Author Topic: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed  (Read 9933 times)

dim

My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« on: 22 November, 2017, 11:22:29 am »
They saw a property for rent, contacted the landlord, viewed the property and agreed to rent it for £800 per month

The Landlord stated that he is in Newcastle, and insisted that they pay £900 into his bank so as to secure the tenancy, sent them an email with a tenancy agreement etc etc

They paid £900 into his bank this morning (transfered from my daughter's bank), and went to make arrangements with the person who lives there at present so as to collect the keys on Friday

Got there and the current tenant had a hissy fit saying that the property is rented through an agent and accused my daughter and boyfriend of being fraudsters

a quick google finds the guy (Edward Freestone) on facebook:
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‎Freestone Edward‎ to HOUSES FOR SALE, RENT OR SWAP ST HELENS AND SURROUNDING AREAS
17 November at 16:21 ·
Private: Hello friends, i have a 2 bedroom house available for rent in Cotterdale Cl, Saint Helens WA9 ( Pets and decoration allowed) Inbox me if you want to rent and for more information...... No agency please.
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‎Richard Dodgson‎ to HOUSES FOR SALE, RENT OR SWAP ST HELENS AND SURROUNDING AREAS
15 November at 16:30 ·
Looking for a 2 bedroom flat or house to rent in st helens asap
FREE
HI GUYS BE VERY CAREFUL A GUY CALLED FREESTONE EDWARD TRIED TO RENT ME A HOUSE THAT WAS NOT HIS!!
I SPOKE TO THE ESATE AGENTS THIS MORNING AND THEY CONFIRMED THAT HE WAS NOTHINGTO DO WITH THE HOUSE
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My daughter and her boyfriend have gone to the bank and the police and I just hope that they will get their money back as they saved up for a long time ... seems like this guy scams people all over the country :(

“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #1 on: 22 November, 2017, 11:25:03 am »
How were they able to view the property if the 'Landlord' was not the owner?  where did they get the initial details from?
Move Faster and Bake Things

dim

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #2 on: 22 November, 2017, 11:40:35 am »
How were they able to view the property if the 'Landlord' was not the owner?  where did they get the initial details from?

property was advertised on facebook and the scammer stated that he owns the property. They went to the address to view the property and the current tenants let them in to view

apparantly this fraud is pretty common here in the UK
“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #3 on: 22 November, 2017, 11:48:45 am »
It is a common fraud - and the problem is that the only contact is via FB (who won't release details of the account without a struggle and all that will give you is an email address and a temp IP address) and a bank account.

Really sorry for your daughter and boyfriend. My daughter almost got caught by something similar but contacted me first before handing over anything.

<i>Marmite slave</i>

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #4 on: 22 November, 2017, 11:55:52 am »
It's one of those things where accepted business practices are barely indistinguishable from a scam anyway.  Sticking to a bricks-and-mortar letting agency just means you get exploited in legal ways by weasels in pointy shoes.

dim

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #5 on: 22 November, 2017, 12:05:03 pm »
It is a common fraud - and the problem is that the only contact is via FB (who won't release details of the account without a struggle and all that will give you is an email address and a temp IP address) and a bank account.

Really sorry for your daughter and boyfriend. My daughter almost got caught by something similar but contacted me first before handing over anything.

They have just been to Barclays, and they never got any help whatsoever from the bank. The bank says they must go to the police

I would have thought that the bank would try and recover /freeze the money if it has not been withdrawn yet, or to obtain CC footage of the guy when he attempts to withdraw the money from his bank or ATM (they only paid the deposit a couple of hours ago)
“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #6 on: 22 November, 2017, 12:52:39 pm »
I would not expect Barclays to do anything. Think about it; two people walk in and say "I want you to transfer money back from a bank account that isn't mine into my account, and the bank account is with a different bank."

Of course they can't do anything. Banks following instructions like that would just lead to another type of fraud - people would buy high-value items like cars, pay by bank transfer then get the bank to transfer the money back again!

The police are the only route.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

ian

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #7 on: 22 November, 2017, 12:57:08 pm »
Am I missing something, they went around to see the place, the current tenants let them in to view and I presume confirmed it was for rent (otherwise why would they let them in to view)?

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #8 on: 22 November, 2017, 01:00:37 pm »
Am I missing something, they went around to see the place, the current tenants let them in to view and I presume confirmed it was for rent (otherwise why would they let them in to view)?

Presumably if you're pulling this scam, the first thing you do is find somewhere that is actually for rent through someone else, and assume that - in the best tradition of landlords - the tenants are used to people turning up to view without warning, and British Politeness does the rest.

ian

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #9 on: 22 November, 2017, 01:04:48 pm »
Ah, I see, he's piggybacking an existing rental. I'd be a terrible scammer. Mind you, with all the money I've received from helpful operatives of the IMF (Hi Christine!) and various African governments, I don't need to.

