Author Topic: Arithmetic that makes you cringe  (Read 41074 times)

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #350 on: 04 January, 2022, 08:44:52 am »
Perhaps it's "autocarrot that makes you cringe".  ;D Similarly, the use of "tonne" rather than "ton" in metaphorical expressions looks wrong to me. "He won tonnes of money on the lottery. She lost her licence after being caught at a tonne on the M5."
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Mr Larrington

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Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #351 on: 04 January, 2022, 09:50:39 am »
I expect the Torygraph refuses on principle to use tonnes because they’re
  • “woke”, and
  • FOREIGN
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Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #352 on: 04 January, 2022, 12:02:49 pm »
She lost her licence after being caught at a tonne on the M5."

This would seem unlikely, as it's within the speed limit  ;)


The use of tonne in metaphorical expressions is probably inevitable when you have Young People who are used to metric.  You hardly ever encounter imperial tons in the real world, so might remain blissfully unaware of the preferred unit for those expressions, perhaps considering it to be a quirk of spelling.  On the plus side, you might have a future career as a copy editor for the Graun.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #353 on: 04 January, 2022, 12:11:28 pm »
In the real world other than the USA, most of the time when you encounter a ton(ne) it's unspecified cos it's either obvious or doesn't really make any difference, seeing as they're so close. I'd be in favour of spelling both versions "ton" cos I don't like the doubled consonant followed by the e (similarly I prefer gram to gramme). When accuracy is needed, use kgs. Or maybe lbs if dealing with Americans.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #354 on: 04 January, 2022, 12:19:33 pm »
In the real world other than the USA, most of the time when you encounter a ton(ne) it's unspecified cos it's either obvious or doesn't really make any difference, seeing as they're so close. I'd be in favour of spelling both versions "ton" cos I don't like the doubled consonant followed by the e (similarly I prefer gram to gramme). When accuracy is needed, use kgs. Or maybe lbs if dealing with Americans.

Agreed, other than a move to change the spelling is going to result in 'mils' style confusion.  But I suppose that's where we are already.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #355 on: 04 January, 2022, 12:27:34 pm »
If you mistake millimetres and thousands of an inch, which I presume is what you're talking about with 'mils', you end up with something seriously the wrong size, whereas if you order two tons of coal and get two tonnes, you won't even notice the difference. And an HGV driver might say they have a 40-ton lorry but I bet they weigh the load in kg. So I don't think it's comparable (unless mils are something completely different to what I think they are).
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Arellcat

  • Velonautte
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #356 on: 04 January, 2022, 01:07:48 pm »
She lost her licence after being caught at a tonne on the M5."
This would seem unlikely, as it's within the speed limit  ;)

Given that a hundredweight in the UK was legislated as 112 lbs, I wondered if 'ton' as a colloquialism for 'hundred' came before or after that ruling.  Doing the ton could be 112 mph, so all those café racers cutting down their mudguards and windscreens were all well short.  Interestingly, if doing the ton was 112 km/h, it is very close to 70 mph.
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T42

  • Patron saint of the dry joint
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #357 on: 04 January, 2022, 02:21:12 pm »
If you mistake millimetres and thousands of an inch, which I presume is what you're talking about with 'mils', you end up with something seriously the wrong size, whereas if you order two tons of coal and get two tonnes, you won't even notice the difference.

If you were to order two US tons and get two tonnes I'd think you'd be delighted.
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Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #358 on: 04 January, 2022, 03:00:56 pm »
She lost her licence after being caught at a tonne on the M5."
This would seem unlikely, as it's within the speed limit  ;)

Given that a hundredweight in the UK was legislated as 112 lbs, I wondered if 'ton' as a colloquialism for 'hundred' came before or after that ruling.  Doing the ton could be 112 mph, so all those café racers cutting down their mudguards and windscreens were all well short.  Interestingly, if doing the ton was 112 km/h, it is very close to 70 mph.
I'd never thought about linking it with a hundredweight.

If you mistake millimetres and thousands of an inch, which I presume is what you're talking about with 'mils', you end up with something seriously the wrong size, whereas if you order two tons of coal and get two tonnes, you won't even notice the difference.

If you were to order two US tons and get two tonnes I'd think you'd be delighted.
Yep.  :thumbsup:
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #359 on: 11 January, 2022, 12:37:51 pm »
Not really bad arithmetic, but this seems like the appropriate thread for this grumble:

I've noticed a journalistic trend towards the use of kilowatt-hours per year to express power.  I mean, it's a potentially useful unit as a step towards calculating the running costs of a thing, but it's not exactly intuitive.  If you want to impress us with how power-hungry the thing is, use Watts - most people have a sense of what Watts are.  If you want to tell us how expensive it is to run, use the appropriate currency unit.  Otherwise you might as well express it in Pirate-Ninjas.

