Author Topic: Grammar that makes you cringe  (Read 835129 times)

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
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Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #675 on: 09 February, 2010, 04:33:49 pm »
That's not really fair as it was written by a German.


I'm not surprised - it does seem that a Brit's bad grammar/spelling is often distinct from that by Jonny Foreigner (usually worse!)
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #676 on: 09 February, 2010, 04:38:57 pm »
It's a brave person that criticises the spelling or grammar of someone speaking/writing a foreign language.

I know my written French/German/Spanish is bad/bad/shocking.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #677 on: 09 February, 2010, 04:50:11 pm »
That's not really fair as it was written by a German.

a) how was I supposed to know that? For that matter, how do you know it was written by a German?

b) when I needed help with a Polish translation earlier, I didn't just guess, I asked someone who speaks Polish. If I were selling goods internationally, I would consider it a good idea to get these things right. You know, create an impression of professionalism and all that. It's not that difficult.

d.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #678 on: 09 February, 2010, 04:57:54 pm »
a) how was I supposed to know that? For that matter, how do you know it was written by a German?

Probably a guess based on the fact that the contact number for the seller (kf-trendstore2) is +49xxxxxxxxxxx. (That information was just a click away.)
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #679 on: 09 February, 2010, 04:58:09 pm »
[off topic]My brother in law has a huge collection of bad-ingleesh-manuals. We shop at pound shops just to pick them up for him. [/off topic]

iakobski

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #680 on: 09 February, 2010, 05:01:01 pm »
The first one is interesting:
Quote
the Skin fits the iPhone a hundred percently

  • the Skin fits the iPhone fully
  • the Skin fits the iPhone totally
  • the Skin fits the iPhone completely
  • the Skin fits the iPhone a hundred percently

?

LEE

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #681 on: 09 February, 2010, 05:06:29 pm »
This whole thread makes me cringe if I'm being honest.

 

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #682 on: 09 February, 2010, 05:07:31 pm »
This whole thread makes me cringe if I'm being honest.
Makes "one" cringe surely?  :P

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #683 on: 09 February, 2010, 05:08:14 pm »
This is one of my all time favourites:-

Danger Sign | Engrish.com

"The little part which suffocates when the sharp part which gets hurt is swallowed is contained generously."
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #684 on: 09 February, 2010, 05:21:38 pm »
a) how was I supposed to know that? For that matter, how do you know it was written by a German?

Probably a guess based on the fact that the contact number for the seller (kf-trendstore2) is +49xxxxxxxxxxx. (That information was just a click away.)

So the contact number for the seller is on a different page to the one I was looking at. And it's only there indirectly.

In future, I shall remember to spend more time investigating the author's background before making frivolous comments about bad English on an internet message board.  ::-)

d.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #685 on: 09 February, 2010, 05:22:31 pm »
In future, I shall remember to spend more time investigating the author's background before making frivolous comments about bad English on an internet message board.  ::-)

Excellent.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #686 on: 09 February, 2010, 06:47:12 pm »
I like the way the sub-editors of the BBC RSS news service quickly mash words together to provide the detail

Giant snowman collapses on boy, 2

A 3m (10ft) snow figure falls on a two-year-old boy on holiday in Austria but he is unhurt after a night in hospital. 

Was the snowman hurt, or the boy, and just exactly what were they expecting the hospital to do?
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #687 on: 09 February, 2010, 09:18:44 pm »
I like the way the sub-editors of the BBC RSS news service quickly mash words together to provide the detail

Giant snowman collapses on boy, 2

A 3m (10ft) snow figure falls on a two-year-old boy on holiday in Austria but he is unhurt after a night in hospital. 

Was the snowman hurt, or the boy, and just exactly what were they expecting the hospital to do?

And who is on holiday, the snowman or the boy, or both?

Unless someone writes only in simple single clause sentences, these type of ambiguities are completely normal, context usually makes it clear what is meant. Would anyone ever use "he is unhurt" about a "snow figure"?

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #688 on: 09 February, 2010, 11:03:57 pm »
Anaphora resolution is a very tricky part of natural language processing (some bits of my NLP lectures from Yorick Wilkes stick in my head).

It should be easy for a human to work out which subject "it" refers to in a sentence such as "Mary dropped the plate onto the floor. It shattered." (It's unlikely the floor would shatter.) But it's non-trivial for a computer to do the same.

