Member survey

[Davef]

Maybe we could tap into all the covid19 contact tracing that is going to be plumbed into all smart phones.


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[Ajax Bay]

SportIdent stuff is good. It is also used for some sportives and mountain bike races, seems to work nicely.
Though not exactly cheap. And risk of riders losing their dibber, or controls going missing if left unattended.

This stuff requires a box at each control, switched on (and it's not just a mechanical switch, needs a specific bespoke electronic device, and then they'd have to be picked up afterwards. Non-starter afaics. Still think parkrun wheeze is a possible - and certainly worth a trial. Scanners in towns all around the country, laying idle except on Saturdays, and the onus on riders (members or not) to bring their printed barcode to the start.

[grams]

I can't think many Parkrun directors would be happy lending out their essential equipment to anyone.

In any case, the dedicated hardware scanners are being superseded by the Parkrun barcode scanning app, which is a bit more user friendly and can scan barcodes off phone screens (the hardware ones can't). I'm sure AUK could spend a million quid developing something similar.

[fuaran]

Or you can buy cheap NFC tags. Available for about 20p each.
So could have those stuck at the control. Then riders just need to wave their phone at it. Easier and quicker than scanning a QR code.
Though not sure how many phones have NFC built in nowadays?

[mattc]

I can't think many Parkrun directors would be happy lending out their essential equipment to anyone.

In any case, the dedicated hardware scanners are being superseded by the Parkrun barcode scanning app,

Sounds like a problem followed by a solution to me!

Audax is a volunteer-heavy activity (just like parkrun); many many events would not have happened if someone just said:
"I can't think that <so and so> will want to give up their <time, kit, building> for a morning."

And I know of at least one PR director who runs audaxes ...

[LittleWheelsandBig]

... There is some potential for riding a foreign perm with ‘two brevet cards in your pocket’ (one of them an AUK DIY) but frankly I dislike that approach to riding brevets and it is arguably against AUK regulations.

Funny enough, it's not against AUK regulations but is likely against the regulations of the ACP affiliate running the event, as most follow ACPs lead in declaring rides cannot contribute to any other organisations awards.

Such regulations date back to ancient schisms and squabbles between rival - mostly French - cycling organisations... The world has long since moved on...

Regardless, I don’t like collecting two brevets for one ride. I prefer individual rides for individual brevets, analogous to the old RTTC approach of ‘one rider, one award’ e.g. if a vet or woman wins overall, they choose whether they win the overall or win their specific category. If they pick the overall, the next rider in that category collects the category win.

[S2L]

I can't think many Parkrun directors would be happy lending out their essential equipment to anyone.

In any case, the dedicated hardware scanners are being superseded by the Parkrun barcode scanning app,

Sounds like a problem followed by a solution to me!

Audax is a volunteer-heavy activity (just like parkrun); many many events would not have happened if someone just said:
"I can't think that <so and so> will want to give up their <time, kit, building> for a morning."

And I know of at least one PR director who runs audaxes ...

Yes, but the vast majority of BP and BR 200 don't have more than 1 manned intermediate control and typically rely on 2-5 between non manned controls and infos along the way.

[Ajax Bay]

Or you can buy cheap NFC tags. Available for about 20p each.
So could have those stuck at the control. Then riders just need to wave their phone at it. Easier and quicker than scanning a QR code.
Though not sure how many phones have NFC built in nowadays?

Most in current use: https://blog.beaconstac.com/2019/02/phones-compatible-with-nfc-find-the-complete-list-here/
"a method of wireless data transfer called NFC (Near field communication) that detects and then enables technology in close proximity to communicate without the need for an internet connection. It's easy, fast and works automagically."

[The_Mikey]

Or you can buy cheap NFC tags. Available for about 20p each.
So could have those stuck at the control. Then riders just need to wave their phone at it. Easier and quicker than scanning a QR code.
Though not sure how many phones have NFC built in nowadays?

Most mid to high end phones have NFC these days but there are still a lot of exceptions, although by far the biggest anxiety about having to use a phone is battery life and signal related,   whatever system  is used would need to be bullet proof if you're going to persuade people to trust the technology to reliably and accurately record control points, no matter what hardware is used and no matter if there's no data signal (some parts of Wales have no mobile signal provision whatsoever) , it has to just work.

[Manotea]

... There is some potential for riding a foreign perm with ‘two brevet cards in your pocket’ (one of them an AUK DIY) but frankly I dislike that approach to riding brevets and it is arguably against AUK regulations.

Funny enough, it's not against AUK regulations but is likely against the regulations of the ACP affiliate running the event, as most follow ACPs lead in declaring rides cannot contribute to any other organisations awards.

Such regulations date back to ancient schisms and squabbles between rival - mostly French - cycling organisations... The world has long since moved on...

Regardless, I don’t like collecting two brevets for one ride. I prefer individual rides for individual brevets, analogous to the old RTTC approach of ‘one rider, one award’ e.g. if a vet or woman wins overall, they choose whether they win the overall or win their specific category. If they pick the overall, the next rider in that category collects the category win.

on the one hand the example given doesn't relate to the issue under discussion and on the other there are many examples of brevets contributing to multiple awards both within AUK and ACP.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Either AUK should inherently recognise an AUK’s ride in another organisation’s event (e.g. PBP) without needing an AUK brevet card or it shouldn’t recognise another organisation’s event as an AUK brevet.

