Hmmm. I was sort of hoping that using GPS was not going to be a geek fest. :(
So, I need to learn how to use bikehike, install and learn how to use mapsource, then I can do something. Surely there must be a more straightforward approach?
<daunted and put off by the complexity :( >
Just as a test I've created a 1 mile gpx test file using bikehike. I've loaded this down to my computer and then onto the memory card of my gps. Unfortunately the gps doesn't seem to be able to find this. Any ideas why please?The 60CSx can't read GPX files on the memory card. You need to load the route to its internal memory. You can use software like GPSBabel or MapSource to load the route. Or you can install the Garmin Communicator Plugin, then use the option in Bikehike to download directly to the GPS unit.
Hmmm. I was sort of hoping that using GPS was not going to be a geek fest. :(All the above posters have put forward excellent procedures, but like you suggest you are, I am technically challenged in GPS (as in so many other ways!)
So, I need to learn how to use bikehike, install and learn how to use mapsource, then I can do something. Surely there must be a more straightforward approach?
<daunted and put off by the complexity :( >
I'm sure there is, there is a much easier way with the Edge 605/705/800 series.
I'm sure there is, there is a much easier way with the Edge 605/705/800 series.
I've probably been told beofore, but like PB I'm a complete novice at this - so could you please expand on that comment for me? I have a 705. :)
Hmmm. I was sort of hoping that using GPS was not going to be a geek fest. :(
You may have already discovered that Routes are a series of marks between which the GPS unit navigates according to a path of its own choosing; if you set it to "Follow Road" it will (mostly) take a path which conforms to the mapping contained in the unit. I say "mostly" because it will occasionally decide to "avoid a Highway" ... etc etc
This is where Greenbank’s method might score, since it combines Track with “hidden” routing and s he says, you get the turn warnings as back -up to the Track. Although it does seem extra faffing to put in all the route viapoints.
Ooops. Sorry if I've misremembered but I was referring to the use of a Route set to transparent together with a Track, so you got a line to follow combined with prompts at relevant turns. Apologies if that wasn't your post somewhere; I've read so much of this stuff .....This is where Greenbank’s method might score, since it combines Track with “hidden” routing and s he says, you get the turn warnings as back -up to the Track. Although it does seem extra faffing to put in all the route viapoints.
Which method of mine?
The one I use for the Edge 705 (plot route in bikely using follow road) means I can generally plot a 200km Audax in under 10 minutes. I then download it once as a GPX track and then download exactly the same thing as a GPXX route.
If you mean the jwo-esque one routepoint per routesheet instruction method then, yes, that generally takes anything between half an hour and an hour for a 200km ride (rides like the Elenith and BCM 600 take roughly the same time to plot as they have about the same number of instructions as a typical local 200km ride for me despite being much longer).
Ooops. Sorry if I've misremembered but I was referring to the use of a Route set to transparent together with a Track, so you got a line to follow combined with prompts at relevant turns. Apologies if that wasn't your post somewhere; I've read so much of this stuff .....This is where Greenbank’s method might score, since it combines Track with “hidden” routing and s he says, you get the turn warnings as back -up to the Track. Although it does seem extra faffing to put in all the route viapoints.
Which method of mine?
The one I use for the Edge 705 (plot route in bikely using follow road) means I can generally plot a 200km Audax in under 10 minutes. I then download it once as a GPX track and then download exactly the same thing as a GPXX route.
If you mean the jwo-esque one routepoint per routesheet instruction method then, yes, that generally takes anything between half an hour and an hour for a 200km ride (rides like the Elenith and BCM 600 take roughly the same time to plot as they have about the same number of instructions as a typical local 200km ride for me despite being much longer).
Fair point, but I have always puzzled over the attraction of the "Off Road" option. Ultimately I bow to your greater knowledge here because I haven't really used it, other than briefly to discover I didn't like it. My (limited) experience is that I got a series of "as the crow flies" straight lines from one way/viapoint to the next. If the path is curvy this means the screen displays a series of forks where the Route line diverges from the roads on the map. It's a purely personal preference thing, but as I said above, I'm primarily a "map" person and I wasn't comfortable with the constant requirement to interpret whether I was looking at just a general direction pointer or an actual fork in two roads. My brain is too small to cope with much information descending at 20 mph at 3 a.m. - I just want things simple!You may have already discovered that Routes are a series of marks between which the GPS unit navigates according to a path of its own choosing; if you set it to "Follow Road" it will (mostly) take a path which conforms to the mapping contained in the unit. I say "mostly" because it will occasionally decide to "avoid a Highway" ... etc etc
I see this general comment rather often and I feel it gives the GPS and Routes generally something of a bad rep, by only telling half the story.
Yes all the above is true, "if you set it to Follow Road".
You don't say anything about how a GPS behaves if you don't set it to 'Follow Road'.
