Are we our own worst enemy?

[Zipperhead]

I say we, but obviously I don't mean any of us because we've all got more sense.

Yesterday I decided to meet a couple of the others at Hyde Park corner (enjoying a bit of sunshine and watching the sights was more appealing than staying late at work and having a shorted distance).

So I got myself and ice cream and sat down to watch and wait.

For those that live in parts forrin, Hyde Park Corner is a large roundabout with a footpath across the middle of it, which cyclists are allowed to use.

Every time the lights changed at the top of Constitution Hill to allow the cars out (and pedestrians and cyclist to cross onto HPC) a stream of cyclist would come along, mostly wearing "safety equipment", but all of them sprinting like buggery towards the other side.

There was no way that they could get to the other side in time to catch the crossing light there, they just ended up stopping and waiting.

Meantime, in there short journey across the poor pedestrians were subjected to being in the middle of a bicycle grand prix, with the front runners doing about 20mph, the slow ones at least 15mph.

There were a few cyclists going the other way as well, and despite the excellent visibility, there were a few near misses as both sets tried to take the shortest line and ended up in conflict with each other.

[Julian]

This is the nearest some of these people have been to success since they came 3rd in the egg and spoon race at primary school.  I bet they have an internal commentary in their head:  and he's making a break for it!  Nigel Throppleton in the lead, tearing past the peloton... just watch him go!

When it rains they can't take the bike and have to go back to shunting old ladies out of the way on the tube with oversized suitcase-on-wheels because they're that damn important.

[Wendy]

This is one reason I go around the roundabout, not across the middle.

[Notsototalnewbie]

I only ever attempted to use the route through the middle a handful of times before deciding I'd have an accident sooner or later, and using the outside instead (which is much quicker anyway). Facing all those cyclists coming towards me at speed and in an unpredictable manner freaked me out.

[nuttycyclist]

I go round the junction cos I find it easier than trying to get out from the kerb through four lanes to the centre of Constitution Hill to bump onto the island to get to the crossing.  It is a very strange layout.

Conversely, when rushing to Liverpuddlian Street in desperation to get home, I exit the park under the Arch, see the green light for me and flick out onto the roundabout...  only to then take avoiding action through all the traffic racing at me around the roundabout as they have a green light.

Once out of London I'm ok as we have so few pyscho-paths here that there are no anti-cyclist conflict points built in.

[Charlotte]

When I have to do HPC, I tend to use the road.  I think it's safer in the long run.

[Tiger]

Every time the lights changed at the top of Constitution Hill to allow the cars out (and pedestrians and cyclist to cross onto HPC) a stream of cyclist would come along, mostly wearing "safety equipment", but all of them sprinting like buggery towards the other side.

There was no way that they could get to the other side in time to catch the crossing light there, they just ended up stopping and waiting.

This is part of my daily commute. There is a reason for the apparent lemming-like rush. All the regular morning commuters know that when the lights change at the top of the HPC system, only by sprinting can one hope to get across and out onto constitution hill - because the lights on the other side of the system are in sequence, and don't quite allow enough time for a measured crossing of HPC and an exit onto C Hill. So either one sprints it or sits and waits for another very long delay, due to the low priority of the crossing Vs the main flow - it is a long wait. Hence the wacky races accident waiting to happen. The situation is worsened by the sheer number of cyclists now at that junction - far more than theshared use pathway was intended to carry, and the fact that so many of them are complete cycling oiks.  

Two weeks ago one of them overtook me going down Constitution hill - itself a grave mark of disrespect - hammering along and as the lights changed outside buck house and the worlds tourists flowed into the road, instead of stopping, or even slowing an iota he jinked onto the pavement (at very high speed) with his arse in the air, and clipped some poor bloke with a mobile phone just walking along, scattering his phone some yards away.  That is someone who should not be on a bike at all.

[juliet]

I take that junction in both directions daily, & just tolerate the wait. 

Despite my usual attitude to cycling facilities etc, I'd never actually considered going round the junction - it always appears pretty hairy (I'm travelling at rush-hour).  Might give it a go tonight/tomorrow.

[Notsototalnewbie]

I used to think it looked hairy, but the traffic on it is usually moving slower than you think. As long as you take your lane it's ok. I don't dawdle on there if I can help it,  but have seen an old lady on a sit up and beg serenely cycling around in no particular hurry!

[Julian]

It was part of my commute for two years, and the only hairiness to it is f*ckwits changing lane suddenly, without checking their mirrors.  Usually because they're bored waiting, so they do it at speed and with no warning. 

Now that I commute round the arse end of Kilburn, I actually miss doing HPC twice a day.

[Wowbagger]

HPC always frightens the life out of me.

[nicknack]

Back in the dim and distant, I used to find Marble Arch more of a piggy than HPC. What's it like now?

[Wendy]

Back in the dim and distant, I used to find Marble Arch more of a piggy than HPC. What's it like now?

Yes, I think Marble Arch is slightly more hairy than HPC, as is Vauxhall Gyratory.  HPC is alright, the biggest problem is going from Hyde Park to Grosvenor Place, and getting taxis going all the way across to the right hand lane, followed by all the way back left to duck down Constitution Hill.  If you're aware of this, it's no biggie.

[Greenbank]

I've always thought of Vauxhall Gyratory and E&C to be worse than either Marble Arch or HPC.

But then that's purely subjective (and also because South London is better than the grimy North).

[Ian H]

The topic heading suggests we're lumping all cyclists together. 

It does seem to be the case that, if you create shared pedestrian/cyclist facilities, the cyclists using them will behave like pedestrians on wheels.

[Wendy]

Close Ian, they will do that, but some will also be pushy arsehole cyclists like the worst of the drivers we come across.

[juliet]

E&C is pretty straightforward IME but that might just be daily experience for 6 years talking

[Ian H]

Close Ian, they will do that, but some will also be pushy arsehole cyclists like the worst of the drivers we come across.

True. Unfortunately.

There's a little voice in my head says 'mandatory cycling tests', but I realise that would be impractical and, for encouraging people on to bikes, counterproductive.

[border-rider]

HPC always frightens the life out of me.

I used to do it every day before the cyclepath was there, and before the stupid pedestrian/horse/cyclist lights at the top of Constitution hill were put in

On my now occasional trips to London, I still ride round HPC on the road.  It's fine.

[Wendy]

E&C is pretty straightforward IME but that might just be daily experience for 6 years talking

That was my impression too, though I've only done it a few times on bike.

[alexb]

E&C is OK IF you know where you're going.
If not, then trying to read the signs, whilst dodging five lanes of traffic is a f*cking nightmare. Add a few potholes and it's a real buzz (in the negative sense).

[Regulator]

E&C? 

[Greenbank]

Infanta de Castile (although that's a myth that it got it's name from the Spanish Princesses).

a.k.a. Elephant and Castle roundabout.

[Regulator]

Ahhhh - I don't find it too bad.  I think Marble Arch is worse - simply because of the phasing of the lights and the bus slip road.

[alan]

The topic heading suggests we're lumping all cyclists together. 

It does seem to be the case that, if you create shared pedestrian/cyclist facilities, the cyclists using them will behave like pedestrians on wheels.

Close Ian, they will do that, but some will also be pushy arsehole cyclists like the worst of the drivers we come across.

The one thing that all these cyclists,peds & drivers have in common is................
human nature..
& it is crap design