I’ll just leave you to get on with doing something I dislike intensely.

[mattc]

I can't think many Parkrun directors would be happy lending out their essential equipment to anyone.

In any case, the dedicated hardware scanners are being superseded by the Parkrun barcode scanning app,

Sounds like a problem followed by a solution to me!

Audax is a volunteer-heavy activity (just like parkrun); many many events would not have happened if someone just said:
"I can't think that <so and so> will want to give up their <time, kit, building> for a morning."

And I know of at least one PR director who runs audaxes ...

Yes, but the vast majority of BP and BR 200 don't have more than 1 manned intermediate control and typically rely on 2-5 between non manned controls and infos along the way.

You've totally lost me there MrL - grams+me were commenting on kit loan, not controls.

How is your Easter?

[Manotea]

The problem with a barcode or QR code is that it would require individually-printed brevet cards per person (or at least pre-printed name/code labels - which wouldn't support EOL entries of course) and although this isn't at all difficult to achieve technically I'm not sure anyone has the will to go down that route.  In practice handing out personalised cards at the start of a big event is a much bigger job than just handing out generic ones and getting riders to write their name on.  Plus barcodes aren't very weatherproof (don't know if QR codes are more robust?)
...

My practice - and I suspect I'm in the majority here - is to hand out personalised cards at the Arrivee.

Putting barcodes on brevets card labels has been on my list of things to do for quite some time, however, I suspect such an approach whilst worthy and practicable is already somewhat obsolescent.

This barcode on brevets approach is however compliant with ACP/BRM/LRM regs...

[Ajax Bay]

Barcode on brevets approach
"compliant with ACP/BRM/LRM regs" Good.
"already somewhat obsolescent" not so good.

[bhoot]

An app doing just that was demonstrated at the reunion weekend last year, developed by a volunteer. I've trialled it on a few rides (not all audax, just made up some local routes and added controls for test purposes) and it seems to work OK. I am fairly sure the developer would be happy to share the code. Note it's just Android as that's all we have in our household.

Sounds awesome!

Sorry, just realised that the presentation from the reunion was never uploaded on the website - but it's there now https://audax.uk/news/e-brevet/

[psyclist]

An app doing just that was demonstrated at the reunion weekend last year, developed by a volunteer. I've trialled it on a few rides (not all audax, just made up some local routes and added controls for test purposes) and it seems to work OK. I am fairly sure the developer would be happy to share the code. Note it's just Android as that's all we have in our household.

Sounds awesome!

Sorry, just realised that the presentation from the reunion was never uploaded on the website - but it's there now https://audax.uk/news/e-brevet/

Looks really interesting and well thought out. I do hope this sees the light of day.

[bludger]

An alternative I can think of would be a contactless card payment of £0.01 or whatever, with every rider using a specific contactless debit/credit card registered against their name on the ride. But now we're getting into big "solutions" here...

[Greenbank]

An alternative I can think of would be a contactless card payment of £0.01 or whatever, with every rider using a specific contactless debit/credit card registered against their name on the ride. But now we're getting into big "solutions" here...

Someone (AUK/organiser) would be stung with not insignificant fees for those card payments. TANSTAAFL.

[bludger]

Is there such a thing as a "card tap" that doesn't charge a fee?

Like when you check your balance in a cash machine.

[S2L]

It would be nice to have some sort of flexibility on the Audax season for insurance purposes.

If an event needs to be rescheduled to the following season, and right now we are seeing all of them having to face this, it would be nice to transfer the riders automatically (if they wish) without them having to manually complete and sign a new entry form. This is not necessary if rescheduling for the same Audax season, but currently it is simply not possible.
It is a huge logistical task if an organisers has 100+ riders already signed up.
The alternative is to refund them all, which involves some losses inevitably.

[CrazyEnglishTriathlete]

There are a few PROFs (Permanent Rides on Foreign Soil) that count for AUK points , including quite a few in the Alps as well as a full SR series in Corsica.

[grimpeur du sudocrem]

There are a few PROFs (Permanent Rides on Foreign Soil) that count for AUK points , including quite a few in the Alps as well as a full SR series in Corsica.

Where are these listed? If we can't ride we might as well plan, and dream.
The current search facility doesn't help much.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Rather than having the barcode printed on the brevet card, the barcode could simply be the membership number in same way parkrun do. Each rider turns up with their barcode printed and laminated diy, or for those that want to splash out £5 printed on a little hard piece of plastic or as a wrist band.


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Not everyone has a printer let alone a laminater.

[Davef]

Rather than having the barcode printed on the brevet card, the barcode could simply be the membership number in same way parkrun do. Each rider turns up with their barcode printed and laminated diy, or for those that want to splash out £5 printed on a little hard piece of plastic or as a wrist band.


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Not everyone has a printer let alone a laminater.

2.3million people have managed it for parkrun. My first one was printed by a friend, then I bought one online for £5. I appreciate not everyone has internet or £5.


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[mattc]

There are a few PROFs (Permanent Rides on Foreign Soil) that count for AUK points , including quite a few in the Alps as well as a full SR series in Corsica.

Where are these listed? If we can't ride we might as well plan, and dream.
The current search facility doesn't help much.

is the Perms control map still up?
Iirc that was a quick way to find rides àbroad.