Author Topic: Census thread for discussions about the census  (Read 5972 times)

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #25 on: March 06, 2021, 10:32:05 pm »
Are you allow to not answers questions relating to ethnicity, sexual orientation, or nationality?

OK, nationality is simple enough, but ethnicity's a bit vague isn't it?

Is there a list of the census questions online somewhere?
I'd say nationality's equally vague (unless they actually mean citizenship).
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #26 on: March 06, 2021, 10:37:15 pm »
Are you allow to not answers questions relating to ethnicity, sexual orientation, or nationality?

OK, nationality is simple enough, but ethnicity's a bit vague isn't it?

Is there a list of the census questions online somewhere?
I'd say nationality's equally vague (unless they actually mean citizenship).

Both are essentially reporting self-identity.
Just ask Ali G.

Non-Census example of where this can be problematic:
Despite "physical" ethnicity having an impact on health outcomes, it's self reported ethnicity that is recorded not "the doctor reckons this patient is South Asian and so more at risk of diabetes"
But having someone else record someone's identity based on is problematic in itself.
Gender is also self identified on health records, Sex at birth is down to the midwifes reckoning though.

Beardy

  • What’s this do?
  • I’ve always wondered where this was
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #27 on: March 06, 2021, 10:53:36 pm »
Are you allow to not answers questions relating to ethnicity, sexual orientation, or nationality?

OK, nationality is simple enough, but ethnicity's a bit vague isn't it?

Is there a list of the census questions online somewhere?
I'd say nationality's equally vague (unless they actually mean citizenship).

Both are essentially reporting self-identity.
Just ask Ali G.

Non-Census example of where this can be problematic:
Despite "physical" ethnicity having an impact on health outcomes, it's self reported ethnicity that is recorded not "the doctor reckons this patient is South Asian and so more at risk of diabetes"
But having someone else record someone's identity based on is problematic in itself.
Gender is also self identified on health records, Sex at birth is down to the midwifes reckoning though.
And as Steph (and others) will tell you, that’s not always as clear cut as most assume.
Sorting my life out, one shed at a time.

fd3

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2021, 12:13:35 am »
I think the only question you can choose not to answer is sexuality.  The "nationality" question is actually phrased as "passport" and does accept other forms of citizenship ID.
I also find the ethnicity question confusing.  I don't understand how/why there is a distinction between British, Irish, European White.  It seems like it's a confusing mix of skin colour and cultural background.
Strange things are afoot at the circle K.

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #29 on: March 07, 2021, 12:39:51 am »
Form for England:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/file?uri=/census/censustransformationprogramme/questiondevelopment/census2021paperquestionnaires/householdenglandpdf.pdf


Questions:
   
Quote
What is your name?
    What is your date of birth?
    What is your sex?
    On 21 March 2021, what is your legal marital or registered civil partnership status?
    Who is (was) your legal marriage or registered civil partnership to?
    Do you stay at another address for more than 30 days a year?
    What is that address?
    Are you a schoolchild or student in full-time education?
    During term time, where do you usually live?
    What is your country of birth?
    If you were not born in the United Kingdom, when did you most recently arrive to live here?
    Including the time you have already spent here, how long do you intend to stay in the United Kingdom?
    One year ago, what was your usual address? 
    How would you describe your national identity?
    What is your ethnic group?
    What is your religion? (This question is voluntary)
    This question is intentionally left blank
    What is your main language?
    How well can you speak English?
    What passports do you hold?
    How is your health in general?
    Do you have any physical or mental health conditions or illnesses lasting or expected to last 12 months or more?
    Do any of your conditions or illnesses reduce your ability to carry out day-to-day activities?
    Do you look after, or give any help or support to, anyone because they have long-term physical or mental health conditions or illnesses, or problems related to old age?
    If you are aged 16 or over go to 26 – if you are aged 15 or under go to 51
    Which of the following best describes your sexual orientation? (This question is voluntary)
    Is the gender you identify with the same as your sex registered at birth? (This question is voluntary)
    The next set of questions is about your qualifications.
    Have you completed an apprenticeship?
    Have you achieved a qualification at degree level or above?
    Have you achieved any other qualifications?
    Have you previously served in the UK Armed Forces?
    In the last seven days, were you doing any of the following?
    Which of the following describes what you were doing in the last seven days?
    In the last four weeks, were you actively looking for any kind of paid work?
    If a job became available now, could you start it within two weeks?
    In the last seven days, were you waiting to start a job already accepted?
    Have you ever done any paid work?
    Answer the remaining questions for your main job or, if not working, your last main job.
    In your main job, what is (was) your employment status?
    What is (was) the name of the organisation or business you work (worked) for?
    What is (was) your full job title?
    Briefly describe what you do (did) in your main job.
    What is (was) the main activity of your organisation, business or freelance work?
    Do (did) you supervise or oversee the work of other employees on a day-to-day basis?
    If you had a job last week go to 47; If you were temporarily away from work last week go to 47; If you did not have a job last week go to 51
    In your main job, how many hours a week do you usually work?
    How do you usually travel to work?
    Where do you mainly work?
    What is the address of your workplace or depot?
    There are no more questions.

