I think my sister-in-law also has about 1500W of lighting just for the stairs and landing. Builders should be shot for fitting so many GU10 housings; they're worse for the leccy bill than tumble driers if they're in rooms which are used a lot.I've got cheapo Tesco own-brand 11W "Stick" CFLs (http://www.tesco.com/groceries/Product/Details/?id=259117114) on my hall and landing.
Are there any CFLs that genuinely come on instantly and can cope with being flicked on and off for short periods? The upcoming ban on 60W round bulbs is a problem for lighting our hall and stairs. The LED alternative is now available at £55 each, which would have a payback period of about three centuries given how little the lights are used.
I've had a quick look round the 'net following on from this thread. The Aurora 6W GU10 is good value (<£15) and looks pretty enough that it might work as a 35W replacement in one of my kitchen fixtures where the whole bulb is exposed.Bought 2 to try them. Brightness is good, but 4000k is just too white and clinical for our kitchen general room lighting.
A good point implied by RZ is that Halogen spots are a fire risk and SHOULD (although hardly anyone bothers) have a heat/fire retardent shroud over them in a confied space. Many will be encased in loft insulation.
LEDs should run cold/cool by comparison. I may get some just for this reason alone.
Well my three (based on the OP) have arrived.I am; the patches of light on the worktop are MUCH brighter than the 50W halogens, although these are 25 deg rather than 38 deg or whatever the halogens were, so you'd expect that. On balance, I'd say the same amount of light is coming from them. Unfortunately getting lumens figures for halogens is tricky.
Initial impression - colour good. Not convinced of the 50W equivalence.
I have one 50W Halogen in the downstairs Loo that will be a good place to start trialling an LED replacement.
I'd like a fairly wide beam and a colour temperature that doesn't result in a blue-white glare of my B&M CYO front light but also isn't too yellow.
1 - What bulb would meet those requirements?
2 - Have we established a cheap and reputable stockist?
1 - What bulb would meet those requirements?
2 - Have we established a cheap and reputable stockist?
I have one 50W Halogen in the downstairs Loo that will be a good place to start trialling an LED replacement.
I'd like a fairly wide beam and a colour temperature that doesn't result in a blue-white glare of my B&M CYO front light but also isn't too yellow.
It's a BOG - get over yourself! ::-) ;)i think the object of having a light in your downstairs khazi is *not* to get it over yourself. Or the carpet, or your degree certificate, or any family pet that happens to follow you in.
I have one 50W Halogen in the downstairs Loo that will be a good place to start trialling an LED replacement.
I'd like a fairly wide beam and a colour temperature that doesn't result in a blue-white glare of my B&M CYO front light but also isn't too yellow.
It's a BOG - get over yourself! ::-) ;)
These give a nice light for cfl http://www.lampspecs.co.uk/Light-Bulbs-Tubes/Megaman-GX53-Downlights/FOZZ-CONXENTO-GX53-Adjustable-Spotlight-White-Megaman they are GX53 but the GU10 cfl replacements are not so good. The best led gu10 replacements I have found so far are Toshiba but at £25 a pop a non starter, I need over 50.
I've seen modern "designer" houses where there are no pendants and every room has many spots recessed into the ceiling.
The recessed 50W GU10 fittings are the worst because there isn't, nor is there likely to be, an LED replacement that fits; you need a 7W or 8W LED and, because waste heat isn't radiated but stays in the chip, you need a big heatsink and hence a large lamp module.
We have a room at work where the lights are networked (wired with a web services interface). Good fun, but at home there are quite a small number of settings that I actually want. (Edit to add) and for wired-in lights I see little need for wireless and have little desire for manufacturer lock-in, I'd be looking for control in the fittings rather than the bulbs.I still haven't found a match for the halogen colour temperature and hue. Beam angle and brightness are good, price and dimensions are about there, but the light quality isn't good enough.
We're gradually trying LEDs in place of halogen in the kitchen, but so far I've yet to find a "bulb" that I'd want to use to replace them all - either too blue, too narrow a beam or too expensive.
Slightly tangential to this discussion, but Philips have just released their Hue system in the US. This zigbee networked lamp is a good indication of where the future lies, with every light bulb we own being a network device that can be controlled individually and as groups. A certain large search engine company is heavily invested in this area as they really, really want to be in our homes (the Internet of things is getting ever so close now).
Slightly tangential to this discussion, but Philips have just released their Hue system in the US. This zigbee networked lamp is a good indication of where the future lies, with every light bulb we own being a network device that can be controlled individually and as groups. A certain large search engine company is heavily invested in this area as they really, really want to be in our homes (the Internet of things is getting ever so close now).
As a fully-paid-up Luddite, I find this very, very scary.
Slightly tangential to this discussion, but Philips have just released their Hue system in the US. This zigbee networked lamp is a good indication of where the future lies, with every light bulb we own being a network device that can be controlled individually and as groups. A certain large search engine company is heavily invested in this area as they really, really want to be in our homes (the Internet of things is getting ever so close now).
As a fully-paid-up Luddite, I find this very, very scary.
Slightly tangential to this discussion, but Philips have just released their Hue system in the US. This zigbee networked lamp is a good indication of where the future lies, with every light bulb we own being a network device that can be controlled individually and as groups. A certain large search engine company is heavily invested in this area as they really, really want to be in our homes (the Internet of things is getting ever so close now).
As a fully-paid-up Luddite, I find this very, very scary.
As a fully-paid-up computer geek, I find it even scarier.
If there were any nice (ie. not pig ugly) LED candle-bulbs then I'd complete my migration to LEDs and CFLs.
It's entirely possible to have a house, with decent bright lighting, main lights, spot lights and accent lights, running with a total of less than 150 Watts (with every one of them turned on).
In the old house we got used to turning the stair light on, running up/down in the dark and then turning it off. When it blew we didn't even notice. We used to only have the lights on in the room we were in, and because they were often dimmed too we were using minimal wattage.
This is the LED "bulb" I have that's really good for supplementing daylight:
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/200755048519 - Day White version.
The "corn cob" arrangement makes it very wide angle, though it's not a bright as a conventional 100W bulb. The Warm White is dimmer still.
This is the LED "bulb" I have that's really good for supplementing daylight:
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/200755048519 - Day White version.
The "corn cob" arrangement makes it very wide angle, though it's not a bright as a conventional 100W bulb. The Warm White is dimmer still.