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #10 on: 22 November, 2017, 02:39:43 pm »
I'm afraid unless you post up a photo of yourself with a loaf of bread balanced on your head, I won't believe a word you say.

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #11 on: 22 November, 2017, 02:59:12 pm »
Am I missing something, they went around to see the place, the current tenants let them in to view and I presume confirmed it was for rent (otherwise why would they let them in to view)?

Presumably if you're pulling this scam, the first thing you do is find somewhere that is actually for rent through someone else, and assume that - in the best tradition of landlords - the tenants are used to people turning up to view without warning, and British Politeness does the rest.

Unless the scammer knows the tenants or maybe the scammer is the tenant! Rent is so expensive these days..
Move Faster and Bake Things

Snakehips

  • Twixt London and leafy Surrey
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #12 on: 22 November, 2017, 03:11:27 pm »
It sounds like the current occupants are at least in on the scam.
If somebody turned up on my doorstep saying they wanted/expected to move in, I would sympathise with them and tell them they had been scammed. I wouldn't immediately accuse them of being fraudsters.
An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #13 on: 22 November, 2017, 03:24:33 pm »
snakehips makes a very good point.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #14 on: 22 November, 2017, 03:26:15 pm »
It sounds like the current occupants are at least in on the scam.
If somebody turned up on my doorstep saying they wanted/expected to move in, I would sympathise with them and tell them they had been scammed. I wouldn't immediately accuse them of being fraudsters.

ditto.  What's more I wouldn't open the door anyway unless I expected viewers by an appointment with my normal contact.   Even if they did look harmless.
Move Faster and Bake Things

ian

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #15 on: 22 November, 2017, 03:35:06 pm »
Well, presumably the scammer scans the ads for currently available rentals and 'adopts' one. So the current tenants may well be expecting viewings. That said, I'm sure I'd only view with the landlord around, I wouldn't just turn up at someone's flat. And vice versa, if I were the tenant, I wouldn't conduct any viewings on behalf of my landlord. You can't just invite anyone in, that's how you get difficult to shift vampires.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #16 on: 22 November, 2017, 05:26:04 pm »
I don't get vampires because the road to my house goes over running water.

This is another variation of the popular push payment fraud, often used to nick completion funds from housebuyers.  It's basic social engineering.  Some banks will compensate but they don't have to - they are merely following your correctly-authorised instructions.  One lady lost £20m when her husband (at work)asked her via e-mail for a CHAPS payment for a business opportunity.  Except the e-mail wasn't from her husband.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

Karla

  • car(e) free
    • Lost Byway - around the world by bike
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #17 on: 22 November, 2017, 05:44:35 pm »
Well, presumably the scammer scans the ads for currently available rentals and 'adopts' one. So the current tenants may well be expecting viewings. That said, I'm sure I'd only view with the landlord around, I wouldn't just turn up at someone's flat. And vice versa, if I were the tenant, I would conduct any viewings on behalf of my landlord. You can't just invite anyone in, that's how you get difficult to shift vampires.

Remembering back to the misty days of my studenthood in the mid noughties, I wouldn't have been surprised if some new tenants of certain landlords had turned up on spec without them.  I didn't have any of those landlords myself, and I might not personally have let those tenants in, but a sizeable proportion of tenants on that sort of let won't find unannounced viewings particularly remarkable - and this will be a large enough fraction that the scammer can get away with it, particularly since he's hidden behind a fake facebook account. 

I'd find an unannounced visitation a lot less fishy than a request to pay someone several hundred pounds when I'd never met them in person or communicated outside soshul meeja and I didn't have the door keys in my hand. 

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #18 on: 22 November, 2017, 05:50:54 pm »
Indeed.

As a tenant, my response to an unannounced viewing would be to refuse entry.  They don't want that landlord anyway.

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #19 on: 22 November, 2017, 06:08:43 pm »
I don't get vampires because the road to my house goes over running water.

This is another variation of the popular push payment fraud, often used to nick completion funds from housebuyers.  It's basic social engineering.  Some banks will compensate but they don't have to - they are merely following your correctly-authorised instructions.  One lady lost £20m when her husband (at work)asked her via e-mail for a CHAPS payment for a business opportunity.  Except the e-mail wasn't from her husband.

Indeed.

A friend of mine is moving.   He was asked by the estate agent to provide copies of his bank details and statements.   I suggested to him that he should only be doing this, if required, face to face with his solicitor.   He was sceptical of my advice but did indeed do as I suggested.

WTF does an estate agent need your bank details for I wonder?

