Seatbags or alternatives

[henshaw11]

In a - possibly vain - attempt to lighten the Speedmachine (yes, I know one answer is to ride summat else) I'm thinking of ditching the rack and possibly even the mudguards for this summer.

Hopefully :
a) it'll save mebbe a few lbs in weight
b) it'll force me to carry less (see a))
c) I might even get a few roadie mates back for being 'guardless

Arguably it may look a little tidier too, but given that I fit at least of of the 'typical' 'bent criteria (ie beardie), I'm not sure I should worry...probably the roadie trying to get out

Alternatives:
Radical Aero Wide - mebbe  a bit big for what I want, and I could be tempted to overpack - but on the plus side, carrying the same as I do at the moment I'm still ditching the rack. But bloody expensive IMO.

Hpvelo Microbag - only a litre, might struggle to get a stupidly large smartphone+20"/26" tubes+ leatherman in there. Quickpro minipump will probably stash somewhere else. Can't find any decent pictures of them, or at least, stuffed with..err..stuff. Can't tell if there's a light loop either.

Some sort of bumbag - pref waterproof, with a light loop, tho' I have a red fiberflare I was intending to seat-mount somehow so mebbe that's less of an issue. One problem seems to be the amount of hip padding/clasp doesn't lend itself to wrapping the belt under the seat pad. Could wrap the belt back around on the bag (as I do with a Northface bumbag when I'm using the shoulder strap) and use a separate webbing strap, but the belt will just pick up any road muck and water.

Ortlieb do something that looks almost apart from a bulky (?) belt:
http://www.ortlieb.co.uk/shoulder-travel/hippack-2.html

Plus
http://www.inov-8.com/New/Global/Product-View-RaceElite-3-5-Black-Red-SS14.html?L=26
(and the central bottled section would get most of the back wheel junk)

This looks like it ought to be pretty waterproof  - looks like the main belt is removable too, so it *could* be strapped under a 'bent seatpad with separate webbing:
http://www.over-board.co.uk/waterproof-waist-pack-yellow.html
(and there's a more swanky looking carbon version, tho' it loses an external pocket)

Camelbak or similar clone ? - depends on the straps, I've already got both a small and large 'unbottle', but there's no real room for anything else, unless I stitched/fastened something else to it.

Answers, postcard, etc...

[Kim]

On the basis that the only sane way to lose weight from a HPVelotechnik cycle is to buy something else, I'd concentrate on improving the aerodynamics.  Therefore: Tailbox?

[henshaw11]

Ta, but given that my sociable riding's down here in the Surrey Hills, with the small club recently started at my gym, a tailbox would probably make matters worse on climbs, although it would save a bit of energy on the flats/shallower stuff.

On a lot of the climbs I can keep up - or thereabouts  - with the majority in the club, but it takes it's toll on longer rides - even just losing a few lbs at not much cost/effort would probably be helpful. Looks like the mudguards and rack probably add about 4 1/2 lbs (plus it'd ditch the rack light) :
http://www.bentrideronline.com/archives/reviews/speedmachine.htm
http://stevebriggs.netfirms.com/rcn/RCN_094.pdf

I haven't completely dismissed the idea of something lighter, but I'd still probably want to use the SPM for sunday rides (ie as training), and keep the lighter thing for club excursions on sportives (I know, the overpriced S-word..).

Edit - ooh, that's handy, the Over-board bunch are actually in Thorpe, round the corner from our office ...just a shame we got flooed out and are temporarily over near Reading

[Kim]

Ta, but given that my sociable riding's down here in the Surrey Hills, with the small club recently started at my gym, a tailbox would probably make matters worse on climbs, although it would save a bit of energy on the flats/shallower stuff.

On a lot of the climbs I can keep up - or thereabouts  - with the majority in the club, but it takes it's toll on longer rides - even just losing a few lbs at not much cost/effort would probably be helpful.

Ah, it really is about weight then.  And biomechanics.

TBH, I think the way to keep pace with DF bike riders on lumpy terrain is either to work harder than they do, or ride a DF bike.  Unless you can persuade them to ride at your pace, or play leapfrog the whole time (which is hardly sociable).

2kg is in the noise for me.  I wouldn't expect it to make a difference in climbing performance.  On the other hand, unbolting what you already have is free...

[swscotland bentrider]

I've not tried this but the idea popped into my head while reading this thread. Ortlieb do a system for attaching external pockets (in two sizes) or a bottle cage to their panniers. I've fitted this system on my Ortliebs and very good it is too. It occurred to me that you might be able to fix it to a seat back and then be able to use a pannier pocket as a seat pack?

[henshaw11]

I think the way to keep pace with DF bike riders on lumpy terrain is either to work harder than they do,

Tick

or ride a DF bike.

