Post by: Mrs Pingu on 11 July, 2020, 07:25:04 pm
I made a buckshee one out of a buff but it's not the easiest thing to ve understood in when talking. So being as it's compulsary up here I thought I'd buy a couple of washable reusable ones.
Anyone have any experience as to what's easiest to be understood in, a curved shaped fitted or a pleated mask?
I did try asking Google but it was useless.
Post by: giropaul on 12 July, 2020, 08:22:43 am
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 12 July, 2020, 09:24:21 am
Post by: Beardy on 12 July, 2020, 10:20:32 am
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 12 July, 2020, 02:14:03 pm
On Friday I spent a couple of hours wearing a pleated 'surgical' mask. Relatively easy to talk and breathe but painful on the ear straps while simultaneously slightly too large for me, so tended to slip down off my nose. So I replaced it with a cloth one which has 'round the head' straps rather than ear straps. Much more comfortable, still breathable, but definitely not so easy to be understood. Your ears might vary.
Post by: Manotea on 12 July, 2020, 02:52:41 pm
Post by: IanN on 12 July, 2020, 03:09:09 pm
But... in work I am also struggling with the latest surgical type masks with ear loops. They really cut in after a while.
BC, surgical masks had tie on straps which you can make fit (your lumpy head may vary)
They also migrate down my face as I talk for any length of time
I think a homemade / non medical mask may take a few iterations
Post by: andrewc on 12 July, 2020, 03:58:32 pm
Post by: FifeingEejit on 12 July, 2020, 04:12:23 pm
Anyone got any experience?
I made a buckshee one out of a buff but it's not the easiest thing to ve understood in when talking. So being as it's compulsary up here I thought I'd buy a couple of washable reusable ones.
Anyone have any experience as to what's easiest to be understood in, a curved shaped fitted or a pleated mask?
I did try asking Google but it was useless.
Ye bide roond Aiberdeen wai and ye want tae be forstawed?
Masks... My glasses fog up everything I breathe, which is quite often...
I've almost got the hang of having to conciously triple my breathing rate, but this... It seems to be that some people have figured it out, and aren't telling those that haven't.
I haven't got round to making a cloth mask yet (I use an AUK buff for essential shopping duties / bank robberies etc)
But... in work I am also struggling with the latest surgical type masks with ear loops. They really cut in after a while.
BC, surgical masks had tie on straps which you can make fit (your lumpy head may vary)
They also migrate down my face as I talk for any length of time
I think a homemade / non medical mask may take a few iterations
I'm sure I've seen something about alternatives to using ear loops, as the board communications put out something to the local volunteer industry making them about not using certain materials on them due to infection control) i.e. they can't be washed
Some sort of conversion that makes them more like tie on; can't find link...
Post by: chrisbainbridge on 12 July, 2020, 06:53:01 pm
I think everybody in Britain with some spare cloth, buttons and a sewing machine made a thousand of them in April.
Post by: Sergeant Pluck on 12 July, 2020, 08:05:52 pm
In the case of surgical masks, I find ones with ties to be much better than ear loops. However, if needs must (current stock seems to be ear loops) I use a face mask ear protector like this:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B085759SFH/ref=crt_ewc_title_huc_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A1N6ZQKZEV2MI8
This improves the fit and helps to avoid getting my bloody hearing aids caught when I take a mask off.
Post by: Kim on 12 July, 2020, 09:25:00 pm
It is possible to get a headband with two buttons, one above each ear. The mask then loops onto the buttons. Most nurses use them.
Alternative glasses-wearer approach: Attach buttons to the arms of your glasses with suitable o-rings.
Hardcore barakta approach: Have suitable anchor points surgically implanted in your skull.
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 12 July, 2020, 11:01:24 pm
Anyone got any experience?
I made a buckshee one out of a buff but it's not the easiest thing to ve understood in when talking. So being as it's compulsary up here I thought I'd buy a couple of washable reusable ones.
Anyone have any experience as to what's easiest to be understood in, a curved shaped fitted or a pleated mask?
I did try asking Google but it was useless.
Ye bide roond Aiberdeen wai and ye want tae be forstawed?
Wot? ???
Post by: FifeingEejit on 13 July, 2020, 01:05:15 am
Anyone got any experience?
