Author Topic: Scottish football  (Read 1279 times)

Scottish football
« on: 07 March, 2021, 02:53:41 pm »
Its been a long wait but its over, Rangers are champions and have had some good results in europe this year.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #1 on: 07 March, 2021, 08:41:28 pm »
Until the SFA impose a point reduction (shall we say 25 points to make the rest of the season interesting) for the failure of the fans to obey rules about public gatherings.  :demon:

It will never happen but I think it might be rather poetic.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #2 on: 07 March, 2021, 08:45:51 pm »
It's really strange, seeing Scottish and Football next to each other, like that!

John Stonebridge

  • Has never ridden Ower the Edge
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #3 on: 08 March, 2021, 09:32:51 am »
It will be interesting to see how Rangers get on v. Slavia Prague this week, the team who beat Leicester (3rd in the English Premier League) in the last round of the Europa League.   


     

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #4 on: 08 March, 2021, 09:43:09 am »
Yes it's always good to see a small team collect their first major trophy, especially since they've only been in existence for 8 years!
Mind of a cyclist, body of a dart player.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #5 on: 08 March, 2021, 04:28:14 pm »
Don't you just love sore loosers, they even turn on the managers. Tribal warfare still is a part of Glasgows culture as seen in the last post by WCTD 🤭.  Rangers will have a tough time against Slavia Prague but you never know.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #6 on: 08 March, 2021, 04:33:10 pm »
Play nice now, boys.

I come from Kirkcaldy originally, therefore have no interest in the fitba'.  :thumbsup:

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #7 on: 08 March, 2021, 04:42:01 pm »
Matthew   Dont forget about the mob outside Parkhead protesting about the results, an  issue thats been overlooked 🤔

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #8 on: 08 March, 2021, 05:20:03 pm »
Salar55 I have no skin in this game, I am a soft southerner who's opinion has no value. My local teams are Reading and Brentford unless I should be following Maidenhead Utd in the non league.

My comment was in jest but given the failure of the fans to control their celebrations (locally, in NI and in Corby) it might seem less unreasonable.

I agree though there were issues with the Celtic fans gathering to call for their managers head before christmas. Maybe the title should be awarded to Hibs or Aberdeen just so all Glaswegians can be united in their disappointment.  :demon:

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #9 on: 08 March, 2021, 06:26:43 pm »
Matthew   Good on you supporting grassroots football, you are a real football supporter. The big clubs are destroying the game, not enough money filters down to the lower leagues.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #10 on: 08 March, 2021, 06:52:02 pm »
Don't you just love sore loosers, they even turn on the managers. Tribal warfare still is a part of Glasgows culture as seen in the last post by WCTD 🤭.  Rangers will have a tough time against Slavia Prague but you never know.

TBF the only people in Scottish football who believe (the) Rangers have won 55 trophies are their own fans and possibly Clydebank while trying to claim Airdrieonians history along with their name.

 ;D

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #11 on: 08 March, 2021, 08:00:39 pm »
4 Spanish teams have a  tax problems due to a charity status. I wonder what the SPANISH FA and the tax office will do.

John Stonebridge

  • Has never ridden Ower the Edge
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #12 on: 10 March, 2021, 12:13:57 pm »
Any predictions for the Celtic v Rangers game scheduled currently for Sunday 21st March with a 1200 KO?  I mean off the pitch.   

I can see it being moved to the nearest Police Scotland can find to a graveyard slot - so it wont be held at the weekend.  I can see it taking place the following day with a KO early enough to at least try and deter the bams.  Maybe 1600 or so and the polis will do a rain dance (not always required in Glasgow mind).     

Of course that slot will no doubt upset Sky whose entire coverage of Scottish football is centred round Celtic & Rangers and in particular the contractual obligation to have four games between them each season.  On this occasion they are probably best not to quibble - they'll have Police Scotland & the Scottish Government itching to flex their muscles and call it off entirely.           

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #13 on: 10 March, 2021, 10:14:50 pm »
Every cyclist in Scotland wants the old firm game, guarantees empty roads . ;D

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #14 on: 10 March, 2021, 11:00:49 pm »
Any predictions for the Celtic v Rangers game scheduled currently for Sunday 21st March with a 1200 KO?  I mean off the pitch.   