Necks issues *may* prevent this from being a real alternative, but when the local (Sigma) Spesh Concept shop has some Roubaix in their test fleet, I'm gonna give one a try. I've yet to take the slick-shod mtb out on a sunday ride, which could be interesting..

Unless you can persuade them to ride at your pace, or play leapfrog the whole time (which is hardly sociable).

Don't really need to do the former, there's a wide-ish range of ability - tho' this weekend we actually had a slow and fast group. Towards the end I was suffering a bit in the fast group, but mainly 'cos some family circumstances - and being flooded out of the office - have meant the last month or two has been a write-off
Plus it's not yer usual chain-gang* ride - people are getting a bit more organised, but without the usual CC expectations they're used to me dropping out and gaining ground downhill into some climbs..tho' annoyingly I often get stuck behind someone into the wigglier descents. Oh well...

*Note to the one of the (novice ?) Kingston Wheelers group out on sunday, in the unlikely event anyone reads this. If a recumbent passes you near at the top of an incline 'cos you've all fucked up your gearchanges and stood up and *still* gone backwards, don't blooding well overtake at 1 or 2 mph difference and box-in said recumbent on the downside of the hill. You *will* be deemed a bunch of annoying twats. I eventually pulled out and was still up the next longer drag before them...

2kg is in the noise for me.  I wouldn't expect it to make a difference in climbing performance.  On the other hand, unbolting what you already have is free...

I like free - I've actually got an airshock bought in a CRC sale some years ago to fit, but that was on the basis that the cheap oem thing would eventually need replacing.

I've not tried this but the idea popped into my head while reading this thread. Ortlieb do a system for attaching external pockets (in two sizes) or a bottle cage to their panniers. I've fitted this system on my Ortliebs and very good it is too. It occurred to me that you might be able to fix it to a seat back and then be able to use a pannier pocket as a seat pack?

Ta, I'll have a look for that

[Kim]

That's not a bad idea.

I think in this situation I'd be getting the sewing kit out and making some sort of pouch that could hang over the top of the seat as an attachment for, well, whatever.  Ortlieb pockets might be a nice easy cheat.

[teamonster]

I've got a pair of these, http://smokymtnsaddlebags.com/7-recumbentbag/ but you have to go pretty minimal with kit - will hold phone, keys ,wallet etc. But beware customs duty and post office handling charge this end. Find a friend in the States to ship to, and get them to post on !

[PhilO]

I recently bought a little rucksack from Decathlon, with the intention of converting it to hang on the seat of my Optima. I haven't got around to doint the sewing yet, but it looks promising holding it up to the seat. When (if) I get round to it I'll report back.

[Kim]

Another thought:  Have you considered something like the Radical frame pouch?

[henshaw11]

Thanks all..
smokeymtn things look a bit like the size of the Microbag perhaps..hmm, hadn't spotted that Radical pouch, looks a decent size without being excessive - I've actually lobbed a battery pack under the boom before now, but it's unlikely I'd want the two to coexist. Had vaguely wondered about a small rucsac, kinda depends on how much stitching I'd need to do.

Another thing I spotted was actually an Ortlieb Camera case - it's got a few loops - and a harness - that might lend itself to seat mounting.

Oh, I weighed my rackpack last night..8lbs

Was a bit puzzled 'til I realised my u-lock, which I normally leave out on a sunday ride, was still in there 
On the flipside, leatherman+2 tubes + repair kit+levers just peeks over 2lbs..again, not a huge saving but worth having.

[henshaw11]

On the basis that the only sane way to lose weight from a HPVelotechnik cycle is to buy something else, I'd concentrate on improving the aerodynamics.  Therefore: Tailbox?

I'd kinda forgotten about this - 12.3kg speedmachine c/o airshock, some lighter bits, and in particular a novosport seat (and no sidestand). A far bit of weight saving over standard (tho' arguably the cash would probably be better put towards a Fujin SL..)
http://www.velomobilforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/speedmachine-light.18872/
(or on traumvelo.de un der hpvelo..)

Picked up an overboard waist pack after all. In carbon, of course - plus it'll be easier to wipe clean, t'others with a zip have a more textured surface. 20"+26" tubes, leatherman, puncture kit, chain breaker, pump fit quite nicely, probably got room for a flapjack or racecape at a push. Now just need to get some webbing straps to secure it to the seat. Also the straps to the drybag-style rolltop are just the right width to hang my red fiberflare from

[PhilO]

I recently bought a little rucksack from Decathlon, with the intention of converting it to hang on the seat of my Optima. I haven't got around to doint the sewing yet, but it looks promising holding it up to the seat. When (if) I get round to it I'll report back.

Finally got around to doing this. Managed it with minimal sewing, just cutting the lower half of one shoulder strap off, plus the ladderlock buckles on the upper straps:
.
.
.

Er... direct linking of the picture doesn't seem to be working, do here are links to the pictures on Google Drive:

Pic 1

Pic 2

Pic 3

Hopefully I've set the permissions correctly. Shout up if you can't see them...

