Sportive 'code of conduct'?

[arabella]

Is there such a thing?
Can potential riders view it before signing up to an event?
Having gone against the current of a sportive at the weekend it certainly doesn't seem to be the case. 

[mattc]

I would think that almost any problematic behaviour would be covered by the Road Traffic Act (but never enforced, admittedly).

[Philip Whiteman]

The only one I have seen is this:
http://www.cyclosportives.co.uk/epicRegulations.htm

As with most, conditions are more about terms and conditions for the company rather than inter-rider etiquette.

[barakta]

I'm a huge fan of 'codes of conduct' especially in an events context where attenders/members may come from a wide variety of backgrounds with different expectations.  They can be a useful simple words explanation of legal contexts too and I think they can get people to start thinking consciously about behaviour rather than just relying on assumptions etc.

[JonJo]

Having gone against the current of a sportive at the weekend it certainly doesn't seem to be the case.

Ditto. The number of kamikaze cyclists heading straight at us was unbelievable.

I would think that almost any problematic behaviour would be covered by the Road Traffic Act (but never enforced, admittedly).

Except we were on a disused railway line so the RTA probably doesn't come into it, just consideration for other cyclists and walkers.

[vorsprung]

There is no special law or central authority for sportives so there is no code of conduct

OTOH all audax rides are under AUK rules so riders are expected to stick to the rules and could be theoretically sanctioned

[mattc]

Having gone against the current of a sportive at the weekend it certainly doesn't seem to be the case.

Ditto. The number of kamikaze cyclists heading straight at us was unbelievable.

I would think that almost any problematic behaviour would be covered by the Road Traffic Act (but never enforced, admittedly).

Except we were on a disused railway line so the RTA probably doesn't come into it, just consideration for other cyclists and walkers.

Ah. Without googling, I have no idea what laws apply! (I suspect there are some, because e.g. you can't cycle on a footpath)

Anyway, you've nothing to complain about until you've tried to ride up the Galibier against the current of a sportive that believes the road is closed. (I basically had to dismount for every blind corner, and my average speed was bad enough already.)

[JonJo]

Anyway, you've nothing to complain about until you've tried to ride up the Galibier against the current of a sportive that believes the road is closed. (I basically had to dismount for every blind corner, and my average speed was bad enough already.)

Yeah, I can see how that would be an absolute pain. Lots of blind bends up there. Anyway, I wasn't really complaining but Mrs. JonJo was absolutely fizzing with anger at the lack of consideration given by the oncoming riders.

I think these are the type of people who wouldn't read or abide by any code of conduct though.

[Martin]

I've read somewhere that single file riding was required (again an event specific requirement) and certainly observed this to be the case on the dozens of perms I've done on my manor where sportives are 2 a penny

Anyway, you've nothing to complain about until you've tried to ride up the Galibier against the current of a sportive that believes the road is closed. (I basically had to dismount for every blind corner, and my average speed was bad enough already.)

France innit? the one I did in 2008 the Gendarmes would not even let anyone ride along the public road to the start village without a current rider number (detachable from your big number so bot reusable) can you imagine that in the UK? 

[mattc]

Anyway, you've nothing to complain about until you've tried to ride up the Galibier against the current of a sportive that believes the road is closed. (I basically had to dismount for every blind corner, and my average speed was bad enough already.)

France innit? the one I did in 2008 the Gendarmes would not even let anyone ride along the public road to the start village without a current rider number (detachable from your big number so bot reusable) can you imagine that in the UK? 

No, not likely

The problem with this lot was that the road wasn't completely closed. They weren't just letting casual cyclists(such as me) through, but a couple of vans snuck thru too (I'm guessing they had some useful purpose, perhaps important deliveries, I dunno). I dread to think what happened when the riders met one of the vans !!!

(The lead riders actually had an escort moto making a massive racket with sirens etc, so they were ok - it was the strung out mass a few minutes behind that caused me all the pain. Then just before the top I met Mr Poulton coming down, but that's another story ... )

[Martin]

The problem with this lot was that the road wasn't completely closed. They weren't just letting casual cyclists(such as me) through, but a couple of vans snuck thru too (I'm guessing they had some useful purpose, perhaps important deliveries, I dunno). I dread to think what happened when the riders met one of the vans !!!