Also here with more details:
https://census.gov.uk/help/how-to-answer-questions/paper-questions-help

Giraffe

  • I brake for Giraffes
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #30 on: March 07, 2021, 08:46:43 am »
Did mine yesterday - didn't know if it was permitted before 21st. but it didn't stop me.
No religion - CBA with that BS, English (on the grounds that t'other nations would choose theirs), male (no intention of changing - too late anyway!).
Left feedback: form easy and straightforward; would have liked a print-out available.
2x4: thick plank; 4x4: 2 of 'em.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2021, 09:05:42 am »
No census here yet, but plotting to be in Scotland next March.  :demon:
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2021, 09:30:13 am »
We’ve had a letter.

The name of your employer seems weirdly specific. Has that always been there? Also we’re being acquired :)

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #33 on: March 07, 2021, 09:43:47 am »
    Including the time you have already spent here, how long do you intend to stay in the United Kingdom?

aka When are you fucking off back to where you came from?

If you say you were born here you skip this question. Maybe they don't want to know how many want to leave.

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #34 on: March 07, 2021, 10:09:03 am »
I'm fine with job title but name and address of employer? that's going too far.

fd3

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #35 on: March 07, 2021, 10:14:28 am »
Left feedback: form easy and straightforward; would have liked a print-out available.
Funny, I did the opposite.  It was tedious because if A&B are married with their children C, D and E you need to specify that A is married to B, B is married to A, marriage to same or different sex for A then B, C is child of A, C is child of B, C is sibling of D, C is sibling of E, D is child of A ...

    Including the time you have already spent here, how long do you intend to stay in the United Kingdom?

I was not asked when I would be leaving the UK - possibly because I have been here over 10 years, but the form wasn't clever up to this point, why start now?
Strange things are afoot at the circle K.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #36 on: March 07, 2021, 10:24:24 am »
Perhaps the paper questions are slightly different from the online ones? Just because...  ???
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #37 on: March 07, 2021, 10:43:31 am »
The paper versions are here.

You only get the Go Home question if you've been here less than 12 months.

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #38 on: March 07, 2021, 10:46:23 am »


    Including the time you have already spent here, how long do you intend to stay in the United Kingdom?

I was not asked when I would be leaving the UK - possibly because I have been here over 10 years, but the form wasn't clever up to this point, why start now?

That question (12 on the paper form) is only for people not born in the UK and who arrived after 21 March 2020. And the answers you can tick are only: less than 1 year,  more than 1 year.

If you did it online, you would not see the question if it's not applicable.

That list of question doesn't give the whole picture, best to look at the form itself (for England):
https://www.ons.gov.uk/file?uri=/census/censustransformationprogramme/questiondevelopment/census2021paperquestionnaires/householdenglandpdf.pdf
https://census.gov.uk/help/how-to-answer-questions/paper-questions-help

Mrs Pingu

  • Who ate all the pies? Me
    • Twitter
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #39 on: March 07, 2021, 11:28:55 am »
No census here yet, but plotting to be in Scotland next March.  :demon:
Hollybobs or more permanent?
Do not clench. It only makes it worse.