I made a buckshee one out of a buff but it's not the easiest thing to ve understood in when talking. So being as it's compulsary up here I thought I'd buy a couple of washable reusable ones.
Anyone have any experience as to what's easiest to be understood in, a curved shaped fitted or a pleated mask?
I did try asking Google but it was useless.
Ye bide roond Aiberdeen wai and ye want tae be forstawed?
Wot? ???
You mean "fit?"
Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
Post by: T42 on 13 July, 2020, 07:52:45 am
Alternative glasses-wearer approach: Attach buttons to the arms of your glasses with suitable o-rings.
Then you sneeze and blow your glasses off.
We have pleated masks, but unless I twist them the ear-loops pull the upper edge into my eyes. Hard on the ears, though - can't imagine wearing that all day.
Post by: Shreds on 13 July, 2020, 09:14:08 am
At present they are also very difficult to source good ones. NHS have priority.
N95 or FFP3 (full face, P3 level protection) are very much what are seen as the ‘standard’ but some masks protect against fibres and dusts, rather than vapours. The total ignorance of the Great British public, panic buying and hoarding is probably why initially they were not recommended.
Now getting them for genuine work purposes where they are needed is proving very difficult. Prices have doubled too.
https://www.jspsafety.com/link/en/force10/e/
And are masks being used to protect you or to protect others from you?
To avoid condensation and be suitable for use over a long period as well as having suitable level filtration is very, very expensive. Ask a dental surgeon.
https://www.jspsafety.com/link/en/respiratory-protection/powercap-infinity-papr/powercap-infinity-complete-unit/a/?parm=NOM041%20%20%20%20%20aeabab&cat=JSP
You dont see too many of those being used. (Again very, very difficult to source at present).
Post by: Kim on 13 July, 2020, 12:25:14 pm
And are masks being used to protect you or to protect others from you?
To protect others from you. That's why we're talking about drip-catching cloth masks that are practical to wear for prolonged periods, rather than anything that might have effective filtration.
Post by: andrewc on 13 July, 2020, 02:52:13 pm
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 13 July, 2020, 09:30:06 pm
And are masks being used to protect you or to protect others from you?
To protect others from you. That's why we're talking about drip-catching cloth masks that are practical to wear for prolonged periods, rather than anything that might have effective filtration.
And because we're being asked to, up here.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 13 July, 2020, 09:52:27 pm
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 13 July, 2020, 11:16:06 pm
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 14 July, 2020, 08:50:05 am
Just tried a pleated one (work-supplied). Much more comfortable (less hot) than buff, shaping bit over nose makes big difference to glasses misting up.
We are going to make some up for forthcoming holiday in Scotland. Triple-layered masks only are acceptable up there.
The idea that the simple pleated tyvek ones are single use annoys me. Get some alcohol, spray after use. They'll be fine for one person using multiple times.
Post by: rafletcher on 14 July, 2020, 11:55:57 am
P
We are going to make some up for forthcoming holiday in Scotland. Triple-layered masks only are acceptable up there.
Not according to this from gov.scot
"What is a face covering?
A face covering can be any covering of the mouth and nose that is made of cloth or other textiles and through which you can breathe.
Religious face coverings that cover the mouth and the nose count as face coverings for these purposes.
You may also use, if you prefer, a face visor but it must cover your nose and mouth completely.
When applying or removing the covering, it is important that you wash/sanitise your hands first and avoid touching your face.
After each use, you must wash the face covering at 60 degrees centigrade or dispose of it safely."
Their advice (re washing/sanitising hands, not touching face) is also pretty much impossible to follow unless you're in a sterile environment.
Post by: phantasmagoriana on 14 July, 2020, 12:04:46 pm
We are going to make some up for forthcoming holiday in Scotland. Triple-layered masks only are acceptable up there.
Nope, anything goes really (even Buffs/scarves are fine). Mine certainly isn't triple-layered.
Then again, half the people I've seen appear to have missed the bit about covering their noses... :facepalm:
Post by: rafletcher on 14 July, 2020, 12:11:46 pm
Or you could use alcohol, or diluted bleach
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK214356/
Looks like 30 minutes in a 1:100 dilution is recommended.
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 14 July, 2020, 12:12:39 pm
Post by: Sergeant Pluck on 14 July, 2020, 12:14:21 pm
Everyone knows they are not the be-all and end-all. But the evidence that they help is accumulating. How hard is it to grasp?
