Lightweight touring setup

[quixoticgeek]

There's probably a weight factor too, thinking about it.  A heavier rider isn't going to notice the weight of luggage as much, so their comfort tradeoff will be different.  Personally, a few more kilos makes hardly any difference on the bike, but a bad night's sleep really slows me down.

Thing is with modern technology and camping products even camping you can get a surprising amount in a small space. Exped Downmat HL is under 500g, it's about the size of a 1 bottle. A down sleeping bag packs down to next to nothing. Add in a bivvi and tarp, and you've got a full shelter in not much space. In fact with my current bulky 1kg synthetic sleeping bag, I can get everything I need for an overnight camp (shelter, sleep system, food, cook system) in a 15l pack. The extra change of clothes necessary for a longer trip wouldn't push beyond about 20L or so. Easily enough to fit in a saddle bag.

J

[mattc]

<not a camping expert, but ... >

The new super-light/small stuff is rather spendy though. It's become another wealth-based arms race, alongside expensive light bikes. Luckily you CAN still travel with a cheap heavy bike and cheap bulky gear, but it does make one rather jealous of high-tech comrades

(It may be that it's quite cheap compared to 40yrs ago in real terms - but as I say, I'm no expert!)

[Kim]

Thing is with modern technology and camping products even camping you can get a surprising amount in a small space. Exped Downmat HL is under 500g, it's about the size of a 1 bottle. A down sleeping bag packs down to next to nothing.
 Add in a bivvi and tarp, and you've got a full shelter in not much space. In fact with my current bulky 1kg synthetic sleeping bag, I can get everything I need for an overnight camp (shelter, sleep system, food, cook system) in a 15l pack.

My Downmat 7M and down sleeping bag effectively fill an Ortlieb Back Roller (with a few small items crammed in around them).  That's probably 15 litres before you've started, and I still need a liner if it's going to be below 5C.

I hadn't seen the HL before.  Looks like a good weight/volume saving, if you can stay on it (probably better suited to bivvis than tents).

[αdαmsκι]

Here's my set up when I cycled from Belgium to Greece a few years ago. I camped but didn't take cooking stuff



I used the Nelson longflap on my LEJoG this year but as I wasn't camping I need less stuff.

[mzjo]

It also depends on your tolerance for wearing lycra off the bike. Or for cycling long distances in non-cycling clothes. Or indeed for doing things other than just cycling and sitting round a campsite while on tour.

As has been said, we all have our own personal comfort items or acceptable level of discomfort.  One of my local "hard man" tourists gets a tarpaulin and sleeping bag in a Campers Longflap along with his clothes etc.  That is way beyond what I could cope with.

That's not hard!! Hard is leaving the tarp and bag at home and sleeping in the saddlebag. It's not called a Camper for nothing.

I personally couldn't fit anything else in a saddlebag (or even a 15l rucksack) once I had put my Decathlon polaire in it. That's progress (it actually lives on the bag loops or under a bungie rather than in the bag!)

[Bolt]

This is a good lightweight and capacious option: https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=103567.0

[zigzag]

my setup for a two-week trip across europe, slept outside all nights except one, was comfy enough


my opinion is that traveling with lighter bike is so much nicer that it outweighs the benefit of having extra comfort gear (i wouldn't mind if someone else was carrying it for me though..)

[Kim]

I'm not sure that helicopters qualify as lightweight...

[quixoticgeek]

my setup for a two-week trip across europe, slept outside all nights except one, was comfy enough


my opinion is that traveling with lighter bike is so much nicer that it outweighs the benefit of having extra comfort gear (i wouldn't mind if someone else was carrying it for me though..)

This is the sort of thing I'm aiming for. Our of curiosity could you share some info on your loadout? What was in what pouch ?

J

[zigzag]

This is the sort of thing I'm aiming for. Our of curiosity could you share some info on your loadout? What was in what pouch ?

J

without going into too much detail (and i forgot what was there exactly), the stuff was distributed as follows:
*bottom bracket case - tubes, tools, and spares
*frame bag - battery packs, aa batteries, charger, spare lights, collection of usb cables
*tri bag - toiletries - sunscreen, toothpaste/brush, lip balm, plasters etc.
*saddle bag - bonk rations, arm/leg warmers, musette, silk liner, survival bag
*bar bag - bubble wrap, down gilet, waterproof jacket, spare shorts and socks
*yellow 5l waterproof bag - for food on the go

the idea was to have heavier items near the centre of gravity so that the bike is still fun to ride.

what i am looking for now is a custom ultrasonically welded waterproof frame bag with two waterproof and sheltered zips, but haven't found who could make one yet (there's a myriad of options for water-resistant ones)

[mrcharly-YHT]

So you didn't have anything approaching a rain cover or sleeping bag, just a survival bag and silk liner? Presumably you slept in the down vest and relied on it not raining at night or being cold?

Were campsites ok with you not having a tent or did you just wild camp it and be discrete?

No way of cooking food so you ate out for all meals?

[Cudzoziemiec]

Bubble wrap is light but bulky. If you're content using that as bedding, best fill up two panniers worth so you can a) have spare when the first bursts, 2) amuse yourself popping it, iii) impress other cyclists with your speed up hills despite "loaded panniers"!

[zigzag]

So you didn't have anything approaching a rain cover or sleeping bag, just a survival bag and silk liner? Presumably you slept in the down vest and relied on it not raining at night or being cold?

Were campsites ok with you not having a tent or did you just wild camp it and be discrete?

No way of cooking food so you ate out for all meals?

survival bag is waterproof, it worked well on damp grass. slept in down vest two nights, other nights were warm enough without it. checked weather forecast for the night, which was accurate. never camped on the camp sites, mainly in the fields or bus shelters
bought ready made meals and snacks in the shops or stopped at the restaurants.
bubble wrap was cut to my torso size and was of the non-poppable type, more durable.

[Karla]

Deano, Dale et al will confirm I got a mat and summer sleeping bag into my Carradice Nelson along with civvy stuff on the last Tan Hill trip, with tent strapped under the lid.  I didn't have a stove, but then again I lugged a Whisperlite and a bottle of patrol around Kyrgyzstan for two weeks this summer and I wouldn't take one again for a tour of less than $MANY_MONTHS, as that cup of tea in the morning isn't worth it for the extra kilo of weight IMO.  Like Zigzag, I think that too much load spoils the handling of the bike and takes half the fun out of it.

All this is immaterial really, as the OP says he wants to do B&B touring.  I really can't see why you'd want panniers for such a thing, they'll just be an enticement to take excess rubbish.  You basically want a set of civvy clothes, an extra layer, a waterproof, a toolkit, a wash kit and a book or alternative evening entertainment, and that will all go in a saddlebag or rack pack.

[Ham]

I really can't see why you'd want panniers for such a thing, they'll just be an enticement to take excess rubbish. 

Reasons for panniers:

 - You prefer 'em for reasons of ease of mount/demount
 - you prefer 'em for reasons of weight distribution location
 - you prefer 'em for reasons of ease of transport through airports
 - you prefer 'em (two) for reasons of organisation and ease of access
 - you prefer 'em for flexibility

That doesn't mean that you can't achieve any of the above with alternate setups, but my preference is for panniers for the combination of qualities, I can't see any downside. (possibly, the ease of removal makes them less secure than a saddle pack? possibly airbrake effect is lessened on frame packs? neither are significant to me)

[Kim]

I'll add:

- Already have front panniers for full camping setup, no pressing reason to buy more luggage.
- Waterproofing of panniers tends to be better than that of rack bags.