Author Topic: Base training  (Read 250347 times)

rob

Re: Base training
« Reply #950 on: 09 April, 2018, 07:18:44 pm »
Is it just me who makes a playlist by bpm for cadence, then?

 :-\

The problem I have is that if I listen to the same music when doing normal tasks I start to get a bit tense.   I think I have developed a subconscious link between dance music and hurting myself.

jiberjaber

  • ... Fancy Pants \o/ ...
  • ACME S&M^2
Re: Base training
« Reply #951 on: 09 April, 2018, 09:12:13 pm »
Is it just me who makes a playlist by bpm for cadence, then?
No, I have an FTP and ramp test playlist plus for everything else there's some hard and fast euro EDM to keep pace to....
Regards,

Joergen

Re: Base training
« Reply #952 on: 11 April, 2018, 09:03:00 am »
Is it just me who makes a playlist by bpm for cadence, then?

 :-\

The problem I have is that if I listen to the same music when doing normal tasks I start to get a bit tense.   I think I have developed a subconscious link between dance music and hurting myself.
Well yeah. Coming into the outskirts of Paris last PBP my radio started playing some tracks from a spinning class. Mr Smith was a bit (unpleasantly) surprised by the boost from behind.

Re: Base training
« Reply #953 on: 13 April, 2018, 02:18:54 pm »
I had a hard under/over session (McAdie) to do 10 days ago and it felt pretty grim from the off. Kept going but only by reducing the Intensity for the last couple of blocks. The TSS still managed to be higher than any prior session in my lengthy (month long!) TR "career" up to then. Cue a week+ of acute moaning man flu.

Well, a brief interlude of wellness followed that man flu before I succumbed to a lingering nasty cold/throat infection which still persists. All training out of the window for a few weeks now, with my TR sub mocking me daily.

Don't think I've ever had such a prolonged period of sickness. Any connection to the earlier much ramped-up workload is purely coincidental, I'm sure...

Re: Base training
« Reply #954 on: 13 April, 2018, 02:39:59 pm »
Well, a brief interlude of wellness followed that man flu before I succumbed to a lingering nasty cold/throat infection which still persists. All training out of the window for a few weeks now, with my TR sub mocking me daily.

Don't think I've ever had such a prolonged period of sickness. Any connection to the earlier much ramped-up workload is purely coincidental, I'm sure...

It's a bugger, isn't it.  At the same stage myself with the lingering "swallowing broken glass" and coughing up phlegm thing going on, but have been persisting with trainer sessions in the gym and today pushed my HR to 176 (the highest I've recorded in a long time) during a simulated 10m hill climb.  No doubt a symptom of being unwell but happy to at least get some training in as I have my first event next Sunday.
The sound of one pannier flapping

Re: Base training
« Reply #955 on: 13 April, 2018, 02:52:37 pm »
Well, a brief interlude of wellness followed that man flu before I succumbed to a lingering nasty cold/throat infection which still persists. All training out of the window for a few weeks now, with my TR sub mocking me daily.

Don't think I've ever had such a prolonged period of sickness. Any connection to the earlier much ramped-up workload is purely coincidental, I'm sure...

It's a bugger, isn't it.  At the same stage myself with the lingering "swallowing broken glass" and coughing up phlegm thing going on, but have been persisting with trainer sessions in the gym and today pushed my HR to 176 (the highest I've recorded in a long time) during a simulated 10m hill climb.  No doubt a symptom of being unwell but happy to at least get some training in as I have my first event next Sunday.

A kindred spirit! Bar the broken glass and foul stuff I actually feel pretty normal now so I'll probably do a super gentle session keeping the HR right down. Cheers.

Re: Base training
« Reply #956 on: 13 April, 2018, 03:54:26 pm »
I'm in the same boat - done TR solidly since September and got my FTP up significantly, and then this rotten cold has come along and I've not been on the turbo for 2 weeks (I did a TT last Saturday and got a PB, but I wasn't anywhere near what I wanted). My wife and daughter have had the same bug, and to a similar level, so I don't think I got it worse because I'd been training...
Gonna have a bike fit on Sunday, so hopefully I can do an FTP test and get going again from then.

Re: Base training
« Reply #957 on: 15 April, 2018, 11:10:23 am »
A strange thing has happened.  Just finished my usual training lap of the "hills" of north London - a loop taking in Muswell Hill, Highgate Hill & Swains Lane - which comes in at exactly 15 miles.  Being in town there are obviously variations due to traffic, lights, etc, but I've been doing this for several years so times vary but are within a known range (~2 mins).

Anyway, got back and casually checked the Bolt and, lo, it was the fastest ever time by a full 5 minutes (53.06 vs previous 58.04).  I thought something must be wrong so double-checked everything but the stats are all correct.  This is fairly incredible!  I'm on the tail end of a bad cold and was coughing my lungs up by the end (sports-induced asthma?) but was determined to do a fast ride in preparation for my first event of the year next Sunday.

