Author Topic: Ashes 2013-14  (Read 17864 times)

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #50 on: 25 November, 2013, 12:39:53 pm »
I think it a great shame that MH issues, especially in sports people, still have to be skirted round with 'words in scare quotes'.
I wish Jonathan Trott all the very best and hope that he can overcome his problems and return to the game at some point.

Well to be fair the BBC didn't put the description in quotes, and I was directly quoting the BBC article.  If the clinical diagnosis (if there is one) hasn't been made public, the media catch all terms are understandable - perhaps.
Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #51 on: 25 November, 2013, 02:01:17 pm »
I think it a great shame that MH issues, especially in sports people, still have to be skirted round with 'words in scare quotes'.
I wish Jonathan Trott all the very best and hope that he can overcome his problems and return to the game at some point.

Well to be fair the BBC didn't put the description in quotes, and I was directly quoting the BBC article.  If the clinical diagnosis (if there is one) hasn't been made public, the media catch all terms are understandable - perhaps.

Oh, I wasn't having a pop at you, Andy. I didn't read the bbc article but I saw others where scare quotes were around the phrase - which, certainly in the case of Marcus Trescothick, didn't help. If there's no diagnosis I think they'd be better off with just "unwell".
At least the PTB appear to have shipped Trott straight out, hopefully to avoid being plagued by press hyenas on departure and arrival.
Again I wish him well.
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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #52 on: 25 November, 2013, 09:09:49 pm »
Well, what an interesting development this is.
And it's good news for England. And good news for Trott too. IMO.

Anybody listening to the commentary throughout the first test would have noticed how much the TMS commentators were talking about Trott. It was pretty obvious they could see straight away there was something going on. And it's been building for a while too.

And the Aussies picked it up. There were onto it like a flash. Blimey, they know how good he is. He's hardly a novice against Australia is he? They could see straight away the problems he was having, and they came right out with it, no messing around, just like Aussies do. And they were spot on. And it's fair game. Do they ahve knowledge of his MH issues?I really doubt it. All they see is a guy putting himslef forward in one of the most hostyile, comp[etitive sporting environments you could imagine. Trott's team mates probably knew, the Aussies knew and finally Trott has nowhere to go, but to admit it to himself. The game's up. Whatever he has going on right now, has obviously started to really encroach more into his concentration and that's a nightmare scenario if you're in that kind of colosseum environment. I wonder had the Aussies not started on him whether he would have been tempted to carry on, hoping it would all sort itself out. Paradoxically they've probably done England a favour.

Trott's a very kind of nervous, obsessive, compulsive kind of character with all the rituals he has to go through before he can face the next ball. It's fine when he can hold it all together, but when things fall apart, heaven knows what he's trying to hold together. And as much as I have empathy for anybody with HM issues [god knows I've had a few myself], the last place you want to be in batting at No3 against Australia in an ashes series. Like, for goodness sake, get the f*** out of there.
And thankfully he has.

And if anybody thinks the level of sledging is any worse than it ever has been, sorry, I just don't believe it. Think Lilly and Thompson? Can you imagine what that was like batting with those two animals bearing down on you? And if you think the English players don't reciprocate then well, I just don't buy it. The difference is these days we have stump mics. We get it all. Years ago we heard nothing.

This is good news for both England and Trott. For Trott he gets to exhale a huge sigh of relief and go curl up a corner somewhere and lick himself better, and England get the chance to regroup with a different team and come once more.

Strangely enough I'm more optimistic than I was yesterday.
Garry Broad

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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #53 on: 26 November, 2013, 12:02:39 am »
Ah, mental health eh?

Box it up in a crate and send it home. Job done.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #54 on: 26 November, 2013, 12:14:47 am »
I'm with you on that, JD.  I think poor Jonathan Trott's troubles are far from over, especially as he now has the stick of public "failure" to beat himself with.  He will know there is lots of sympathy for him but I doubt if that will help immediately.  I really do hope he will be ok. 

As for all the talk about the "normal" level of sledging from both sides, I've no doubt that that is true, although the stump mike doesn't appear to have picked up much from England, does it?  Whatever, if you remove sledging from both sides, what is left ?  Cricket, which is why they are there in the first place.  I think it's all colossally childish and weak and I wish the authorities would stamp it out.  If people want to fight, put them in a sack - otherwise just play cricket.  As for big man Warner - how could you hit a slight bloke like Joe Root and him not go down; bit humiliating really, don't you think?!

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #55 on: 26 November, 2013, 12:24:24 am »
Ah, mental health eh?

Box it up in a crate and send it home. Job done.

Well, they would be your words and your analogy, but given how far he is from home, do you have any other practical suggestions that would be more helpful to him right now?
Garry Broad

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #56 on: 26 November, 2013, 12:45:39 am »
As for big man Warner - how could you hit a slight bloke like Joe Root and him not go down; bit humiliating really, don't you think?!

Two wrongs don't make a right, but when it comes to punching opposition players in bars, the English have form too.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/491219.html

But I agree with you, I don't like any of the nasty sledging at all, regardless of where it comes from, and would be happy to see it stamped out, but in this game England lost not because of any kind of under hand tactics, they were just comprehensively beaten, fair and square. Ironically, considering the build up to the game, Broad has come out of the whole experience pretty much unscathed as far as I can see.
Garry Broad

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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #57 on: 26 November, 2013, 06:35:34 am »
Ah, mental health eh?