[Kim]

Totally rocking the German schoolkid look 

[Cunobelin]

The answer is "Drillium"


This a Drillium Catrike frame:

[cycleman]

one bump and a folding catrike   

[Tigerrr]

the speedmachine is in my opinion simply too heavy to go far and fast on terrain that has lumps. It is excellent for town, or even OK on the track, but after a few hours its weight starts to empty ones legs and the hills seem to get steeper and steeper. I couldnt keep up with the cycle club on it towards the end of the sunday run. That was a stripped down speedmachine too. Mr Larringtons famous PBP experience shows where the speedmachine route ends.
The answer is indeed a lighter steed. The move to a fujin SL2 completely changed the picture for and the cycle club couldnt keep up with me, although I dropped back on slower hills. My flat speeds over distance rose hugely, along with my condition post ride. With a luggage box on another 2 mph was added and had i been fitter I could have been seriously fast, however far.
I doubt you can turn the heavyweight into a lightweight.

[henshaw11]

I take it that was monsieur le maire ?

TBH I quite agree- that's pretty much my experience with it - I'm not far behind on all but the steeper climbs but it takes it's toll towards the end, so it's more of a lard limitation exercise..I've taken the rack off which was disappointingly light ! (Must post a piccie of the little pack I bought - it's a bit of a botch onto the seat but it's actually quite rattle-free and I just need a little stitching at a few spots on a trap to make it more presentable..)

I was thinking about looking around for a Fujin SL2* to try (a pity that Laid-back had their demo nicked last year), so I guess I'll be talking to Darth Stuart in the near future. I've got to drop the SPM in at bikefix soonish to replace the USS steerer bearings, anyway. Tho mebbe I'll collar him at Hillingdon on sunday, if he's there - I've not been to a bhpc event yet, so looking forward to that (I think).

*That said, I *did* like the look of Arallsopps Furai SL when I saw it, not to mention it being USS and slightly more upright, but I guess if I'm gonna go light/roadie-chasing mebbe the Fujin SL2 is a better bet, if a little more extreme.

Oh, meant to ask - some posts elsewhere (BROL) seemed to suggested the Fujin SL2 was a bit flexy - or is that more a matter of large 'Merkins riding them.. ?

[frankenthorn]

I've taken the rack off which was disappointingly light !

Hollow pin chain might save a noticeable amount (that's noticeable on the scales, if not real life) due to the sheer quantity of chain on your average RWD recumbent!  The other obvious mod (though it has potential resale issues) would be cut the boom down as much as you can.  (Possibly including the derailleur post too if there's any "extra" showing above the front derailleur?)  And the airshock is supposed to be 228g lighter than the standard HPV shock.  For those with extra £'s, does anyone know if the carbon boom can be fitted to the Speedmachine?  (Though that will apparently only drop 170g.)

Though as other's have noticed, there's really not all that much you can do to lighten the average HPV product!

Oh, meant to ask - some posts elsewhere (BROL) seemed to suggested the Fujin SL2 was a bit flexy - or is that more a matter of large 'Merkins riding them.. ?

IMHO unless you need (or at least want!) the extra absence of weight then an SL1 might be better value for money?

[Kim]

Oh, meant to ask - some posts elsewhere (BROL) seemed to suggested the Fujin SL2 was a bit flexy - or is that more a matter of large 'Merkins riding them.. ?

IMHO unless you need (or at least want!) the extra absence of weight then an SL1 might be better value for money?

I think they're both unobtainium at the moment, anyway.  Otherwise I'd be in the queue for an SL1 (gotta have that disc brake).

[henshaw11]

Oh, meant to ask - some posts elsewhere (BROL) seemed to suggested the Fujin SL2 was a bit flexy - or is that more a matter of large 'Merkins riding them.. ?

IMHO unless you need (or at least want!) the extra absence of weight then an SL1 might be better value for money?

I think they're both unobtainium at the moment, anyway.  Otherwise I'd be in the queue for an SL1 (gotta have that disc brake).

Not exactly - I mailed Elan back in Jan:
https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=78565.0

- basically you downgrade an SL2, the disc fork's an option anyway, as I think the boom and seat are.

[arallsopp]

I've taken the rack off which was disappointingly light

Sorry, just seen this topic. Yep. I took mine off the SMGTe when I was feeling similarly challenged, and found it weighs absolutely bugger all. Needless to say, its back on now.

A lightweight chain will go a long way towards SL territory, but really you're on the edge of what PanzerFahrrad* can do. My Furai is about 8kg lighter than the SMGTe when both are set up for touring / commuter detail.

I'm a fan of the CRC sale sponsored weighty waity game. Kit comes up that I might want one day at a price I can't resist, and I buy it. Amazing how much weight you can shed using nice pedals, a decent crankset, and a super light chain.


*TM BentMikey.