Snakehips

  • Twixt London and leafy Surrey
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #20 on: 22 November, 2017, 06:25:32 pm »
WTF does an estate agent need your bank details for I wonder?
Is he a cash buyer? Estate agents like to satisfy themselves that a cash buyer actually has enough cash.
An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #21 on: 22 November, 2017, 06:28:37 pm »
It's not the estate agent's business though.  They can 'like' all they want. 

Ruthie

  • Her Majester
Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #22 on: 22 November, 2017, 06:57:57 pm »
It sounds like the current occupants are at least in on the scam.
If somebody turned up on my doorstep saying they wanted/expected to move in, I would sympathise with them and tell them they had been scammed. I wouldn't immediately accuse them of being fraudsters.

ditto.  What's more I wouldn't open the door anyway unless I expected viewers by an appointment with my normal contact.   Even if they did look harmless.

My landlords have sent random viewers round in the past. It’s common practice.
Milk please, no sugar.

dim

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #23 on: 22 November, 2017, 08:00:56 pm »
lots more people scammed .... (quote from Facebook:

Do not reply to a cullwick mark anthony he is a fraud!! Saying he has a property on penn road, it has been confirmed this is not the case at all!.
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Abi Malik
Abi Malik Oh gosh he's at it again. He did the same the other month with a property in watermead x
Like · 11 November at 16:41
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Karina Price
Karina Price What the hell, was it reported?? Xx
Like · 11 November at 16:42
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Abi Malik
Abi Malik Yes the police were involved I think xx
Like · 11 November at 16:42
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Karina Price
Karina Price Ill ring them now, i cant believe this, do you know who admin is for this group?he should be blocked! X
Like · 11 November at 16:44
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Mani Rai
Mani Rai I posted last time on Aylesbury private property plz be careful don’t do any business on Facebook, I can’t believe still people believe I’ll post again , admin can block him he will create another I’d , thing is everybody should b very careful
Like · 1 · 11 November at 16:54
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Leanne Stevens
Leanne Stevens He messaged me about the property
Like · 11 November at 16:57
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Karina Price
Karina Price He went quiet when he realised it wasnt just me to move in
Like · 11 November at 16:58
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Mani Rai
Mani Rai He doing to everyone ,plz check with every person who want to rent property check online with full address an pay about £10 , you can check who is original landlord
Like · 11 November at 17:00
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Dawn Barlow
Dawn Barlow
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Like · 12 November at 18:16
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Dawn Barlow
Dawn Barlow He’s still at it-just posted this an hour ago on another page
Like · 12 November at 18:16
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Karina Price
Karina Price Can you report it to admin and post a post up to warn people?
Like · 12 November at 18:45
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Dawn Barlow
Dawn Barlow I’ve asked to join the group awaiting confirmation then I will x
Like · 1 · 12 November at 18:46
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Karina Price
Karina Price Brilliant thank you x
Like · 12 November at 18:55
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Karina Price
Karina Price Bloody bastard!
Like · 12 November at 18:44
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‎Heidi Wattam‎ to Aylesbury Private Property to Rent
11 November at 16:14 · Weedon ·
The post in this group from Cullwick Mark Anthony is a scam!! He called our office yesterday demanding the address for the Penn Road property without providing contact details for a viewing. A lady who is looking to rent on this group messaged me about the same one, he is posing as Landlord and she almost paid him £800 to love in to a house he does not own!!
DO NOT PAY
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‎Katy Harrison‎ to Houses for sale or rent around Keighley
16 November at 10:01 ·
⚠️ WARNING ⚠️
Do not correspond with a man called Cullwick Mark Anthony.
(I am one of the admin of 'houses for rent in Keighley and surrounding areas-PRIVATE LETTINGS' group and it has come to our attention that he is a scammer.He made suspicious comments on posts and inboxes and after searching his name we found he has scammed money from people in the past)
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“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: My Daughter and her boyfriend have been scammed
« Reply #24 on: 22 November, 2017, 09:07:38 pm »
It sounds like the current occupants are at least in on the scam.
If somebody turned up on my doorstep saying they wanted/expected to move in, I would sympathise with them and tell them they had been scammed. I wouldn't immediately accuse them of being fraudsters.

ditto.  What's more I wouldn't open the door anyway unless I expected viewers by an appointment with my normal contact.   Even if they did look harmless.

My landlords have sent random viewers round in the past. It’s common practice.

And look what happens! 

I've not rented for years.  I'm positive my first landlady (as it happens) would never have sent people knocking on the door to view without telling us and the 2nd (an agency) didn't either.

Altho' I am no lawyer I would suggest that whilst a landlord might claim the right to inspect his own property for maintenance purposes, viewers turning up without prior notice could abuse the right of the tenant to 'quiet enjoyment':

https://www.foxwilliams.com/news/704

but given the demand for housing I wouldn't be surprised to hear that tenants can't stand on their rights these days.

Move Faster and Bake Things