South(ish) of France(ish) by train.

[Basil]

40 years ago this October June I proposed to Mrs B in a secluded cove by Saint-Raphael. We'd caught a sleeper from Paris and we'd sort of like to repeat the experience.
I'm a bit overwhelmed looking on tinternet.
Anyone got any suggestions on where I should be looking?  Or tips or recent experiences?
We'd like to avoid flying, but won't rule it out completely.
We're pretty relaxed and flexible on the final destination.

Edited to correct date.  End of October was our actual wedding date.

[Wowbagger]

Are you hoping to take a bike or two?

[Basil]

Are you hoping to take a bike or two?

Absolutely not!

[Canardly]

Have a look at Ouigo trains from Lille. Amazing value all online (no frills or catering tho' but). Otherwise Eurostar goes direct to the South of France. For some reason trains to  Saint-Raphael seem to depart  from Paris. As usual, the most expensive bit is the UK.

[Basil]

OP edited to correct date error.   End of October will be our 40th wedding anniversary.  Checking traditional wedding anniversary gifts suggests that I need to buy Mrs B a curry.
 

[lissotriton]

Seat 61 will tell you which trains go where. Looks like there is a sleeper from Paris to Nice. https://www.seat61.com/France.htm

Or if you want something a bit fancier, there's the Venice Simplon Orient Express. https://www.belmond.com/trains/europe/venice-simplon-orient-express/

[Cudzoziemiec]

OP edited to correct date error.   End of October will be our 40th wedding anniversary.  Checking traditional wedding anniversary gifts suggests that I need to buy Mrs B a curry.
 

You want a romantic return trip to Brum, then. 

[yoav]

This may not sound logical but take a look at the Deutsche Bahn website (www.bahn.com). Not only they have an English website but they cover all of Europe and much easier to use than the SNCF website for planning journeys.

[perpetual dan]

There aren’t as many sleeper trains in France these days, but (as above) seat61 is your friend. https://www.raileurope.com/en is also pretty good for specifics, provided you’re in the booking window for your trains.

[robgul]

My suggestion would be :

Take the train to London and then Eurostar to Lille - stay overnight* - several nice hotels and restaurants near the station.

Take the TGV from Lille to Marseille - it's fast and comfortable (1st class is cheap as chips) with ever-changing countryside - then either stay the night in what is an interesting and lively city, or continue the same day on the coasal train towards Nice alighting at St Raphael.

I've not been on a French sleeper train for many years but the advent of the TGV has made journeys so much faster that it's all doable in a day.  We've been to/from the S of France by train 4 or 5 times in the last 8 years, both direct Eurostar and changing at Lille (just avoid the Paris change as station to station is hot and sweaty on the Metro) - a painless experience

Bookings are simple to make with trainline.eu  (they bought the excellent capitaine-train website) - and I think there are old-git prices too!

*as you live in the back of beyond it may be simpler to stay overnight in London, get an early Eurostar and just change at Lille - it's only a change of platform - onto the TGV (they used to run a Eurostar service direct to Marseille but that stopped in 2020 - it may be back for summer of 2023?)

[ian]

We regularly take the train to the south of France (we'll be going to Avignon in August). I don't think they're doing the through trains at the moment, so we break in Lille or Paris (we usually do Paris on the way back and make a weekend of it).

I confess we splurge on the first class (or whatever they call it these days) experience, but regardless, it's a far more pleasant way to travel than being cooped up in a flying tin can, and leaving London mid-morning usually gets you to the south of France in time for evening drinks.

[pcolbeck]

They don't do the direct fro St Pancreas to Avignon any-more. We have done this trip several times and are doing it again at the end of August.

St Pancrease -> Lille Europe
Lille Europe -> Avignon TGV

The Avignon train continuous to Nice and terminates in Marseilles.

You can do the whole trip in a day easily if you can get to St Pancreas for the first Eurostar. (Lille to Avignon is only 4.5 hours). If you cant the have an overnight in Lille its lovely.

Things to watch out for:

Most TGV for the south go from Lille Europe but a few go from Lille Flanders. They are just about next door to each other but be sure to check.

