Author Topic: Wheel woes on the challenge fujin SL (Read 5716 times)

Tigerrr · « **on:** 28 July, 2011, 01:35:16 pm »

Just starting to ride again and have found the cassette on the rear wheel is all ruined - sprockets and hub splines chewed to bits. It's a challenge wheel and getting it fixed is going to be a nightmare based on past experience.
Popped spare wheel on and found bearings obv trashed plus rim braking worn heavily.
So - reckon I need a new wheel. A world of complication has opened up. I want a light but strong rim braking 26" to fit into the frame with shimano 11/28 cassette. Maznged to find the cassette but wheel is proving tough. MTB wheels are all disc these days and built to take huge tyres.
What's a good choice?
Bike used for Audax and going fast as I can. I had hoped to be joining the folk leaving from Oxford tomorrow night but right now I am up on blocks.
Plus - what's the thing about 130/135mm hubs?

Quint · « **Reply #1 on:** 28 July, 2011, 01:37:39 pm »

Have you tried Chain Reaction, V quick and good with advice on the phone as well, best of luck

Biggsy · « **Reply #2 on:** 28 July, 2011, 01:43:11 pm »

Quote from: Tigerrr on 28 July, 2011, 01:35:16 pm

Plus - what's the thing about 130/135mm hubs?

What d'ya mean?

Modern Shimano "MTB" hubs (Deore etc) are 135mm wide from outside locknut to outside locknut. The modern ones tend to be non-convertable to 130mm. Modern "road" hubs tend to be 130mm.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #3 on:** 28 July, 2011, 02:04:57 pm »

Quote from: Biggsy on 28 July, 2011, 01:43:11 pm

Quote from: Tigerrr on 28 July, 2011, 01:35:16 pm
Plus - what's the thing about 130/135mm hubs?

What d'ya mean?

Modern Shimano "MTB" hubs (Deore etc) are 135mm wide from outside locknut to outside locknut. The modern ones tend to be non-convertable to 130mm. Modern "road" hubs tend to be 130mm.

I suspect I have a 26" rim with 130mm hub requirement. This woudl be typical of the Challenge approach to complicating life if possible - but I am not sure. (Have not measured it and don't have it in front of me as I talk to various wheel suppliers. However I was hoping another Fujin owner might know based on their experiences with the model.

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #4 on:** 28 July, 2011, 02:07:36 pm »

Firstly - cassette or freewheel?

Number of sprockets?

OLN - we need to know this (130/135)

What is the hub you have in there now? If you tell us that we will be able to work out the oln.

There is nothing to stop you using a disk hub and not bothering with fitting disk brakes.

There are plenty of rims in 559 that are for rim brakes. I've just built up a wheel using an XM117 rim - cheap rim, no eyelets but fairly light.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #5 on:** 28 July, 2011, 03:55:20 pm »

My ignorance is showing. I thought the cassette was just a description of the sprockets set.

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #6 on:** 28 July, 2011, 04:00:34 pm »

I would be very surprised if it isn't a cassette - it was the 11-28 bit that made my mind think "possibly freewheel".

I've tried looking up the fujin - I guess you have the original hubs - which look to be unbranded. Ruddy pain, that.

If it turns out to be a 135oln hub, then you can do much worse than go to merlin cycles. They do a good wheelbuild and are cheap.

See this: http://www.merlincycles.co.uk/Bike+Shop/Wheels/Mountain+Bike+Wheels/Custom+Wheels+-+Non+Disc/Rear+Handbuilt+Wheels+-+Non+Disc_WHEELS-REAR-ND.htm

If it is an 130mm oln, then I'm not sure of the best option.

Chris N · « **Reply #7 on:** 28 July, 2011, 04:14:08 pm »

Can the Fujin take disc brakes? Bound to be 135mm if so.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #8 on:** 28 July, 2011, 04:20:17 pm »

Thats a relief - I am sure it is cassette because that is what I have bought in the past - and it is an unusual size which means that if I find one I buy it. The one I just bought was half the price I paid last time for a custom built. It is a challenge hub - some sort of superlightweighted ceramic bearing job. This is 2nd wheel to trash in same way - I guess I am too heavy for the mechanism.
Thanks for tips - I will go home and measure the blasted thing.
Just saw the note re discs and yes it can so maybe that answers the measuring question! Top thought there.

All I need then is a nice light strong shimano hubbed 26" wheel witrh braking surface. In central London! Not at Bikefix nor Cycle surgery, their wheels of that type are MTB/commuter clunkers and I don't think Condor carry 26" stuff. Ideas anyone?

Biggsy · « **Reply #9 on:** 28 July, 2011, 04:21:36 pm »

Quote from: Tigerrr on 28 July, 2011, 03:55:20 pm

My ignorance is showing. I thought the cassette was just a description of the sprockets set.

It is, but MrCharly was asking to tell what kind of hub is desired. A hub for a cassette has the freewheel mechanism integrated into the hub or freehub rather than the sprockets. A cassette is just a collection of splined sprockets.

A "freewheel" (of the multi-gear variety) is a set of threaded sprockets screwed onto a freewheel, that's replaced a complete unit. A hub for a freewheel is different from a hub for a cassette.

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #10 on:** 28 July, 2011, 04:24:56 pm »

Merlin cycles will ship very quickly - last time I bought from them they told me it would be 5 days - the wheel was built and arrived with me 3 days later. But they only do 135oln hubs.

Do you have to have 11-28? Merlin have 11-32 for £16.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #11 on:** 28 July, 2011, 04:37:42 pm »

i will definitely go to merlin for my next cassette - that is a very low price indeed. 28 is about the max I can manage chainwise with a triple on the front.
Still scouting for a shop in town with a wheel - I was hoping to buy it tonite and get it fitted in time to be riding tomorrow PM.

Biggsy · « **Reply #12 on:** 28 July, 2011, 05:27:34 pm »

Do any of your local bike shops stay open til 6pm or later? A Halfords might. How about getting a cheap crappish wheel that will do for the one ride (and be an emergency spare for the future)?

alexb · « **Reply #13 on:** 28 July, 2011, 05:43:45 pm »

Have you considered building this up around something like a Shimano Ultegra hub (good seals, 130mm OLN) built onto a standard MTB rim? I'd suggest Parker International for the build, they are very cheap and good, but I'm not sure if they'll do a 26" rim. It would be worth asking.

Merlin sells road groupsets, so despite there not being a listing for that combination, I'm sure a phone call would get you what you want.

Jedrik · « **Reply #14 on:** 28 July, 2011, 09:50:39 pm »

My Fujin takes an ordinary MTB-hub.
After 740 km of HBKH I left it standing for two weeks since I was injured. Then I found out that the bearings and freewheel bits in the hub had corroded and the hub would not move any more - that was after just about 3500 km on that wheel. Got a replacement by Challenge asap, but did not trust the hardiness of the wheel any more and build my own with an XT-hub (135 mm) and a nice, slim 559 x 15 rim for typical audax weather. No problems ever since.

Edit: If you can get hold of a wheel with the same hub, you just pull of the free wheel bodies and swap - easy as pie.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #15 on:** 29 July, 2011, 08:53:44 am »

Indeed jedrik - I think the original Challenge branded hub is simply too lightweight to cope. In my case the sprockets have eaten the splines on the hub - explains why I was getting so much chain slip, but I think means the wheel is now scrap. I understand others eat the bearings which are tiny ceramic jobs that look like they would not last too long in our weather.
I am sourcing a basic shimano hub and mavic combo as a new spare and I think I will get something special built for sunny park sprinting.

Jedrik · « **Reply #16 on:** 29 July, 2011, 11:37:51 am »

As I said, the freewheel body is easily replaced, not even tools needed. Mine shows wear marks from the sprockets, too, but it's not too bad.

The bearings in the hub and freewheel are identical, but not standard sized. Replacements can be gotten from whoever sells older American Classic hubs (don't know about the new ones).

With replacements by Challenge I put hub and freewheel in working order again and now have a light wheel for special purposes on stand-by while I ride the sturdier XT-Mavic-Wheel in all weathers.

Arno · « **Reply #17 on:** 29 July, 2011, 01:52:08 pm »

I've had Mavic Cross Trail 26'' factory wheels on my high racer (2 years, maybe 2000 or 3000km) , they may not be easy to service, but they felt stiff and quite aero, with flat spokes, and have not failed so far.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #18 on:** 01 August, 2011, 01:23:19 pm »

So....ended up getting a cheapo mavic/noname hub. Seems just fine! Goes round and round, quite fast in fact - but weighs double plus the lightweight job - that could be my critical advantage in the park eroded. So I think it will do nicely for the backup emergency wheel.
Meanwhile - looking at the Merlin folk who suggest a Hope hub and Mavic rims etc - hmm hub alone >£100. I am always looking for reasons to spend more money on the bike - is a Hope hub worth the price of 2 cheapo wheels I wonder? Will it give me superpowers? I like Hope stuff generally - is conveys a strong sense of 'secret ingredient' that marks out the truly serious sportsperson from the dabbler.

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #19 on:** 01 August, 2011, 01:37:46 pm »

The hope hub will enable you to produce the ambience of a football rattle every time you freewheel. This could be a wonderful plus if you like frightening small children and giving old people heart attacks.

Kim · « **Reply #20 on:** 01 August, 2011, 01:50:48 pm »

Isn't that what lowracers are all about?

Biggsy · « **Reply #21 on:** 01 August, 2011, 01:56:09 pm »

It's well worth getting a major-brand hub for a rear freehub-type hub. There are some awful cheapo no-name freehubs around, that fail in the first few hundred miles. One was supplied some years ago on my brother's Trek 820.

Tigerrr · « **Reply #22 on:** 01 August, 2011, 01:58:23 pm »

Ah - so the Hope has the high performance audible freewheel alert feature.
Very useful for letting the other guy know you are freewheeling easily as you pass. A salt rubbing feature.
I am tempted - but the total wheel price is something like £250 which is pretty steep.

Biggsy · « **Reply #23 on:** 01 August, 2011, 02:09:18 pm »

£250 is a lot indeed, but the wheel if it's good will last decades, albeit with the occasional replacement hub part and rim*. It will save the cost of having to buy another whole hub after a while, and will save the labour of lacing the spokes again.

* I know this sounds worryingly similar to the proverbial everlasting broom that needs a new head and a new handle every now and then - but a broom doesn't have a hub shell and spokes!

swscotland bentrider · « **Reply #24 on:** 01 August, 2011, 05:12:56 pm »

Last winter I treated my ICE B2 to a set of Hope Pro 2 hubs on Mavic XC717 rims / Scwalbe Kojak tyres. Nice lightish wheels that seem tough as well. Remember you save the weight of a bell. Just freewheel as you are approaching human obstacle and they jump for their lives!

Author Topic: Wheel woes on the challenge fujin SL (Read 5716 times)

Chris N