UPDATE: One of these bulbs has blown now (all but the bottom row of LEDs don't come on), so eight quid for six months is not great value. On the other hand, I don't know of any other light that so closely matches the colour of daylight, that I do like during the day in this room with a not-big-enough window.
, so eight quid for six months is not great value.
... I tried CFL, but as they blew after 3 weeks I decided the Tesco Halogen at £1.50 for 4 were a better replacement than the cheapest CFL I could get my hands on at the time at £3.75 each (so considerable money for 12 months worth)....Why is it that every CFL I've ever bought has lasted for years, but others blow 'em in no time? Did you put in CFLs & keep using the old dimmer switches?
... I tried CFL, but as they blew after 3 weeks I decided the Tesco Halogen at £1.50 for 4 were a better replacement than the cheapest CFL I could get my hands on at the time at £3.75 each (so considerable money for 12 months worth)....Why is it that every CFL I've ever bought has lasted for years, but others blow 'em in no time? Did you put in CFLs & keep using the old dimmer switches?
BTW, you can get dimmers that work with CFLs.
And why do people complain about them taking forever to come on? I just switched on the light in this room - straight on, no hanging around. The one in the bathroom sometimes takes a while, but that's ancient. It was fine for years, up to a few months ago.
Turning 'em on & off all the time is wasteful. If you insist on doing that, don't buy CFLs. It breaks them quickly. It's cheaper & more energy efficient to leave them on unless you're leaving the room for a significant time.... I tried CFL, but as they blew after 3 weeks I decided the Tesco Halogen at £1.50 for 4 were a better replacement than the cheapest CFL I could get my hands on at the time at £3.75 each (so considerable money for 12 months worth)....Why is it that every CFL I've ever bought has lasted for years, but others blow 'em in no time? Did you put in CFLs & keep using the old dimmer switches?
BTW, you can get dimmers that work with CFLs.
And why do people complain about them taking forever to come on? I just switched on the light in this room - straight on, no hanging around. The one in the bathroom sometimes takes a while, but that's ancient. It was fine for years, up to a few months ago.
Definitely not on a dimmer ;) I'm not stupid. Straightforward switch. I think the problem that kills them is that I turn the lights off when I leave a room, so they are being turned off while still in the 5 minute startup time.
As for ages to turn on, maybe my body clock is different but the last bulb I timed (before throwing it away in disgust, was still a faint glimmer after I'd walked into the room, rummaged in a cupboard, gone back to a different room to get a torch, gone back to the cupboard and found the stuff, and then turned the light on as I'd finished. We were turning the light on at least 30 minutes before using the room if we planned ahead.
And there lies my gripe with so called "energy efficient" bulbs. If I walk into a room, turn on light, find what I'm looking for and leave, then I'm using just a few seconds of energy. If I want to protect my CFL and so leave it on all night so as to not "misuse them", I'm burning more energy then by having proper bulbs that are getting trickier to buy.But how often do you walk into a room, look around for a few minutes, then leave? Are you really doing it often enough to break the lights in weeks? I find that hard to imagine. How many rooms do you have that you enter frequently but briefly? I can't see how anyone would do enough walking into & out of rooms for a minute or two to break CFLs quickly. Most of the rooms in my house are occupied in relatively solid blocks or time, so it makes sense to leave the light on, or it's off. I believe this is quite normal. Neither I nor Mrs B spends much time dashing from room to room. Yes, one of us sometimes wants to fetch something from a dark room. Fine - light on & off. But that doesn't add up to lots of cycles per light per day.
There is hardly anything in the world that someone cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price alone are that person's lawful prey. It's unwise to pay too much, but it's worse to pay too little. When you pay too much, you lose a little money -- that is all. When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing it was bought to do. The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot -- it can't be done. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run, and if you do that you will have enough to pay for something better.
LIDL are flogging Philips LED bulbs at 2 for £14 next Monday in my local store (Warwick). Otherwise £8 each.The 9 or 9.5W GLS-style ones are extremely good - claimed 40W equivalent but more like 60W in a pendent fitting because most of the light goes downwards.
I was a fairly early adopter of LED GU10s starting with a batch of 10 about four years ago, we now have approx 40. The early ones were disappointing in output and colour, but the latest ones are excellent, better than halogens. Five of the earliest batch have been replaced, all the others are going fine.
We have them all on for 8+ hours six days a week so the saving in electricity is about 600 pounds a year, out of a total layout of around 450 pounds (they were all bought at around the 10 pound mark). So on electricity alone they are a substantial saving, that does not include replacement halogens which used to be a weekly job to replace one or two that had blown. That's probably 3 or 400 quid over the four years (assuming 1000-2000 hour bulbs) not to mention the time and hassle of replacing.
Elfin safety issues:
Dangerous GU10 LED Spot Light is Cheap and Bright but could Kill you: http://youtu.be/keaE7QTKTYE
LED Tube Lighting Install & Theory: http://youtu.be/saYtnaBp4QA
To be fair it would could only kill you if you grab the bulb while it is turned on (who does that with a ceiling spot light?).
Have just bought a supermarket LED 8w=40w bulb B22 BC, 470 lumens, 25 year life, 40,000 switching cycles. £9.I recently picked up a bunch of Duracell-branded 8W/40W B22 bulbs at the local Asda for the princely sum of a fiver each - very impressed so far, and not just on the power consumption front either.
Works excellently. I'll let you know if it lasts 25 years.
I have just purchased a set of six of theses http://www.beamled.com/bri-tek-3-3w-spotlight-bulb-gu10-equivalent-to-30w-120-beam-angle-true-retrofit.html
the first order I put in I went for the "cool white" as I thought I didn't want a dim room , how wrong was I ??
OMG it was a blinding ice white light from out side it looked like I was running an arc light from the war !,
a phone call to the company and I now have the "warm white" not yellow at all and theses lamps give a great spread of light fully illuminating our kitchen not like the std halogens .
Very happy bunny
Regards
Ade
Why would you put an uber-bright power indicator on a device that people are going to have next to their bed?)
Why would you put an uber-bright power indicator on a device that people are going to have next to their bed?)
Because the LEDs that you can get now are so much brighter than the ones that the product was designed with?
I am surprised you resorted to masking tape, not an additional resistor in series with the offending LED.
I used to have to replace a GU10 halogen bulb approx once a fortnight in my kitchen and utility room (8 of them). Since getting the same ones Diver300 linked to above I haven't had a single one go in well over a year now. I think they've already paid for themselves twice over :thumbsup:
7DayShop are now offering GU10 3.5W Non-Dimmable LED Lamps for £4.74 a piece - and cheaper if you buy more than one:
Clicky (http://www.7dayshop.com/special/led-energy-saving-lamps-bulbs/240-volt-gu10-3w-led/greenworld-gu10-3-5w-non-dimmable-led-lamp-daylight-35w-downlighter-replacement?)