Post by: ian on 14 July, 2020, 12:19:54 pm
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 14 July, 2020, 12:32:29 pm
Post by: Sergeant Pluck on 14 July, 2020, 12:39:42 pm
I'm not super-bothered either way. I don't think there's much, if any evidence, that they're very effective so there's an element of theatre, go about your business you'll be fine, you're wearing a facemask after all.
There’s none at all that they are veryeffective. But I think we should be doing all we can, including things that look as if they may help even to a limited degree. Add that to all the other things that work to a limited degree...
Post by: Jaded on 14 July, 2020, 01:58:00 pm
Post by: fimm on 14 July, 2020, 04:48:30 pm
...
After each use, you must wash the face covering at 60 degrees centigrade or dispose of it safely."
What? We've just been washing our (made with TLC by my mother) cloth masks along with our hands when we get home. 60 degrees C water does not come out of the tap. How come soap and tap water kills virus on your hands but not on a mask?
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 14 July, 2020, 05:02:39 pm
Or could be it's not to do with viruses but bacteria which would otherwise grow in a warm, moist environment. Dunno...
Post by: Lightning Phil on 14 July, 2020, 05:09:46 pm
Not according to this from gov.scot
After each use, you must wash the face covering at 60 degrees centigrade or dispose of it safely."
I am using my Buffs but Buffwear says that original Buffs should not be washed hotter than 30°C, so that rules out Buffs as masks in Scotland as I will not be disposing them after I have worn them.
Doesn’t really matter if you have enough buffs. The virus only lives for so many hours (72 hours ish) on the fabric, so can wash one buff as normal, then leave it, and use another etc. So three or four buffs rotated over a week, would be fine if just using to go into shops etc.
The other thing you could do is use a miox water purifier to create a solution that’ll kill the virus. Put buff in that before its main wash. I still have one from when I travelled round the world, and about same size as a large penlight torch!
Post by: ian on 14 July, 2020, 05:15:29 pm
Don't mess. Buy an autoclave.
I remember my gran used to boil-wash tissues on the stovetop. With hindsight, it explains the distinctive taste of her soups.
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 14 July, 2020, 05:30:23 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50112609677_6aafd1ca44.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jmhdXF)2020-07-14_05-23-08 (https://flic.kr/p/2jmhdXF) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr
Post by: rafletcher on 14 July, 2020, 05:43:43 pm
...
After each use, you must wash the face covering at 60 degrees centigrade or dispose of it safely."
What? We've just been washing our (made with TLC by my mother) cloth masks along with our hands when we get home. 60 degrees C water does not come out of the tap. How come soap and tap water kills virus on your hands but not on a mask?
Actually, I’d recommend dunking in boiling water, or steaming, for 10 minutes. That’s should sanitise most things ;D
More soberly, it would seem the advice in Scotland is as random as it is in the UK.
Post by: ian on 14 July, 2020, 06:32:32 pm
Post by: Andrij on 14 July, 2020, 07:08:24 pm
Then again, half the people I've seen appear to have missed the bit about covering their noses... :facepalm:
There's a image doing the rounds (which of course I can't find now) comparing wearing masks as stated above with wearing underwear (for men). I'm sure everyone can come up with a mental picture.
Post by: phantasmagoriana on 14 July, 2020, 07:15:07 pm
Then again, half the people I've seen appear to have missed the bit about covering their noses... :facepalm:
There's a image doing the rounds (which of course I can't find now) comparing wearing masks as stated above with wearing underwear (for men). I'm sure everyone can come up with a mental picture.
I've been thinking about printing that one out and putting posters of it out and about! ;D
Post by: De Sisti on 14 July, 2020, 07:16:49 pm
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 14 July, 2020, 07:42:30 pm
Is the yacf still selling buffs?https://sites.google.com/site/paudax/ as per https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=94501.0 for Audax buffs.
I thought YACF buffs were long gone.
Post by: Andrij on 14 July, 2020, 08:29:54 pm
Then again, half the people I've seen appear to have missed the bit about covering their noses... :facepalm:
There's a image doing the rounds (which of course I can't find now) comparing wearing masks as stated above with wearing underwear (for men). I'm sure everyone can come up with a mental picture.
