Author Topic: I seem to be campaigning now.  (Read 1275 times)

I seem to be campaigning now.
« on: 18 May, 2022, 09:23:13 am »
I was told that I couldn't take my bicycle into the recycling centre as it would be too dangerous. This was after I asked the council if I could do so, who then forwarded my request to Veolia. While waiting for them to reply I rode to the recycling centre with my recycling, some scrap metals, on the trailer. The staff were surprised to see me but let me in after I showed them the required ID.

The next day Veolia emailed to say I could not do this: dangerous, lots of site traffic, blah blah. I wrote back to say I have already done so and the site traffic at 5mph is not the danger, but it is the road traffic at 20 - 40 mph on the roads I had to use to get there.

After a couple of days I used Veolia's web form for the London HQ and put my case. I used terms such as 'anti cycling rhetoric' and 'bikelash'.

Today is now almost one week later and I have this reply from the original Veolia local administrator:
'We have been asked by the council to carry out a risk assessment at the Household Waste Recycling Centre'

I will keep fingers crossed.

Wowbagger

  • Sylph
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #1 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:28:22 am »
"Our risk assessment has concluded that the chief danger lies in the operation of motor vehicles so from 01/06/2022 motor vehicles will no longer be granted admission to our site."
I want to surf the zeitgeist to where it’s all happening

Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #2 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:39:48 am »
If the site is too dangerous to use by bike, then it needs fixing.  I'm sure that'll be their way of thinking?  Best of luck though!

Karla

  • car(e) free
    • Lost Byway - around the world by bike
Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #3 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:50:12 am »
Why did you ask them?   Were the staff at the site refusing you entry?

Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #4 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:58:14 am »
"Our risk assessment has concluded that the chief danger lies in the operation of motor vehicles so from 01/06/2022 motor vehicles will no longer be granted admission to our site."
I went the other way and said that if H&S say it is too dangerous to use a bicycle on a 5mph site then bicycles would be banned from the public road.

Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #5 on: 18 May, 2022, 10:02:39 am »
Why did you ask them?   Were the staff at the site refusing you entry?

Pretty standard.  I'm not allowed access to the local recycling centres with a bike.  There's a separate entrance which involves a lengthy detour and then pressing a buzzer, which eventually results in someone opening the security gate.  The gate is too narrow for a large Carry Freedom trailer! Even then you're only allowed to drop things off in a box well away from the main part of the centre.

The whole thing is designed for one-way (motorised) vehicles.
The sound of one pannier flapping

Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #6 on: 18 May, 2022, 10:03:15 am »
Why did you ask them?   Were the staff at the site refusing you entry?
Bicycles were not mentioned as an allowed vehicle on the site, or at all. I did not want to carry scrap metal to the site and then be told 'no entry' at the gate. I took the chance as I couldn't be asked to wait anymore. If I was refused entry then there is a scrap yard further down the road that would take my scrap metals.
As for the staff, I don't think they were aware of any ban or if they knew of one they used common sense, saw the site was empty, and let me in.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #7 on: 18 May, 2022, 10:13:38 am »
Today is now almost one week later and I have this reply from the original Veolia local administrator:
'We have been asked by the council to carry out a risk assessment at the Household Waste Recycling Centre'

I will keep fingers crossed.
"Our risk assessment shows the biggest danger is being hit by falling waste items. Therefore our Household Waste Recycling Centre will no longer be handling household waste."
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #8 on: 18 May, 2022, 10:16:43 am »
On a slightly more serious note, I'm surprised by the frequency with which access to waste sites comes up as a topic on this forum.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Snakehips

  • Twixt London and leafy Surrey
Re: I seem to be campaining now.
« Reply #9 on: 18 May, 2022, 10:31:12 am »
At the Villiers Road Recycling Centre Kingston there is a brief period set aside for people who choose to visit by means other than motor vehicle, i.e. Sundays 3:15-4pm -  pedestrian / cycle access. All access has to be booked in advance.

Mustn't grumble in the circumstances .

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #10 on: 18 May, 2022, 11:30:14 am »
I know I posted this in the other thread, but for future reference: https://twitter.com/kimble4/status/1321095487139811332

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #11 on: 18 May, 2022, 04:10:55 pm »
My local tip is also run by Veolia and they allow people in by bike.
Strange things are afoot at the circle K.

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #12 on: 18 May, 2022, 05:00:23 pm »
They will be banning pedestrians at waste sites next. Sorry it’s too dangerous with all these vehicles. Best you stay in your car to be safe.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #13 on: 18 May, 2022, 05:09:32 pm »
They will be banning pedestrians at waste sites next.

They frequently do, in order to prevent people parking their car on the surrounding streets and jumping the queueueueue on foot.  What people who don't have access to a car are supposed to do I'm not sure.

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #14 on: 18 May, 2022, 08:56:25 pm »
Good grief. This has long been a whinge of mine about the Merton tip, and prompted by this thread I thought I'd pick up the cudgels and fight the cyclists' corner.

