Author Topic: Going VOIP - losing the landline  (Read 15135 times)

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #25 on: 01 March, 2021, 10:01:57 am »
Quote
I'm still quite fond of having telephony independent of mains electricity.

Mobile phones cover this well enough in most scenarios.  Obviously if that's not an option (eg. you live somewhere with no mobile coverage), some consideration for what happens when the mains fails is prudent.  I assume that whenever our-favourite-telco start replacing copper pairs with fibre, they'll be installing some battery backup at the customer's end.
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Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #26 on: 01 March, 2021, 10:09:26 am »
We have three boxes on the window sill. Two are phone sockets, one labelled BT, the other Telewest Broadband. We've never plugged anything into either of them and it doesn't appear as if the BT socket is actually connected to the outside world. There's also what looks like a TV aerial socket, also labelled Telewest Broadband. We've never plugged anything into that either.
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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #27 on: 01 March, 2021, 10:29:56 am »
If people are really interested in battery backups, the requirement is set by Ofcom and is (or was anyway) a regulatory requirement that people could still call 999 when there's a powercut. I've not kept up with their latest thinking, when it was first introduced you had to have an hours battery to run the bit of kit in your house that a corded phone could connect to.

The most recent guidance I could find is here https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0016/123118/guidance-emergency-access-power-cut.pdf which I think says the one hour thing still stands in most cases.


tiermat

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #28 on: 01 March, 2021, 11:16:35 am »
When we had FTTP installed* we were told that the terminating box also had a POTS interface on it (with our landline number attached), if we wanted to use that instead of the (antiquated) cable to another part of the house.

So far I haven't taken them up on that, but might when we have our next office re-shuffle as the fibre enters the building in the corner of the office.

*1928 detached, no FTTC to the street, but FTTP is, go figure
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Mr Larrington

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #29 on: 01 March, 2021, 11:52:54 am »
My BT-supplied FTTP termination box has what appears to be a standard phone socket next to the Ethernet one and I really ought to get round to finding out whether I can transfer my landline to it and dispense with the copper string altogether.  Unlike most of you tragically hip sorts I do actually use mine as I know where it is at all times and don’t keep forgetting to resupply it with fresh voles.
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Wombat

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #30 on: 01 March, 2021, 03:50:00 pm »
I'm officially puzzled now.  My phone is plugged into that phone socket alongside the ethernet port in the modem thingy.  We are fibre only, no copper wire at all.  So, surely this business of going VOIP whether I like it or not, won't actually affect anything?  I'm game for new DECT-ish phones anyway, sometime in the next couple of years, I'm fed up with my shitty Panasonics.

Idiot question 2.  OK, so maybe I have a power cut, so my router dies.  The modem box has battery backup (2018 install) so if I plugged my PC ethernet cable directly into the modem and ignored the dead router, would this work?  I've never been sure what a router does, but if it just spreads the electronovoles around, then surely I can have one connection?  As the mobile signal is shite here, some form of connection to the outside world would be important. 

I eventually found the access to the AA cells in the battery backup box, took some doing...
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Feanor

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #31 on: 01 March, 2021, 04:19:07 pm »
Idiot question 2.  OK, so maybe I have a power cut, so my router dies.  The modem box has battery backup (2018 install) so if I plugged my PC ethernet cable directly into the modem and ignored the dead router, would this work? 

Not without some re-configuring your PC.
Where you have a separate modem and router, the router has your ISP username and password, handles the login and sets up the PPPoE session acting as the PPPoE endpoint.

You'd need to configure a PPPoE client on the PC, and enter your ISP username/password here.

fuaran

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #32 on: 01 March, 2021, 08:14:06 pm »
I'm officially puzzled now.  My phone is plugged into that phone socket alongside the ethernet port in the modem thingy.  We are fibre only, no copper wire at all.  So, surely this business of going VOIP whether I like it or not, won't actually affect anything?  I'm game for new DECT-ish phones anyway, sometime in the next couple of years, I'm fed up with my shitty Panasonics.
Seems Openreach used to provide a Fibre Voice Access (FVA) service. Basically means the FTTP modem has a built in analogue telephone adapter. But that has now been discontinued, the latest FTTP modems don't have any phone port. And it may be switched off for existing customers at some point.
https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/products/product-withdrawal/fibre-voice-access

So it is now up to the ISP as to whether they provide any VOIP service.