I've been thinking about printing that one out and putting posters of it out and about! ;D
:thumbsup:
Post by: Kim on 14 July, 2020, 09:00:05 pm
Or could be it's not to do with viruses but bacteria which would otherwise grow in a warm, moist environment. Dunno...
Yes, I think that's generic advice based on killing somewhat hardier bacteria. (There's a reasonable case for not cultivating non-COVID nasties on your mask, especially if they're being shared between users in a healthcare setting.)
FWIW, I've been washing my Buffs at 40C with no ill effect.
Post by: andrewc on 14 July, 2020, 09:53:46 pm
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 14 July, 2020, 10:49:14 pm
FWIW, I've been washing my Buffs at 40C with no ill effect.On them or you? ;D
Post by: Shreds on 14 July, 2020, 11:27:53 pm
https://www.jspsafety.com/link/en/respiratory-protection/powercap-infinity-papr/powercap-infinity-complete-unit/a/?parm=NOM041%20%20%20%20%20aeabab&cat=JSP
Currently favoured by dentists!
Does not entirely protect you, and differing filters are relevant for vapours and gases. The size of the Covid 19 virus is 0.12 microns. That is pretty small, much smaller than the holes in a scarf wrapped around your face, although how many of these microns are necessary to infect and cause the disease, is another question?
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 15 July, 2020, 08:46:53 am
Post by: MikeFromLFE on 15 July, 2020, 08:59:16 am
I believe the scullery maid washes the staff Buffs here at 60c and the Buffs are still fine.
FWIW, I've been washing my Buffs at 40C with no ill effect.
I have a good choice of designs from the trendy YACF design through to the popular and babe-magnet EU flag for days when I'm feeling a bit bold.
Pity I never splashed out on a AUK buff.
Post by: phantasmagoriana on 15 July, 2020, 09:07:29 am
Post by: MikeFromLFE on 15 July, 2020, 01:33:55 pm
I'm wrong.I believe the scullery maid washes the staff Buffs here at 60c and the Buffs are still fine.
FWIW, I've been washing my Buffs at 40C with no ill effect.
I've been down to inspect the coppers in the servant's quarters and the girl down there says that they get washed at 40 or 50 depending on whatever else is getting washed at the time.
Post by: Regulator on 15 July, 2020, 02:07:07 pm
Two or three ply is recommended, depending on the material(s) used. I've got some two ply that can be used on their own or with a PM2.5 filter.
Do not use a face mask/covering with a valve (as shown in the ad put out by the Department for Health and Social Care - see this tweet from Trish Greeenhalgh (https://twitter.com/trishgreenhalgh/status/1283040983546986500)) as they defeat the purpose of face coverings.
Trish is, basically, *the* authority on face coverings. Well worth following her on Twitter.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 15 July, 2020, 02:21:06 pm
Post by: Kim on 15 July, 2020, 02:25:39 pm
Post by: Regulator on 15 July, 2020, 03:10:28 pm
Interesting, hadn't heard that. I just had a look at mine that has a valve and I suspect the valve is basically cosmetic; there are two layers of cloth behind it and it's in the area covered by the PM2.5 filter, if I put that in.
The valve will still increase the ability for virus particles to escape and therefore the mask should not be used in the context of Covid19 face covering.
Valved masks need to remain in the clinical realm where their use in relation to Covid19 is appropriate.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 15 July, 2020, 03:32:51 pm
Post by: Regulator on 15 July, 2020, 04:51:30 pm
TBH I don't think mine would be allowed in a clinical setting... it fits in better with one of Roger's special dressing up parties!
I agree. Proper valved masks are only really useful in clinical settings. Most of what you can buy on the internet aren't really fit for purpose.
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 15 July, 2020, 05:49:20 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50116189561_476376ec91.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jmAz8P)2020-07-15_05-43-21 (https://flic.kr/p/2jmAz8P) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr
Post by: andrewc on 15 July, 2020, 09:21:52 pm
Post by: Zipperhead on 15 July, 2020, 10:21:27 pm
In the case of surgical masks, I find ones with ties to be much better than ear loops. However, if needs must (current stock seems to be ear loops) I use a face mask ear protector like this:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B085759SFH/ref=crt_ewc_title_huc_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A1N6ZQKZEV2MI8
This improves the fit and helps to avoid getting my bloody hearing aids caught when I take a mask off.
