Author Topic: SPD pedals with reflectors...  (Read 3581 times)

SPD pedals with reflectors...
« on: October 29, 2018, 08:05:54 am »
I'm aware of Shimano Click'R, which seem to be the only Shimano SPD reflector pedal on Chain Wiggle, but what are the other options?  Is there anything else that approaches the ease of use of double sided Shimano m520s?
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2018, 08:52:23 am »
PD-M324 has reflector mountings like any other cage-type pedal. Although single sided, the pedal usually hangs to the correct attitude to clip in, provided the bearings are in good shape.  There are several models of click'r with reflectors built in.

All SPD pedals have some form of reflector attachment; however most of them are flimsy, expensive nonsense. Here are a few

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/ev/EV-PD-M520-2235.pdf

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/ev/EV-PD-M545-1752B.pdf

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/ev/EV-PD-A520-2422.pdf

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/ev/EV-PD-A530-2743A.pdf

PD-M324 reflectors are not immune to damage either but they are at least easily replaced with standard ones, available in any LBS.

cheers

vorsprung

  • Opposites Attract
    • Audaxing
Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2018, 09:50:46 am »
Audaxing Blog follow @vorsprungbike on

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2018, 10:35:01 am »
I have these on one bike (maybe an earlier version)
I use those too (T-780, replaced by T-8000).
I don't have any more problem with clipping in than I did with M530 or similar (about 75% success rate starting off on 20%, where you've got to be properly clipped in before the pedal reached the bottom for the first time).

You've got to move the foot forwards a little during the clip in action rather than just stomping down, but it's easy enough to get used to.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2018, 12:27:39 pm »
I use SM-PD22 on all my double sided SPDs. Never had any issues in thousands of kms... I don’t bother taking them off anymore.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2018, 01:01:57 pm »
Using these on my SPD shod road bikes, only downside is it makes them single sided, so the ones that give one side a platform may make more sense for some.
http://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/131856590782-0-1/s-l1000.jpg



Newer SPD-SL pedals take these
https://www.bike-discount.de/media/org/orgb_S/orgid_27/thumbs/31343_1796586.jpg
Which I've found to be decent, and since the pedals are single sided already doesn't really create an inconvenience

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2018, 04:35:55 pm »
Thanks all.

T8000 look good...

Using these on my SPD shod road bikes, only downside is it makes them single sided, so the ones that give one side a platform may make more sense for some.
http://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/131856590782-0-1/s-l1000.jpg
...

When unclipped does the SPD side default to up position with these (in link)? 
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2018, 06:02:12 pm »
There is no ideal solution - Click'R have a low release tension, M324 have unserviceable bearings* and the add-on reflectors make double-sided pedals single-sided.  Ride a pre-1985 bike at night, that neatly sidesteps the problem.

*unless you spend more on the special tool than on the pedals
And Darkness and Decay and the Coronavirus held illimitable dominion over all.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2018, 06:05:47 pm »
Put some Scotchlite on the crank arms for visibility and work on the principle that in the extremely unlikely event of being prosecuted for lack of pedal reflectors, you'll become a cycling legend.

(I have the cheesy clip-in platforms on one of my bikes, historically to make a set of pedals where one side had a b0rked mechanism usable, but I find them useful enough that I've kept them.)
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2018, 07:10:27 pm »
Click'R have a low release tension

I've never had my Click'R unclip when I didn't want to, this is based on hundreds of commutes, a couple of fixed Audaxes and even the Mersey Roads 24h TT (on fixed too and it did involve a few climbs).
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2018, 07:18:23 pm »
Thanks all.

T8000 look good...

Using these on my SPD shod road bikes, only downside is it makes them single sided, so the ones that give one side a platform may make more sense for some.
http://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/131856590782-0-1/s-l1000.jpg
...

When unclipped does the SPD side default to up position with these (in link)?

Can't properly remember, the bikes with them have been rather neglected of late.

Had a look at the bikes,
The SPD-M525 style (metal cage as part of pedal body) seem to rotate over from reflector up so the free clip plate is at the top.
The SPD-M520 style (no cage) arent rotating from reflector up but are from anywhere off centre, and very slowly

The M520 style pedals have had a harder life though so I'd put that largely down to wear, tear and being abused with road grit.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2018, 08:10:46 pm »
Thanks again all - useful.
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2018, 08:17:22 pm »
There is no ideal solution - Click'R have a low release tension, M324 have unserviceable bearings* and the add-on reflectors make double-sided pedals single-sided.  Ride a pre-1985 bike at night, that neatly sidesteps the problem.

