Author Topic: Ghosts, do they actually exist?  (Read 4929 times)

Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« on: 19 November, 2009, 11:45:49 am »
Im sat in the 6th form photography room, with a load of other people. The subject of ghosts came up after someone watched some scary film last night.
Anyway, hes said what has happened to him and his family, and other things. Some things he says ive sort of had happen, some noise in the night or something. Ive sometimes beeen in bed and its sounded like the chairs downsgtairs are being moved, and a door opening and closing.
Now ive never really bothered with ghosts etc, but is this ghosts? Ive just put it down to wind, and have no other reason to think otherwise.
So, my question is, are these people beleiving in ghosts for a logical reason, or are they just belieiving them bcausse of the amount of films that they have watched.
I cant work it out. Is it that they have seen some films with stuff in, and their imagination was playing tricks on them, or is it that they have actually had things happen to them?
Some of the things they say, like what happens when they are trying to sleep, to me, seems like they are thinking about it because of a film, something they have been told or something else.
Im not saying ghosts dont exist, more that some things do sometimes seem over worked.
Or are ghosts just not realy, and its minds playing tricks on what you actually want to see, or are thinking about?
Just as a thought.


Don't question. It makes people angry.

nicknack

  • Hornblower
Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #1 on: 19 November, 2009, 11:53:13 am »
Anyone's head is perfectly capable of coming up with some seriously weird crap. No need to invoke the supernatural.
There's no vibrations, but wait.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #2 on: 19 November, 2009, 11:57:33 am »
Anyone's head is perfectly capable of coming up with some seriously weird crap. No need to invoke the supernatural.

 ;D

This sums up a whole-world view. No need to say anything else, ever.
Rust never sleeps

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #3 on: 19 November, 2009, 12:00:33 pm »
Nicknack, thats what i think. Its simple to get thinking something in the night when your expecting something, or if something happens and you just thinkg its ghosts or something.
Ive got doubts


Don't question. It makes people angry.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #4 on: 19 November, 2009, 12:02:23 pm »
Yes according to my Thai MIL.

She reckons one haunts the bathroom and bangs the door. I told her it was me who bangs the door :D
"100% PURE FREAKING AWESOME"

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #5 on: 19 November, 2009, 12:12:55 pm »
No they don't. Not in the sense of extra-corporeal beings.

However, we have very powerful minds and memories, coupled with an impressive set of senses. These can trigger an awareness of things at odd times.

How many of us have been cycling and, for no explicit reason, been particularly cautious of a car - then the driver has done something daft? Sixth sense, or the bundle of experience+subconsious noticing subtle things about the way the car is being driven?

I had a very wierd experience once. I'd fallen asleep reading on my narrowboat. Suddenly I woke, feeling someone grasp my shoulders and shake me firmly. I sat up in shock, looking round. I could *feel* where I'd been gripped on my shoulders. No-one there. Then I saw that the candle (in a wooden holder) had burnt down, the holder was alight, flaring up. This was on a wooden wardrobe next to a stack of books.

Now, did a supernatural being come and wake me? Or did part of my mind insert something into my dreams to wake me?
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #6 on: 19 November, 2009, 01:01:09 pm »
IMO, ghosts in the 'Victorian apparition' sense probably not; but a perhaps more interesting question is what do we make of the possibility of a supernatural, spiritural dimension to life...
Cycle and recycle.   SS Wilson

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #7 on: 19 November, 2009, 02:51:42 pm »
Ghosts

I've seen three the first one all I saw was a very bright white shape of a hunched up person that went passed the glass door of the kitchen this was at 2 am
2. A German soldier in full uniform in Guernsey, we were on a school trip and there were 14 of us in a very large tent and I woke up and he was standing at the end of the tent.
3. This was a monk, I kid you not, 5.30am in the morning driving to work, a car overtook me and the next thing I saw was he swerved to the other side of the road like he has lost control, the next thing I saw a black shadow in front of me, I hit the brakes, but there was nothing there. I carried on down the road and the car that swerved was stopped, so I pulled up behind him and he was out of his car shaking, I have never seen a man so frightened, I ask him what he saw and he said it was a monk with his hood up, to be honest all I saw was a black shape.
I'm not a crack pot, but I do believe that some people can see ghosts and others can't.
My father during the war made some sandwiches to take up to the captain and on the way up the stairs the captain passed him going down he called out "your sandwiches Sir", but he never spoke, he opened the bridge door and saw the captain laying on the floor with two other officers present, he later found out he died of a heart attack.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #8 on: 19 November, 2009, 03:37:54 pm »
Ghosts

I've seen three the first one all I saw was a very bright white shape of a hunched up person that went passed the glass door of the kitchen this was at 2 am
2. A German soldier in full uniform in Guernsey, we were on a school trip and there were 14 of us in a very large tent and I woke up and he was standing at the end of the tent.
3. This was a monk, I kid you not, 5.30am in the morning driving to work, a car overtook me and the next thing I saw was he swerved to the other side of the road like he has lost control, the next thing I saw a black shadow in front of me, I hit the brakes, but there was nothing there. I carried on down the road and the car that swerved was stopped, so I pulled up behind him and he was out of his car shaking, I have never seen a man so frightened, I ask him what he saw and he said it was a monk with his hood up, to be honest all I saw was a black shape.
I'm not a crack pot, but I do believe that some people can see ghosts and others can't.
My father during the war made some sandwiches to take up to the captain and on the way up the stairs the captain passed him going down he called out "your sandwiches Sir", but he never spoke, he opened the bridge door and saw the captain laying on the floor with two other officers present, he later found out he died of a heart attack.


Maybe it is one of those things, but i do think that some of it is either made up, or you think it, because of the power of the mind.
The lad said that his mum was acting strange, had a demon inside her. So they got someone around to get rid of the demon. The person started speaking a weird language, but then his mums head went back, she went all pale and her nose started to bleed. The woman that came to get rid of the demon said something, and the lads mum spoke, but in a more manly voice, and the voice said it didn't want to leave.
Anyway, think he said the demon did go, but his mum was knocked out for 3 days(my arse, who wouldn't take someone to the hospital if they were knocked out like that?)
He firmly believes this.
Also said that he was once upstairs, the house was empty besides him, and he was just stood in his bedroom. He heard a noise like something was being dragged. Then he stepped aside and a knife slid along and floor or something like that.
He actually believes that a demon in the house was after him, and the rest of his family, and wanted to take his mum away.
Another thing was that his dad was in on his own(his dad is a big guy, does alot of weight training) and he heard voices saying that 'they' were going to kill him. He ended up going downstairs, getting a knife, going back upstairs and standing by the spare room door with the knife, before going off to the shed and sitting in there crying.
And the final one i remember, was he has a brother who is lucky to be alive. Apparently he was born 3 months too soon, with lots of problems and his parents were told he was going to die. He ended up surviving and this lad in school believes that his brother had someone/something looking after him. Said that his mum would close the bedroom door at night, but it would be open in the morning. And when his brother was 2/3 and couldn't really talk properly, he would go to the bottom of the stairs and talk fluently to someone, but no-one would be there.

Some stuff there is no answer for, other stuff i have my doubts if its true or not.
There is a road somewhere, and apparently there's a young girl that is in the road, and people have run her over. When they get out and go looking for her she isn't there. They call the police and there's looking but nothing, not even damage to the car.

On the A60, my dad said that if you came around the courner with full beam on, sometimes your headlights would reflect into a big house's window at the side of the road and it would look like theres a ghost at the side of the road.
Explanation for other things?


Don't question. It makes people angry.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #9 on: 19 November, 2009, 06:28:40 pm »
Haven't we had a very similar thread recently?

I am sure that there are 'rational' explanations for many ghostly events and I'm equally sure that there is much about the world that can't be explained by our current knowledge. Electricity for instance. Is it electron flow or is it hole flow. Does anybody know yet?

My experience is that I have never seen a ghost, when I had the opportunity to I didn't bother looking, but I have met people who I am certain believe they have seen ghosts.
Never knowingly under caffeinated

border-rider

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #10 on: 19 November, 2009, 06:37:04 pm »
I am sure that there are 'rational' explanations for many ghostly events and I'm equally sure that there is much about the world that can't be explained by our current knowledge. Electricity for instance.

Unless I've missed something, we have a pretty good explanation for electricity.

Jacomus

  • My favourite gender neutral pronoun is comrade
Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #11 on: 19 November, 2009, 07:23:31 pm »
How can we say for sure, there is no proof yet.

Personally, I reserve judgement.

A while ago, I saw something that creeped me right out. My housemate and I were alone in our house, the other person was out and about. We had dinner together, cuddled up on the sofa and watched 9 Songs, then a bit of real pr0n, and went to our respective rooms to finish the night.

About 3am I woke up, for no reason. I went for a slash and back to bed, about 30s after tucking myself back in I heard my housemate scream. I shot downstairs and to her room as she exited it ASAP and nearly ran into me coming in the opposite direction, i kept going into her room and spotted a man standing outside the French windows, looking in.

Wrenching the doors open, ready to commit some seriously prosecutable GBH, I realised that there was nobody there. I had intended to open the door into him, he was stood in the way, but all I achieved was to damage the door by throwing it against the frame and hurt myself by falling onto the deck as I expected the door to hit something solid.

Freaky as hell. Ghost? Maybe, maybe not. At least it was more frightening for her than seeing me naked!
"The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity." Amelia Earhart

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #12 on: 19 November, 2009, 07:25:41 pm »
I am sure that there are 'rational' explanations for many ghostly events and I'm equally sure that there is much about the world that can't be explained by our current knowledge. Electricity for instance.

Unless I've missed something, we have a pretty good explanation for electricity.

It's probable that I've missed it but when I was a sparky nobody knew how electricity worked. We knew what it did and how to make use of it, but there was no agreement on which way it 'ran' along the cable or through the components. If it's been solved I'd like to know :)
Never knowingly under caffeinated

LEE

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #13 on: 19 November, 2009, 07:26:19 pm »
I am sure that there are 'rational' explanations for many ghostly events and I'm equally sure that there is much about the world that can't be explained by our current knowledge. Electricity for instance.

