bryan Chapman Memorial 600!
Saturday 18th May
https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/ (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/bryan-chapman-memorial-600/)
Complementing it will be:
3 day Pauline Porter Populaire 2-2-2
Friday 17th May
https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/pauline-porter-populaire-222/ (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/pauline-porter-populaire-222/)
Anglesey & Back 300+300
Saturday 18th May
https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/anglesey-back-300-300/ (https://www.pedalution.co.uk/events/anglesey-back-300-300/)
The Bryan Chapman has a slight rework. On the return from Snowdonia the route will come back as the outward route along the coast through Harlech with the sleep control at Aberdyfi. This easier night section allows for the inclusion of Gospel Pass on the return with little change to the elevation gain.
The Anglesey & Back will have a sleep stop at Menai Bridge where even the full value rider has time for some winks before the return 300. Due to shortest distance stuff you'll be following the coast from Machynlleth rather than hopping over Corris Pass.
The Pauline Porter Populaire is roughly 200 a day. Where possible it will use quieter roads and thus the route differs in several spots and has some more climbing involved. Sleeping will be at Kings YHA both nights.
Both latters have limited availability as there will be no hot bedding. There is the option to camp on the Populaire at Kings for a reduced rate.
If anyone wants to volunteer please do DM me. There'll be a helpers ride 2 weeks prior.
Big thanks to Pauline Porter for letting me honour her creation of the BCM by putting her name to the Populaire!
Post by: Ajax Bay on 22 October, 2023, 10:19:05 am
I've never seen the attraction of the Trawsfynydd route after dark, preferring your planned coastal choice. Just the one visit to King's then: southbound turning right after the Mawddach (Barmouth) bridge.
I would seek inspiration from Colin's Cambrian 6c for the route south from Knighton to Clyro (473-508).
Gospel Pass at 520km in just adds to what was already a challenging ride.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 25 October, 2023, 02:19:33 pm
Well done on the revised routes, Will.
I've never seen the attraction of the Trawsfynydd route after dark, preferring your planned coastal choice. Just the one visit to King's then: southbound turning right after the Mawddach (Barmouth) bridge.
I would seek inspiration from Colin's Cambrian 6c for the route south from Knighton to Clyro (473-508).
Gospel Pass at 520km in just adds to what was already a challenging ride.
The easier return along the coast to Aberdyfi and lack of second Kings ascent will get riders further along the route in about the same time as if returning over Trawsfynydd to Kings, so the extra challenge of Gospel Pass will be dampened; plus the elation from the extra views will offset the sting. But then again Gospel Pass is a bit like Cheddar Gorge; a couple of steep bits but the rest isn't too taxing.
Post by: JonB on 25 October, 2023, 05:18:51 pm
The easier return along the coast to Aberdyfi and lack of second Kings ascent will get riders further along the route in about the same time as if returning over Trawsfynydd to Kings, so the extra challenge of Gospel Pass will be dampened; plus the elation from the extra views will offset the sting. But then again Gospel Pass is a bit like Cheddar Gorge; a couple of steep bits but the rest isn't too taxing.Classic - put in, arguably, the highest road pass in Wales at the tail end of a tough 600 and it's described as not too taxing :facepalm: This is GWR propaganda in full 'spin' mode ;D
Post by: CrazyEnglishTriathlete on 25 October, 2023, 09:32:44 pm
Post by: aidan.f on 28 March, 2024, 09:30:26 am
02:00hrs Saturday to 12:00hrs Monday just £12 ..I did wonder if it's was a scam, but have used the booking site before, all seems fine :-)
Basepoint Chepstow Beaufort Park, Riverside Court, Beaufort Park, Chepstow, NP16 5UH
https://maps.app.goo.gl/RrXVkMmWjCn28iVB6 (https://maps.app.goo.gl/RrXVkMmWjCn28iVB6)
Booking: www.yourparkingspace.co.uk (http://www.yourparkingspace.co.uk)
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 28 March, 2024, 10:02:36 am
I have the second Kings stop last year at 373km, and Aberdyfi on this years route at 381, so it's not much further along, but avoiding those climbs in the dark will be worth it.
The easier return along the coast to Aberdyfi and lack of second Kings ascent will get riders further along the route in about the same time as if returning over Trawsfynydd to Kings, so the extra challenge of Gospel Pass will be dampened; plus the elation from the extra views will offset the sting. But then again Gospel Pass is a bit like Cheddar Gorge; a couple of steep bits but the rest isn't too taxing.