Given a sentence such as "Mary dropped the plate onto the glass table. It shattered." is truly ambiguous (even for a human).
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #689 on: 10 February, 2010, 07:12:46 am »
Even more tricky in French, where both plate and table are feminine nouns...
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Auntie Helen

  • 6 Wheels in Germany
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #690 on: 10 February, 2010, 09:11:06 am »
'Tother week in my German studies at Uni we discovered that in German you are able to differentiate the following:

The journalist told the author (female) about her friend

In English we don't know if the friend is the friend of the journalist or the author. In German you use a different word for 'her' which shows you to whom the friend belongs. Which is nice and precise, in a typical German way!
My blog on cycling in Germany and eating German cake – http://www.auntiehelen.co.uk


Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #691 on: 10 February, 2010, 09:17:25 am »
I like the way the sub-editors of the BBC RSS news service quickly mash words together to provide the detail

Giant snowman collapses on boy, 2

A 3m (10ft) snow figure falls on a two-year-old boy on holiday in Austria but he is unhurt after a night in hospital. 

Was the snowman hurt, or the boy, and just exactly what were they expecting the hospital to do?

And who is on holiday, the snowman or the boy, or both?

Unless someone writes only in simple single clause sentences, these type of ambiguities are completely normal, context usually makes it clear what is meant. Would anyone ever use "he is unhurt" about a "snow figure"?

The main ambiguity is about being hurt in hospital. All the others are merely side stalls at the show.
It is simpler than it looks.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Ride adventurously and stop for a brew.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #692 on: 11 February, 2010, 12:12:29 am »
'Tother week in my German studies at Uni we discovered that in German you are able to differentiate the following:

The journalist told the author (female) about her friend

In English we don't know if the friend is the friend of the journalist or the author. In German you use a different word for 'her' which shows you to whom the friend belongs. Which is nice and precise, in a typical German way!
"Seine" equivalent to the Latin "su" meaning "one's own"? I have forgotten how to say this in German  :-[ and have never learnt Latin, but a word with this meaning - belonging to the subject of the clause, but applicable to all persons - exists in many European languages. In Polish it's "swój".
Riding a concrete path through the nebulous and chaotic future.

Auntie Helen

  • 6 Wheels in Germany
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #693 on: 11 February, 2010, 07:43:39 am »
You get 'ihrer' for her (the journalist), or 'derer' for her (the author).

My German teacher spent a fair while explaining how German can be excessively precise like this, thus why it's a good language for technical stuff.
My blog on cycling in Germany and eating German cake – http://www.auntiehelen.co.uk


Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #694 on: 11 February, 2010, 02:54:22 pm »
A letter I received from my bank this morning:



It would have irritated me slightly less if they'd actually sent me the envelopes I requested.

Legs

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #695 on: 11 February, 2010, 04:05:28 pm »
A letter I received from my bank this morning:

It would have irritated me slightly less if they'd actually sent me the envelopes I requested.

"Yes, I know I'm stationary!"

It's probably apocryphal; the story of the maths exam paper which said against every question 'Show your working'.  Sure enough, for every question, the little lad had drawn a picture of himself sitting at a table, working!

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #696 on: 12 February, 2010, 08:33:24 am »
You get 'ihrer' for her (the journalist), or 'derer' for her (the author).

My German teacher spent a fair while explaining how German can be excessively precise like this, thus why it's a good language for technical stuff.

I think that there was an equivalent to this in Old and Middle English (unsurprisingly since English has the same roots as German).
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

Redlight

  • Enjoying life in the slow lane
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #697 on: 12 February, 2010, 09:37:22 am »
Perhaps someone has mentioned this already but one I hate is the use of "invite" as a noun.  It's "invitation".

Calm now  8)
Why should anybody steal a watch when they can steal a bicycle?

Auntie Helen

  • 6 Wheels in Germany
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #698 on: 12 February, 2010, 09:44:36 am »
Perhaps someone has mentioned this already but one I hate is the use of "invite" as a noun.  It's "invitation".
Yep, that gets right up my nose too!
My blog on cycling in Germany and eating German cake – http://www.auntiehelen.co.uk


clarion

  • Tyke
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #699 on: 12 February, 2010, 09:52:31 am »
'There's a rockabilly party on saturday night
Are you gonna be there?
I got my invite'

>:(

That's grated since the first time I heard it.
Getting there...