What has caused this increase in form is unclear.  The only change in my programme has been mixing up intervals on the trainer - 30 mins of fast efforts followed by 2 x 10 mins of 110% FTP at high resistance and low cadence (~60) staying seated - real killers!  Also I've been doing more goblet squats - 8 x 12 reps @ 40k three times a week.  They really seem to target the quads in a beneficial way for cycling.
The sound of one pannier flapping

Re: Base training
« Reply #958 on: 16 April, 2018, 10:00:29 am »
I'm back into it now.  Bike fit Sunday morning - position fine on the hoods but I need a new saddle (so I can get forward and open up my hip angle while getting my back down low) and a -17 degree stem to get reasonably low in my aero bars. I followed that by a Ramp Test X (was supposed to be a 20 minute test but I didn't have the motivation).
https://www.trainerroad.com/career/duncanm23/rides-new/32966849
I stopped about 30 seconds before I did on my last one, so I guess my FTP has probably lost a few watts, but given I have hardly ridden in 2 weeks and I still have a rubbish head cold, I think that's not a bad outcome.

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Base training
« Reply #959 on: 16 April, 2018, 12:51:12 pm »
i had a first big weekend of riding this year with 456km all in (audax plus club run), felt quite strong on both days although the club run was painful on sunday. my rule of thumb recovery time is one day for 100km ridden, so will be back on the trainer thursday or friday to start the final intensive week of build phase.

Re: Base training
« Reply #960 on: 17 April, 2018, 10:42:14 am »
Well that hurt. Couldn't do the last interval, even with it turned down a bit:
https://www.trainerroad.com/career/duncanm23/rides-new/33045675

I guess being able to breathe is probably useful.  :-X
The new FTP from the ramp test came back as 248.  First time I've gone downwards, but not too bad given the caveats.

Re: Base training
« Reply #961 on: 18 April, 2018, 08:10:11 pm »
Helped out with the first club TT last night so went and did it myself today far more motivational than an ftp test!
FTP up by 8 according to Xert and a good time to work on for the rest of the season especially as I had mudguards, Dynamo, etc on the bike.

Re: Base training
« Reply #962 on: 24 April, 2018, 10:34:14 am »
I'm really struggling with getting my consistency back after my cold. I've now got 8 completed TR rides, 6 abandoned ones, and 2 outdoor rides in my current plan.
I've got another TT on Thursday, so that will be another outdoor ride, and Saturday I recced the course and tacked on a nearby hill, so that was a good solid ride with high consistent power and high TSS, but I slept badly again last night so I skipped this morning's TR ride.
I've not got my low stem or new saddle yet, so I will have to use my old position in the TT :( but I am planning on taking off the water bottle, sticking out pump etc and making the bike a bit cleaner. I need to bodge a bridge across my aero bars to attach a light to.

Re: Base training
« Reply #963 on: 24 April, 2018, 11:01:12 am »
I'm really struggling with getting my consistency back after my cold. I've now got 8 completed TR rides, 6 abandoned ones, and 2 outdoor rides in my current plan.

My batch of colds / sore throat / chest infection took me out for a month; still have a very occasional tickly cough (habit?) but in all other regards feel restored to full health.

I've completed two TR sessions since returning, shifting to shorter duration "minus" variants of the specified workouts and dialing back the intensity to 95% half way through the over-unders. This may be a combination of loss of form due to the long break, perhaps compounded by a recent shift to accurate power measurement, rendering my previous FTP setting somewhat optimistic...

Planning another "minus" variant today, then a short break followed by (probably) an FTP test to reset my number to something accurate.

Re: Base training
« Reply #964 on: 24 April, 2018, 11:50:44 am »
Finished my first competitive ride of the year on Sunday and my optimism from the previous Sunday's training ride was largely validated.  A PB by 4.5 minutes (this time over a hilly 90-mile course), in spite of the recent lurgy, and placed 45th out of 600 (many of whom are pretty serious club riders on bling bikes riding in chain gangs) and 2nd in age category.  Never finished higher than 75th overall in the 8 previous rides of the same event.

The training seems to be working!
The sound of one pannier flapping

Re: Base training
« Reply #965 on: 27 April, 2018, 07:40:06 pm »
The next 2 weeks (after tomorrow) of the TR 40k TT plan are "taper". I don't have anything in 2 weeks time, so that seems unnecessary to me. Is there any benefit in doing it, or should I return to a sustained power build plan?
I have no specific goals that I really need to be at my best for, I just want to keep building my fitness (and now I have my TT saddle and stem I can also work on my position).

Phil W

Re: Base training
« Reply #966 on: 27 April, 2018, 07:56:35 pm »
Taper as you know is to improve your form or freshness ahead of an event without losing too much fitness. So if no event no reason you can not do something higher volume and / or stress. Just watch out for overtraining / fatigue creeping in if you do not build in enough recovery in your plans.

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Base training
« Reply #967 on: 27 April, 2018, 08:01:39 pm »
it's becoming too hot for me to train indoors; the windows are south facing and the temperature in the room is 21+ deg even when it's cloudy/rainy like today. could barely finish sweet spot session (with reduced intensity) which i normally find quite easy..

