Cassette sprocket choices

[Wothill]

Maybe it's only me but shimano cassettes have been a bugbear to me over the last several years. When I first made up a bike with 10 speed the Shimano 12-27 seemed just about perfect (with a triple chainset when I needed a really low gear). It had single tooth gaps all the way to the 17 and the 17 to 19 gap never seemed to big. Nowadays you cant get the 12-27 (at least I never see one) and anything with a big sprocket larger than 25 misses the 16. I don't like the 15-17 gap although I get used to it when touring.
Even with 11-speed the problem is just the same: they add an 11 sprocket and to get 32 at the low end they miss out the 14 too leaving a horrible 12 to 14 gap.
I have discovered Microshift which do a 11-28 (11-speed) with a straight run to 17 and also do an 11-32 which just misses the 16. But I still have a 10-speed bike for which I will use my last 12-27 cassette soon.
Anyone else annoyed by this or am I just being fussy about gaps?
Alf

[sojournermike]

No, you’re not alone. Lots of of us have gearing bugbears.

Whilst I think having a 16 is nice, I hate the 19 to 22 jump that adding seems to entail on a lot of modern cassettes. I’ve moaned before about how the two insistence on starting at 11 spoils the party.

Fwiw, I’ve got a 12 speed groupset and that does at least allow 11-32 with reasonable gaps - not Campag if you hate 19-22 - and. 48/32 chainrings work well with that cassette. Ymmv:)

11-32: 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19, 21, 23, 25, 28, 32

Mike

[hubner]

If you're not racing, I think a 14 is the smallest one would need, even then you'd pedalling downhill or with a gale behind you.

Eg 10 speed
14 15 16 17 18 19 20 22 25 28
14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 25 28

Eg 11 speed
14 15 16 17 18 19 20 22 25 28 32
14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 25 28 32
14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 25 28

[sojournermike]

If you're not racing, I think a 14 is the smallest one would need, even then you'd pedalling downhill or with a gale behind you.

Eg 10 speed
14 15 16 17 18 19 20 22 25 28
14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 25 28

Eg 11 speed
14 15 16 17 18 19 20 22 25 28 32
14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 25 28 32
14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 25 28

Yep, that’s true. But, I did find running a 50:13 top a little bit low in everyday larking around my local, generally rolling, terrain. I obviously didn’t need more gear inches, but I did spin it out quite a lot. 50:12 is much better for me.

[hubner]

50x13 at 100rpm is about 30mph!

[LittleWheelsandBig]

And your point is?

[sojournermike]

50x13 at 100rpm is about 30mph!

Yep - but I tend to keep spinning and there are plenty of little downhill bits where that takes me over 30

[Wothill]

I agree the 11 is not a high priority although on a recumbent it can be nice still to be pedalling at 60 kph but I can do that on my 10-speed with 12/52. With 11 speed the 11 sprocket seems universal; the equivalent top gear would be with a 48T chainring but there are not many modern chainsets with that as an option  unless you use a square taper BB.
Perhaps the worst example of road cassette at present looks like the Shimano 11-34. I think the 11 to 13 gap and would drive me mad. That cassette would be far more cyclist friendly (to 95% of cyclists) if the 11 was a 12.

[drossall]

Technology has advanced a lot since the days when you could wander into a good bike shop and choose individual sprockets off the Regina board...

[sojournermike]

Technology has advanced a lot since the days when you could wander into a good bike shop and choose individual sprockets off the Regina board...

Miche still make useful 10 and 11 speed cassettes, and offer ndividual sprockets if you can find a supplier. Examples of ok 11 speed cassettes include:

12-29
12-30
12-32
12-34

Campagnolo and Praxis both make 48/32 chainsets that are not square taper. Shimano offers GRX in 46/30 and 48/31, which require using a Grx front mech but are fully Road compatible (in 11 speed world). There is choice but it needs a bit of effort and, depending on where you start, money.

[aidan.f]

If anyone wants a little used 11 speed 14-28 Miche cassette - let me know..

[Wothill]

Technology has advanced a lot since the days when you could wander into a good bike shop and choose individual sprockets off the Regina board...

Miche still make useful 10 and 11 speed cassettes, and offer ndividual sprockets if you can find a supplier. Examples of ok 11 speed cassettes include:

12-29
12-30
12-32
12-34

Campagnolo and Praxis both make 48/32 chainsets that are not square taper. Shimano offers GRX in 46/30 and 48/31, which require using a Grx front mech but are fully Road compatible (in 11 speed world). There is choice but it needs a bit of effort and, depending on where you start, money.

Maybe I haven't looked hard enough. Are the Miche cassettes Campag only? I knew about the GRX but had only seen the 46/30 version. In fact I have used 46/30 for touring and it works perfectly with an old shimano triple front derailleur.

[Wothill]

Fwiw, I’ve got a 12 speed groupset and that does at least allow 11-32 with reasonable gaps - not Campag if you hate 19-22 - and. 48/32 chainrings work well with that cassette. Ymmv:)

11-32: 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19, 21, 23, 25, 28, 32

Mike

The Microshift one that I am using is 11-speed and just like your 12-speed except it saves a sprocket in the low half: 11,12,13,14,15,17,19,21,24,28,32

[aidan.f]

Maybe I haven't looked hard enough. Are the Miche cassettes Campag only? I knew about the GRX but had only seen the 46/30 version. In fact I have used 46/30 for touring and it works perfectly with an old shimano triple front derailleur.

Shimano only.. 14-25, 14-27, 11-30, 18,28, 11-32, 11,34 all £44

https://www.merlincycles.com/miche-primato-light-cassette-11-speed-228242.html

[sojournermike]

Maybe I haven't looked hard enough. Are the Miche cassettes Campag only? I knew about the GRX but had only seen the 46/30 version. In fact I have used 46/30 for touring and it works perfectly with an old shimano triple front derailleur.