(I'm suspicious this is due to nobody under the age of 40 having used a 1-bar electric fire.)

Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #360 on: 11 January, 2022, 12:53:36 pm »
Not really bad arithmetic, but this seems like the appropriate thread for this grumble:

I've noticed a journalistic trend towards the use of kilowatt-hours per year to express power.  I mean, it's a potentially useful unit as a step towards calculating the running costs of a thing, but it's not exactly intuitive.  If you want to impress us with how power-hungry the thing is, use Watts - most people have a sense of what Watts are.  If you want to tell us how expensive it is to run, use the appropriate currency unit.  Otherwise you might as well express it in Pirate-Ninjas.

(I'm suspicious this is due to nobody under the age of 40 having used a 1-bar electric fire.)
Or a 100W lightbulb.

The persistent use of kW to represent energy is also bloody irritating.
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Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #361 on: 11 January, 2022, 04:06:04 pm »
I expect the use of kW to represent energy is more due to lack of physics but familiarity with electricity bills than unfamiliarity with lightbulbs and similar.

But in similar vein, this is from Bristol Water's snappily titled Watertalk: First there's some talk about washing a single pair of jeans, then:
Quote
An average washing machine uses a titanic 112 litres of water a week. Make sure you fill it up rather than relying on half loads and save yourself a thirst-quenching 10 litres of water each time.
It would be helpful to know how many times a week they reckon an average washing machine is used. I doubt it's as simple as half load saving an actual 50% of the total water use.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #362 on: 11 January, 2022, 04:15:22 pm »
Quote
An average washing machine uses a titanic 112 litres of water a week. Make sure you fill it up rather than relying on half loads and save yourself a thirst-quenching 10 litres of water each time.
That makes literally no sense.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #363 on: 11 January, 2022, 04:28:03 pm »
The basic reasoning is sound, I think. The average household washes a certain amount of clothes each week. The average washing machine uses a certain amount of water for each wash. Many machines have a 'half-wash' feature which reduces the amount of water used, but it probably doesn't actually halve it. So if you switch the machine on when it's half full and use the half-load feature, you will still be using more water per garment – and thus, over a week in which the same total amount of laundry is done, more water overall – than if you wait till the machine is full and don't use the half-load feature.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #364 on: 11 January, 2022, 05:09:26 pm »
The basic reasoning is sound, I think. The average household washes a certain amount of clothes each week. The average washing machine uses a certain amount of water for each wash. Many machines have a 'half-wash' feature which reduces the amount of water used, but it probably doesn't actually halve it. So if you switch the machine on when it's half full and use the half-load feature, you will still be using more water per garment – and thus, over a week in which the same total amount of laundry is done, more water overall – than if you wait till the machine is full and don't use the half-load feature.

Except that most modern washing machines automatically adjust how much water they use, according to the load.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #365 on: 11 January, 2022, 05:42:53 pm »
But it's not a straight line relationship with the load. If you run a washing machine completely empty, it will still use some water.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #366 on: 11 January, 2022, 05:54:19 pm »
(I'm suspicious this is due to nobody under the age of 40 having used a 1-bar electric fire.)
Or a 100W lightbulb.

Ohgod, now I feel old.

Mr Larrington

  • A bit ov a lyv wyr by slof standirds
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Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #367 on: 11 January, 2022, 06:13:40 pm »
Not really bad arithmetic, but this seems like the appropriate thread for this grumble:

I've noticed a journalistic trend towards the use of kilowatt-hours per year to express power.  I mean, it's a potentially useful unit as a step towards calculating the running costs of a thing, but it's not exactly intuitive.  If you want to impress us with how power-hungry the thing is, use Watts - most people have a sense of what Watts are.  If you want to tell us how expensive it is to run, use the appropriate currency unit.  Otherwise you might as well express it in Pirate-Ninjas.



?
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
Satisfying the Bloodlust of the Masses in Peacetime

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Arithmetic that makes you cringe
« Reply #368 on: 11 January, 2022, 08:37:23 pm »
Nahh, the other kind of Pirate-Ninja: A unit of power equivalent to 1 kilowatt-hour per sol (approximately 40.55W).  It was made up by Andy Weir for his novel, and promptly adopted (in milli-pirate-ninja form) by the Curiosity rover team at JPL.