Author Topic: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018  (Read 25541 times)

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #75 on: 13 July, 2018, 11:50:24 am »

cygnet

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #76 on: 13 July, 2018, 11:50:40 am »
back to the old course then.

If your support has transport, get them down to the Esplay/Hodnet RAB for those laps (overnight usually). It's about halfway between Prees and Shawbirch so feeding plans should not be to affected if you can do this.

Marshalls (when they're not busy obvs) should be able to tell your crew when you are likely to be moved to/from the Quina Brook circuit in the evening/morning

Does that mean they have removed the Battlefield laps at the start?

Edit because too slow

Pick up a bottle at Prees on the way down, send your crew to Shawbirch until you pass them for the second time, then back to Prees. Still similar feeding.
There's a layby on the LHS about 1/2 a mile before you get to Shawbirch
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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #77 on: 13 July, 2018, 12:17:08 pm »
Looks like they've added an 10 miles to the Prees-Esply leg from Esply down to Shawbirch.  It's a 40 mile round trip now.  Need to rethink feeding options.

Only during the Saturday afternoon, not at night.

Start to Prees Island is approx 25 miles, then you do approx a further 60 miles before returning to Prees for the second time. This 60 miles is Prees-Epsley-Shawbirch-Epsley-Shawbirch-Epsley-Prees.

Night circuit is still Prees-Epsley-Prees (c 20 miles)

OK, I'm getting really confused now.

I thought Quina Brook was the night circuit. 



So we follow the sequence above, lapping Quina brook until night fall, then do reps on Prees-Espley-Prees over night.  Then what?

Apologies if I'm being thick, I've not ridden this before and it's making my brain hurt.

cygnet

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #78 on: 13 July, 2018, 12:50:44 pm »
They will switch you back on to Quina Brook c. 5-6am then laps of that until the finishing circuit is open c. 10-11am

(Times approximate based on previous years with the old finish)
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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #79 on: 13 July, 2018, 01:34:18 pm »
I'll look forward to that. I never seem to get away from Espley before 8am.

It 's always amusing when slow riders get turned at Tern Hill, leaving their support bemused at Espley, or in the Raven getting a bacon butty.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #80 on: 13 July, 2018, 01:44:19 pm »

I thought Quina Brook was the night circuit. 


Quina Brook is the slow, laney circuit that they put you on for a change and when the main roads might be a bit busy, ie early Saturday evening and late Sunday morning.

The night circuit is on the main road: Prees-Tern Hill-Epsley-Shawbirch.  It's a bit faster and is obviously quieter then. 

cygnet

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #81 on: 13 July, 2018, 02:05:42 pm »
I'll look forward to that. I never seem to get away from Espley before 8am.

It 's always amusing when slow riders get turned at Tern Hill, leaving their support bemused at Espley, or in the Raven getting a bacon butty.

 :facepalm: I looked up "lap" rather than "next lap"
Add about 1 hr to my times above would match ESL's observation better
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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #82 on: 13 July, 2018, 02:56:16 pm »
We're always ready to tell supporters where their rider is on the night circuit at Espley. Heather keeps a very good record.

I've never been at Prees during the night, the riders can sneak off in several directions there, so the recorders might not be keen on distractions.

Assuming Sam is present, the sign that riders are about to be turned is a blonde lady in a fluorescent jacket and a fleece hat, looking down the road with an intense expression.


Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #83 on: 14 July, 2018, 12:01:03 am »
24 Hour Time trialling has been likened to watching paint dry. Someone's got to find that interesting. This is a roughly-cut investigation into those fascinated by the annual spectacle of paint drying.


mattc

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #84 on: 14 July, 2018, 08:01:25 am »
We're always ready to tell supporters where their rider is on the night circuit at Espley. Heather keeps a very good record.

I've never been at Prees during the night, the riders can sneak off in several directions there, so the recorders might not be keen on distractions.

Assuming Sam is present, the sign that riders are about to be turned is a blonde lady in a fluorescent jacket and a fleece hat, looking down the road with an intense expression.


Great picture!

(I suspect it's invisible to those not logged-in to Facebook :( )

What an asset that "blonde lady" has been  :thumbsup:
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #85 on: 16 July, 2018, 01:33:20 pm »
This takes place on the roads around me (I live between Wrexham and Prees) and am planning to come out over the 24 hours to spectate.

Is the start time 13:00 from Wrexham?  Is there room at the start to watch without getting in the way, or would a couple of miles along the route be a better place?

What's the attitude towards non-participants riding on the route during the TT?  I'll be behind the starters between Wrexham and Prees so no problem there (and would probably take a route via Malpas in any case), but I would ride to the various turning points, and obviously the fastest route to do so is by following the route itself.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #86 on: 16 July, 2018, 01:38:03 pm »
The etiquette is that riders go in the opposite direction on the finish circuit. It's not unusual to see clubs out.

There are shortcuts for key locations, the first is the 100 mile mark, as that is published during the race. Only the very slowest will be diverted before that, so it shows the early form.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #87 on: 16 July, 2018, 04:51:50 pm »
Quote
24 Hour Time trialling has been likened to watching paint dry.

As one who puts on a 24 hour time trial event I am likely to agree, cycle racing anyway is only interesting to those who actually do the racing and the only spectators generally are those who are in the pit stop handing out bottles, the rest of the time it is pretty boring even for them.  But we stage it so the racers can race and we are happy to do it.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #88 on: 16 July, 2018, 05:24:01 pm »
That film is largely about how information flows around a 24 hour event. Sam, the main character in it was the winner's team boss for two successive years. Unfortunately he passed away last year, so apologies to those who may find it a bit too poignant.