Shimano only.. 14-25, 14-27, 11-30, 18,28, 11-32, 11,34 all £44

https://www.merlincycles.com/miche-primato-light-cassette-11-speed-228242.html

Campag is also available and you have to look around for suppliers of the ratios you want.

Merlin currently have the cheap offer. But also try Holland Bike Shop, AMA… and various other uk suppliers.

[Andy W]

Im currently awaiting my bike refurb to be completed. It currently has 49/39/26 chainset and tenspeed 13/26 cassette. Using bar end shifters that rattle. Its functional but there is a lot of overlap with the close cassette and triple. I have a relatively low top gear and only just a1:1 bottom gear. At 62 i want to future proof the gear ratios somewhat, therefore the bike is being fitted with Campag 12 speed Chorus, ratios are 48/32 chainset and 11/34 12 speed cassette. I may have to keep the deep drop brakes (RX100). Hopefully the Chorus brakes will fit to complete the Campy groupset.

[ElyDave]

I agree the 11 is not a high priority although on a recumbent it can be nice still to be pedalling at 60 kph but I can do that on my 10-speed with 12/52. With 11 speed the 11 sprocket seems universal; the equivalent top gear would be with a 48T chainring but there are not many modern chainsets with that as an option  unless you use a square taper BB.
Perhaps the worst example of road cassette at present looks like the Shimano 11-34. I think the 11 to 13 gap and would drive me mad. That cassette would be far more cyclist friendly (to 95% of cyclists) if the 11 was a 12.

You get used to it. I rode it around the King Alfred Way with 50/34 on the front last year

[hubner]

50x13 at 100rpm is about 30mph!

And your point is?

If that gear is too low, congrats!

But if it's for pedalling downhill, I would suggest that it's a gear one can do without if it reduces the gaps in the cruising gears. It might be also a good idea to modulate your speed downhill, even using your brakes, to match the road conditions.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

I regularly get above 50 kph on descents and I like to carry momentum into the subsequent rise through rolling terrain. I don’t like waiting for my speed to drop sufficiently before I can start pedalling on an uphill.

Given that almost every cassette has an 11t now, very high gears are difficult to avoid anyway.

[Lightning Phil]

It might be also a good idea to modulate your speed downhill, even using your brakes, to match the road conditions.

Where do you get the idea that descending at 30 mph didn’t match road conditions, given you have no context other than downhill and speed?

[ElyDave]

And then the killings began

 

[sojournermike]

I regularly get above 50 kph on descents and I like to carry momentum into the subsequent rise through rolling terrain. I don’t like waiting for my speed to drop sufficiently before I can start pedalling on an uphill.

Given that almost every cassette has an 11t now, very high gears are difficult to avoid anyway.

There’s a steep local descent where I’ve spun a 52/11 combination up to 80km/h - whilst that was about limit of spin it was also limit of courage due to the urgent need to apply the brakes. I don’t do this often, but I’m with LWaB on this. 50km/h is an entirely normal and reasonable speed on a constantly pedalling rolling ride and getting on it early in a climb is good. 48/11 makes 50 to 65 kph or 30 to 40 mph reasonably accessible when the opportunity arises. I do use bigger sprockets on the flat;)

[chopstick]

I have recently bought a 2nd hand hybrid that's about 25 years old, for commuting to and leaving at the railway station.  It has a 6 speed freewheel of the Shimano "Megarange" variety and it's bloody awful - a 42% jump from 1st to 2nd gear, which makes it useless - just too much of a cadence killer.  I gather it's supposed to be a bail-out gear but I don't see the sense in it.  I end up going onto the little ring of the triple (28/38/48) and using the middle/top end of the freewheel rather than risk accidentally going from 2nd to 1st on the middle ring.

The freewheel is: 14,16,18,21,24,34  and from what I can gather, is about the only 6 speed freewheel available with 34T (though I did have a Suntour 14-34T 5 speed back in the early 80s).

I like low gears (34T or 36T on the back to get a bottom gear of about 20" or less) and when I don't need the really low gears, I'm happy to stay on the middle ring of my touring bike (26/36/48 & 11-34T 9 speed) with a top gear of 89" and coast rather than pedal downhill.  I will use the big ring with a top gear of 119" if I'm playing silly buggers on a good downhill - and then I can hit 40mph before spinning out.  But the truth is, unless I'm playing silly buggers, I don't use the big ring at all.  A top gear of about 90"-95" would be more than adequate for me.

On the back end, I reckon that a 14T top gear and closer spacing in the middle of the cassette would be beneficial but I haven't really looked into it on account of nothing like that being available - certainly not readily available at a reasonable price.

I'm looking at getting a new bike and I'm liking the idea of a sub compact 24/38 with a 10 speed 11-36T cassette.  That way, I get the low gears that I like but the 11T allows me a useable top gear.  There's a lot of cross-over but that also means that most of the time it won't matter what ring I'm using at the front.

[Adam]

You could always fit a 7 speed freewheel (non Megarange version) with a 34T and either fit a new 7 speed shifter, or just keep it 6 speed by adjusting the high end to lock off the smallest gear.  Sunrace MFM300 has 14-16-18-21-24-28-34T.

[chopstick]

Cheers - I didn't consider whether a 7 speed freewheel would fit.  OLD is 135mm so I did consider getting a cheap wheel and going 9 speed, using a spare RD and changing the shifter.

Edit: - I just looked up Sheldon and he concurs re. the 6 to 7 speed conversion