(The lead riders actually had an escort moto making a massive racket with sirens etc, so they were ok - it was the strung out mass a few minutes behind that caused me all the pain. Then just before the top I met Mr Poulton coming down, but that's another story ... )

was it La Marmotte? when I did it none of the roads were closed but the locals were just savvy enough to avoid the course especially in reverse 

L'Ardecheoise which I've done 3 times also only closes the shortest common section; vehicles are allowed over the rest of it but they are so few and far between not any problem at all; plus they like cyclists 

compare and contrast to this; FFS! and I could have had an almost free place! (£75 rather than £1600)

http://www.rideacrossbritain.com/2014-rules-and-regulations/

[Tim Hall]

compare and contrast to this; FFS! and I could have had an almost free place! (£75 rather than £1600)

http://www.rideacrossbritain.com/2014-rules-and-regulations/

I've just had a gander at those. Blimey. Rule 2.10

No drugs, illegal substances, performance enhancing substances or intoxicants of
any kind are permitted to be used by any Participant

So no refreshing glass of light ale at the end of the day.  That's even more serious than mandatory plastic hats.

[Cudzoziemiec]

compare and contrast to this; FFS! and I could have had an almost free place! (£75 rather than £1600)

http://www.rideacrossbritain.com/2014-rules-and-regulations/

I've just had a gander at those. Blimey. Rule 2.10

No drugs, illegal substances, performance enhancing substances or intoxicants of
any kind are permitted to be used by any Participant

So no refreshing glass of light ale at the end of the day.  That's even more serious than mandatory plastic hats.

And I was just thinking:

Anyway, you've nothing to complain about until you've tried to ride up the Galibier against the current of a sportive that believes the road is closed. (I basically had to dismount for every blind corner, and my average speed was bad enough already.)

France innit? the one I did in 2008 the Gendarmes would not even let anyone ride along the public road to the start village without a current rider number (detachable from your big number so bot reusable) can you imagine that in the UK? 

No, not likely

The problem with this lot was that the road wasn't completely closed. They weren't just letting casual cyclists(such as me) through, but a couple of vans snuck thru too (I'm guessing they had some useful purpose, perhaps important deliveries, I dunno). I dread to think what happened when the riders met one of the vans !!!

The van stopped and handed out important deliveries - un coup de rouge and a baguette, n'est-ce pas?

[ian.r.mcdonald]

am i being unfair to think that rider skill (or perhaps fairer to say experience) and use of etiquette is about 500% higher on audax rides compared to sportives?

[Slimline Saxon]

Rode a sportive today, the list of rider offences is too long to publish, but can be summarised as a total lack of awareness of anything else on the road, vehicle, bike, animal, people etc.

Communication is almost non existent, coming up the inside on steep hills was a problem on RideLondon at Leith Hill for example, changes of direction without warning causing crashes.

As a generalisation, they buy the pro or top of the range kit and bikes, then ride as if they are on TDF, taking racing lines across slower riders, ignoring any approaching traffic at junctions in case they lose precious time.

Not sure why I entered two sportives this year, did not get great enjoyment out of them.

[arabella]

Reminds me, must ask the boss how his (22yo) son got on on the sportive he did the other week.  My advice was that the son informed hiself of group riing etiquette, wonder if he did

Ian, I don't think you are being unfair ...

<rant which led to my original post still avoided>

[Euan Uzami]

Rode a sportive today, the list of rider offences is too long to publish, but can be summarised as a total lack of awareness of anything else on the road, vehicle, bike, animal, people etc.

Communication is almost non existent, coming up the inside on steep hills was a problem on RideLondon at Leith Hill for example, changes of direction without warning causing crashes.

As a generalisation, they buy the pro or top of the range kit and bikes, then ride as if they are on TDF, taking racing lines across slower riders, ignoring any approaching traffic at junctions in case they lose precious time.

Not sure why I entered two sportives this year, did not get great enjoyment out of them.

Yes,  undertakers really get up my goat as well, it was completely endemic on the sportive I rode about a month ago. However it would be slightly rose tinted to pretend it never happens at all in audaxes though.

