Author Topic: Ashes 2013-14 (Read 17861 times)

Jaded · « **Reply #100 on:** 11 December, 2013, 01:11:01 am »

Another Boycott in the making?

Please no, 50 runs scored over a day and a half, strokes played with consummate, exquisite boredom.

clifftaylor · « **Reply #101 on:** 11 December, 2013, 06:26:21 am »

That's exactly what England need - somebody who can hold one end down, giving other people the chance to score runs.

matthew · « **Reply #102 on:** 11 December, 2013, 12:40:39 pm »

The england openers aught to be taking the approach of:

Not out at lunch - good doing my job, runs not important
Not out at Tea - good doing my job 50-70 runs would be nice but not vital
Not out at close - job done ideally 100 runs to my name but importantly 90 overs in the bowlers legs so the likes of Pieterson and Bell can make runs tomorrow.

Carberry appears to have the right attitude to leaving the ball outside off stump but was caught pulling. A shot that should only be attepted if you can keep it down or clear the rope.
Cook has in the past managed it but needs to bat first without the effort of captaining in the field for a day and a half before being sent in.

andyoxon · « **Reply #103 on:** 11 December, 2013, 03:51:17 pm »

~~I've read the signs and our local willow tree is predicting that England might be about to be free from the WACA stranglehold...~~

Australian Willow, I think.

madcow · « **Reply #104 on:** 11 December, 2013, 11:36:07 pm »

Quote from: clifftaylor on 11 December, 2013, 06:26:21 am

That's exactly what England need - somebody who can hold one end down, giving other people the chance to score runs.

Thanks, cliff, that's exactly what I meant. Slow and boring to score runs and wear the bowlers out.
K.P is great at flashy batting strokes but to win matches you have to score lots of runs and get the other side out.
There is nothing more knackering for a fast bowler than having to bowl all day long at someone who plays safe, steady shots. It annoys the hell out of them, then they get raggy. That's when a good batsmen starts scoring.

England are simply not scoring enough runs . Root has averaged 43 and he's the highest scorer on this tour.

(I'm not saying K.P is crap, as his Test record is almost as good as Boycs, but for some reason he isn't coping with the Aus bowling so far. Hope he can improve asap.)

Von Broad · « **Reply #105 on:** 12 December, 2013, 09:08:30 pm »

No catching the start of play for this one, not for me anyway, not at 2.30am!
Time zones come calling. It's a big place out there.

Well it's a fascinating situation, but very tough to come back from 2-0 down, not impossible but a real tough call, but I'm wishing some good wishes for a change - negativity gets to be draining after a while

Jaded · « **Reply #106 on:** 12 December, 2013, 11:40:46 pm »

It does mean that my morning meeting could be carried out in front of the big screen, if news is good.

andyoxon · « **Reply #107 on:** 13 December, 2013, 08:06:01 am »

Like Brisbane, running away from England again.

matthew · « **Reply #108 on:** 13 December, 2013, 10:10:05 am »

Let them off the hook again.

143-5 to 326-6 at the close

Smith 103no and Haddin 55 to lift the Aussies from the mire

andyoxon · « **Reply #109 on:** 13 December, 2013, 12:25:20 pm »

Probably down to the England batsmen to stay in and build a decent total to stay in the match, so that doesn't bode too well.

Von Broad · « **Reply #110 on:** 13 December, 2013, 06:41:33 pm »

Quote from: matthew on 13 December, 2013, 10:10:05 am

Let them off the hook again.

143-5 to 326-6 at the close

I'm not sure we let them off the hook so to speak [although I say that in ignorance, I know nothing of how we bowled subsequent to 143-5 or if there were any dropped catches etc]
Sounds like the majority of those six Australia wickets were giveaways, which was surprising to hear on the radio this morning before I left the house.
If, on a decent pitch, after being 143-5, they decide not to play so many throwaway shots and knuckle down then that's not necessarily England's fault. You can only bowl as best you can.

The big difference is confidence. imo.
In current form, if England had been 143-5, chances are the final all-out total might easily have been anything between 144 and 326!
It's a test winning side when, if one person fails, then somebody else steps up to the plate to take over.
England have been very good at doing that in recent years. It's what the Ashes winning side was made of in Australia last time around under Strauss - there was always somebody that came good at the right time, and the whole team chipped in big time. That's what Australia are doing this series.

matthew · « **Reply #111 on:** 13 December, 2013, 10:04:40 pm »

Agreed, I am not sure we let them off the hook but rather they got out of jail. None of our bowlers were capable in the heat to break through that pair and into the tail.

Last summer was similar an England player managed to step up in each test with bat and ball whilst the Aussies didn't. This time round the Aussies are getting a star performance in each test and the others are pitching in while we look like rabbits in the headlights.

bobb · « **Reply #112 on:** 13 December, 2013, 10:08:29 pm »

Quote from: matthew on 13 December, 2013, 10:04:40 pm

....while we look like rabbits in the headlights.

England certainly look like rabbits when batting!

mcshroom · « **Reply #113 on:** 13 December, 2013, 10:21:00 pm »

Rabbits are more amusing and seem to last longer than English batsmen at the moment: -
http://youtu.be/wVN4PRLrpsA

(Ok probably a hare)

Deano · « **Reply #114 on:** 13 December, 2013, 10:27:05 pm »

Quote from: Von Broad on 13 December, 2013, 06:41:33 pm

Quote from: matthew on 13 December, 2013, 10:10:05 am
Let them off the hook again.

