Author Topic: Sherlock  (Read 39317 times)

Jaded

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  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #175 on: 12 January, 2014, 10:24:24 pm »
Lots filmed locally.

It was the best of the series.
It is simpler than it looks.

Kim

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Re: Sherlock
« Reply #176 on: 13 January, 2014, 12:32:36 am »
Meh.

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #177 on: 13 January, 2014, 06:39:37 am »
I enjoyed that, lots of fun  :thumbsup: Think I preferred the wedding episode though.
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Charlotte

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Re: Sherlock
« Reply #178 on: 13 January, 2014, 08:36:04 am »
I thought it was absolutely brilliant.  I love the way that all the characters have developed beyond mere sidekicks for Sherlock and I love the way that the writers have taken Conan Doyle's original and done something bold and modern with it.

Most people are deeply conservative and want the thing to play out in a particular way.  Gatiss, Moffat and Thompson didn't treat the original books with reverence and I think that annoys a lot of people.

Did anybody spot that the actors playing Sherlock's Mum and Dad were actually Timothy Carlton and Wanda Ventham, Benedict Cumberbatch's parents?

/obligraun
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citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Sherlock
« Reply #179 on: 13 January, 2014, 09:03:42 am »
I was quite enjoying it for the first half an hour or so, up to the point where Sherlock noticed the big toothy fish in the harbour and got his water skis out... I don't mind that they've made Mary more of a character than she was in the books, but what they've made her is just silly.

The last hour seemed to go on for an eternity.

Troels made a great Bad Dude though.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #180 on: 13 January, 2014, 11:31:30 am »
Did anybody spot that the actors playing Sherlock's Mum and Dad were actually Timothy Carlton and Wanda Ventham, Benedict Cumberbatch's parents?

Mary (Amanda Abbington) is Martin Freeman's other half in real life too.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

fuzzy

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #181 on: 13 January, 2014, 11:57:18 am »
I was quite enjoying it for the first half an hour or so, up to the point where Sherlock noticed the big toothy fish in the harbour and got his water skis out... I don't mind that they've made Mary more of a character than she was in the books, but what they've made her is just silly.

The last hour seemed to go on for an eternity.

Troels made a great Bad Dude though.

WT actual F?

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #182 on: 13 January, 2014, 12:01:56 pm »
WT actual F?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

Oblique reference to the scene in Bad Dude's apartment with Mary.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #183 on: 13 January, 2014, 01:32:35 pm »
As I said last night in reply to someone considering wheter or not it had jumped the shark: It was more of a Sharknado.  (And I mean that in a good way, I just had higher hopes after last week's episode.)


citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #184 on: 13 January, 2014, 02:28:42 pm »
As I said last night in reply to someone considering wheter or not it had jumped the shark: It was more of a Sharknado.  (And I mean that in a good way, I just had higher hopes after last week's episode.)

I think that's a fair comment.  ;D
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

fuzzy

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #185 on: 13 January, 2014, 03:18:26 pm »
WT actual F?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

Oblique reference to the scene in Bad Dude's apartment with Mary.

Ah! I'm with you now- I think.

(click to show/hide)

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #186 on: 13 January, 2014, 03:21:36 pm »
The bit where... <spoiler snipped>

Oh, I quite liked that. It was fun. I was thinking of the revelation about a certain character's past.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

fuzzy

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #187 on: 13 January, 2014, 03:31:50 pm »
The bit where... <spoiler snipped>

Oh, I quite liked that. It was fun. I was thinking of the revelation about a certain character's past.

See that bright light floating just above my head?

Thats me getting it that is ;D

mattc

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Re: Sherlock
« Reply #188 on: 13 January, 2014, 07:08:13 pm »
Did anybody spot that the actors playing Sherlock's Mum and Dad were actually Timothy Carlton and Wanda Ventham, Benedict Cumberbatch's parents?

Mary (Amanda Abbington) is Martin Freeman's other half in real life too.
Further trivia: I believe they're still "living in sin", but have now married on screen 3 times!

(Anyone else still think of Abbington in The Bill? God I feel old ... )

Anyhoo, we really enjoyed this one. I'm quite impressed that they could make 3 such varied episodes.

My favourite is still the wedding episode, but I can imagine if you prefer the drama over the zaniness, then Ep3 would be preferred (unless you hate the whole series!)
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spindrift

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #189 on: 13 January, 2014, 07:26:34 pm »
"He made me wear his hat!"

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #190 on: 16 January, 2014, 07:41:32 am »
It's a modern caricature of the original Conan Doyle stuff.  Obviously the original was written as being bang-up-to-date too but the makers of this re-take knew perfectly well they could not match Conan Doyle on his own turf and went off at a tangent.   A good try but of course not in the same 'League'.   The terminator-like thought 'screens' are way out of date and might be fine for a robot but the human brain simply doesn't work like that.  Not even if you are Sherlock Holmes.  Unless of course he is later revealed to be an android*.

 Milverton Magnusson was good and would also have made an excellent job in the original setting.



* a possible explanation for the re-appearance after the fatal leap.  Military grade or a re-build.
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citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Sherlock
« Reply #191 on: 16 January, 2014, 09:04:10 am »
Milverton Magnusson was good and would also have made an excellent job in the original setting.

Actually, having previously complained that they stray too far from the original stories, it's only fair to say that I thought they did very well with this one. And it's one of my favourite Holmes stories so I had high expectations. Making Milverton/Magnusson a Murdoch-style media mogul was... marvellous.

Shame they had to spoil it slightly by having Holmes be the one to do him in. It just felt wrong.

I suppose the only alternative would have been for Mary to do it, which would have ruined her redemption story. But that was a load of tosh too.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #192 on: 16 January, 2014, 09:10:29 am »
Incidentally, for a modern update of Holmes, I don't think you can do better than Bert Coules. He adapted many of the original stories for radio but then also wrote some more of his own, fleshing out some of the many cases mentioned in passing in the original books. He uses the original characters in the original setting but there's definitely a modern sensibility to his work.

Also, Clive Mereson, who plays Holmes in the Coules radio versions, knocks Cumberbatch into a cocked hat.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

fuzzy

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #193 on: 16 January, 2014, 09:24:09 am »
It's a modern caricature of the original Conan Doyle stuff.  Obviously the original was written as being bang-up-to-date too but the makers of this re-take knew perfectly well they could not match Conan Doyle on his own turf and went off at a tangent.   A good try but of course not in the same 'League'.   The terminator-like thought 'screens' are way out of date and might be fine for a robot but the human brain simply doesn't work like that.  Not even if you are Sherlock Holmes.  Unless of course he is later revealed to be an android*.

 Milverton Magnusson was good and would also have made an excellent job in the original setting.



* a possible explanation for the re-appearance after the fatal leap.  Military grade or a re-build.

Your brain doesn't work that way. I'm not sue mine does either but then, I'm not Sherlock Holmes. Some folks branes may work that way. In fact most folks branes may work that way and the fact that yours and mine don't may indicate that we are androids :D

Tim Hall

  • Victoria is my queen
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #194 on: 16 January, 2014, 09:53:47 am »
Incidentally, for a modern update of Holmes, I don't think you can do better than Bert Coules. He adapted many of the original stories for radio but then also wrote some more of his own, fleshing out some of the many cases mentioned in passing in the original books. He uses the original characters in the original setting but there's definitely a modern sensibility to his work.

Also, Clive Mereson, who plays Holmes in the Coules radio versions, knocks Cumberbatch into a cocked hat.

I've got lots of the Bert Coules stuff as MP3, grabbed from Radio 4 Extra when it pops up from time to time. In fact there's a series just finishing at the moment.  But the two things (recent TV and Coules' radio stuff) are very different beasts.
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citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #195 on: 16 January, 2014, 09:57:36 am »
the two things (recent TV and Coules' radio stuff) are very different beasts.

True. Very different. And Coules is better. ;)

I'd like to see a Bert Coules take on putting Holmes in a modern setting.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

redshift

  • High Priestess of wires
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Re: Sherlock
« Reply #196 on: 16 January, 2014, 10:15:24 am »
Your brain doesn't work that way. I'm not sue mine does either but then, I'm not Sherlock Holmes. Some folks branes may work that way. In fact most folks branes may work that way and the fact that yours and mine don't may indicate that we are androids :D

The visualisation thing?  My brain does that very strongly in at least one context:  Vision Mixers.  Multiple sources through multiple layers to multiple outputs simultaneously, along with auxiliary outputs and Digital Video Effects layers.  Some of the layers are re-entrant into other layers, others are cut through by the use of 'key' signals which partially split layers.  Transitions can be between sources, or layers, or a mixture of both.

After many years working with these and setting them up for use, I find myself 'looking' at them with a distinct mental picture of signal paths and layers which I can't adequately describe to other people - it just 'is'.  The brain-training period for this is approaching 26 years.

Branes.  Go figure.
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fuzzy

Re: Sherlock
« Reply #197 on: 16 January, 2014, 10:30:26 am »
Your brain doesn't work that way. I'm not sue mine does either but then, I'm not Sherlock Holmes. Some folks branes may work that way. In fact most folks branes may work that way and the fact that yours and mine don't may indicate that we are androids :D

The visualisation thing?  My brain does that very strongly in at least one context:  Vision Mixers.  Multiple sources through multiple layers to multiple outputs simultaneously, along with auxiliary outputs and Digital Video Effects layers.  Some of the layers are re-entrant into other layers, others are cut through by the use of 'key' signals which partially split layers.  Transitions can be between sources, or layers, or a mixture of both.

After many years working with these and setting them up for use, I find myself 'looking' at them with a distinct mental picture of signal paths and layers which I can't adequately describe to other people - it just 'is'.  The brain-training period for this is approaching 26 years.

Branes.  Go figure.

Mine works on an audio visual basis. If I am thinking about something, how to molish something for example, I see the steps of the molishment in my head. If I am reading a book, I see my own private film as I read, hearing the characters speak their parts. If I am thinking about a concept, for example a recipe or a formula, I 'hear' the words in my head- someone, usualy the author if it is a cookbook where I have heard the author, SWMBO or myself otherwise, says"take 200 grams of self raising flour and add 50 grams of salted butter" etc. The only time I see written script is when that is what I am thinking about.

Kim

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    • Fediverse
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #198 on: 16 January, 2014, 03:43:29 pm »
It's a modern caricature of the original Conan Doyle stuff.  Obviously the original was written as being bang-up-to-date too but the makers of this re-take knew perfectly well they could not match Conan Doyle on his own turf and went off at a tangent.   A good try but of course not in the same 'League'.

Yes, they could commision yet another faithful-as-possible adaptation of the original stories, but really, what would be the point?

It's fan fiction, from one of the strongest fandoms there is.  The whole point is to do something differently, exploring the characters and settings.  It's just like all that slash you probably don't read on the internet, but by a couple of established TV writers with a stonking great budget. 


Quote
The terminator-like thought 'screens' are way out of date and might be fine for a robot but the human brain simply doesn't work like that.  Not even if you are Sherlock Holmes.  Unless of course he is later revealed to be an android*.

If you're going to nitpick, let's be realistic here for a minute.  For a start, no robot is ever going to 'think' by overlaying English text (or 6502 assembly code) on it's raw uninterpreted visual input.  That's just ridiculous.

On the other hand, if you want to convey someone's thoughts on screen, you don't have a whole lot of options.  You can have them do a voice over.  Or you can cut to a series of flashbacks to them learning relevant things.  Or flash forward to them explaining why they did what they're about to do.  Or you could draw some text or diagrams on the screen.  Why not?  It's quick, easily interpreted, and doesn't detract from the pace like traditional approaches.  If you're going to object to that, then why not the dozens of other screen storytelling cliches that were no doubt used in the same programme, but we're so used to that they were allowed to pass without comment?

I can take or leave Sherlock's thought overlay, but I *really* like the way that pop-up text is used to show what people are reading from electronic devices, as an alternative to a clunky close-up of a MovieOS display, or writing in a phone call where a text message would be used.  I also loved the way the subtitles were done on Heroes (both the open captioning of non-English languages, and the closed captions for the hearing impaired on the HD-DVD[1] release) - positioned around the screen like speech bubbles in a comic, rather than boringly static at the bottom of the screen.  It's innovative, I like it, some people don't.


As for brains, mine works in a way not entirely dissimilar to redshift's, at least some of the time.  It's not verbal, or really visual, just an abstract sense of the connectivity of a system.  Good for problem solving, but hard to communicate without translation.  If a writer were to represent it on screen, they'd probably resort to a high-speed series of clichés reminiscent of The Matrix, Prison Break or Numb3rs (or any science fiction scene that results in a character having a spontaneous nosebleed).  But that's really not what's happening in my head.


[1] I'm not sure whether the Blu-Ray standard allows you to do that with closed captions.

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Sherlock
« Reply #199 on: 16 January, 2014, 03:45:22 pm »
It's fan fiction, from one of the strongest fandoms there is.  The whole point is to do something differently, exploring the characters and settings.  It's just like all that slash you probably don't read on the internet, but by a couple of established TV writers with a stonking great budget.

Yadda yadda baby yadda yadda bathwater...
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."