Can I use 35c M+ tyres with Shimano deep drops?

[Charlotte]

Building up my tourer, I have some lightly used Schwalbe Marathon Plus 35c tyres that I'd like to use.  I'm going to fit Shimano A550 deep drop brakes and big mudguards.

Will it all fit?  Or will it depend on the frame dimensions (distance of brake bridge from droputs?).  Am I barking up the wrong tree and would it be better to stick with 28c?

Also, is it imperative to have bigger rims for tyres like the 35c M+, or can I fit them on thinner rims like MA3, Open Pro or Rigida Chrina?

[gene hunt]

I would run a 28, clearance will be very tight with a 35.

[Simon Galgut]

IME you won't have room for 35s and 'guards. And open pros will be too narrow. But, apart from that you should be fine 

[Zoidburg]

I would say it depends on the frame dimensions.

On the wheel front I would be erring on the side of chunkier rim, many have tried and got away with a 35mm tyre on typical road rim but manufacturers (mavic iirc) do not recommend it.

I think you will get the tyre in but not the guards, not big uns anyway, a dual pivot was never really meant to run with a 35mm tyre, the only one I have seen that is an old Alongha "big dog" which was a dual pivot meant to fit BMX bikes, they are good if you can find them though and clearance is huuuuuge.

[Charlotte]

Oddly, I have a set of Alongha's in the parts bin.  I would prefer to use A550s because they're so good, but at least I have the option.

[Zoidburg]

Oddly, I have a set of Alongha's in the parts bin.  I would prefer to use A550s because they're so good, but at least I have the option.

You would know if you had the Big Dogs, they are scaled up in all dimensions, not just drop, huge chunky things they are they have enough drop to work in a Raleigh 20 and that is a lot of drop.

I will try and google some.

[Chris N]

Oddly, I have a set of Alongha's in the parts bin.  I would prefer to use A550s because they're so good, but at least I have the option.

You'll only be able to use make the most of brakes with a deeper drop if your frame is designed for it - the rim will be in the same place, regardless of the brake dimensions.

If they do fit, you'll be fine with 35mm tyres on the Open Pro rims.  I'm currently running 46mm tyres on Open Sports, which have the same internal width as Open Pros.

[Zoidburg]

Oddly, I have a set of Alongha's in the parts bin.  I would prefer to use A550s because they're so good, but at least I have the option.

You'll only be able to use make the most of brakes with a deeper drop if your frame is designed for it - the rim will be in the same place, regardless of the brake dimensions.

If they do fit, you'll be fine with 35mm tyres on the Open Pro rims.  I'm currently running 46mm tyres on Open Sports, which have the same internal width as Open Pros.

I think what Charlotte was looking for was a DP with more clearance to coin the MTB term. Some DPs will have much longer slots for the pads but not perhaps the clearance she is looking for.

Thats why suggested she seek out the Alongha Big Dog.

[Chris N]

Ok, gotcha.  There's also a brake on the Rivendell site that might do the job: Rivendell Bicycle Works: Brakes Dunno if you can get 'em in the UK.

[Zoidburg]

This one?

http://www.rivbike.com/products/list/brakes#product=15-150

Clearance aplenty.

[border-rider]

I can (just) run 35 mm Paselas on the MC with guards and Shimano deep-drop DPs.  You won't get away with M+s IMO.

35 mm M+s will be fine on skinny rims though.

[andygates]

35 mm M+s will be fine on skinny rims though.

Fit fine, pretty balloony-looking.  I occasionally run 35mm crossers on my Open Pros.

[Biggsy]

Alhonga Deep Drop calipers have enough room for mudguards + 35mm tyres (albeit quite narrow guards for the tyres).  I'd expect the same from Shimanos if the drop is appropriate.

Pressure from tyres that wide can cause a dangerous amount of stress on rims as narrow as Open Pro/MA3.  It's OK with low pressure like you might use on the front, but I wouldn't be happy with that combination at the back.

[andrew_s]

Oddly, I have a set of Alongha's in the parts bin.  I would prefer to use A550s because they're so good, but at least I have the option.

Changing brakes is unlikely to allow you to fit larger tyres.
The critical distance is the distance between the rim and the underside of the fork crown or rear bridge. That's fixed, and is also what determines what brakes you have to use. The only way you will get any extra clearance by changing brakes is if your old brakes are sufficiently chunky that they project further below the axis of the brake bolt than the fork crown does.

MV is unusual in being able to fit 35mm + guards under 57mm dual pivots. Either his fork crown/seatstay bridge arrangement is unusually slimline, or he was using old model Panaracers which were actually only 32mm.

[border-rider]

Alhonga Deep Drop calipers have enough room for mudguards + 35mm tyres.  I'd expect the same from Shimanos if the drop is appropriate.

The drop's much less with the Shimanos though

Pressure from tyres that wide can cause a dangerous amount of stress on rims as narrow as Open Pro/MA3.  It's OK with low pressure like you might use on the front, but I wouldn't be happy with that combination at the back.

been fine for me since 2001, and through multiple tens of thousands of miles.

[border-rider]

MV is unusual in being able to fit 35mm + guards under 57mm dual pivots. Either his fork crown/seatstay bridge arrangement is unusually slimline, or he was using old model Panaracers which were actually only 32mm.

The bike was built specifically to allow it. It's still very marginal at the back though.  The front's fine.  This is with track ends, of course, so the wheel can be slid back for extra clearance.

They are current Panaracers.  I agree my situation is not usual, and that was really what I was saying upthread - that usually 35 mm tyres and Shimano DPs don't mix.

[andrew_s]

Pressure from tyres that wide can cause a dangerous amount of stress on rims as narrow as Open Pro/MA3.  It's OK with low pressure like you might use on the front, but I wouldn't be happy with that combination at the back.

hoop stress is proportional to pressure x tube diameter.
I'd be inclined to limit tyre pressure to 85psi in a 35mm tyre - equivalent to 120psi in a 25mm tyre.

[gene hunt]

The issue with a larger tyre on a road rim is they can roll off, I was warned about that be my LBS.

[border-rider]

The issue with a larger tyre on a road rim is they can roll off, I was warned about that be my LBS.

Not sure about that

MTB's often have rims much skinnier than their tyres, and as I say it's never been an issue for me.

[Chris N]

The issue with a larger tyre on a road rim is they can roll off, I was warned about that be my LBS.

Not sure about that

MTB's often have rims much skinnier than their tyres, and as I say it's never been an issue for me.

Indeed - I've ridden several miles on a totally flat 37mm tyre on an Open Sport without it rolling off.  Wasn't pleasant, but it got me to work when my pump packed up.  Fatter tyres are ok, as long as you don't pump them up too hard (but why would you run a 35mm tyre at 100 psi+?).  Keep the pressure down and an eye on the rims and it should be fine.

The bike was built specifically to allow it. It's still very marginal at the back though.  The front's fine.  This is with track ends, of course, so the wheel can be slid back for extra clearance.

Track ends are great, aren't they?  I can fit a 32mm Pasela on the back of my Pearson Hanzo-a-like.  Shame I can't get one on the front too.