143-5 to 326-6 at the close

I'm not sure we let them off the hook so to speak [although I say that in ignorance, I know nothing of how we bowled subsequent to 143-5 or if there were any dropped catches etc]
Sounds like the majority of those six Australia wickets were giveaways, which was surprising to hear on the radio this morning before I left the house.
If, on a decent pitch, after being 143-5, they decide not to play so many throwaway shots and knuckle down then that's not necessarily England's fault. You can only bowl as best you can.

The big difference is confidence. imo.
In current form, if England had been 143-5, chances are the final all-out total might easily have been anything between 144 and 326!
It's a test winning side when, if one person fails, then somebody else steps up to the plate to take over.
England have been very good at doing that in recent years. It's what the Ashes winning side was made of in Australia last time around under Strauss - there was always somebody that came good at the right time, and the whole team chipped in big time. That's what Australia are doing this series.

I'm quite pleased about the development of the series. Apart from the nostalgic pleasure of going to sleep with Australia at 150-5 (ooh, we can get them out cheaply) and waking up to them at 350-6, and the joy of seeing a fast bowler such as Mitch Johnson rampaging through the tail (I enjoyed the bag-of-shite chants as much as anyone, but I've a soft spot for a fellow left-armer, and he's been fabulous), the series so far has highlighted that England still have a whole raft of unresolved issues, and they've been complacent on the back of a summer victory. The Aussies have come back - which is thoroughly admirable, since it wasn't just England who were beating them, they were being thrashed by India and nearly all comers.

England were by far the better team in the summer, but there were loads of problems in the team, which they don't seem to have done much to resolve. Since Collingwood retired no-one has made a place for themselves at number six (though I'm pleased to see Ben Stokes, the first Cumbrian to represent England, being picked), Jimmy Anderson isn't having the impact he used to have, Matt Prior is horribly out of form, and the captaincy seems to be weighing down on Cook.

Anyway, regardless of England's success, I'm enjoying having highlights free. Hopefully this is a transitional England who'll learn from the experience, though Flower seems to be a bit too unbending in his approach.

mattc · « **Reply #115 on:** 14 December, 2013, 08:57:53 am »

KP:
He just doesn't have the mental strength to be a Test batsman. He gets bored, goes for a pull, gets out - repeat ad nauseum

I've tried to give him the benefit of the doubt, but he's just been taking the piss recently. Past glories are no use to us. Drop him.

Pfffft.

Jaded · « **Reply #116 on:** 14 December, 2013, 09:05:37 am »

So, from a good reachable target we get back to the old 'avoid the follow on' as target.

andyoxon · « **Reply #117 on:** 14 December, 2013, 11:29:34 am »

This Australian side, on home grounds, are simply able to dominate England in batting and bowling, and are the better side. I'm hoping for a consolation win at the MCG or SCG, but doubtful it will happen on the current form. $:-\$

clifftaylor · « **Reply #118 on:** 15 December, 2013, 12:06:56 pm »

And Broad is now out of this match (at least) with a foot injury. $:-\$

ferret · « **Reply #119 on:** 15 December, 2013, 03:25:02 pm »

After listening to the high lights of the first day I didn't bother to catch up with any more, I suppose if you look back at the summer it's not at all surprising that Australia are giving us a stuffing, if it wasn't for weather interrupted games back then we would have lost that series as well or at best it would have been a draw. Even during the summer Test Cook & KP were not batting to the best of their ability along with one or two others now we're on Aussie wickets the short comings of our batsmen stick out like sore thumbs, I have never liked KP so it goes without saying if it were down to me he would be the first out the door, as far as I'm concerned he's an arrogant prick who plays for himself and not the team unfortunately cricket is a team game, perhaps he should take up golf. Batsmen like Pietersen have to be consistent, I think batsmen 4 & 5 need to stay in like as been said up thread wear the bowlers down don't worry about hitting the ball out of the ground, block, take singles keep changing the batsmen don't let the bowler settle wait for the bad ball, don't chase after wide balls . this is stuff you learn in secondary school it's not rocket science

well thats my tuppence worth

mattc · « **Reply #120 on:** 15 December, 2013, 03:31:18 pm »

Re: ferret's guide to batting. DId anyone hear the crazy stat about Boyc's inningses at Perth?
He hit something like two centuries in a row with exactly 0 boundaries (that's a zero).

A master of the #digin indeed.

ferret · « **Reply #121 on:** 15 December, 2013, 05:19:49 pm »

well exactly, I believe that he has the fourth career highest test score or something like that, but he was also called boring at times, well if boring wins matches then so be it.
I was also talking about batsmen 4 & 5 who need to hold onto their wicket, especially if the first 3 have thrown their wickets away, but of course every game is different, unfortunately our batsmen and especially KP only seem to be able to play one style and that ain't working, time to change tack I think try a different approach (I just thought) back in the summer didn't one of the England squad say that Cook wasn't adventurous as a captain, maybe the answer is that, get adventurous or get a new captain it may even do his batting some good a'la Botham. Mind you I'm getting fed up with this weather I'll give it a bash just pay for my flights and hotel can't say fairer than that

Jaded · « **Reply #122 on:** 15 December, 2013, 05:22:37 pm »

Whilst boring wins matches it loses customers.

clifftaylor · « **Reply #123 on:** 15 December, 2013, 05:52:01 pm »

The current England performance isn't going to win new customers, is it?

ferret · « **Reply #124 on:** 15 December, 2013, 06:43:09 pm »

well it all depends on what people want, people who can actually bat and score runs but take a a few innings to make a good score or people who go into a 5 day game and use T20 tack ticks and throw any chance of winning or retaining what ever trophy they're playing for away, is it possible that we've actually forgotten how to play a 5 day game, going by some of the shot selections I would say yes, reminds me of the 20 over slog we used to play in the local pub league.