I you are going to Avignon and want to hire a car make sure the train goes to Avignon TGV not Avignon Central (most TGV go to Avignon TGV not Central but some don't). Avignon Central is a little station with a tiny car park and one car rental office. When an entire TGV disembarks the rental office is overwhelmed and the queue stakes ages not helped by the fact that they can never find the cars as there isn't room in the car park so they end up dumped in the streets all around. Avignon TGV is on the outskirts and modern with a big car park and lots of car rental places, much easier.

The Ouigo TGV services are really cheap but don't have a buffet car so remember to buy drinks and snacks at Lille before bordering. There is also a charge like on an flight for more then one large piece of luggage and a weight limit. The normal TGVs have a buffet car.

When booking a TGV choose seats on the upper deck for a better view (nearly all the ones that go to the south are double deckers now).

If you got to Languedoc Roussillon (Rhone to Spain) rather than Provence (Rhone to Italy) everything will quite a lot cheaper and less crowded. Pezennas is lovely  or if you want somewhere right on the coast Collioure is really nice. Montpelier is highly recommended if you want somewhere larger.

Avignon in itself is beautiful and a good place to get the train to drive to anywhere in either Provence or Languedoc.

[Little Jim]

We went to Marseilles on the train about 5 years ago.  It was brilliant.  Not only do you avoid all the hassle of airports but you have plenty of leg room, can get up and walk around when you want and you get off right in the middle of the city that you are visiting rather than some shitty airport that is miles from where you want to be (London Stanstead?).  We will definitely use the train a lot more in the future, and we have just come back from Northern Italy on the train which was excellent.  I am not allowed to book things like foreign travel because it is assumed that I will mess it up but SWMBO uses trainline.com for the tickets and they have been great to use, and as previously mentioned Seat 61 is also an excellent source of information.

[pcolbeck]

The Italian TGV equivalents are fantastic. Very stylish and comfy. Used one between Venice and Florence a few years ago.

[Little Jim]

The Italian TGV equivalents are fantastic. Very stylish and comfy. Used one between Venice and Florence a few years ago.

Yes, we used one to go from Florence to Turin and it was great but although they do run from Turin to Paris the times didn't work out and so we got the Ouigo TGV instead.  Nothing wrong with it at all but it was definitely looking "tired" inside and had obviously done a few miles whereas the Italian train (not a Fecciarosso) was almost brand new and very smart and clean.

[Basil]

You're all being fantastically helpful and informative.  Thanks. I'm glad I asked.

[andrewc]

A second vote for an overnight in Lille. It's a nice little city .   I stayed at https://www.hotel-brueghel-lille.com/


When I retire one of the things I intend to do is get a Eurail pass and do a few long train journeys.  I'm assembling the Portillo wardrobe in preparation!

[fimm]

Mr fimm went to Toulon in the following way - train Edinburgh to London, Eurostar to Paris, night in Paris. If it is your wedding anniversary Paris is nicer than Lille, perhaps? TGV from Paris direct to Toulon.

[Basil]

Mr fimm went to Toulon in the following way - train Edinburgh to London, Eurostar to Paris, night in Paris. If it is your wedding anniversary Paris is nicer than Lille, perhaps? TGV from Paris direct to Toulon.

Thanks, but we've been to Paris a couple of times.  I lived there for a few years, so I've definitely had enough.

[pcolbeck]

Lyon is a possibility. A lot of the TGVs from Lille to the south stop there.

[ian]

Lyon is a possibility. A lot of the TGVs from Lille to the south stop there.

We've done this a few times too – Lyon is a great city to spend a couple of days in.

[Basil]

You do realise that Lyon is twinned with Birmingham?   

[SteveC]

I wouldn't worry - Anger (beautiful city on the Loire and all that) is twinned with Wigan!

[robgul]

. . .  when you get east of about Frejus the S of France becomes rather more expensive - Bandol or Cassis are both pleasant places to stay for a few days, and better value.

[Quisling]

This is an excellent resource which summarises the routes available for flight free European trips.  There is a wealth of other useful stuff on the website too.
https://www.greentraveller.co.uk/flight-free-journey-planner