I can see it being moved to the nearest Police Scotland can find to a graveyard slot - so it wont be held at the weekend.  I can see it taking place the following day with a KO early enough to at least try and deter the bams.  Maybe 1600 or so and the polis will do a rain dance (not always required in Glasgow mind).     

Of course that slot will no doubt upset Sky whose entire coverage of Scottish football is centred round Celtic & Rangers and in particular the contractual obligation to have four games between them each season.  On this occasion they are probably best not to quibble - they'll have Police Scotland & the Scottish Government itching to flex their muscles and call it off entirely.           

7am while they're still hungover?
Since when did Fans of the twa cheeks work?

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #15 on: 11 March, 2021, 07:35:09 am »
Every cyclist in Scotland wants the old firm game, guarantees empty roads . ;D

There is no old firm anymore, The old firm derby ceased in 2012 when Rangers were liquidated in 2012 and Charles Green bought the assets and formed a new company called Sevco 5088, later changed to RIFC, this company had to apply to join the Scottish leagues and this was accepted by other members so the new company started from the bottom tier and had to work their way through the leagues.

The CVA agreement that Craig Whyte put forward was not only rejected by HMRC but by others such as convicted criminal Dave King who later went on to become chairman of the new company.

I can screenshot a picture of the liquidation document if you like, or if you can tell me when they paid all creditors and exited administration with the help of their fans, you know like Hearts did?

As Walter Smith ( and a few others) once said “I wish the new Rangers every success” or as QC for Charles Green stated at the court of session in Edinburgh “Rangers no longer exist, there is nothing now but assets. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a diehard fan that refuses to accept this”

All the evidence is there, even the face painter got shafted  :) From the Herald 2012

NEWS
6th April 2012
From florists to a face painter: Small firms left out of pocket
By Mark Smith
   
THE total Rangers owes may be huge – up to £130 million – but the debt is made up of large and small amounts.

There is £26.7m owed to Ticketus, the firm Craig Whyte sold four years of season ticket revenue to, and £93m to HM Revenue and Customs but there is also £70 to a florist, £61 to a cleaning supplies company and £40 to a face painter.

The bigger debts also include £800,000 Rangers still owe Hearts for the transfer of Lee Wallace but many small business near Ibrox and across the west of Scotland are owed smaller amounts.

Mind of a cyclist, body of a dart player.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #16 on: 11 March, 2021, 09:21:52 am »
Next you'll be telling us that Newport County aren't Newport County, and Accrington Stanley aren't Accrington Stanley.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #17 on: 11 March, 2021, 10:15:35 am »
Its business , i was made redundant buy a firm that went bust. Went to Europe for a couple of months cycling , if i took a job the redundancy money would be cut. Guess what, came back and was employed buy the same (company  ?) people who ran the old one.. They paid top rate money so was always worth the risk.

The top tax figure owed is 650+ million Euro for the 4 Spanish clubs , you could say the tax man stopped Rangers paying what they owed to others.

Wowbagger

  • Sylph
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #18 on: 11 March, 2021, 10:29:00 am »
Professional football is a massive con in which people are fooled into thinking they are supporting something with which they can identify/represents them but is primarily a massive business for others to get rich. It's a shame that the German model isn't more widespread, where the fans have a big stake in each club.

The same applies to all professional sport to one degree or another. I've never understood, for example, why Sunday cyclists feel better about themselves when they wear the colours of the commercial teams that dominate the Tour de France. At least football fans have the history and heritage of their clubs actually having some local ties, even if they are now owned by massive foreign conglomerates.

There's so much here which is a parallel to the Southend Football thread. Lots of sociology involved.
Bach without a doubt.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #19 on: 11 March, 2021, 10:33:55 am »
You could also say that David Murray should not have used the EBT scheme to avoid paying taxes on players salary  ;) or that he should not have borrowed near 600m for his companies including the then Rangers and to quote the man himself, this gem from the Craig Whyte trial “it was the only way we could pay for players that otherwise we could not afford” You could also say that he could’ve ran a sensible business model instead of running up huge debts and selling the then Rangers for a whole £1 coin  ::-)

There are still questions as to wether he paid tax on this deal too  :P
Mind of a cyclist, body of a dart player.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #20 on: 11 March, 2021, 10:40:46 am »
If football was run under sensible commercial rules you would have to think that the likes of Brechin city or Dumbarton would have chance of doing the 10 in a row :facepalm:

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #21 on: 11 March, 2021, 10:54:27 am »
If football was run under sensible commercial rules you would have to think that the likes of Brechin city or Dumbarton would have chance of doing the 10 in a row :facepalm:

Brechin, Dumbarton and many, many other clubs are run using a sensible business model, they only buy players they can afford !

They also don’t have a guy (Gavin Masterton) who was head of BoS and lending obscene amounts to Murray and his companies. The same guy was also the chairman of DAFC who lost 6-0 to the then Rangers on the last day of the season but yet, their players and management were celebrating in the then Rangers dressing room! It’s maybe a coincidence that the entire staff of DAFC went on an all expenses paid jolly to the Bahamas for 3 weeks.

I agree entirely with Wow’s sentiments above, I stopped becoming a paying customer of the club I supported when they started paying dividends to the major shareholders.
Mind of a cyclist, body of a dart player.

Re: Scottish football
« Reply #22 on: 11 March, 2021, 12:08:10 pm »
I agree entirely with Wow’s sentiments above, I stopped becoming a paying customer of the club I supported when they started paying dividends to the major shareholders.
Which clubs actually pay dividends? Manchester Utd for sure, and then?  Most football clubs lose money day-to-day and need the ownership to put money in.

John Stonebridge

  • Has never ridden Ower the Edge
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #23 on: 11 March, 2021, 12:19:44 pm »
Professional football is a massive con in which people are fooled into thinking they are supporting something with which they can identify/represents them but is primarily a massive business for others to get rich. It's a shame that the German model isn't more widespread, where the fans have a big stake in each club.

The same applies to all professional sport to one degree or another. I've never understood, for example, why Sunday cyclists feel better about themselves when they wear the colours of the commercial teams that dominate the Tour de France. At least football fans have the history and heritage of their clubs actually having some local ties, even if they are now owned by massive foreign conglomerates.

There's so much here which is a parallel to the Southend Football thread. Lots of sociology involved.

That's an interesting point WoW.  I was part of a group of Falkirk FC fans and lifelong Season Ticket holders who put a proposal to the club in 2019-2020 to broaden out the ownership knowing that a couple of the then 6 major shareholders were looking to sell, along with a serious concern for how the club was being (mis) managed.  While this involved a reasonably significant initial investment the longer term plan was to do something similar to Heart of Midlothian where fans would own the vast majority of the club through a fans foundation and regular monthly subs.   

Some fairly dubious obstacles were put in our way and the upshot was that the club gave us the bums rush and ultimately sold a 26% stake in the club to Jim & Carrie Rawlins for around £350k last autumn (google then & Falkirk FC for the story but neither has any connection to town or club).  This was broadly equivalent to the amount on offer from our group but we wanted a bigger stake of 50%.  Either way the club is valued overall at somewhere between £1m - £1.3m.   

Anyhow our fans group still exists, and our conclusion from this experience is that the club are actively opposed to fan ownership but cant say so openly.  The fan base currently represents a very nice steady and predictable source of funds with no strings attached and they don't want to rock the boat by turning donations into share purchases which of course carry risk but also influence.   

As you say it is a shame that we don't follow the German model but my experience of the last couple of years shows why exactly why my home town club doesn't want it.  Given that the major shareholders mentioned above held their investment for about 20 years (in fairness to them they were part of the clubs rescue in 2001) and had been trying to sell for at least the final 5, their approach might only really bite them on the bum if and when they try to sell up. 

Edit - and along with the members of the group I was involved in, the club ain't getting any more donations from us.  We did some calculations that suggested that between us we covered around 1/3rd of the clubs off field revenue so big enough to get through the Boardroom door for a conversation but not enough to hold sway.   

Mr Larrington

  • A bit ov a lyv wyr by slof standirds
  • Custard Wallah
    • Mr Larrington's Automatic Diary
Re: Scottish football
« Reply #24 on: 11 March, 2021, 12:28:28 pm »
Every cyclist in Scotland wants the old firm game, guarantees empty roads . ;D

There is no old firm anymore


Meet the new firm / Same as the old firm?
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
Satisfying the Bloodlust of the Masses in Peacetime