I am looking forward to the gospel pass, because no matter how tough the climb the views are worth it, especially as it is always sunny in Wales. Is there a more scenic 600km in the calendar? Machynleth mountain road, Harlech beach, pen-y-pass and now the gospel pass too before Tintern Abbey.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 30 March, 2024, 01:30:09 pm
On a non-cycling logistics matter I now (hopefully) have cheap convenient parking for duration of the event.
02:00hrs Saturday to 12:00hrs Monday just £12 ..I did wonder if it's was a scam, but have used the booking site before, all seems fine :-)
Basepoint Chepstow Beaufort Park, Riverside Court, Beaufort Park, Chepstow, NP16 5UH
https://maps.app.goo.gl/RrXVkMmWjCn28iVB6 (https://maps.app.goo.gl/RrXVkMmWjCn28iVB6)
Booking: www.yourparkingspace.co.uk (http://www.yourparkingspace.co.uk)
Parking at Innage Farm is £5 for the duration. It is 10mins ride from Bulwark and for our sole use.
Post by: aidan.f on 30 March, 2024, 07:53:22 pm
Thankyou for the reminder of what you have gone to the trouble of putting in place, and yes, although I was aware of parking at the farm I should have considered the very reasonable charge properly.
Post by: pangolin on 17 April, 2024, 10:30:05 am
Post by: chocjohn9 on 28 April, 2024, 09:58:54 am
I got around LEL and PBP because of the availability of HOT and quick food.
(Actually not so quick on PBP but that's for another day)
To the people with experience (!) what did you eat? garages? Greg's?! where, what, when? all the details please!
This is a make or break factor for me.
Thanks a lot in advance
Post by: Hot Flatus on 28 April, 2024, 10:26:59 am
First Bryan for me.... let's talk about food.
I got around LEL and PBP because of the availability of HOT and quick food.
(Actually not so quick on PBP but that's for another day)
To the people with experience (!) what did you eat? garages? Greg's?! where, what, when? all the details please!
This is a make or break factor for me.
Thanks a lot in advance
I'm not riding this year, and haven't ridden the event for over a decade, but looking at the route I'd say it all hinges on your speed and whether you attempt the ride without a sleep stop. If you do then the garage in Newtown is what you need to know about, although it looks like it's not 24 hr anymore. Tesco garage is open until midnight.
If you do sleep, then I'd be eating at Menai and picking up some food to eat on the bike on the return loop south of Barmouth.
Otherwise you pass through plenty of towns with cafés and shops. A googlemap search of a town for cafes will offer up opening hours and sometimes menus and prices. Cafes do tend to come and go.
As long as you carry some food to eat between controls then it isn't a ride I'd be worrying about for food availability.
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 29 April, 2024, 11:10:31 am
First Bryan for me.... let's talk about food.
I got around LEL and PBP because of the availability of HOT and quick food.
(Actually not so quick on PBP but that's for another day)
To the people with experience (!) what did you eat? garages? Greg's?! where, what, when? all the details please!
This is a make or break factor for me.
Thanks a lot in advance
first control - honey cafe, fairly quick provision of breakfast items like hot sausages sandwiches, or beans on toast
second control - raid the co-op
third control - audax volunteer control at kings quick provision of hot food
extra stop for ice cream
fourth control - audax controal at menai - quick hot food
extra stop petrol station
fifth control audax volunteer control - quick hot food.
newtown - free control cafe, not too slow, supermarkets available, possibly also McD's
next control - village shop snacks and drinks
finish
Remember that gregg's receipts are not audax UK compliant as they do not have the store address, which is a shame because it's quick cheap hot food that is appealing (to me) on an audax.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 29 April, 2024, 11:14:28 am
Hi Will, any news on showers at the sleep stop?
I was going to give the Football Club showers a clean when up there this weekend. But alas, they have been knocked down. So a flannel shower in the toilets and put some spare bibs in your dropbag.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 29 April, 2024, 11:20:34 am
First Bryan for me.... let's talk about food.
I got around LEL and PBP because of the availability of HOT and quick food.
(Actually not so quick on PBP but that's for another day)
To the people with experience (!) what did you eat? garages? Greg's?! where, what, when? all the details please!
This is a make or break factor for me.