Wombat

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #33 on: 01 March, 2021, 09:39:46 pm »
Ah, thanks, thats very helpful (which is far more than can be said for BT). So at some point, I change to VOIP telephony, I assume it will need an ethernet type port. Wonder if BT will give me a new router with more than the measly 3 ports my current superhub has? Its a pathetic thing, with the weediest wifi on the planet, yet it puts out BT fon, and BT wifi X whatever they are, which I can't turn off, and can't access. I think they're meant to provide a wifi service to passing folk, but the signal wouldn't reach the road, and I don't think John's sheep have smartphones.

I'll do a bit of basic research on VOIP telephony, I gather some DECT phones can also use VOIP.
Wombat

Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #34 on: 02 March, 2021, 07:34:49 am »


I'll do a bit of basic research on VOIP telephony, I gather some DECT phones can also use VOIP.
As mentioned up there I use a Siemens DECT set up with SIP capabilities. I /think/ their sip versions give it away by having - sip in the model number.
I'm on my second iteration of the seimens phone hub if that's a recommendation.
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Jaded

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #35 on: 11 March, 2021, 06:39:56 pm »
And it is done!

Seems to ring the phone quicker than the old way. And I get instant an call log on AAISP's Control Pages.

I've registered the older DECT phones on the new base, and they've got odd ring tones, so I'll have to reset them...
It is simpler than it looks.

Jaded

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #36 on: 11 March, 2021, 06:45:15 pm »
Ooooh! Exciting! I can call myself!!!
It is simpler than it looks.

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #37 on: 11 March, 2021, 06:53:21 pm »
Ooooh! Exciting! I can call myself!!!
Have you got an exciting name to call yourself?  ;)
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Jaded

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #38 on: 14 March, 2021, 11:13:46 am »
Just made my first chargeable call.

The cost? 5.9604p  ;D
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Woofage

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #39 on: 05 October, 2021, 05:25:46 pm »
Jaded, I hope you don't mind me asking a Q here as my issue is sort of similar.

We have just moved our business back to our home office. We have a BT Cloudphone service with 2 handsets (Yealink) and an app on my phone (I can make and receive business calls anywhere, even on my bike[1] - yay!).
I was hoping to just end the broadband service part of our BT bundle and just continue with the Cloudphone part. The man at BT says no - I also need BT broadband otherwise the CP will stop working[2]. It works here though[3].
So, I'm a but stuck as to where to go. I have no problem with the BT CP system, and it's not expensive. Can the panel recommend an alternative to BT Cloudphone? The mobile app bit is the clincher here.

[1] I did so just the other day  8)
[2] I'm confused by this. It's clearly not the full Nimbo-Cumulos type of cloud ???. If I can receive a call on my mobile why can't the base-station/handsets be reached on a land-based part of th'Internet? Devices locked to the BT network? Probably.
[3] Our BB is supplied by JL, which is re-branded Plus.net. I guess we're currently on BT BB after all so I can't disprove his comment (it's probably a moot point anyway).
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Jaded

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #40 on: 05 October, 2021, 06:01:04 pm »
Hi,

Quick answer, I haven't set mine up to do anything other than go to voicemail if it isn't answered. (That voicemail is then emailed to me as an fps, which is really useful)

Looking at the instructions, I can have the system ring other numbers, and set a time delay. e.g. ring my mobile after 15 seconds. I'm guessing that I can then answer on my mobile. That costs what it would normally to call my mobile. I haven't tried this, but will do, as it looks useful. I doubt that I can make calls that appear to be from the landline.

My VOIP is provided by my BB supplier, AAISP.
It is simpler than it looks.

Woofage

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #41 on: 08 October, 2021, 11:23:13 am »
The app that BT uses just creates an additional handset, but one that you can answer anywhere. It's not a call re-direct so no additional charges involved. You should ask your provider if they offer something similar.

