Pedalcover insurance & flats - a cautionary tale

[Mrs Pingu]

Just in case anyone else here currently has or is intending to have Buildings & contents insurance for a flat with Pedalcover, their new underwriter doesn't provide buildings cover for flats.

I only found this out too late after renewing (we've had no buildings cover for the last week) when I found the buildings section had been removed from my policy docs, despite the renewal email including buildings. Seems it was automatically removed by the underwriters system when I renewed and it was not flagged up.

[grams]

Don’t the freeholders arrange cover for the whole building?

[Feanor]

Don’t the freeholders arrange cover for the whole building?

What is this 'freehold' of which you speak?

[Mrs Pingu]

Don’t the freeholders arrange cover for the whole building?

This is Scotland, it disnae work like that here. There's no freehold vs leasehold.

[Jurek]

Pedalcover's new underwriter appear to do as they please.
Included in which was telling me that they no longer wanted my custom.
I got similar cover from M&S for a quarter of Pedalcover's last premium.

[salar55]

Questions
How much is insurance today for cover with no exemptions, house, normal cycling and foreign travel? I don't insure bikes, had a quote many years ago for an expensive bike and reckoned I could buy another one every 5 years by not buying insurance.

[andrewc]

They seem _very_ keen to retain my business,  I've had multiple emails, text messages & a phone call asking me to update my details.


The chap on the phone said they'd need receipts for my bikes, or receipts for the parts used to build up from a bare frame.   


They are also concerned about my roof ,  I don't know why as I'm sure my policy is contents only.   Buildings insurance is provided by my service charge. 



"I have noticed that the building your flat is in is down on your current policy as having 100% flat roof.
 
If that is correct I will need to refer to the insurers for approval. To help me do so, please can you let me know which floor you are on and how many floors there are in the buildings in total?" 

[rafletcher]

The chap on the phone said they'd need receipts for my bikes, or receipts for the parts used to build up from a bare frame.   

Yeah, thats what put me off - but how many other uderwriters will say the same when it come to an actual claim? Probably best of not insuring the bikes I have, all of which were self-built, and a lot of the parts were second hand.

[nuttycyclist]

Questions
How much is insurance today for cover with no exemptions, house, normal cycling and foreign travel? I don't insure bikes, had a quote many years ago for an expensive bike and reckoned I could buy another one every 5 years by not buying insurance.

I have a similar mentality when looking at quotes, e.g. every white appliance or similar where at the checkout you get asked if you want insurance.    If I took that monthly fee and transferred it to a bank account, then by the time I needed a claim (assuming not warranty covered, and not all items failing at the same time) then I'd probably be able to buy a new item.     

Insurance comes into its own should there be a massive claim, but.

[robgul]

The real question here seems to be why the hell are you using Pedalcover - the mainstream buildings/contents insurers for the most part will include/add bikes at very little extra cost.

[Paul H]

I don't insure bikes, had a quote many years ago for an expensive bike and reckoned I could buy another one every 5 years by not buying insurance.

Things may have changed since your quote. The value of my insured bikes is equivalent to 103 years years of premiums, or between 21 and 34 years for a single bike, the payout last year for an accident damaged frameset and front wheel was about 19 years.  This is with TSB Pick and Protect which is a stand alone policy, Barclays now offer something similar.

[rafletcher]

The real question here seems to be why the hell are you using Pedalcover - the mainstream buildings/contents insurers for the most part will include/add bikes at very little extra cost.

Absolutely, but has any actually claimed recently against one of these policies? Do the underwriters pay up with no evidence of the cost of home-built bikes? Surely they’ll want to see all the receipts and some (like me) won’t have them all neatly filed ready to go. Bike insurance works well for off the peg, unmodified ones, not so well for anything else.

[nuttycyclist]

I don't insure bikes, had a quote many years ago for an expensive bike and reckoned I could buy another one every 5 years by not buying insurance.

Things may have changed since your quote. The value of my insured bikes is equivalent to 103 years years of premiums, or between 21 and 34 years for a single bike, the payout last year for an accident damaged frameset and front wheel was about 19 years.  This is with TSB Pick and Protect which is a stand alone policy, Barclays now offer something similar.

I don't need an answer, but was the accident which damaged the frameset of your own fault or another's?

I believe I am covered under various policies should I cause an incident whilst cycling <makes note to check> thus indemnifying me against the expletive insurance companies who prefer to write a car off instead of repair it, but now I wonder where my non-cycling daughter stands should she cause same situation when crossing the road as she is not insured    <she's standing in the middle of the road you idiot - ed>    (but ed, what about the other 99% of the pedestrians that haven't taken out insurance?),

If I cause damage to myself, as I did more than once whilst offroading, I accept it as my fault.   If somebody else causes damage to me whilst I am out then I will be cross, but hey ho and hopefully they will cough up - as they have more than once as the bill for a new wheel from the LBS is cheaper than loss of no-claims for a new driver / new headset and pedal is easier than losing the taxi operator license / etc.   

The volume of money I have paid into insurance over the years is significantly lower than it should have been.  The volume of money I have claimed is significantly lower than anything paid out (and I know that should I make a claim then the subsequent years input will be much higher to refund the insurance company).     Others I know that have had made a claim get significantly lower payment than the item's net worth, or no payment at all due to smallprint.

My house insurance is an extremely old policy but it is unlimited cover - and I bet should I claim for all buildings and contents I don't get it.   What monetary value is on sentimental items and actually getting back Grandad's tool?    (£4.50 in the antique store the other day)

I am still at a net loss to the insurance companies.

[Paul H]

Bike insurance works well for off the peg, unmodified ones, not so well for anything else.