Box it up in a crate and send it home. Job done.

Well, they would be your words and your analogy, but given how far he is from home, do you have any other practical suggestions that would be more helpful to him right now?
Yes, I think JD is being a bit harsh and probably jumping to some conclusions there.

...
Just heard that Flower knew about JT's issues since 2009. I imagine they've worked with him a lot - given other recent Test players' experiences - and that taking him on this tour was not a decision they rushed into.
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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #58 on: 26 November, 2013, 08:10:58 am »
Just heard that Flower knew about JT's issues since 2009. I imagine they've worked with him a lot - given other recent Test players' experiences - and that taking him on this tour was not a decision they rushed into.

Exactly.

The resignatory tone and body language shown by Andy Flowers in the press conference yesterday says it all. He wasn't giving the signs of a man who was surprised by the turn of events. More saddened than anything else. Of course they knew. And it's to JT's integrity that he allowed them to know in the first place. 

Things have changed a bit these days. Not for everybody in employment, but for some.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cricket/the-ashes-england-have-backroom-bases-covered-8740885.html
Garry Broad

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #59 on: 26 November, 2013, 10:17:37 am »
As for big man Warner - how could you hit a slight bloke like Joe Root and him not go down; bit humiliating really, don't you think?!

Two wrongs don't make a right, but when it comes to punching opposition players in bars, the English have form too.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/491219.html

But I agree with you, I don't like any of the nasty sledging at all, regardless of where it comes from, and would be happy to see it stamped out, but in this game England lost not because of any kind of under hand tactics, they were just comprehensively beaten, fair and square. Ironically, considering the build up to the game, Broad has come out of the whole experience pretty much unscathed as far as I can see.

Agree with all this, Gerry.  I wasn't really having a go - just a bit of mild sledging; I'm off to stamp it out right now!

Definitely agree that we were thrashed comprehensively (which emphasises how unnecessary sledging is!).

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #60 on: 26 November, 2013, 09:53:06 pm »
I wasn't really having a go - just a bit of mild sledging; I'm off to stamp it out right now!

Hey, no problem. Don't be too hasty to stamp out the mild sledging - you might need it later on in the series :)

See everybody in Adelaide
Can't wait.
Garry Broad

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #61 on: 26 November, 2013, 11:39:20 pm »
 :)  - and don't call me Gerry!

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #62 on: 02 December, 2013, 09:14:46 am »
so Bresnan complete with iffy back gets the call plus a bit of a shuffle with the batting order, I think I would like to see Bell come in at number 3 just to see how he gets on, give him the opportunity to really make his mark on the team. Anyhow it all kicks off again on Thursday.
 

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #63 on: 02 December, 2013, 01:44:48 pm »
Lets hope the England batsmen have been in the nets, getting some extra short ball practice...
Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #64 on: 02 December, 2013, 05:18:04 pm »
They didn't do too well at Alice Springs, at least Monty got to turn his arm over :) 

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #65 on: 05 December, 2013, 07:44:26 am »
Dropped CLM... :-\

Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #66 on: 05 December, 2013, 11:29:45 am »
If 'catches win matches' then I am afraid England just missed their chance(s).

Three drops in the day of varying difficulty; Root's was apparently one that you would be very proud to have held, Monty should have taken his in the follow through and Carberry will be wishing the ground would open up and swallow him.

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #67 on: 05 December, 2013, 01:29:15 pm »
If 'catches win matches' then I am afraid England just missed their chance(s).

Three drops in the day of varying difficulty; Root's was apparently one that you would be very proud to have held, Monty should have taken his in the follow through and Carberry will be wishing the ground would open up and swallow him.

Yes - I guess it's one of those things that most players have to go through at some point.
Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #68 on: 05 December, 2013, 02:59:43 pm »
Catches can win matches, but dropped catches are often soon forgotten. That'll certainly be the case when if England blast out Australia in the first session tomorrow...
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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #69 on: 06 December, 2013, 12:29:56 am »
I have a feeling that England are going to be up against it again in this test.  Anyway, next update in 6-7hrs time...
Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson

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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #70 on: 06 December, 2013, 07:37:55 am »
You were right.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #71 on: 06 December, 2013, 08:51:12 am »
Well, if you're in the driving seat like the Aussies are, that was a very good toss to win on a pitch like that.
Certainly makes things very difficult for England. They need to dig in and steady the ship if they can.
Batting for two days would be useful!
Garry Broad

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #72 on: 06 December, 2013, 08:51:45 am »
I watched the high lights on TV last night and thought not too bad, Monty had a wicket and was unfortunate not to have two, Broad did well again and Swan took a lovely catch at full stretch. I thought I could go to bed safe in the knowledge that not much could go wrong, oh how wrong was I.
All I can say at the moment  is Oh Dear, I couldn't even listen to all of the high lights on radio 5. :facepalm:
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Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #73 on: 06 December, 2013, 11:33:43 am »
so dropping Clarke cost 130 runs, Haddin cost 113. The pair at the crease rather owe the side a few runs, and need to put some miles in the Aussie bowlers.

Re: Ashes 2013-14
« Reply #74 on: 06 December, 2013, 01:52:00 pm »
Even 371 to avoid the follow-on looks like a bit of a distant hope atm...
Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson