[HAMR] New challenger - Bruce Berkeley AKA Cycle_dr 1

[Clemo]

Road.cc is becoming the Daily Mail of cycling sites!

It's there already

[jochta]

Road.cc is becoming the Daily Mail of cycling sites!

It's there already

It's been there for a while.

[Exit Stage Left]

The story has become about 'due diligence'. Journalists shouldn't just accept what they're told in press releases.

Strava is a good primary source, and there's nothing wrong with reporting what's happening there. We can also accept that records are going to take a while to ratify. So when we're told that Bruce has gone for records, has been seen to do them on Strava, and has applied for ratification, it all seems to add up.

The unusual thing here is that Janet Davison did her ride after Bruce, and was ratified. YACF's role in this is interesting. Jo's graphics were the best way of monitoring the rolling progress of the participants. But there's no point in doing that work if the record fails due to lack of due diligence.

[Snowandale]

You may notice in every upload Bruce mentions names of people he rode with, I guess these are the witness's Guinness requires. In the recent guinness rules someone posted here it didn't mention spot tracker, just GPS.

So far we know he is keeping gps data files, power data, taking pictures and potentially witness log. Yet 99% of posters assume he is just winging it.

[Exit Stage Left]

We're just waiting for his 'record' from January last year to appear on the Guinness site.

http://road.cc/content/news/141773-bruce-berkeley-rides-nearly-10000km-january-set-new-guinness-world-record

Janet Davison is listed as holding the record for her ride in July last year, which has been ratified. So Bruce had a six months start in getting listed as the record holder, which was a new one. It's not that we don't believe that he's doing the miles, but that he'll never appear in the book.

That doesn't really matter that much to me, but it clearly matters to a lot of people, because it's even in the title of the road.cc link.

[Snowandale]

We're just waiting for his 'record' from January last year to appear on the Guinness site.

http://road.cc/content/news/141773-bruce-berkeley-rides-nearly-10000km-january-set-new-guinness-world-record

Janet Davison is listed as holding the record for her ride in July last year, which has been ratified. So Bruce had a six months start in getting listed as the record holder, which was a new one. It's not that we don't believe that he's doing the miles, but that he'll never appear in the book.

I still have not seen where Bruce claims to hold the records, he just claims to have beaten the guinness records.

Regardless even if he did claim to hold them and it later turned out his log keeping wasn't sufficient, we all make mistakes. He doesn't claim to hold any Guinness records on his social media profiles, he simply claims to have ridden certain mileage.

[Greenbank]

You may notice in every upload Bruce mentions names of people he rode with

Every one? I see he's named people he's ridden with just 3 times in the last two weeks.

The scant few photographs that are uploaded to Strava don't offer much in the way of proof, there are no obvious locations or dates/clocks visible to help corroborate things. But, of course, he could be keeping the bulk of his evidence separate (which would be a good idea anyway).

Ah, I see he's got a bit more stuff on Facebook each day.

He'll need to be keeping the .fit files from the Garmin separately. You can't get the original files out of Strava, only ones that have been downsampled and much of the useful (in terms of aiding validation) detail is lost.

[Exit Stage Left]

I still have not seen where Bruce claims to hold the records, he just claims to have beaten the guinness records.

Regardless even if he did claim to hold them and it later turned out his log keeping wasn't sufficient, we all make mistakes. He doesn't claim to hold any Guinness records on his social media profiles, he simply claims to have ridden certain mileage.

If you read the relevant articles you'll find that the month record was a new one. He approached Guinness, and they suggested a minimum standard of 5,000km. They told Janet Davison the same.

As was the case when he set the Guinness World Record for distance ridden in a week last year, there was no existing record ratified by the organisation for Berkeley to aim at.

He told Wade Wallace of Australian website Cycling Tips (link is external) that Guinness World Records had suggested he ride at least 5,000 kilometres, but he was aware other people on Strava were posting greater monthly distances so decided to aim for 10,000 instead.
- See more at: http://road.cc/content/news/141773-bruce-berkeley-rides-nearly-10000km-january-set-new-guinness-world-record#sthash.wY2PQzr4.dpuf

But he's not listed as the record holder.

These things go round and round these days because reading skills are getting worse. People see what they want to see. Is Bruce listed as the week record holder?

[Snowandale]

I still have not seen where Bruce claims to hold the records, he just claims to have beaten the guinness records.

Regardless even if he did claim to hold them and it later turned out his log keeping wasn't sufficient, we all make mistakes. He doesn't claim to hold any Guinness records on his social media profiles, he simply claims to have ridden certain mileage.

If you read the relevant articles you'll find that the month record was a new one. He approached Guinness, and they suggested a minimum standard of 5,000km. They told Janet Davison the same.

As was the case when he set the Guinness World Record for distance ridden in a week last year, there was no existing record ratified by the organisation for Berkeley to aim at.

He told Wade Wallace of Australian website Cycling Tips (link is external) that Guinness World Records had suggested he ride at least 5,000 kilometres, but he was aware other people on Strava were posting greater monthly distances so decided to aim for 10,000 instead.
- See more at: http://road.cc/content/news/141773-bruce-berkeley-rides-nearly-10000km-january-set-new-guinness-world-record#sthash.wY2PQzr4.dpuf

But he's not listed as the record holder.

These things go round and round these days because reading skills are getting worse. People see what they want to see. Is Bruce listed as the week record holder?

Again, where had Bruce claimed to be a holder of any Guinness record. Please enlighten me with the exact quotes.

[Exit Stage Left]

He can't claim to be a Guinness record holder, because he isn't. On two separate occasions he has set out to establish a new cycling record, in consultation with Guinness. Neither record is listed. Do you see a pattern?

[Greenbank]

Again, where had Bruce claimed to be a holder of any Guinness record. Please enlighten me with the exact quotes.

First one I've found on google (I'm still looking as I'm sure I saw something else...):-

http://www.noble-wheels.com/about-me/

// Bruce Berkeley

I have set two world records riding wheels built by Jonny – in June 2014 I managed 2,825km in 7 days and in January 2015 I rode 9,751km in one month. The next goal starts on January 1st 2016 with my attempt to break Tommy Godwin’s year record of 122,000km in 12 months. Jonny has teamed up with Boyd Cycling and Chris King to give me the best set of wheels for my journey. Cheers guys!!

[Exit Stage Left]

A Guinness record would be a tangible achievement. As it is, Bruce has not ridden the furthest distance in a month, or a week. If he doesn't have the Guinness record, he has nothing, as the article I linked to notes. This is why informed observers have doubts.

He told Wade Wallace of Australian website Cycling Tips (link is external) that Guinness World Records had suggested he ride at least 5,000 kilometres, but he was aware other people on Strava were posting greater monthly distances so decided to aim for 10,000 instead.

That’s actually some distance short of the 13,813 kilometres that Tommy Godwin rode in 1939 on his way to establishing a new record for distance ridden in a year, and the likelihood is that Berkeley’s mark will be beaten at some point this year by Steve Abraham and Kurt Searvogel.

Both of those riders are aiming to break the 'unbreakable' Year record – but their attempts aren’t recognised by Guinness World Records, which considers the feat too dangerous to attempt.

While they covered less distance than Berkeley last month, as the days lenghten in the Northern Hemisphere over the coming months, so too will the distances they put in.

Likewise, the 2,825 kilometres Berkeley rode to establish that weekly record last year is less than the distance covered in the Race Across America (RAAM), though Guinness World Records doesn’t tend to recognise events where sleep deprivation may be an issue.

AdTech Ad
We’re aware of other examples of riders putting in more than 3,000 kilometres in a week – Mike Hall during the first seven days of last year’s inaugural Trans Am Bike Race for instance.