I've just noticed that the BT app is provided by RingCentral. I have therefore contacted them to see what they can offer.
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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #42 on: 08 October, 2021, 12:54:23 pm »
Is this the same as going digital?  BT have just told me that we are going digital and will need a new adapter. Apparently it is called digital voice.

IanDG

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #43 on: 08 October, 2021, 03:01:43 pm »
I use BT for the internet but haven't had a phone attached to the landline since June 2019. Use mobile/VoIP for all calls. Mobile reception is not as good in Clarencefield (where I'll be when I finally manage to get the cottage finished) but the internet speed is better than in Dumfries- will have to look at other options then.

Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #44 on: 09 October, 2021, 06:33:03 pm »
Is this the same as going digital?  BT have just told me that we are going digital and will need a new adapter. Apparently it is called digital voice.
Phone lines (POTS or Plain Old Telephone System) is a pair of copper wires designed to take signals at audio frequencies. Tapping a phone line consisted of connecting headphones to the phone line. The ringing comes from 80 ish volts of ac, which actually powers the bells (for the half-dozen subscribers in the UK who still have phones with actual bells)

For 2 decades now, ADSL or FTTC has put higher frequencies on the same copper wires. The copper wires are not the best for high frequencies, but it is all that is available. The data carried by those far exceeds the data carried by audio frequency signals, so there doesn't seem to be much point to put in cables and systems that are designed for the audio. It makes a lot more sense to have cable better suited to high frequencies, and the electronics no longer has to keep on working with an 80 V ac on the wires if the POTS doesn't have to work.

Of course as soon as that is done, POTS won't work. However a VOIP to POTS adapter will be fairly trivial to engineer.
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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #45 on: 09 October, 2021, 06:55:23 pm »
"Going digital" probably means something specific to our-favourite-telco's marketroids.  But they're probably about 12 and don't remember ISDN.

It probably means either VOIP generally, a specialist POTS-replacement VOIP service to accompany FTTP, or a VOIP product they're pushing this week.  Who's to say?  No technical term survives contact with Marketing.

Kim

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #46 on: 09 October, 2021, 06:55:58 pm »
However a VOIP to POTS adapter will be fairly trivial to engineer.

They're called ATAs and they're almost universally awful.  Much better to use an IP handset, unless you have very specific needs.

Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #47 on: 09 October, 2021, 07:07:37 pm »
Is this the same as going digital?  BT have just told me that we are going digital and will need a new adapter. Apparently it is called digital voice.

I'd guess it's this transition : https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-58233420     or       https://digitalwholesalesolutions.com/2019/10/the-bt-openreach-pstn-and-isdn-2025-switch-off/
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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #48 on: 10 October, 2021, 12:56:25 am »
Quote
Openreach are adamant the December 2025 deadline is set in stone. Public Switch Telephone Network (PSTN) Lines that have not migrated to alterative services in April 2025 will be deemed as Orphaned Assets and Openreach intend to work with CPs to identify and migrate these customer to alternative products by the December 2025 deadline so they do not lose service. The actions to be taken are yet to be defined and the difficulties identifying the use of the line, and in some cases the end user customer, along with the contractual agreement to move is still to be confirmed but be assured, services will be withdrawn and customers will be impacted should they not move in time.

Quote
This means alarm line companies, payment terminals, traffic light systems, payphone lines, emergency pendants, dialysis machines, telemetry devices

I see this going roughly as well as when they planned to switch off FM radio in 2015, and that wouldn’t have broken any dialysis machines.

Woofage

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Re: Going VOIP - losing the landline
« Reply #49 on: 09 May, 2022, 12:07:21 pm »
https://www.virtuallandline.co.uk/

We transferred to this lot about 6 months ago. We went with the UK unlimited package at £7.95 a month, although for a reason that I cannot fathom, they are charging us £7.96 a month. The OCD isn't strong enough yet for me to ask for a refund of the 6p.

I found it quite amusing that someone had set up her mother in Poland with a Colchester dialling code.

Thread necromancy.

How's it going with Virtual Landline, WB? Can you load the app on more than one device with the package you have?
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