I'm very tempted to switch our kitchen over to them - any reason why I shouldn't?
I've not got enough LED lights at home, lon enough to see how bad that can be, but I have had to retire an Exposure bicycle light, where both the LED had dimmed significantly over several years of use, and the battery life had reduced below a useful level (and that's not a cheap light!)
Tragically, I'm finding myself resisting replacing the CFL in the bathroom with an LED lamp because the taking-a-minute-to-get-to-full-brightness effect is actually desirable when you go to the loo in the middle of the night. :facepalm:
If I don't want to blast myself with light at "bladder o'clock" (TM Wowbagger), I use the little light over the mirror (which in our case is a fluorescent tube). I'd have expected Kim, being Kim, to use an Alpkit headtorch...
I've not got enough LED lights at home, lon enough to see how bad that can be, but I have had to retire an Exposure bicycle light, where both the LED had dimmed significantly over several years of use, and the battery life had reduced below a useful level (and that's not a cheap light!)
Are those two related, and given the increase in efficiency of modern LEDs, have yours really decayed or are they just not as good as teh rest as the rest have improved? I'd expect a set of LEDs to last much longer than a few years.
As for CFLs being dead in the water, I'd suggest that the thread elsewhere about getting the landlord to replace a bulb suggests a reason they won't be gone for a long time (unless LED prices come down to the same level). Taking all the light bulbs with you when you moved out used to be only a student prank or an act of spite.Having posted that the day before yesterday, what did I do yesterday? It was there in Sainso's, £5.99 compared to £4.49 for the equivalent CFL, so not hugely more expensive - though of course both wildly more than the old filament bulbs - but also not hugely more efficient; 6W compared to 9W for "40W equivalent". And in practice the LED and the CFL (a different one of unkown wattage) do seem to be equivalent to the surviving 40W filament bulbs (reflector types in a spot lamp, not use much, which is presumably how they've survived so long - though some just do survive). The LEDs and incandescents are a better colour than the CFLs, but the LEDs are also much newer, so we'll see.
CFLs are the work of Stan!
LEDs are getting nicer and cheaper. Got my last by mail order (can't remember whether it was Amazon or ebay) . They weren't too pricy given their claimed longevity.
They have been brighter than anticipated and U'd suggest getting a LOWER wattage than you might think you need.
I've seen that happen. Many LED lamp manufacturers quote the life of the LEDs, and ignore the other electronic components, mainly electrolytic capacitors, that don't last as long as the LEDs, especially when used near their limits.CFLs are the work of Stan!
LEDs are getting nicer and cheaper. Got my last by mail order (can't remember whether it was Amazon or ebay) . They weren't too pricy given their claimed longevity.
They have been brighter than anticipated and U'd suggest getting a LOWER wattage than you might think you need.
Thread necromancy.
The claimed longevity of these lamps (30,000 hours) is a LIE!
Three of the four lamps in my kitchen have now failed in less than a year.
They have lasted around 10% of the stated life.
I am underwhelmed.
I have neither fitting nor power source to run these on DC. My kitchen is not very damp as most cooking is in either the microwave or gas oven. I would not term conditions here 'extreme.
yes
Curiously if I switch it on downstairs, then switch it off upstairs, then the LEDs have a very faint glow which does not go away. Conversely if I do the opposite, then they stay 100% off when switched off.
???
Makes for a handy night light for nocturnal toilet visits, just not sure it's doing the leds any good.
CFLs are the work of Stan!
LEDs are getting nicer and cheaper. Got my last by mail order (can't remember whether it was Amazon or ebay) . They weren't too pricy given their claimed longevity.
They have been brighter than anticipated and U'd suggest getting a LOWER wattage than you might think you need.
Thread necromancy.
The claimed longevity of these lamps (30,000 hours) is a LIE!
Three of the four lamps in my kitchen have now failed in less than a year.
They have lasted around 10% of the stated life.
I am underwhelmed.
Yes, you can replace the transformers with the same ones, or similar... But there is another way:
I bought these holders:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00CJC3QDU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
which means I could use GU10 bulbs, which connect directly to the mains, thus removing the need for any transformers.
GU10 bulbs run straight off the mainsYes, you can replace the transformers with the same ones, or similar... But there is another way:
I bought these holders:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00CJC3QDU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
which means I could use GU10 bulbs, which connect directly to the mains, thus removing the need for any transformers.
Being thick but how do these eliminate the transformers?
Any thoughts about options for LED workshop lighting? I'm using fluorescent at the moment, but the SEEKRIT BUNKER is not that high, and is pretty dim. Plus, while I haven't yet smashed a tube, I've always regarded as just a matter of time, LED would help in that respect, too. I suspect the LED tape/strip is probably the best, I could increase the light by running multiples alongside each other.
Any thoughts about options for LED workshop lighting? I'm using fluorescent at the moment, but the SEEKRIT BUNKER is not that high, and is pretty dim. Plus, while I haven't yet smashed a tube, I've always regarded as just a matter of time, LED would help in that respect, too. I suspect the LED tape/strip is probably the best, I could increase the light by running multiples alongside each other.
I'm testing out a 6ft LED replacement for 8ft T12 flouros atm at the town hall. Will let you know how I get on. You're always welcome to come and see it in person if you're going past.
... I guess the only concern is that the wire is not going to be long enough, can I buy holders with extra long wires, as everything I could find was short? Thanks
CFLs are the work of Stan!
LEDs are getting nicer and cheaper. Got my last by mail order (can't remember whether it was Amazon or ebay) . They weren't too pricy given their claimed longevity.
They have been brighter than anticipated and U'd suggest getting a LOWER wattage than you might think you need.
Thread necromancy.
The claimed longevity of these lamps (30,000 hours) is a LIE!
Three of the four lamps in my kitchen have now failed in less than a year.
They have lasted around 10% of the stated life.
I am underwhelmed.
And another one down
And another one down
Another one bites the dust!
Our bathroom light bulb (decent but oldish CFL) expired in a puff of magic smoke on Sunday night. I had a rummage in the lightbulbs box, and - ignoring the useless exotica - came up with a choice of either:
- Countless 40W tungsten lamps we removed when we moved in
- A 75W halogen lamp
- A Tesco-branded CFL of unknown specification
- An older looking CFL with "A BIT DIM" written on the base in marker pen
Tesco seemed like the best option, and it lasted hours before it started making unhealthy noises. So halogen it was, pending a bit of lightbulb shopping.
Yesterday I went lightbulb shopping. Remembering that Wilko sell lightbulbs and have a number of them plugged in and operating on display, I brought the flicker meter with me. They all had a measurable 100Hz ripple (though ambient light made it hard to determine how severe it was), apart from - ironically - one of those vintage-effect LED filament things that are barakta's nemesis. I gambled on a filament-inna-pearl-envelope which does a convincing impression of a Real Lightbulb, and having brought it home I'm actually quite impressed with it. Not really what I wanted for the bathroom, thobut, so I've had to play musical lightbulbs with the bedroom.
I think what's needed is a visit to a Local Electrical Shop on a quiet afternoon to see if they'll let me audition a selection of lamps with the flicker meter.
If I'm paying attention I can percieve flicker up to about 1kHz, given movement of the light source or some object it's illuminating, but 100Hz doesn't bother me if there's no movement. Barakta seems to percieve flicker at hundreds of Hertz just by looking at the source, and it only seems to become completely indistinguishable from DC at about 6kHz (fast and dirty test with a red LED, she may respond differently at other wavelengths). Plus her eye movement disorder means that she sees stroboscopic artefacts (like you'd get by panning a slow exposure camera) every time she moves her head under fickering light.Our bathroom light bulb (decent but oldish CFL) expired in a puff of magic smoke on Sunday night. I had a rummage in the lightbulbs box, and - ignoring the useless exotica - came up with a choice of either:
- Countless 40W tungsten lamps we removed when we moved in
- A 75W halogen lamp
- A Tesco-branded CFL of unknown specification
- An older looking CFL with "A BIT DIM" written on the base in marker pen
Tesco seemed like the best option, and it lasted hours before it started making unhealthy noises. So halogen it was, pending a bit of lightbulb shopping.
Yesterday I went lightbulb shopping. Remembering that Wilko sell lightbulbs and have a number of them plugged in and operating on display, I brought the flicker meter with me. They all had a measurable 100Hz ripple (though ambient light made it hard to determine how severe it was), apart from - ironically - one of those vintage-effect LED filament things that are barakta's nemesis. I gambled on a filament-inna-pearl-envelope which does a convincing impression of a Real Lightbulb, and having brought it home I'm actually quite impressed with it. Not really what I wanted for the bathroom, thobut, so I've had to play musical lightbulbs with the bedroom.
I think what's needed is a visit to a Local Electrical Shop on a quiet afternoon to see if they'll let me audition a selection of lamps with the flicker meter.
Our visual cortex is supposed to be too slow to recognise 100 us flicker;) but have heard you discuss this before. Why are the led filament thingies Barakta's nemesis? That's a new one on me?
If I'm paying attention I can percieve flicker up to about 1kHz, given movement of the light source or some object it's illuminating, but 100Hz doesn't bother me if there's no movement. Barakta seems to percieve flicker at hundreds of Hertz just by looking at the source, and it only seems to become completely indistinguishable from DC at about 6kHz (fast and dirty test with a red LED, she may respond differently at other wavelengths). Plus her eye movement disorder means that she sees stroboscopic artefacts (like you'd get by panning a slow exposure camera) every time she moves her head under fickering light.Our bathroom light bulb (decent but oldish CFL) expired in a puff of magic smoke on Sunday night. I had a rummage in the lightbulbs box, and - ignoring the useless exotica - came up with a choice of either:
- Countless 40W tungsten lamps we removed when we moved in
- A 75W halogen lamp
- A Tesco-branded CFL of unknown specification
- An older looking CFL with "A BIT DIM" written on the base in marker pen
Tesco seemed like the best option, and it lasted hours before it started making unhealthy noises. So halogen it was, pending a bit of lightbulb shopping.
Yesterday I went lightbulb shopping. Remembering that Wilko sell lightbulbs and have a number of them plugged in and operating on display, I brought the flicker meter with me. They all had a measurable 100Hz ripple (though ambient light made it hard to determine how severe it was), apart from - ironically - one of those vintage-effect LED filament things that are barakta's nemesis. I gambled on a filament-inna-pearl-envelope which does a convincing impression of a Real Lightbulb, and having brought it home I'm actually quite impressed with it. Not really what I wanted for the bathroom, thobut, so I've had to play musical lightbulbs with the bedroom.
I think what's needed is a visit to a Local Electrical Shop on a quiet afternoon to see if they'll let me audition a selection of lamps with the flicker meter.
Our visual cortex is supposed to be too slow to recognise 100 us flicker;) but have heard you discuss this before. Why are the led filament thingies Barakta's nemesis? That's a new one on me?
The problem with the LED filaments is twofold: Firstly, the simple glare of a bright, small light source, and with the vintage-effect lamps, typically placed in a way that it's hard to avoid looking at. More pertinently, the filament is a long string of LEDs in series, which means it doesn't switch on until it has, say, 150V across it. Combine with a lack of smoothing capacitor (either through cost-cutting or the size constraints of hiding the electronics in the cap of the lamp) and you end up with the lamp flickering at 2x mains frequency with a particularly obnoxious (ie. close to 50%) duty cycle.
..... Combine with a lack of smoothing capacitor (either through cost-cutting or the size constraints of hiding the electronics in the cap of the lamp) and you end up with the lamp flickering at 2x mains frequency with a particularly obnoxious (ie. close to 50%) duty cycle.The lower the duty cycle, the more obnoxious, in my experience.
So how TF am I supposed to get rid of failed lamps?
..... Combine with a lack of smoothing capacitor (either through cost-cutting or the size constraints of hiding the electronics in the cap of the lamp) and you end up with the lamp flickering at 2x mains frequency with a particularly obnoxious (ie. close to 50%) duty cycle.The lower the duty cycle, the more obnoxious, in my experience.
Particularly evil are some car stop/ tail lights (VW) where the same brightness is used for both, but with a 10% duty cycle at 100 Hz for the tail light, and on all the time when braking. The 9 ms off-time is more likely to annoy other drivers than shorter off times. Of course, 9 ms off-time is only just shorter than you get with LEDs run from 50 Hz, half-wave rectified.
Anyone know of a good source of 12V transformers suitable to drive LED spotlights? I want to replace some halogen lights in a display cabinet with LEDs.
TIA.