None of that is to disparage Berkeley’s achievements – almost 10,000 kilometres is something many cyclists would be happy to be able to ride in a year let alone a month, and being able to put in a daily distance greater than that of the longest one-day pro race, Milan-San Remo is beyond all but a handful.
- See more at: http://road.cc/content/news/141773-bruce-berkeley-rides-nearly-10000km-january-set-new-guinness-world-record#sthash.FKZOQiOv.dpuf

[Greenbank]

In this interview:-

http://www.bicycling.com/racing/record/bruce-berkeley-talks-month-record-motivation-and-what-s-next

he really doesn't go out of his way to explain he doesn't hold the record.

What had you done before this?
Last year, I did the week record in June—I rode 2,825 kilometers in a week and beat the Guinness week record. That was physically harder than the month record!

...

But you weren’t far off of 10,000! Were you tempted to not stop riding until midnight of that last day to try to get it?
I really wanted to enjoy the experience on the last day. I wanted to have some fun, be off the bike a bit. I knew I’d gotten the record, and once I achieved that marker, it was hard to push past that marker. I think if someone beat the record, I’d be motivated to come back and try again!

[Wowbagger]

He can't claim to be a Guinness record holder, because he isn't. On two separate occasions he has set out to establish a new cycling record, in consultation with Guinness. Neither record is listed. Do you see a pattern?

I hate to be pedantic* but you can't see a pattern from just two examples.

*lie

[Exit Stage Left]

He can't claim to be a Guinness record holder, because he isn't. On two separate occasions he has set out to establish a new cycling record, in consultation with Guinness. Neither record is listed. Do you see a pattern?

I hate to be pedantic* but you can't see a pattern from just two examples.

*lie

That's part of the problem, Bruce isn't a long distance TTer, so all we've got to go on are these two instances where he fails to go further than others have done in a week and a month, and then fails to follow up with the paperwork to get a Guinness listing.

[Mr Larrington]

If you want to be really picky he doesn't say he holds the Guinness record, just that he exceeded the Guinness-approved week record and the 5000 km in a month target set by Guinness.  Neither of which are actual records as most people would understand them anyway.

[jochta]

If you want to be really picky he doesn't say he holds the Guinness record, just that he exceeded the Guinness-approved week record and the 5000 km in a month target set by Guinness.  Neither of which are actual records as most people would understand them anyway.

I don't think there is a holder of a week record yet. So what exactly does he think he beat?

From the Road.cc article...

“They told us: “We have recently opened a record category for one week (minimum of 2,800 km to beat).”

[Revolution9]

Who's "Fake Doctor HAMR MyArse" ?

[Exit Stage Left]

If you want to be really picky he doesn't say he holds the Guinness record, just that he exceeded the Guinness-approved week record and the 5000 km in a month target set by Guinness.  Neither of which are actual records as most people would understand them anyway.

I don't think there is a holder of a week record yet. So what exactly does he think he beat?

From the Road.cc article...

“They told us: “We have recently opened a record category for one week (minimum of 2,800 km to beat).”

Wiki has some entries.

Seven days[edit]
On Sunday 17 March 1940 Pat Hawkins, an 18-year-old female from Western Australia, set the 'World Seven Days record' in Perth, having ridden 1,546.8 miles (2,489.3 km) to surpass the previous best (1,438.4 miles (2,314.9 km)) set by Mrs Valda [or Ada Vera] Unthank of Hastings, Victoria. Hawkins also broke the West Australian records for one, two, three, four, five, six and seven days, plus surpassing the Australian professional men's record of Ossie Nicholson.[40] No authority appears to maintain this record, however notable distances ridden in seven days include:

Tommy Godwin rode 2,084 miles (3,354 km) between 16 and 22 July 1939.[43]
Bruce Berkeley rode 2,825 kilometres (1,755 mi) between 23 and 29 June 2014.[44][n 1]
Richard Nutt rode 2,830 kilometres (1,760 mi) between 1 and 7 June 2015. [45]
One month[edit]
There have been numerous claims about the most distance ridden in one month. The only authority currently recognising this record appears to be Guinness World Records where the record is held by Janet Davison (UK) who rode 6,455 kilometres (4,011 mi) between 24 July and 22 August 2015.[46] Notable distances ridden in one month include:

Tommy Godwin rode 8,583 miles (13,813 km) in July 1939.[43]
Bruce Berkeley rode 9,750 kilometres (6,060 mi) in January 2015.[44][n 1]
Steve Abraham rode 6,469 miles (10,411 km) in October 2015.[48]
Kurt Searvogel rode 6,828 miles (10,989 km) in December 2015.[48]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycling_records#Seven_days

[jochta]

If you want to be really picky he doesn't say he holds the Guinness record, just that he exceeded the Guinness-approved week record and the 5000 km in a month target set by Guinness.  Neither of which are actual records as most people would understand them anyway.

I don't think there is a holder of a week record yet. So what exactly does he think he beat?

From the Road.cc article...

“They told us: “We have recently opened a record category for one week (minimum of 2,800 km to beat).”

Wiki has some entries.

Seven days[edit]
On Sunday 17 March 1940 Pat Hawkins, an 18-year-old female from Western Australia, set the 'World Seven Days record' in Perth, having ridden 1,546.8 miles (2,489.3 km) to surpass the previous best (1,438.4 miles (2,314.9 km)) set by Mrs Valda [or Ada Vera] Unthank of Hastings, Victoria. Hawkins also broke the West Australian records for one, two, three, four, five, six and seven days, plus surpassing the Australian professional men's record of Ossie Nicholson.[40] No authority appears to maintain this record, however notable distances ridden in seven days include:

Tommy Godwin rode 2,084 miles (3,354 km) between 16 and 22 July 1939.[43]
Bruce Berkeley rode 2,825 kilometres (1,755 mi) between 23 and 29 June 2014.[44][n 1]
Richard Nutt rode 2,830 kilometres (1,760 mi) between 1 and 7 June 2015. [45]
One month[edit]
There have been numerous claims about the most distance ridden in one month. The only authority currently recognising this record appears to be Guinness World Records where the record is held by Janet Davison (UK) who rode 6,455 kilometres (4,011 mi) between 24 July and 22 August 2015.[46] Notable distances ridden in one month include:

Tommy Godwin rode 8,583 miles (13,813 km) in July 1939.[43]
Bruce Berkeley rode 9,750 kilometres (6,060 mi) in January 2015.[44][n 1]
Steve Abraham rode 6,469 miles (10,411 km) in October 2015.[48]
Kurt Searvogel rode 6,828 miles (10,989 km) in December 2015.[48]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycling_records#Seven_days

But no Guinness record holder for a week which is what AFICT he is claiming or being accredited to having beaten.

[Exit Stage Left]

It doesn't augur well for Bruce, when his claimed mileage in a month is less than a month's distance within both Kurt and Steve's year rides.

[Si S]

Who's "Fake Doctor HAMR MyArse" ?

PMSL

Someone (possibly otp?) proving a point methinks and I suspect using Bruce's own tracks to do it.

[Wobbly]

Who's "Fake Doctor HAMR MyArse" ?

PMSL

Someone (possibly otp?) proving a point methinks and I suspect using Bruce's own tracks to do it.

Ummm... would someone be so kind as to enlighten me what on Earth you're both on about?

[Greenbank]

The cyclist currently second in the January distance challenge on Strava:-

https://www.strava.com/challenges/January-2016-ride-distance-challenge

(It's nothing to do with me before anyone gets any ideas.)

[mrcharly-YHT]

Who's "Fake Doctor HAMR MyArse" ?

PMSL

Someone (possibly otp?) proving a point methinks and I suspect using Bruce's own tracks to do it.

Ummm... would someone be so kind as to enlighten me what on Earth you're both on about?

It is someone proving that you can fake things on strava.