Re: Base training
« Reply #968 on: 28 April, 2018, 01:19:18 pm »
it's becoming too hot for me to train indoors; the windows are south facing and the temperature in the room is 21+ deg even when it's cloudy/rainy like today. could barely finish sweet spot session (with reduced intensity) which i normally find quite easy..

South-facing training room here also. I've taken to keeping the blinds in the room down and window open near-permanently to stop the temp climbing. I use two high velocity fans currently and aim to squeeze in a third to help extend the turbo season. That plus a semi-illegal "cover your eyes" dress code...

Sheer madness, but needs must!, as I wish to stick to a TR plan as far as possible for the next 5 months. When the baking British sunshine scuppers me regardless, I'll hit the road or run instead.

Re: Base training
« Reply #969 on: 28 April, 2018, 02:17:36 pm »
I'm in the garage.  It's been freezing all winter, but hopefully it will be OK in the summer!

Re: Base training
« Reply #970 on: 28 April, 2018, 10:55:00 pm »
New saddle and stem (negative 17 degrees) put me in a much better TT position - lower at the front and much more forwards. My ride wasn't very good though:
https://www.trainerroad.com/career/duncanm23/rides-new/33541106

Possibly I was still a bit fatigued from the TT Thursday evening, but it didn't feel like I was quite high enough - I felt like all the power was coming from my quads, and eventually I cooked them. I'm going to do the next week and try to do it all in TT position (I've not donr a full week in ages), then I'll do a recovery week, and then I'll get after the Build phase again.

Re: Base training
« Reply #971 on: 29 April, 2018, 03:23:59 am »
I do a solid month of TR, join the local club TT group, go on holiday and hit the gym bike every day, I add in goblet squats (top tip😁). What happens? 2 days from end of holiday I get a running nose and cough!

Re: Base training
« Reply #972 on: 01 May, 2018, 08:50:43 am »
But! The off-bike time was usefully spent by upgrading the turbo setup to erg and accurate power measurement ;D

I've an FTP test to look forward to, therefore, that will likely reveal my earlier virtual power numbers to have been somewhat optimistic...  :'(

Finally did another FTP test: it's dropped by 5 watts, but (very unusually for me) my weight's fallen too, which I partially attribute to the illness, with the overall result being 3.25 w/kg now from a virtual 3.2 previously.

I'm very happy with that result as it covers a period where the following all occurred:
- 5 weeks of TR sweetspot base programme, albeit spread over a much longer period, plus periodic running sessions at a similar intensity to the TR workouts.
- approx a month in total lost to cold, sore throat, tonsillitis and bronchitis - the works;
- switching from virtual power to a smart trainer with accurate power measurement.

I feel I've made progress, despite the sicknote, which I can tell during the short runs I do. I'm sure that the switch to accurate power measurement on the trainer is masking some of the underlying progress, ie. the earlier FTP virtual-derived number was perhaps overstated by ~5%.

I've founds erg mode makes TR easier to use - mentally less taxing - and the ramp test easier to execute: earlier I was sometimes struggling to find suitable gears (bike had quite wide ratios) as the steps ramped up, causing cadence to make big jumps.

When I first posted on this thread at the beginning of March, I was aiming to go from 3.2 w/kg to 3.5 w/kg by the end of the summer: a nearly 10% increase over 6 months appeared very achievable.

One third of that time has now passed, with only half a step forward. BUT I remain motivated, will stick to the plan and see where it gets me!  ;D


Re: Base training
« Reply #973 on: 01 May, 2018, 10:33:48 am »
I rode this morning and I was crap. The plan called for 4x 5minute intervals at ~FTP. I managed about 3 minutes in the aero position on the first one, and finished on the hoods. I managed about 2 minutes in the aero position on the second, but couldn't get my legs working on the hoods either, so just cooled down and stopped.
https://www.trainerroad.com/career/duncanm23/rides-new/33652521

The aero position is approximately what I had when I did my TT fit, but it's a massive change compared to my normal road position (I sit quite far back normally, so to get low at the front I have to move where I sit forwards by about 4-5 cm!). I don't think I'm getting full leg extension having moved forwards so far, so I probably need to go up a bit, but it also just feels really strange. I need to spend a lot more time in this position to be able to get the power out there (and it's probably worth checking the position is decent aero-wise before I do and discover it's all wrong!).
However, I might be part of a 9 up TTT in a month or so, so I need to get training in the drops (no aero bars or pointy hats). I might just put my original saddle back on, lift the bars up a bit and do a Build to get my sustainable power back up, and come back to the TT position afterwards.

rob

Re: Base training
« Reply #974 on: 02 May, 2018, 09:25:18 am »
Don't unpick your position changes straight away.   I ended up with a similar position after a bike fit 5 years ago and it worked for me, although it's maybe not the existing TT fashion where saddles are going back again.   The forward postion/wider hip angle is a bit more tri-specific.

It's not uncommon for a marked difference in output between the 2 positions but you will adapt.   Perhaps re-test your power in position and then work from that ?   the difference will narrow over time.