No need !!   Merton now allow cyclists and pedestrians to deposit waste at the tip. They're not allowed in, but instead have to pass it to one of the team there.

Added bonus is that neither pedestrians or cyclists need to book a slot, they can just turn up (unlike drivers who do have to book).
Rust never sleeps

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #15 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:09:52 pm »
They will be banning pedestrians at waste sites next. Sorry it’s too dangerous with all these vehicles. Best you stay in your car to be safe.

No pedestrians allowed at mine. >:( Bikes are allowed, though.

I'm not sure what makes the tips in my current council area more dangerous than those in the previous one, which were open to both cyclists and pedestrians. ???

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #16 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:14:42 pm »
They will be banning pedestrians at waste sites next.

They frequently do, in order to prevent people parking their car on the surrounding streets and jumping the queueueueue on foot.  What people who don't have access to a car are supposed to do I'm not sure.

Round here, our only option is a "bulky uplift" at £5 a time. Which isn't a huge sum in itself, but it rather grates that I'm already paying for the running of the tip sites through my council tax, yet I'm not allowed to use them. And it doesn't allow for disposal of stuff that's not allowed in normal rubbish/recycling collections, but isn't actually "bulky".

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #17 on: 18 May, 2022, 09:26:21 pm »
They will be banning pedestrians at waste sites next. Sorry it’s too dangerous with all these vehicles. Best you stay in your car to be safe.

No pedestrians allowed at mine. >:( Bikes are allowed, though.

My point was that even if you arrive at the tip in a car. As soon as you get out of your car, then you are a pedestrian in that environment. Their risk assessment must therefore say it’s safe to be a pedestrian in that area.

bhoot

  • MemSec (ex-Mrs RRtY)
Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #18 on: 18 May, 2022, 10:33:08 pm »
Our local tip was fully accessible by bike under the previous incumbent operators (which may have been Veolia). It's now Corys (we are in Tower Hamlets) and the new rule is "cyclists dismount" and use the pedestian route. When I queried this as it isn't ideal with a bike and trailer, I was told it for "health and safety" reasons. I questioned the nature of the risk, in particular please could they tell me whether I would pose the risk by cycling or be at risk. Needless to say the operatives couldn't say, and it probably wasn't fair to expect them to.

We grumble every time we go but can't quite be bothered to kick up too much as we can at least access the place and don't need a booking.

But seriously, if they really feel vehicle movements are a risk then probably no-one should get out of the car.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #19 on: 18 May, 2022, 11:25:51 pm »
I’ve not cycled to our tip, but if there is a risk for vulnerable users from cars, it is because people get out of their cars and take stuff to the skips. This becoming vulnerable users.
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #20 on: 19 May, 2022, 03:53:39 pm »
my local council has had a vehicles only policy for a while. I suspect it's not just because of car traffic but also the rather large lorries lifting the skips up when they are full. I did try to walk in a few years ago and was turned away, they were happy to take the items off me at the gate though.

They do offer a bulky item home collection service although do not state the fee. The local centre is also now appointment only so they require a pre-registered reg. no. for the vehicle, which is also only allowed 6 visits maximum a month.

They will be banning pedestrians at waste sites next. Sorry it’s too dangerous with all these vehicles. Best you stay in your car to be safe.

No pedestrians allowed at mine. >:( Bikes are allowed, though.

My point was that even if you arrive at the tip in a car. As soon as you get out of your car, then you are a pedestrian in that environment. Their risk assessment must therefore say it’s safe to be a pedestrian in that area.

it is providing you park outside the specific TV / washing machine etc skips then get back in your car (and if the skip lorry is operating in that bit they don't even allow cars in). The main recycling area has a pavement area which is separated from the various skips by a large fence with gates to access them which are locked when the skip lorry is operating in that area. You are not allowed to leave the pavement area.

These sites are ATEOTD designed around quick in and out (and safe) vehicle access with no provision for non motorised users. If it were to be provided for other means it would add to the cost of running the service so GF

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #21 on: 19 May, 2022, 04:50:41 pm »
Stunnngly good news has been received:
"I have been advised by our Risk and Assurance Advisor that a risk assessment has been carried out and that it has now been deemed safe for a bike and trailer to enter the HWRC's, providing that the correct entrance is used and the resident queues in the normal manner with the other vehicles waiting to use the site. Any resident trying to jump the queue or entering the site via the exit gate should be refused entry as any other pedestrian would be.

There will now be instruction given to the operatives at both sites in relation to this new advice."

 :thumbsup:

Wowbagger

  • Sylph
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #22 on: 19 May, 2022, 04:57:15 pm »
Well done Del! I assume that is the Sutton Road site? Or does it cover the Leigh site as well?
I want to surf the zeitgeist to where it’s all happening

Re: I seem to be campaigning now.
« Reply #23 on: 19 May, 2022, 04:59:33 pm »
Well done Del! I assume that is the Sutton Road site? Or does it cover the Leigh site as well?
I took it to mean Stock Road and Leigh Marsh (Two Tree Island) sites.