*unless you spend more on the special tool than on the pedals

re the low tension of click'r pedals; if you use the lower range of normal SPD tension then there is no problem; it is within the same range as click'r pedals



Re the special tool for PD-M324 that is a good point. The tool is needed for several other SPD models too including PD-M323, PD-M505, PD-M535, PD-M636.

  However plenty of folk use these pedals for years and don't need it at all. I have seen the tool on sale for less than £20. I made my own tool.

BTW I have a method of adding yellow reflexite to double-sided SPD pedals that keeps them double sided and doesn't interfere with the release action.

cheers

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2018, 08:52:23 pm »
Confusingly, there are two special tools you'll see for sale: TL-PD33 and TL-PD63 (apparently there is a TL-PD73 but I've never seen it).  The one for M324 pedals is the PD33 version and typically more expensive  :-\

To be fair, the better "axle cartridge" type also needs slightly weird spanners for adjustment.  You need a 7mm and a thin 10mm.  Some Cyclo cone spanners have a 10mm hex cutout which is perfect, but 7mm is a nonstandard size - Japanese, especially, try to keep to even sizes - and you may need to buy it specially, or use an adjustable spanner.
And Darkness and Decay and the Coronavirus held illimitable dominion over all.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2018, 09:30:27 pm »
AFAICT the tools are the following sizes;

Quote
TL-PD33:Big end;13mm/10mm concentric sockets, 17mm outer body
Small end;10mm/7mm concentric sockets, 17mm outer body,17mm spanner to hold outer

TL-PD73;Big end;11mm/8mm concentric sockets,15mm outer body
Small end;10mm/7mm concentric sockets,13.5mm outer body,15mm spanner to hold outer

Also TL-PD63 has a 7/8mm inner locknut tool and a 10/11mm outer cone tool.

but I forget which sizes you need for which pedals; I made tools for each of them and use them as needs be.

Most decent 1/4" drive socket sets contain a 7mm socket; this is the least of your worries...

cheers

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2018, 09:31:12 pm »
Another T780 user here and very happy with them.

One pair on my town bike and the other on the recumbent, yes I know, no point in having pedal refelectors on the bent but hay-ho.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2018, 08:23:43 pm »
Another T780 user here and very happy with them.

One pair on my town bike and the other on the recumbent, yes I know, no point in having pedal refelectors on the bent but hay-ho.

I have these. Great pedals and usually are in the correct orientation for clipping in. But they are Allen key only and mine have fused into the cranks. I’d not buy a pedal now without a flat section to take a spanner.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #17 on: October 31, 2018, 10:03:06 pm »
There is no ideal solution - Click'R have a low release tension, M324 have unserviceable bearings* and the add-on reflectors make double-sided pedals single-sided.  Ride a pre-1985 bike at night, that neatly sidesteps the problem.

*unless you spend more on the special tool than on the pedals

Even if you do fork out for the special tool (I have 3 sets of pedals, so it's worth it). They are a right pain in the arse to service. Getting the right tension on the bearings can easily take an evening of fettling.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #18 on: October 31, 2018, 11:18:39 pm »
there is a quick way to get close to the correct setting, but it is not 100% accurate or consistent, because it relies on the clearance between the cone and the screw thread it sits on.

You just screw the cone in as far as it will go, and then back it off about 1/5 of a turn. Nip the locknut up and then test the bearing for binding/free play. A little trial and error is called for. Ideally you want to approach the correct setting from a position of a little free play. A final small adjustment that eliminates the free play is ideal. If you get the adjustment within three degrees of 'perfect' then you have achieved a tolerance in the range of single figures of microns, i.e. one that is better than most cartridge  bearings (once they are installed).

IME shimano SPD pedal bearings are tiny, almost fragile looking, but they are, if they are kept adjusted and lubricated correctly, extremely long lived.

It is especially important to keep them correctly adjusted; it is obvious that too tight is bad but too loose will accelerate wear greatly; the small balls only work properly if they share the load, and if there is slack in the bearings, they don't do that any more.

cheers

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #19 on: November 01, 2018, 06:39:01 am »
It may have been M323 rather than M324, but a set of pedals I had in this design also had a rubber washer/seal at the the crank end of the spindle.  This perished in less than two years, reinforcing my impression that these were not worth servicing.
And Darkness and Decay and the Coronavirus held illimitable dominion over all.