Just checked and light bulbs can't be recycled, at least here.
So how TF am I supposed to get rid of failed lamps?
Hand them in at the information desk of any branch of PCWorld. Curry's will also accept them. They won't charge you for disposal.
Curry's/PCWorld have a policy of accepting any Ewaste for processing, whether or not they supplied it, as the easiest way for them to comply with WEEE law. You can give them any dead electronic items.
Sainsbury's now stock the R63 7w (60w equivalent) E27 fitting, lamps that adorn my kitchen for £5.
It claims a life "up to 25 years"
Sainsbury's now stock the R63 7w (60w equivalent) E27 fitting, lamps that adorn my kitchen for £5.
I've just fitted one of these to replace yet another from the long-life lamp company.
We will see...
This? https://theconversation.com/leds-could-be-harmful-to-health-the-eu-halogen-ban-will-make-it-worse-102589
Research by "Arnold J Wilkins
Professor of Psychology, University of Essex
As for 'daylight', I wonder if this is going to be a generational thing, with 2700K lighting dying out with those of us who were brought up with incandescent lighting. I know I associate orange light with warmth, but if younger generations don't have that association, why have lighting in unnatural colours?I was wondering along the same lines. But Cdzzmc Jnr has grown up so far on tungsten, CFL, full size fluorescent tubes, and 2700K LED (not necessarily in that order). So I don't think he's quite that generation – maybe Nye is, but I expect it's the generation just being born. He prefers the 6500K because he reckons it's brighter, whereas we reckon it's harsh. It certainly doesn't look anything like daylight to me – as I think I said earlier (though possibly in another thread), it reminds me of my IQ-X more than anything else. But these are only cheapies from Wilko.
As for 'daylight', I wonder if this is going to be a generational thing, with 2700K lighting dying out with those of us who were brought up with incandescent lighting. I know I associate orange light with warmth, but if younger generations don't have that association, why have lighting in unnatural colours?I was wondering along the same lines. But Cdzzmc Jnr has grown up so far on tungsten, CFL, full size fluorescent tubes, and 2700K LED (not necessarily in that order). So I don't think he's quite that generation – maybe Nye is, but I expect it's the generation just being born. He prefers the 6500K because he reckons it's brighter, whereas we reckon it's harsh. It certainly doesn't look anything like daylight to me – as I think I said earlier (though possibly in another thread), it reminds me of my IQ-X more than anything else. But these are only cheapies from Wilko.
I think people, even rich ones, only change the outside lighting when the bulb dies. The security lights at the back of my house are still halogen but they're mostly off. I did replace the lights on the front of the house as they're on from dusk till about 1am (and in the mornings during winter). It's pitch black once the streetlight goes off at midnight.
In other news, I'm a mushy ambient light sort of person. Spare me the harsh, angry photons.
Our outside lamp is twenty years old. I’ve only changed it once and when I did that I put it on a proximity sensor. It is incandescent.
Sorry, I meant they were always on when it's dark. There's a light/dark sensor and a timer. I use the timer (which has the most inaccurate clock ever). Obviously, the main reason for the lights is so that we can see the bears. They hate it when you walk into them.The bears are tangoing on the camping stool. Dancing in the dark, probably.
I did once almost trip over a badger. But that was down the road.
;DOur outside lamp is twenty years old. I’ve only changed it once and when I did that I put it on a proximity sensor. It is incandescent.
Well I’d be pretty miffed if you only gave me any attention once every 20 years ;D
Sorry, I meant they were always on when it's dark. There's a light/dark sensor and a timer. I use the timer (which has the most inaccurate clock ever). Obviously, the main reason for the lights is so that we can see the bears. They hate it when you walk into them.The bears are tangoing on the camping stool. Dancing in the dark, probably.
I did once almost trip over a badger. But that was down the road.
I reckon about half the working incandescent bulbs here have not been changed since I moved here in 1999. Many get little use. Some just LAST.
I reckon about half the working incandescent bulbs here have not been changed since I moved here in 1999. Many get little use. Some just LAST.
This. I think there is a form of natural selection that works with incandescents. You start of with a load of random ones but gradually all the short lived ones blow and get replaced and you end up with only good ones that will last for ages.
Duff fittings or being switched on and off all the time mitigate against any kind of long life for them though. Office use where they are switched on once a day or sometimes left on all the time is perfect for maxing out the life of a good incandescent bulb.
This. I think there is a form of natural selection that works with incandescents. You start of with a load of random ones but gradually all the short lived ones blow and get replaced and you end up with only good ones that will last for ages.
Duff fittings or being switched on and off all the time mitigate against any kind of long life for them though. Office use where they are switched on once a day or sometimes left on all the time is perfect for maxing out the life of a good incandescent bulb.
I don't think I've ever seen an LED icon[1] outside an electronics CAD package. The lightbulb as a symbol for a bright idea, and indeed as an icon for 'lights' and 'on' is bound to live at least as long as the telephone receiver or vintage microphone icons.
The 3.5" floppy for 'save' is doing surprisingly well, considering the short window (at around the time that WIMP GUIs went mainstream) during which they were likely to be the medium in use. I suppose hard disks, like LEDs, lose out as icon-fodder because the average person doesn't really know what they look like.
The bellows camera is still winning, I reckon.
[1] Either the schematic symbol, or a stylised through-hole LED.
You have no idea how adept I am at drawing floppy disks (I know, it's not a disk and it's not floppy, a joke that has less viable currency these days than a Zimbabwean dollar) and good old fashion manila folders. The floppy icon has actually acquired its own meaning separate from what it originally represented. I honestly haven't seen a floppy disk for years. I have a box of them somewhere. I suspect they contain bad poetry written for deprecated girlfriends. I quite possibly have a 5.25-inch disk somewhere that contains the software for running a Hewlett Packard HPLC. I think it might be for an Apple II. I only remember this because it was next to the helium cylinder which was not only critical for degassing acetonitrile but also comedy pizza ordering.(https://assets.atlasobscura.com/media/W1siZiIsInVwbG9hZHMvcGxhY2VfaW1hZ2VzL2EwNDAyNTg5MmNjNWU0MGQ3NF9aaW1iYWJ3ZV8kMTAwX3RyaWxsaW9uXzIwMDlfT2J2ZXJzZS5qcGciXSxbInAiLCJ0aHVtYiIsIngzOTA-Il0sWyJwIiwiY29udmVydCIsIi1xdWFsaXR5IDgxIC1hdXRvLW9yaWVudCJdXQ/Zimbabwe_%24100_trillion_2009_Obverse.jpg)
I fear the future will be bereft of visual metaphors so we'd better kept the old ones going.