Thank you for that very useful bit of information. I've just taken some round to my father, who proceeded to tell me how he had nearly lots one of his hearing aids when he went to the bank.
He's now a happy person (alright, a less miserable person)
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 16 July, 2020, 01:23:37 pm
Quote
Lip reading masks, same core shape as our classic mask but with a clear window to allow lip reading. Plain colours only as patterns can hinder lip reading. Please get in contact to discuss colours as we are making this item to order.
Post by: Andrew Br on 16 July, 2020, 10:04:37 pm
The latest one arrived today, Pingu models..
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50116189561_476376ec91.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jmAz8P)2020-07-15_05-43-21 (https://flic.kr/p/2jmAz8P) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr
Joy Divison
Want.
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 16 July, 2020, 10:17:51 pm
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FACE-MASK-JOY-DIVISION-PULSAR-UNKNOWN-PLEASURES-WASHABLE-REUSABLE-UK/202997007565
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 16 July, 2020, 10:22:43 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50120577926_bd2d463e63.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jmZ4Dh)2020-07-16_10-20-51 (https://flic.kr/p/2jmZ4Dh) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on 17 July, 2020, 12:03:59 am
These arrived today. Elastic round the back of the head, think I'll be changing that as I have enough issues with my scalp as it is.To be worn with this jersey?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50120577926_bd2d463e63.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2jmZ4Dh)
(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1002/5432/products/Day-Of-the-Living-Womens_Back_360x.jpg?v=1575768451)
Post by: Mrs Pingu on 17 July, 2020, 08:12:06 am
Post by: MikeFromLFE on 17 July, 2020, 07:03:32 pm
Is a gimp mask with zip acceptable?
Post by: Pingu on 17 July, 2020, 07:06:43 pm
Post by: MikeFromLFE on 17 July, 2020, 07:23:55 pm
Acceptable for what?My friend didn't say.
Post by: L CC on 17 July, 2020, 08:34:33 pm
Is the yacf still selling buffs?
I did the last order in 2012, and could do so again but there would need to be sufficient interest- I need at least 50 for it to be worthwhile.
Post by: FifeingEejit on 18 July, 2020, 11:08:49 am
Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
Post by: fuaran on 18 July, 2020, 01:22:17 pm
Asking for a friend :Now available from Planet X.
Is a gimp mask with zip acceptable?
(https://www.planetx.co.uk/imgs/products/px/950x600_constWH/CLPXCFFFM-GIMP_P2.jpg)
Post by: arabella on 21 July, 2020, 10:24:59 am
I used the govt approved 15cm x 25 cm design instructions.
One is 2-layer and ties, the other 3-layer, with elastic - simply because of what I dug out of my box of haberdashery stuff (like your box/pile of random cycle bits, only with zips/buttons/ribbons/elastic/etc). I may do a plain one if the fancy ever takes me but 3 can be rotated daily if it comes to it. Though I try to avoid shops in general anyway.
& no, I haven't worked out how to stop glasses misting up. Luckily I don't use them for close up, which tends to be when I need to speak.
Post by: Ashaman42 on 22 July, 2020, 01:32:13 pm
I'm mostly relying on distance and keeping shop trips to a minimum.
Post by: Kim on 22 July, 2020, 05:19:16 pm
does anyone else have a rag bag any more?
I think mine technically goes by the title "trousers drawer" :-[
Post by: frankly frankie on 22 July, 2020, 06:27:18 pm
I have a (yacf) buff. And another buff (winter mode) and I've repurposed a couple of shirts (it's OK, they were already in the rag bag - does anyone else have a rag bag any more?).
I used the govt approved 15cm x 25 cm design instructions.
I find a cotton T-shirt sleeve is quick and easy - sew the cut end up and turn inside out for that professionally-tailored look, leave the other end open to add an insert if desired, knicker-elastic to the corners.
But I'm generally wearing a buff to go into supermarkets.
Post by: hulver on 23 July, 2020, 12:54:38 pm
& no, I haven't worked out how to stop glasses misting up. Luckily I don't use them for close up, which tends to be when I need to speak.
Tissue folded up tucked in the top works for me to stop the misting, with a Buff. Not tried that trick with the mask yet.