Thanks a lot in advance
first control - honey cafe, fairly quick provision of breakfast items like hot sausages sandwiches, or beans on toast
second control - raid the co-op
third control - audax volunteer control at kings quick provision of hot food
extra stop for ice cream
fourth control - audax controal at menai - quick hot food
extra stop petrol station
fifth control audax volunteer control - quick hot food.
newtown - free control cafe, not too slow, supermarkets available, possibly also McD's
next control - village shop snacks and drinks
finish
Remember that gregg's receipts are not audax UK compliant as they do not have the store address, which is a shame because it's quick cheap hot food that is appealing (to me) on an audax.
Audax controls - also bananas at all - would apples be a good choice too?
A few changes on the return.
Newtown not a control but the MDs and Garage are 24hr if you are quick and need to stock up.
Knighton - Offa's Dyke Visitor Centre 9am-6.30pm - cake, coffee & tea available
Llanthony - Treats open all day
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 29 April, 2024, 02:30:24 pm
Probably better, because banana skins should not be discarded to decompose in the wild even though many cyclists do, but apple cores are essentially native and no problems returning to the soil.
Audax controls - also bananas at all - would apples be a good choice too?
Post by: Jacques on 29 April, 2024, 04:22:58 pm
Probably better, because banana skins should not be discarded to decompose in the wild even though many cyclists do, but apple cores are essentially native and no problems returning to the soil.
I agree, after finishing long and hard rides I've sometimes thought to myself that some of the other cyclists in the room look as though they have started to decompose ...
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 30 April, 2024, 12:05:51 pm
last year (due to events beyond the organisers control, scuppering his best efforts) I had to push on to Aberdyfi before stopping.
Previously when sleeping at kings I was evicted from the dormatory after less than 3 hours to make space for later arrivals, and found the second day very painful due to lack of sleep.
Reaching Aberdyfi before sleep should be easier this year due to re-routing, but will there be sufficient capacity for everyone to stop for as long as they need? (at least 4 hours, or waiting until sunrise preferably), otherwise I may look at separate arrangements
Post by: Lightning Phil on 30 April, 2024, 01:44:06 pm
Probably better, because banana skins should not be discarded to decompose in the wild even though many cyclists do, but apple cores are essentially native and no problems returning to the soil.
I agree, after finishing long and hard rides I've sometimes thought to myself that some of the other cyclists in the room look as though they have started to decompose ...
You should speak to organisers at the finish. We see the complete spectrum of rider states at the finish. Some who at first glance look okay, if tired, need help with basic stuff. Not all dictated by arrival time. Some arrive full value in pretty good shape, and go get a pint first, cool as a cat, some arrive somewhat earlier but wasted and needing a few moments before interacting. The fun part it matching up how I usually feel and must look at the end of events I ride to what I see in front of me.
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 30 April, 2024, 02:48:05 pm
Twice I have done this and used the control for sleeping and twice I have really struggled.
last year (due to events beyond the organisers control, scuppering his best efforts) I had to push on to Aberdyfi before stopping.
Previously when sleeping at kings I was evicted from the dormatory after less than 3 hours to make space for later arrivals, and found the second day very painful due to lack of sleep.
Reaching Aberdyfi before sleep should be easier this year due to re-routing, but will there be sufficient capacity for everyone to stop for as long as they need? (at least 4 hours, or waiting until sunrise preferably), otherwise I may look at separate arrangements
There is over twice the capacity at Aberdyfi compared to Kings so with the staggered start time I'm very optimistic everyone will be able to get a good chunk of sleep with minimal evictions.
Post by: mattc on 04 May, 2024, 05:31:09 pm
Probably better, because banana skins should not be discarded to decompose in the wild even though many cyclists do, but apple cores are essentially native and no problems returning to the soil.
I agree, after finishing long and hard rides I've sometimes thought to myself that some of the other cyclists in the room look as though they have started to decompose ...
;D
I see what you did there ...
Post by: Lightning Phil on 05 May, 2024, 02:21:31 pm
Post by: willpom gwraudax on 08 May, 2024, 08:45:10 am
Post by: Wycombewheeler on 08 May, 2024, 11:19:37 am
;D
Post by: IanF on 08 May, 2024, 11:59:27 am
Post by: Jeff E on 08 May, 2024, 02:15:51 pm
Post by: Lightning Phil on 08 May, 2024, 05:56:55 pm
Post by: Jeff E on 08 May, 2024, 06:23:43 pm