Unless I've missed something, we have a pretty good explanation for electricity.

Yes, it's actually called current knowledge

LEE

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #14 on: 19 November, 2009, 07:28:12 pm »
Yes according to my Thai MIL.

She reckons one haunts the bathroom and bangs the door. I told her it was me who bangs the door :D

But how can you explain the terrible deathly smell?

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #15 on: 19 November, 2009, 07:30:43 pm »
It's probable that I've missed it but when I was a sparky nobody knew how electricity worked. We knew what it did and how to make use of it, but there was no agreement on which way it 'ran' along the cable or through the components. If it's been solved I'd like to know :)
In your house it doesn't really run anywhere; it just sort of sits there and wiggles from side to side.

In a d.c. circuit it flows from negative to positive, which is a shame because everyone assumed it was the other way round for a couple of hundred years.  And it's electrons moving through the metal lattice.  The actual speed of the electrons is quite slow - about the same as a snail on dope.  The speed of the current, or "signal" is very fast though (a reasonable fraction of the speed of light), because that's how quickly the electrons at one end of the wire start moving when you give the ones at the other end a shove.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #16 on: 19 November, 2009, 07:45:55 pm »
I am sure that there are 'rational' explanations for many ghostly events and I'm equally sure that there is much about the world that can't be explained by our current knowledge. Electricity for instance.

Unless I've missed something, we have a pretty good explanation for electricity.

Yes, it's actually called current knowledge
:D
Never knowingly under caffeinated

border-rider

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #17 on: 19 November, 2009, 09:29:10 pm »
It's probable that I've missed it but when I was a sparky nobody knew how electricity worked. We knew what it did and how to make use of it, but there was no agreement on which way it 'ran' along the cable or through the components. If it's been solved I'd like to know :)
In your house it doesn't really run anywhere; it just sort of sits there and wiggles from side to side.

In a d.c. circuit it flows from negative to positive, which is a shame because everyone assumed it was the other way round for a couple of hundred years.  And it's electrons moving through the metal lattice.  The actual speed of the electrons is quite slow - about the same as a snail on dope.  The speed of the current, or "signal" is very fast though (a reasonable fraction of the speed of light), because that's how quickly the electrons at one end of the wire start moving when you give the ones at the other end a shove.

yep, this

Think of the power station shoving electrons in at one end and them going all the way round the circuits and back to the station again.  Each individual electron doesn't move very fast, as RZ says, but the pressure that the power station applies (the voltage) propagates almost instantly down the wire.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #18 on: 19 November, 2009, 09:35:00 pm »
That makes some sense and, to move back towards the realm of ghosts, is this theory, or known as in proved?
Never knowingly under caffeinated

border-rider

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #19 on: 19 November, 2009, 09:37:59 pm »
Electricity ?

Known.  For a long time.  James Clerk Maxwell is yer man.

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #20 on: 19 November, 2009, 09:53:22 pm »
Electricity ?

Known.  For a long time.  James Clerk Maxwell is yer man.

I've only checked him on Wikipedia but it doesn't appear to be known as in proved. He was a theorist and wrote an acceptable theory that gives a good, but unproven, explanation. As I recall from C&G electronics training in the early '70's there were alternative theories, not as well known as Maxwells, and hole theory was one. AFAIR, hole theory explained why electrons moved the wrong way in direct current.
Never knowingly under caffeinated

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #21 on: 19 November, 2009, 10:03:44 pm »
Err isn't it only the "wrong way" because we arbitrarily decided that current flows for an arbitrary positive to negative way back when before we understood how it worked ?
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

border-rider

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #22 on: 19 November, 2009, 10:34:15 pm »
I've only checked him on Wikipedia but it doesn't appear to be known as in proved. He was a theorist and wrote an acceptable theory that gives a good, but unproven, explanation.

It's as proven as anything can be.

Quote
As I recall from C&G electronics training in the early '70's there were alternative theories, not as well known as Maxwells, and hole theory was one.

Maxwell's theory is well-integrated with modern physics.  I'm struggling to understand why anyone would think it not proven in any meaningful sense.  Holes are a concept used in semiconductor physics as standing for a place where an electron should be, but they're entirely consistent with Maxwell.

Quote
AFAIR, hole theory explained why electrons moved the wrong way in direct current.

They don't.  It's just that we define current as flowing from positive to negative, but in fact as RZ said electrons move the other way.  It's just an artifact of the way we chose to define current flow, not an aspect of physical reality.

edit:what polbeck said :)

Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #23 on: 20 November, 2009, 08:14:16 am »
The thing about holes being current flow may be people getting mixed up with semiconductors. In a PNP semiconductor the current is carried by holes whereas in an NPN transistor by electrons. Semiconductors are strange beasties though.

oops MV already pointed this out.
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Ghosts, do they actually exist?
« Reply #24 on: 29 November, 2009, 08:02:44 pm »
Back on topic, this appeared on our back gate after today's rain.  Shades of the Blair Witch Project.

Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.