I would suggest that in this mode (confusingly described in the menus as 'Off Road') it behaves entirely predictably and does just what is wanted.
I can't help feeling that some people fall into the trap, early on, of configuring their GPS to 'use Follow Road' (or maybe, of foolishly ticking the 'Don't ask again' box). Unfortunately, once you've done this (and I can see why it seems the obvious thing to do), you are never again given an opportunity to opt for the far more usable and understandable Direct (aka Off Road) mode - so missing out on near-50% of the GPS's functionality for ever more.
Far, far better to set it to 'Prompted' in the menus. Nothing wrong with preferring Follow Road mode - but you need to be able to opt out at will. That is what 'Prompted' gives you.(http://www.aukadia.net/gps/follow-or-off-w.gif)
Ah, I see what you mean now. But if you don't put in the "one point per instruction" waypoints, is there a risk that the GPS unit will work out its own route and expose you to the "I can't use Highways so I've got to go miles out of the way to find a straight crossroads" scenario?
That on my Edge 705 takes 10 minutes to plot for a 200km Audax, but is relying on the GPS to give me the prompts based on its routing and its knowledge of the roads (sometimes it doesn't tell me about every junction which is why I need to have it on the map page to see the where the route and track go). The difference is that I'm not telling the GPS where to tell me what I want it to tell me, which is what you get with the other 'one routepoint per routesheet instruction' method.
The wiggly track is what you see; the route can be set to invisible so you don't get the "as the crow flies line", and the waypoint names give the instruction according to the naming convention at the routesheet points. It's more time consuming than just drawing a track, the benefits of the routesheet instructions coming with the track make it well worth the extra time for me.Yes I can imagine how that works on screen. It comes back to what I said earlier, that different methods suit different people. For me, the simplicity of the Track, uninterrupted by things popping up, seems to work OK, apart from as I said above, I could wish that the Track line was a bit more visible.
Ah, I see what you mean now. But if you don't put in the "one point per instruction" waypoints, is there a risk that the GPS unit will work out its own route and expose you to the "I can't use Highways so I've got to go miles out of the way to find a straight crossroads" scenario?
That on my Edge 705 takes 10 minutes to plot for a 200km Audax, but is relying on the GPS to give me the prompts based on its routing and its knowledge of the roads (sometimes it doesn't tell me about every junction which is why I need to have it on the map page to see the where the route and track go). The difference is that I'm not telling the GPS where to tell me what I want it to tell me, which is what you get with the other 'one routepoint per routesheet instruction' method.
OK, I geddit now. The bit I'd overlooked is that we're talking an Edge and you're using the .gpxx format. I'd never bothered with .gpxx before because I got around any issues with limits on the number of points per Route/Track by splitting my journeys into sections. I guess I ought to put in some more homework! This won't help Polar Bear though, because the Map60 CSx doesn't support .gpxx.But if you don't put in the "one point per instruction" waypoints, is there a risk that the GPS unit will work out its own route and expose you to the "I can't use Highways so I've got to go miles out of the way to find a straight crossroads" scenario?
No because the route you upload is made up of the same 3000+ points that the track is (this is what the GPXX format gets you with its extensions to normal GPX). Each point is 50m-100m from the previous one so there's no choices for the routing algorithm to take.
It won't like any off-road sections that you do, but that's why you look at the map page so that you can see where the track goes. But in normal operation you look at the map page and the GPS prompts you at most junctions with what to do, the 'Dist Next' field also displays the distance to the next expected turn according to the routing algorithm (not the distance to the next point in the route/track).
What's the best way to do this please? We would like to be able to plot a route on the computer, download it onto the GPS then select it for navigation purposes.bear in mind all of the other options talked about above. IMO the most simple is to use a track not a route. Frankly Frankie described it as following a like drawn on map. I used Google Maps to draw the line on Google Maps, pull it around until it goes where I want, then use GMap2GPS, well my own customised version to produce a track. The I save the track, open in it MapSource and load it to my GPS.
Please keep instructions simple :D :thumbsup:
Just as a test I've created a 1 mile gpx test file using bikehike. I've loaded this down to my computer and then onto the memory card of my gps. Unfortunately the gps doesn't seem to be able to find this. Any ideas why please?The 60CSx can't read GPX files on the memory card. You need to load the route to its internal memory. You can use software like GPSBabel or MapSource to load the route. Or you can install the Garmin Communicator Plugin, then use the option in Bikehike to download directly to the GPS unit.
PB there's a confusion here between Routes and Tracks.frankly frankie, I don't understand your quoted limit of 500 trackpoints on any single track.I recently rode the Man of Kent 200km using the organisers supplied gpx track that had 5019 trackpoints(that's what Mapsource or BaseCamp say it had).My Garmin 705 missed pop up directions at 2 junctions but otherwise gave complete turn by turn directions for the whole Audax.Also if you want to produce a route if you use BikeHike and ask for the output as a gpxx route file I thought any 50 or 100 viapoint,waypoint,coursepoint limit didn't apply.Everytime I think I understand gpx tracks and routes another obstacle appears!