Mrs Pingu

  • Who ate all the pies? Me
    • Twitter
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #40 on: March 07, 2021, 11:29:22 am »
It is just me, or do the questions seem a bit more intrusive than last time?
Do not clench. It only makes it worse.

bhoot

  • MemSec (ex-Mrs RRtY)
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #41 on: March 07, 2021, 11:56:14 am »
Regarding the national identity question, some might find this interesting


Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #42 on: March 07, 2021, 12:15:29 pm »
That question allows you to tick as many as you want anyway. I find the "Ethnic group" question a bit more dubious.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #43 on: March 07, 2021, 12:37:42 pm »
No census here yet, but plotting to be in Scotland next March.  :demon:
Hollybobs or more permanent?

Would love it to be permanent, but think a Census Holiday would be fun...
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Mr Larrington

  • A bit ov a lyv wyr by slof standirds
  • Custard Wallah
    • Mr Larrington's Automatic Diary
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #44 on: March 07, 2021, 12:53:07 pm »
Old Soviet census joak:

1: Where were you born?St Petersburg.
2: Where did you first attend school?Petrograd.
3: Where did you get your first job?Leningrad.
[…]
n: Where would you most like to live?St Petersburg.
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
Satisfying the Bloodlust of the Masses in Peacetime

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #45 on: March 07, 2021, 01:03:04 pm »
I think I was last censused in 2002 and the time before that would have been 1991, which is probably the only one I filled out myself.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #46 on: March 07, 2021, 02:01:11 pm »
It is just me, or do the questions seem a bit more intrusive than last time?
Not just you. Though my distrust in the government has deepened since then, so it may be partly that.

They say they first asked for employer in 1911, but not when they most recently asked that. I wonder if the questions let me give my home address and a commute by foot without getting a fine.

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #47 on: March 07, 2021, 02:56:27 pm »
Regarding the national identity question, some might find this interesting
:thumbsup:

Steph

  • Fast. Fast and bulbous. But fluffy.
Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #48 on: March 07, 2021, 03:27:04 pm »
The hate group, 'Fair Play for Women', have launched crowdfunding* for an 'urgent judicial review' of the census question re gender identity, as it apparently erases women, and they weren't consulted.

Well they were consulted, in a round table event that they were specifically invited to, and attended, at the ONS. They have launched 'advice' for people to demand a paper census form, write comments on it and include a letter (template provided).

This ignores the fact that the form is scanned, not read and any extraneous sheets of paper get binned, and any written comments either laughed at or ignored.

Their complaint is that the census actually dares to mention that some people may be trans, and is therefore erasure of lesbians... safeguarding... Handmaids... Patriarchy... silencing... ADULT HUMAN FEMALE LARGE GAMETES and JEWISH TRANSHUMAN CYBORG CONSPIRACY**

*Crowdfunding is the current grift for 'gender critical' groups. The money requested is usually far and away in excess of what would actually be needed, includes loads of "anon--£5000" sums from th eUS religious right, and has so far totalled in the millions. That is real money, that could have been spent on real issues for real women, and has instead been spent on personal expenses, mattresses and "necessary salaries for the organisers". A joke is that a decent TERF grift starts at £100K, or one International Standard Mattress Unit.

**Yes, that is a real claim. One of those pushing it has been invited to speak in the House of Lords along with a Mr G Linehan, about how they are being silenced. No---that isn't a joke either.
Mae angen arnaf i byw, a fe fydda'i

Re: Census thread for discussions about the census
« Reply #49 on: March 07, 2021, 03:55:58 pm »
Regarding the national identity question, some might find this interesting
:thumbsup:
That makes it easier for Priti's Einsatzgruppen.
And Darkness and Decay and the Coronavirus held illimitable dominion over all.