Has that been your experience? The claim I made last year wasn't complicated, required a LBS to do an accident report and a quote for the parts, wasn't an OTP bike, three year old frameset, fifteen year old SON hub. 

[Paul H]

I don't insure bikes, had a quote many years ago for an expensive bike and reckoned I could buy another one every 5 years by not buying insurance.

Things may have changed since your quote. The value of my insured bikes is equivalent to 103 years years of premiums, or between 21 and 34 years for a single bike, the payout last year for an accident damaged frameset and front wheel was about 19 years.  This is with TSB Pick and Protect which is a stand alone policy, Barclays now offer something similar.

I don't need an answer, but was the accident which damaged the frameset of your own fault or another's?

Mine
https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=116321.msg2520429#msg2520429

[nuttycyclist]

I wasn't expecting an answer, but thank-you anyway.

The biggest/last/memorable shunt I had was a u-turning black cab out of the traffic jam I was overtaking.  I t-boned it as I couldn't stop, but I think the majority of the audience would agree that the fault was not of the cyclist riding down a road but that of the driver u-turning out of a queue.      Proper donk as I dented the roof as I went over.   The "little old lady" in the rear found it all amusing, as clearly not her fault and nobody injured.  Driver admitted blame so quickly that I suspected something already on his record.

Damage was a headset and a pedal, bearings gone in both due to impact.   I asked for £x for the pedals, having paid £5x originally (they were old so I replaced like for like as insurance companies do) and taxi driver's wife went ballistic.  It was so funny, not so much that she thought a bicycle could cost so much to repair (I was asking for less than £100 for the whole lot due to my generosity) but that she had to phone me to protect her partner's license and livelihood.    Honestly mate, man up and grow a pair.      It's been over a decade now, I've kept my end of the bargain that "that's the end of it", and even now that I've broken silence nobody can trace you.

[robgul]

I was prompted to swivel round on my chair and get our House Insurance file out - it's a 4 bed, detached house - unlimited contents premium is £72 for this year - that includes bicycles to the value of £10,000* with £5,000 of that for unspecified bikes at not more than £500 each & the remainder for 3 specified bikes (total value stated at £5,000) with a £250 excess. There are no stupid "solid-gold-weighs 50kg " lock requirements when not at home.

The "special offer" bike insurance policies just make no sense - the CTC & BC offers are especially crazy for premiums.  OK, it does depend on where you live but even so . . . .

* reality is that I have the 3 specified bikes, a pub hack that's worth £50 max and my wife's retro Peugeot mixte which is worth about £150.

[grams]

Has that been your experience? The claim I made last year wasn't complicated, required a LBS to do an accident report and a quote for the parts, wasn't an OTP bike, three year old frameset, fifteen year old SON hub.

I think theft is the bigger issue, because you no longer have the bike to prove what you had.

[Mrs Pingu]

The real question here seems to be why the hell are you using Pedalcover - the mainstream buildings/contents insurers for the most part will include/add bikes at very little extra cost.

I'm with Pedalcover because when M&S Insurance stopped doing decent cover for bikes that's who many people on this very forum were recommending at the time, and I've not bothered shopping around since then.

I was prompted to swivel round on my chair and get our House Insurance file out - it's a 4 bed, detached house - unlimited contents premium is £72 for this year - that includes bicycles to the value of £10,000* with £5,000 of that for unspecified bikes at not more than £500 each & the remainder for 3 specified bikes (total value stated at £5,000) with a £250 excess. There are no stupid "solid-gold-weighs 50kg " lock requirements when not at home.

Well go and be useful and tell us who that's with then?

I wasn't asked for any receipts for our bikes BTW.

[Russell]

One issue that I have with PedalCover is that they only offer cover for 30 days unoccupied.  For people in work I guess that's not a problem but for retired folk who want to go on extended tours it's a big issue.

[Feanor]

I am still at a net loss to the insurance companies.

That's kind of the way it needs to be for the majority of people, though, isn't it?
That's how insurance works.

It's not supposed to be an investment vehicle...

[Jurek]

As someone on here, who was formerly a financial adviser, once told me: If you are in a financial position to replace the item in the event of a total loss, then paying out for insurance makes no sense.
My bikes are no longer insured when away from home.
They are insured if stolen from home, coincidentally, as part of the contents policy.
I'm comfortable with that.

[Paul H]

Has that been your experience? The claim I made last year wasn't complicated, required a LBS to do an accident report and a quote for the parts, wasn't an OTP bike, three year old frameset, fifteen year old SON hub.

I think theft is the bigger issue, because you no longer have the bike to prove what you had.

I hope not to find out, but my experience shows that they have no problem treating a bike as a collection of parts rather than a single entity. In the case of theft, I'd expect a bike shop to quote for a replacement based on the the evidence provided, I have enough photos to establish what they are.

[rafletcher]

Has that been your experience? The claim I made last year wasn't complicated, required a LBS to do an accident report and a quote for the parts, wasn't an OTP bike, three year old frameset, fifteen year old SON hub.

I think theft is the bigger issue, because you no longer have the bike to prove what you had.

I hope not to find out, but my experience shows that they have no problem treating a bike as a collection of parts rather than a single entity. In the case of theft, I'd expect a bike shop to quote for a replacement based on the the evidence provided, I have enough photos to establish what they are.

That’s not an option with a theft, which is why most people have insurance.

[Feanor]

As someone on here, who was formerly a financial adviser, once told me: If you are in a financial position to replace the item in the event of a total loss, then paying out for insurance makes no sense.

Hmm, I think that's an over-simplification.
Self-insuring is certainly an option.

Even if I can afford to just replace, I may decide that a low-rate cash bleed which will disappear into the background noise is preferable to a sudden hit.

Depends on the individual's risk appetite and other things.