On the one I entered some of the signs had been nicked or fell off.
Not a problem, on an an audax I would simply have programmed the next control into the GPS or even just asked the way to it,  but doing that on the sportive meant cutting about half of the rest of the route out because most of it was weaving back and forth in pointless dog legs.
It's almost like it's a non-thinking man's ride, for people that just want the physical effort experience but nothing more, like a turbo trainer but outside. I tend to prefer to actually have some destination.

[TimC]

compare and contrast to this; FFS! and I could have had an almost free place! (£75 rather than £1600)

http://www.rideacrossbritain.com/2014-rules-and-regulations/

I've just had a gander at those. Blimey. Rule 2.10

No drugs, illegal substances, performance enhancing substances or intoxicants of
any kind are permitted to be used by any Participant

So no refreshing glass of light ale at the end of the day.  That's even more serious than mandatory plastic hats.

Those rules are essentially to protect the organiser. Nowhere within them is there any guidance about or requirement of high standards of behaviour to other participants or road users.

My experience of Sportives is that the only rule is, "Me first and sod anyone else". I'm sure if you mentioned a code of conduct to most participants, the reply would be a blank stare. Not because the individual is simply a complete tosser (though I don't exclude that possibility), but because the culture of Sportives has grown up that way; they are events for people who actively want to behave anti-socially in public!

[mattc]

Don't worry: it's all bums on saddles. Must be good.

Right? 

[TimC]

Don't worry: it's all bums on saddles. Must be good.

Right? 

Ha! Well, despite my early-morning cynicism and lack of the milk of human kindness, Sportives do encourage people to get off their arses and ride bikes. Trouble is, they don't teach them anything about how to behave on the road (and tacitly encourage bad behaviour), where most clubs or exposure to the more gentle way of the AUK would inculcate some manners and consideration for others. I think it's a shame that Sportive organisers in general haven't tackled that side of the phenomenon, and the result is more conflict not less with the non-riding public.

[mattc]

There's no money in manners.

It's no coincidence that cycling clubs and AUK are non-profit making.

The glossy (profitable) mags often recommend that aspiring Sportive riders first go for some rides with their local (non-profit) clubs - to avoid falling off when riding in a bunch - then go spend their money at some Sportives (see the glossy adverts elsewhere in This Issue!).

[TimC]

Ah well, Matt. Like golf, the Sportive phenomenon will eventually fade and the thrill-seekers will find something else to spend their money on. Sadly, that'll negatively affect many good LBSs as well as the Pinarello boutiques that've sprung up to service the fad, and we'll probably lose a few glossy magazines and websites (Bike Radar, I'm looking at you!). Then the DfT might realise that its pathetic efforts to 'accommodate' cycling over the past few years have done precisely nothing to increase cycling - just like every cycling 'revolution' of the last fifty years, there isn't one happening now.

[ferret]

Anyway, you've nothing to complain about until you've tried to ride up the Galibier against the current of a sportive that believes the road is closed. (I basically had to dismount for every blind corner, and my average speed was bad enough already.)

Yeah, I can see how that would be an absolute pain. Lots of blind bends up there. Anyway, I wasn't really complaining but Mrs. JonJo was absolutely fizzing with anger at the lack of consideration given by the oncoming riders.

I think these are the type of people who wouldn't read or abide by any code of conduct though.

totally agree I happened upon the Dragon Ride earlier this year and I couldn't believe the lack of consideration or how miserable the riders were.

[Tomsk]

"Sigh!" - yes, unfortunately the 'sportive effect' seems to be all pretty negative, really. Only done one this year [Walden Velo TdF route], but similar mentality also recently witnessed on a certain popular Audax:

-numpties veering all over the road
-riders crashing into the back of others, who like them have overshot the turn
-stopping suddenly at turns to check the route
-stalling on hills because they're in the wrong gear
-not pointing out holes etc
-giving funny looks or blanking altogether if you say hello

Serve me right for trying to keep up with the hares, next time I'll ride my shopping bike with the nervous, elderly, infirm or overweight at the back of the field.

[Oaky]

next time I'll ride my shopping bike with the nervous, elderly, infirm or overweight at the back of the field.

you seem to be expecting that the rest of us from the mid-Essex posse will also be riding