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #20 on: November 01, 2018, 08:18:24 am »
the seal is the same pn for both PD-M324 and PD-M323 pedals and costs less than £2.  In the meantime, you can use all kinds of things to replace/supplement the seals, for example

- a length of heat shrink insulation over a cracked seal will last reasonably well
- an industrial bearing seal (eg from simply bearings) will also work

but the simplest (and cheapest/easiest) option is to use a couple of 'o' rings on the pedal spindle. Fit two on each spindle; one contacts the end of the pedal body and the other sits on a slightly more tapered part of the axle and gently pushes against the first.

 The seals are far away from the bearings themselves, so with plenty of grease in/near the bearings water won't easily penetrate the mechanism.

'Not worth servicing' is a rather pejorative description. I don't think it applies to any pedals TBH; they all work better and last longer if correctly lubricated and adjusted. By the same logic you presumably wouldn't bother to remove a stone from inside your shoe....?

cheers

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #21 on: November 01, 2018, 09:58:04 am »
Click'R have a low release tension

I've never had my Click'R unclip when I didn't want to, this is based on hundreds of commutes, a couple of fixed Audaxes and even the Mersey Roads 24h TT (on fixed too and it did involve a few climbs).

OOI did you use these with 51 single release or 56 multi release cleats? 

I've had a look, and turns out I use my m520s at the low tension end.
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #22 on: November 01, 2018, 12:22:38 pm »
'Not worth servicing' is a rather pejorative description. I don't think it applies to any pedals TBH; they all work better and last longer if correctly lubricated and adjusted. By the same logic you presumably wouldn't bother to remove a stone from inside your shoe....?
Is this a shoe where stone-removal takes as long as Shimano pedal-servicing takes? (including sourcing any tools)

And how much is the shoe worth? (Taking into account wear-n-tear).
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2018, 02:02:45 pm »
Quote
for want of a nail, the kingdom was lost....

for want of a dust seal and some grease, the pedals were lost.....

IME, (just like headsets, BBs, hubs and freehub bodies) if you don't maintain pedals, then they tend to fail, sometimes rather quickly.  This leaves you

a) with a bike that is broken and needs repairing, probably at a time that is not of your choice

b) shelling out for another set of pedals

c) with a repeat performance guaranteed at intervals of a year or two, as long as you carry on cycling.

d) needlessly contributing to the appalling waste in our 'throwaway society'

New PD-M324 have a RRP of about £50. You can get them cheaper than that, but that is what you will pay as a 'distress purchase' in the event that the pedals fail and you have to get another set from the LBS in a hurry. 

I learned my lesson years ago; I bought a cheap set of pedals and had them on my training bike.  The pedals were not assembled well in the factory plus I abused them.  Less than a year down the line the pedal bearings were slack, rough, and had clearly had the weather inside them.  At this point I wondered if it was worth doing anything with them, 'because they were only cheap'.  I ummed and ahhed about it and I grudging (it was dark, cold and threatening wet at the time, and I had to work outside) set to.  I found that there had never been the correct quantity of ball bearings inside the pedals. I rectified that, installed better seals, drilled a lube port in the pedal body and put the things back together again.

 Thereafter the pedals needed adjusting about once every six months for the next year or so, then much less frequently. Maintenance consisted of adding grease through the lube port and wiping the excess away. It took half a minute to do that, once every six months or so.

I ended up using those pedals for about twenty years. Towards the end the outsides looked as if they had been in the sea, but the bearings were unbelievably smooth (they just got smoother and smoother as time went on), and they hadn't needed adjusting for several years. Actually I retired those pedals in favour of some different ones, rather than because they were worn out. Goodness knows how much longer they would have gone on for.

Potentially they saved me at least ten pairs of 'cheap pedals' plus whatever breakdowns I'd otherwise have inflicted on myself.

It really does not take long to maintain pedals, once you have set yourself up for it; correctly adjusted and lubricated bearings need adjusting far less often than the other sort, and a lube port makes relubing very easy.

 It really doesn't matter how much your pedals cost, when they break it is a major PITA.

cheers

Re: SPD pedals with reflectors...
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2018, 03:56:58 pm »
Click'R have a low release tension

I've never had my Click'R unclip when I didn't want to, this is based on hundreds of commutes, a couple of fixed Audaxes and even the Mersey Roads 24h TT (on fixed too and it did involve a few climbs).

OOI did you use these with 51 single release or 56 multi release cleats? 

Single release. They're the same ones I've used on my M520 and M540 pedals as they're the same shoes.

I've a special place for any 56 multi release cleats I get; the bin (or the metal recycling skip at the local tip).
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."