In truth there's not a lot of difference but it helps to know that on your GPS a single Route can have:
250 points absolute max (or 50 max if you expect it to autoroute/follow road)
while a Track can have:
500 points max (which won't get you very far, about 30km at default settings
In practice, in the UK, Trackpoints are, on average, less than 300m apart.
Routepoints are, on average, 500m - 2km apart.
Routepoints for autorouting are, on average 5km+ apart.
No doubt FF will be along in a minute but in the meantime I think the answer may be that the .gpxx format does not suffer from the limit on trackpoints. If you use most other Garmin (non Edge) models and try to download into them a Track with more than 500 points, you'll get a "truncated track" message and the line will reach only until the 500th point!PB there's a confusion here between Routes and Tracks.frankly frankie, I don't understand your quoted limit of 500 trackpoints on any single track.I recently rode the Man of Kent 200km using the organisers supplied gpx track that had 5019 trackpoints(that's what Mapsource or BaseCamp say it had).My Garmin 705 missed pop up directions at 2 junctions but otherwise gave complete turn by turn directions for the whole Audax.Also if you want to produce a route if you use BikeHike and ask for the output as a gpxx route file I thought any 50 or 100 viapoint,waypoint,coursepoint limit didn't apply.Everytime I think I understand gpx tracks and routes another obstacle appears!
In truth there's not a lot of difference but it helps to know that on your GPS a single Route can have:
250 points absolute max (or 50 max if you expect it to autoroute/follow road)
while a Track can have:
500 points max (which won't get you very far, about 30km at default settings
In practice, in the UK, Trackpoints are, on average, less than 300m apart.
Routepoints are, on average, 500m - 2km apart.
Routepoints for autorouting are, on average 5km+ apart.
frankly frankie, I don't understand your quoted limit of 500 trackpoints on any single track.I recently rode the Man of Kent 200km using the organisers supplied gpx track that had 5019 trackpoints(that's what Mapsource or BaseCamp say it had).My Garmin 705
So, should I be saving my bikehike creations as routes or tracks then? Is there any benefit to either?
For the life of me I don't understand why it has to be so over-complicated.
Greenbank and frankly frankie,as I explained in a previous post I rode the man of Kent 200 with full pop up directionson my Garmin 705, from a gpx track with 5019 trackpoints.This was a gpx track,NOT a gpxx route or gpxx track!There must be quite a high limit on trackpoints when producing a gpx track on a 705.frankly frankie, I don't understand your quoted limit of 500 trackpoints on any single track.I recently rode the Man of Kent 200km using the organisers supplied gpx track that had 5019 trackpoints(that's what Mapsource or BaseCamp say it had).My Garmin 705
Because the Garmin 705 doesn't have the 500 trackpoint limitation when using gpxx file
Greenbank and frankly frankie,as I explained in a previous post I rode the man of Kent 200 with full pop up directionson my Garmin 705, from a gpx track with 5019 trackpoints.This was a gpx track,NOT a gpxx route or gpxx track!There must be quite a high limit on trackpoints when producing a gpx track on a 705.
Greenbank,if BikeHike etc can produce a track with thousands of trackpoints that also produces pop up directions in a Garmin705,what is the point of producing a gpxx route too?
Greenbank,one last point,a gpxx route seems to work in a 705 and BikeHike if you upload it to BikeHike but produces a straight line between start and finish in Mapsource.
Greenbank,you get full pop up directions displayed on a Garmin 705 from a gpx track produced in BikeHike or Bikely such as "Right on Station Road",Left on Lodge Lane","Right on A272","Left on Batts Bridge Roundabout"(all from Invicta 300km gpx track)plus the schematic diagram of the junction previewed 100m before the approaching junction or turn and then repeated at junction or turn with bleeing to wake you up in both cases.
I had assumed that you needed to put in a GPXX route to perform turn by turn instructions (with road names) rather than the annoying constant "North in 60m" that I got when I tried it Navigating against a GPX track.
When you say 'pop up directions' what kind of directions do you get and how often? Are they just general direction arrows or does it include road names/numbers (i.e. "3rd exit roundabout onto B466
Greenbank,you get full pop up directions displayed on a Garmin 705 from a gpx trackAfter selecting the" Navigate" option on the Garmin 705.
After selecting the" Navigate" option on the Garmin 705.Another wierd feature of the Garmin 705 gpx track is that it has a chain like appearance similar to the presentation of tracks in Mapsource if you just display the track on 705 without pressing "Navigate"As soon as you do press "Navigate"the track becomes pink line overlaying the roads that have been chosen by the 705.Once more Garmin products seem to behave in different ways in software and hardware,given the same information!