I reckon about half the working incandescent bulbs here have not been changed since I moved here in 1999. Many get little use. Some just LAST.
The Centennial Light is the world's longest-lasting light bulb, burning since 1901.
Any suggestions for LED to replace the fluorescent tube in the kitchen? It is currently a 6ft T8, 70W.All the LED replacement tubes that I have seen need to have the ballast removed. It's not exactly difficult to do, but the tubes don't seem to be plug and play.
How does it work for the starter/ballast? Do you need to remove or rewire these? Or worth replacing all of the fittings?
Any suggestions for LED to replace the fluorescent tube in the kitchen? It is currently a 6ft T8, 70W.All the LED replacement tubes that I have seen need to have the ballast removed. It's not exactly difficult to do, but the tubes don't seem to be plug and play.
How does it work for the starter/ballast? Do you need to remove or rewire these? Or worth replacing all of the fittings?
I'm very pleased with the fluorescent-fitting-shaped LED lamps that we have in the garage, but the electrician fitted them and I don't know the make.
Sainsbury's now stock the R63 7w (60w equivalent) E27 fitting, lamps that adorn my kitchen for £5.
I've just fitted one of these to replace yet another from the long-life lamp company.
We will see...
We've had 9 LED downlights in our kitchen for 4.5 years and 16 in the remainder of the ground floor for 3.5 years. No failures and they are guaranteed for 10 years, so I'm not expecting failures for a while.
[2] Single pendant, so you're always washing up / chopping in your own shadow.[/sub]Surely you need a dongle and one of these:-
I think I may have found the holy grail
Sainsbury's now stock the R63 7w (60w equivalent) E27 fitting, lamps that adorn my kitchen for £5.
I've just fitted one of these to replace yet another from the long-life lamp company.
We will see...
Nearly 2 years on, this lamp has lasted, so far.
The lamp over the sink is flickering like mad. My records state it's a Sainsbury's model, replaced 11/11/17.
The lamp over my head appears to have lasted since before I started recording lamp changes.
I think I may have found the holy grail
SANSI update: I now have some of the 2000lm 18W version. This one has a more conventional flataluminium PCBpiece of ceramic with the LEDs mounted to it, for a less impressive 180 degree field of illumination (of course that might work better in some fixtures). Similar well-cooled PSU design. Colour temperature and colour rendering seem similar. I measured ripple at 60kHz this time, so it's also barakta-approved.
I await the delivery of some BC22 to E27 adaptors...
I think I may have found the holy grail
SANSI update: I now have some of the 2000lm 18W version. This one has a more conventional flataluminium PCBpiece of ceramic with the LEDs mounted to it, for a less impressive 180 degree field of illumination (of course that might work better in some fixtures). Similar well-cooled PSU design. Colour temperature and colour rendering seem similar. I measured ripple at 60kHz this time, so it's also barakta-approved.
I await the delivery of some BC22 to E27 adaptors...
And now a couple of the 3000lm 22W. These have the 270 degrees ring of LEDs like the 4000lm version. Ripple at 83kHz, so again no flicker.
In summary then:
18W 2000lm 3000K (and presumably all the lower power versions): Bright, directional light, best for 'spot' type fittings, or above a stairwell or something where it doesn't matter that the ceiling remains gloomy. Pleasant halogen-ish colour temperature.
22W 3000lm 3000K: Very good omnidirectional spread, though not quite as isotropic as a tungsten lamp. Works well in the now legendary spherical paper lampshade to provide a bright central ceiling light.
27W 4000lm 3000K: As above but brighter. Overkill for most applications, but works well for a kitchen or bike-fettling room.
I believe there's also a dimmable version of the 4000lm one. That would be a good choice if you have a dimmer. I haven't tested one so can't vouch for whether it flickers.
They also come in 5000K daylight flavour.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/stores/page/F9B5CA5F-F563-485F-9C26-5BD5A55195CA
I think I may have found the holy grail
SANSI update: I now have some of the 2000lm 18W version. This one has a more conventional flataluminium PCBpiece of ceramic with the LEDs mounted to it, for a less impressive 180 degree field of illumination (of course that might work better in some fixtures). Similar well-cooled PSU design. Colour temperature and colour rendering seem similar. I measured ripple at 60kHz this time, so it's also barakta-approved.
I await the delivery of some BC22 to E27 adaptors...
Careful with the BC22 to E27 Adaptors...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZ2EKCUp7-E
but the Edison is riskier if you don't preserve correct polarityMy late FiL was an electrician. Many many years ago something I've forgotten coincided with him visiting and he ended up poking around in our light switch. He rarely got angry but this was one occasion, when he discovered the switch had been wired into the neutral leaving the bulb and holder always live. "Wired by plumbers" was his frequent verdict.
I'm looking at replacing the 1500mm T8 58W fluorescent in the kitchen with a Philips LED replacement.I've a number (4) of Flouros replaced by the LED variety. They don't appear to be directional.
New 58W fluorescents put out 5400lm 4000K colour temperature . The LED replacement only manages 2000lm 4000K colour temperature.
Is this difference going to be an issue? I assume the fluorescent emits light 360 degrees around the tube whilst the LED only shines "downwards". Is that the cause for the discrepancy in the output?
Are yours straight tube for tube swaps? What model? What's the light level like? The blurb on Screwfix suggested the Philips LED "tube" was directional, with a line to indicate the right orientation.I'm looking at replacing the 1500mm T8 58W fluorescent in the kitchen with a Philips LED replacement.I've a number (4) of Flouros replaced by the LED variety. They don't appear to be directional.
New 58W fluorescents put out 5400lm 4000K colour temperature . The LED replacement only manages 2000lm 4000K colour temperature.
Is this difference going to be an issue? I assume the fluorescent emits light 360 degrees around the tube whilst the LED only shines "downwards". Is that the cause for the discrepancy in the output?
No. Not tube for tube swaps. They're actually these:Are yours straight tube for tube swaps? What model? What's the light level like? The blurb on Screwfix suggested the Philips LED "tube" was directional, with a line to indicate the right orientation.I'm looking at replacing the 1500mm T8 58W fluorescent in the kitchen with a Philips LED replacement.I've a number (4) of Flouros replaced by the LED variety. They don't appear to be directional.
New 58W fluorescents put out 5400lm 4000K colour temperature . The LED replacement only manages 2000lm 4000K colour temperature.
Is this difference going to be an issue? I assume the fluorescent emits light 360 degrees around the tube whilst the LED only shines "downwards". Is that the cause for the discrepancy in the output?
Kim, So the lamp control circuitry had dropped out of regulation? I suppose it's to be expected <216 Volts. If it was physically possible I could lend you a Variac for test purposes. (tucked under a bench for years on the off-chance it would come in useful one day).
Note for next time: Turn one of the Sansis on and see if they're stable.
I hve previously bought Phillips a long time ago which were expensive and didn't last long. Currently I have Lumilife which don't last very long (or go a bit weedy as if battery power is getting low!).
Unfortunately Sansi don't make anything in the smaller sizes (SES, GU10 sort of thing). I suspect it's not easy to fit a proper power supply circuit and a sufficiency of heat-sinking in the space available.According to Amazon they do... https://www.amazon.co.uk/SANSI-E14-Led-Candle-Bulbs/dp/B07T483YCT
Unfortunately Sansi don't make anything in the smaller sizes (SES, GU10 sort of thing). I suspect it's not easy to fit a proper power supply circuit and a sufficiency of heat-sinking in the space available.According to Amazon they do... https://www.amazon.co.uk/SANSI-E14-Led-Candle-Bulbs/dp/B07T483YCT
I've been quite happy with these https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0822B5B3G for quality of light and brightnessAlso not in stock..
Unfortunately Sansi don't make anything in the smaller sizes (SES, GU10 sort of thing). I suspect it's not easy to fit a proper power supply circuit and a sufficiency of heat-sinking in the space available.According to Amazon they do... https://www.amazon.co.uk/SANSI-E14-Led-Candle-Bulbs/dp/B07T483YCT
I hadn't noticed those before.
Out of stock, thobut, and not listed on https://eu.sansiled.com/led-light-bulb.html
Unfortunately Sansi don't make anything in the smaller sizes (SES, GU10 sort of thing). I suspect it's not easy to fit a proper power supply circuit and a sufficiency of heat-sinking in the space available.According to Amazon they do... https://www.amazon.co.uk/SANSI-E14-Led-Candle-Bulbs/dp/B07T483YCT
Just for the ignorant ones here (that'll be me), what is WEE and WEEE?
Following on from another thread where a 50w MR16 Halogen downlighter nearly set my house on fire, I'm looking to replace them with LEDs.
The existing fittings in various rooms are set into holes in the plasterboard, some are 65mm and some are 70mm holes.
What's the general approach to this these days?
1) Retain the existing fittings, and use like-for-like 12v LED lamps. This might require new transformers / SMPSUs, if the existing ones have a minimum load which the 5w LEDs don't reach.
2) Retain the existing fittings, and use 240v MR16 lamps, ditching the transformers / SMPSUs.
3) Replace the entire fitting with a dedicated LED unit.
My gut reaction is (1), for the following reasons:
- Having the 240v - 12v PSU external means it can have better thermal management than trying to cram it into the tiny space in the lamp itself, leaving only the 12v LED driver in the lamp;
- I'm not sure the existing fittings / connectors are rated for 240v. But then again they were marginal for the current for 50w @ 12v! I think I'd prefer to run them at 12 v and the 500mA or so a 5w LED will take.
- I don't want to have to re-drill / patch plasterboard for new fittings which will no doubt be different diameters to my existing mix of 65 / 70 mm 'oles.
So general advice?
And any particular brand of 12v 50w equiv LEDs you'd recommend?
Received wisdom seems to be that if you fit LED fixtures, they'll fail in a couple of years and you'll need to replace them (inevitably with something requiring a different size hole, or at least visibly non-matching). If you fit GU10 or similar fixtures, they'll be flickery shit from the outset, but at least you can change the lamp when it fails.
Received wisdom seems to be that if you fit LED fixtures, they'll fail in a couple of years and you'll need to replace them (inevitably with something requiring a different size hole, or at least visibly non-matching). If you fit GU10 or similar fixtures, they'll be flickery shit from the outset, but at least you can change the lamp when it fails.
I guess it depends on your (in)tolerance to flicker. We’ve had mains GU10 LED replacement bulbs for several years in both kitchen and bathroom. We don’t notice any flicker, and the bulbs have been more reliable than halogen ones.
A couple of weeks after we moved in here I replaced the last of the evil halogen pretending to be incandescent bulb with LED. One of them failed already, that's less than 3 months!
Lumilife is the brand for those interested.
<Grumble>
Yes, and so back to my original q:12 V house lighting traditionally runs from conventional transformers that put out 50 Hz sine waves. An LED lamp will have to have a rectifier to allow for that, which will also allow for it to be inserted either way round if the power supply provides dc.
With a 240v GU-whatever LED lamp, all the chopperising, smootherising ( or lack thereof ), constant-currantizing for the LEDs has to happen within the body of the lamp itself. The smootherising of the 240v to chopperised LV is compromised by lack of space.
But with a 12v LED, all the chopperising and smootherising is done in the external psu, with space to do it properly. So what remains to be done in the lamp? only the constant-currentizing for the LEDs, because the psu provides a constant-voltage clean 12v. Does the constant-currantising involve a further stage of chopperizing and un-smoothing? Or is it a more linear thing? I've never ripped one apart. But my hunch is that there is rather less electronics in a 12v lamp than a 240v one. But I don't know.
Following on from another thread where a 50w MR16 Halogen downlighter nearly set my house on fire, I'm looking to replace them with LEDs.
The existing fittings in various rooms are set into holes in the plasterboard, some are 65mm and some are 70mm holes.
What's the general approach to this these days?
1) Retain the existing fittings, and use like-for-like 12v LED lamps. This might require new transformers / SMPSUs, if the existing ones have a minimum load which the 5w LEDs don't reach.
2) Retain the existing fittings, and use 240v MR16 lamps, ditching the transformers / SMPSUs.
3) Replace the entire fitting with a dedicated LED unit.
My gut reaction is (1), for the following reasons:
- Having the 240v - 12v PSU external means it can have better thermal management than trying to cram it into the tiny space in the lamp itself, leaving only the 12v LED driver in the lamp;
- I'm not sure the existing fittings / connectors are rated for 240v. But then again they were marginal for the current for 50w @ 12v! I think I'd prefer to run them at 12 v and the 500mA or so a 5w LED will take.
- I don't want to have to re-drill / patch plasterboard for new fittings which will no doubt be different diameters to my existing mix of 65 / 70 mm 'oles.