His rider was unknown in '24' circles but known at other distances. The guy we talk to about number 85 being the fastest at 100 miles is Andy Wilkinson, the current UK record holder at 541.17 miles.

I'm still confused by Sam's downcast attitude with 3hrs and 15 mins to go. They might have got the timings wrong. The course is laid out so that the fastest three riders will do all the legs, and slower riders will have sections omitted. No 85 was so fast he did an extra leg. The course isn't a circuit as such, so you've got to be very aware to know what is happening.

The end of the day is on a finish circuit. Once the rider is on that it's just a case of finding out what their mileage was when they entered the circuit, and how fast they are going. There are timekeepers at approx 2 mile intervals around that circuit, and riders have to reach the next timekeeper if they pass one before 24 hours is up.

The finish of the first rider is the important bit to film, but It can be at any of 6 locations, so I need to know a lot about how they are going. We devoted quite a lot of energy to filming the 24 in 2015, as we were testing an approach for filming PBP 2015.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeRBvJ4cMZk

People tend to take things for granted after a while, and seem to think it's merely a question of pointing a camera at the subject. But it involves a lot of mental arithmetic, but so does timing applications of paint, which is when knowing how fast paint dries is a core skill.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #89 on: 16 July, 2018, 05:31:42 pm »
I prefer the 2013 film :)

Actually that was a tense finish - just look at the crews. We were only 4-5min apart for 23hrs...

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #90 on: 16 July, 2018, 05:39:50 pm »
There's always material I don't use. In 2013 one of the supporters let slip that they'd been handing up from a moving car. It wasn't connected with the winner, so I didn't view it as significant.

I had seen an unbadged black Chrysler 300 shoot off from the start in a marked manner, so it wasn't a complete surprise to me. It's sometimes best to take results with a tiny pinch of salt.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #91 on: 16 July, 2018, 07:02:32 pm »
Damn right it wasn't connected with the winner (my missus runs faster with a bottle in her hand than any stinking Chrysler).

But what about anyone beaten by them? Someone gunning for a top x finish misses out with someone breaking the rules in front? Should've reported them to the orgs.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #92 on: 16 July, 2018, 09:05:42 pm »
I know what you mean, but it's also an Audax, and I consider myself on a private excursion. The CTT have done their own filming at various times. It's a different story when I'm a marshal.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #93 on: 17 July, 2018, 07:58:16 am »
I guess it's also a safety issue - which is the point of the rule.  While I can see why you don't want to be an unpaid policeman, there might be an element of protecting themselves from their own stupidity / lack of competence in motorised handups.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #94 on: 17 July, 2018, 08:41:16 am »
It was something that was said immediately after they finished. People become disinhibited by sleep deprivation, so there's a very direct emotional response. That means that there's an element of voyeurism inherent in the process. Looking at how people behave in a moment of release.

There's quite a lot of footage that I wouldn't use because I feel that it reveals aspects of relationships that should be private. It was interesting to look back at the Mersey Roads 2015/16 footage, as Sam Williamson had passed away, and he reminded me a bit of Dave Brailsford, in his combination of passion and attention to detail. In reviewing the footage, it was interesting to see how the team bounced back from poor prospects after just under  21 hours. That echoed the view of Hippy's team at the beginning.

I do breathe a sigh of relief at the end of all the long-distance rides. The nearest I've come to a fatal incident was in talking to the doctor who was first on the scene of the PBP 2011 accident, he was accompanied by a club-mate who was less used to mortality.

There are aspects that would make a good story, from a human interest angle. but I tend to make films that are readily understood only by the participants. Long distance cycling has become more mainstream, and that has introduced some commercial pressures.

However, there is a feeling that there is integrity in these endeavours, especially in the 'unsupported' movement. I have the luxury of pursuing my own version of integrity, which mainly revolves around a capricious spontaneity. That ensures that I'm recording the event itself, rather than padding it out with sofa footage.

It also means that I have shot stuff I have to make a judgement on. I am just mucking about for my own interest. I was making these films before there were internet platforms to display them on. The first experiment was in 2001. I had a specific emotional motivation for that, but that's one of those private aspects.

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #95 on: 19 July, 2018, 03:47:26 am »
I've been trying to find the definitive route for 2018 without success.   Has anyone got sight of the "official" booklet yet, and could you scan it for here?

Is it
 - Start to Prees Heath
 - Prees Heath to Epsley and back (once)
 - Prees Heath to Battlefield and back (once)
 - Quina Brook loops
 - Prees Heath to Epsley loops
 - Quina Brook loops
 - Back to Wrexham
Finish loop circuits

Feanor

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #96 on: 19 July, 2018, 07:08:26 am »
If you download the start list from the CTT website, you will find it's more than a start list.

Its quite a comprehensive document, and includes the routesheet.

cygnet

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #97 on: 19 July, 2018, 05:29:18 pm »
I've been trying to find the definitive route for 2018 without success.   Has anyone got sight of the "official" booklet yet, and could you scan it for here?

Is it
 - Start to Prees Heath
 - Prees Heath to Epsley
* Espley to Shawbirch and back (twice)
* Espley to Prees Heath

 - Prees Heath to Battlefield and back (once)
 - Quina Brook loops
 - Prees Heath to Epsley loops
 - Quina Brook loops
 - Back to Wrexham
Finish loop circuits

Damn I have got to get fit enough to race again next year.
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Karla

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Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #98 on: 19 July, 2018, 05:40:21 pm »
I'll see you there.  Wanna bet on the result?  ;D

Re: Mersey Roads 24hr TT 2018
« Reply #99 on: 19 July, 2018, 08:44:22 pm »