So general advice?
And any particular brand of 12v 50w equiv LEDs you'd recommend?
This cap is probably the principal point of compromise and failure in the design, I'd have thought.
It will likely have a fairly poor ESR rating, and its voltage rating will be close to it's operating envelope I expect.
So with a 12v AC supply, I'd expect the 'DC'-ish supply to the current regulator to be fairly poor in terms of 50Hz ripple, which might account for visible flicker.
It would depend on how well the high frequency current regulator is able to deal with that.
i can imagine there might be potential for beat frequency flicker, too.
This cap is probably the principal point of compromise and failure in the design, I'd have thought.
It will likely have a fairly poor ESR rating, and its voltage rating will be close to it's operating envelope I expect.
So with a 12v AC supply, I'd expect the 'DC'-ish supply to the current regulator to be fairly poor in terms of 50Hz ripple, which might account for visible flicker.
It would depend on how well the high frequency current regulator is able to deal with that.
i can imagine there might be potential for beat frequency flicker, too.
I would agree that the capacitor may be overstressed. However, the visibility of flicker depends on the modulation depth, or how dark the dark times are compared to the bright times. The bad flicker (VW tail lights*) comes from 100 % modulation depth, so they turn off completely, and if that is combined with a poor mark space ratio (the light is only bright for a short part of the cycle) then flicker is very visible.
A capacitor followed by a regulator is likely to have reduced modulation depth, in that it may well not turn off completely, and a good mark space ratio, so that it is at or near full brightness for most of the time, so I think that flicker will be minimal. I don't think that you will get beat frequency modulation between 100 Hz rectified mains and 20 - 100 kHz switching frequency.
Update with what we have in our kitchen now.
JCC JC94174 7W non-dimmable.
Nice pieces of kit and a 10 year warranty.
E decided that a small chandelier in the window of our local antiquarian book-seller would be perfect for the vestibule. It's metal-framed with chain and metal ceiling rose.I suspect you'll get issues with voltage drop.
On removing the old fitting I found we have 2-core lighting wiring, so metal fittings not allowed. My solution was to use an LED driver to convert to 12v and source a suitable LED bulb (found one under bus & caravan fittings).
Separately, I have been replacing the 12v halogen downlighters in the dining room with LEDs, until I fried the transformer. So a replacement driver bought, which is when I discovered that a 25w driver won't cope with 20 watts of LEDs (at least the make I bought), so I had to daisychain another one. Everything works now.
The hall is also 12v downlighters, so that's going to need attention at some point as I replace the current lamps. Only trouble is the hallway is about 25ft long and I've no idea where the transformer is (somewhere under the landing floor).
More than with the current 12v halogen lamps?E decided that a small chandelier in the window of our local antiquarian book-seller would be perfect for the vestibule. It's metal-framed with chain and metal ceiling rose.I suspect you'll get issues with voltage drop.
On removing the old fitting I found we have 2-core lighting wiring, so metal fittings not allowed. My solution was to use an LED driver to convert to 12v and source a suitable LED bulb (found one under bus & caravan fittings).
Separately, I have been replacing the 12v halogen downlighters in the dining room with LEDs, until I fried the transformer. So a replacement driver bought, which is when I discovered that a 25w driver won't cope with 20 watts of LEDs (at least the make I bought), so I had to daisychain another one. Everything works now.
The hall is also 12v downlighters, so that's going to need attention at some point as I replace the current lamps. Only trouble is the hallway is about 25ft long and I've no idea where the transformer is (somewhere under the landing floor).
Under-volted halogen will just be a bit dim.More than with the current 12v halogen lamps?E decided that a small chandelier in the window of our local antiquarian book-seller would be perfect for the vestibule. It's metal-framed with chain and metal ceiling rose.I suspect you'll get issues with voltage drop.
On removing the old fitting I found we have 2-core lighting wiring, so metal fittings not allowed. My solution was to use an LED driver to convert to 12v and source a suitable LED bulb (found one under bus & caravan fittings).
Separately, I have been replacing the 12v halogen downlighters in the dining room with LEDs, until I fried the transformer. So a replacement driver bought, which is when I discovered that a 25w driver won't cope with 20 watts of LEDs (at least the make I bought), so I had to daisychain another one. Everything works now.
The hall is also 12v downlighters, so that's going to need attention at some point as I replace the current lamps. Only trouble is the hallway is about 25ft long and I've no idea where the transformer is (somewhere under the landing floor).
Oh well. Here's hoping I don't have to take too much floorboarding (and carpet) up.Under-volted halogen will just be a bit dim.More than with the current 12v halogen lamps?E decided that a small chandelier in the window of our local antiquarian book-seller would be perfect for the vestibule. It's metal-framed with chain and metal ceiling rose.I suspect you'll get issues with voltage drop.
On removing the old fitting I found we have 2-core lighting wiring, so metal fittings not allowed. My solution was to use an LED driver to convert to 12v and source a suitable LED bulb (found one under bus & caravan fittings).
Separately, I have been replacing the 12v halogen downlighters in the dining room with LEDs, until I fried the transformer. So a replacement driver bought, which is when I discovered that a 25w driver won't cope with 20 watts of LEDs (at least the make I bought), so I had to daisychain another one. Everything works now.
The hall is also 12v downlighters, so that's going to need attention at some point as I replace the current lamps. Only trouble is the hallway is about 25ft long and I've no idea where the transformer is (somewhere under the landing floor).
Under volted leds might not work.
Oh well. Here's hoping I don't have to take too much floorboarding (and carpet) up.Under-volted halogen will just be a bit dim.More than with the current 12v halogen lamps?E decided that a small chandelier in the window of our local antiquarian book-seller would be perfect for the vestibule. It's metal-framed with chain and metal ceiling rose.I suspect you'll get issues with voltage drop.
On removing the old fitting I found we have 2-core lighting wiring, so metal fittings not allowed. My solution was to use an LED driver to convert to 12v and source a suitable LED bulb (found one under bus & caravan fittings).
Separately, I have been replacing the 12v halogen downlighters in the dining room with LEDs, until I fried the transformer. So a replacement driver bought, which is when I discovered that a 25w driver won't cope with 20 watts of LEDs (at least the make I bought), so I had to daisychain another one. Everything works now.
The hall is also 12v downlighters, so that's going to need attention at some point as I replace the current lamps. Only trouble is the hallway is about 25ft long and I've no idea where the transformer is (somewhere under the landing floor).
Under volted leds might not work.