Living small, or just living with less, and not just because you have too...

[border-rider]

We're kind of getting there

We had a massive declutter when we put the house on the market, which involved 12 estate car loads of stuff to be recycled/given to charity shops, and a skip.  An awful lot of the rest (including most of our clothes) went into the attic.

We're now packing ready to move to a rented place, and rationalising further into "stuff we want to live with for the next year (including books & bikes)" and "stuff that's going to stay in boxes".  Most of it is going into the latter category, as is all the stuff already in the attic.

[toekneep]

I heard an interesting comment on these lines a few weeks ago. Somebody I was talking to about having more stuff than we need said that she had put a lot of stuff into storage two years ago. What was interesting was not the fact that she hadn't needed it but more significantly, she couldn't remember what was in there . Says it all really.

[goatpebble]

In reply to Annie, I had read of this man, but did know that a film had been made. Part of me feels deeply suspicious of the idea, because it seems so contrary to his motives. How do you tell such a story, for an audience that will view him as just a subject for a sort of diverting tragedy?

Perhaps I am contradicting my words at the beginning of this thread, but this young man put his life at the limit in his questioning of how to live, and I wonder if the film has just used him as a classic 'outsider', and possibly turned him into a freak.

I suspect that some (like you) took the story at it's heart, but others might have not. For me, having only read fragments of what his family have said, it is impossibly sad, and I hope that people might be shaken enough to ask the same questions he did.

[goatpebble]

Ok, let's be more cheerful.

My favourite room, now sadly dismantled, was a simple 4.5m square space. There was an elegant pair of tall doors opening to the garden, a late Georgian Parian marble fireplace, old oak floor boards, and a ceiling height of 3.8m.

I was incredibly poor, but had a lot of books. In awe of the the rather grand architecture, I built a bookcase that filled one whole wall, copying the mouldings from the door and skirting.

The room was a lesson that I forgot. Just a wall of books, two or three good chairs, and a table. The walls were empty, except for one large and important painting (a good principle to remember)

I went back to that room a few years ago, because it was such a good space. I don't do sofas (I own a small never sat on Corb thing) and time has taught me that books and maps, and a chair for your friend, these are things that open the imagination. You pull out a book, a conversation starts, you share memories and ideas, a few beers, and new adventures might begin. I don't think a big flabby sofa is quite the same.

Edit: this is why I suggest that you get rid of everything that lurks in corners, and be absolute about the things you love. It might be three or four bikes that you can hang on the wall, but flatpack oddities storing never watched dvds should go.

[hellymedic]

I only bought a sofa(bed) because man #1 wanted one.
Man #2 now sits in the soft flabby sofa quite a bit.
I'm happy with green plastic garden chairs; the men are not...

[goatpebble]

I only bought a sofa(bed) because man #1 wanted one.
Man #2 now sits in the soft flabby sofa quite a bit.
I'm happy with green plastic garden chairs; the men are not...

The only dining chairs I have kept are some old French cafe chairs that stack. Men don't mind them, but the cold galvanised steel is a bit of a shock to anyone in a short skirt.

I like the idea that I can store eight chairs in a space just 50cm square!

 

[hellymedic]

Plastic garden chairs are also stackable, though less compact. They are kinder to the short-skirted.

[goatpebble]

Plastic garden chairs are also stackable, though less compact. They are kinder to the short-skirted.

Ah yes, but my chairs are French, and reak of intense Gauloise infused argument, and a frisson of inter-war time wasting stuff at road side cafes, inhaling the fumes from Citroens and hostile philosophers.

Maybe...

[hellymedic]

Mine exude 'anti-style'...

[juliet]

I like sofas!  We have a ginormous sofa that you can fit four (friendly) people on at a push.  And a big beanbag.  We spend a fair amount of time hosting people of an evening, so sprawling-out space is very much worth it.  Plus I like curling up on the sofa with book/laptop/knitting.

[annie]

I have a supersized bean bag bed, much fun, well I think it could be much fun.  I use it to read and to sleep and to look at the stars.  It is a place of refuge and envelopes me with a lovely cosy feeling.

[CathH]

When it came time for Mr CathH and I to replace the old sofa that had been donated by the to-be inlaws, we decided to get two chairs that were just perfect for each of us.  We were in that time of life where all friends and visitors preferred to sit on the floor anyway.

We wandered separately around a furniture store (so as to not influence each other!) and chose two very similar heavy wooden framed and leather-upholstered chairs which we bought footstools for.  We teamed that up with a large low wooden table.  All of this furniture will most likely outlive us.

These chairs have ended up settling close to each other but surrounded with magazine racks, lamps and soft blankets for covering up feet and legs.  We chat, watch telly, argue, doze and snore together in the front room in our chairs!

I seem to have a thing about lamps though; it's coming close to a collection.  There's a lovely crystal one with an ivory silk lampshade that I have my eye on at the moment.

[Jon P]

I agree about the importance of decluttering, but at the same time I look to the future, peak oil etc - I really think that things are as cheap today as they will ever be, so why not stock up as much as possible and hedge against the future.  People have already started stockpiling food - American stores limiting purchases of sacks of rice - but what when everyone goes for bicycle chains and blocks too?  That's assuming you won't just be looted anyway should things get really bad.

My own problem is unfinished projects - you have a mind to do something, buy the components then they just sit around for months.  If I could resolve all these I'd have a lot more space, though I'm quite systematic about clearing everyday things up as I go along.

The clothes that rae mentions are quite clearly the product of slave labour - have you ever made shirts yourself? -  I have -  but got 2 for £5 in tesco last week.  But the people that make them accept the paltry wages so they can raise families themselves

[fruitcake]

I'm at the point where I need more book shelf space or to jetison some books.  I want to keep those though.  Visitors look at a book case to get an idea of what you're interested in.  It's a conversation starter.  The same is not true for DVDs and so those don't stay around long.

I decided to attack my university notes and the paperwork from previous jobs.  I recycled what I knew I would never read again.  The stuff I thought I might-read-once-in-the-next-couple-of-years I digitised and burnt the jpegs to CD, then recycled the paper.  It was nice to read the stuff again while I was digitising it but I haven't read it since.  
Archiving is now a rolling project - I don't keep pieces of paper anymore (except the papers I have to share with others) and I can find documents quicker.  

[border-rider]

Mrs MV just said to me, a propos of nothing: "Those three big vacuum-packed bags of clothes that I made you put in the attic - they've been up there over a year and it's obvious we don't need them.  Take them to the charity shop"



I thought of this thread.

[mr magnolia]

About 18 months ago my company moved to a new office.  We still own the old one so had the luxury of walking out and starting from scratch when we moved here.  'Everyone' wanted to bring piles and piles of stuff that was very important for their work...

We gave everyone (about 40 peeps) a single small box each and said - put the files and the stuff that you will be working on for the next three days in here.  You can then write a list of what you need brought over as the need arises once we have moved.

Given that all the working data was on a new server etc, the amount of stuff that had to be subsequently brought to the new office was startlingly small.  Of course, now we've been here for a while everyone's work place is looking a bit more cluttered...

[Eccentrica Gallumbits]

E left a large suitcase, abandoned by a guest because of a broken clasp, by her front door in Ealing. Overnight it disappeared. On the second morning, there it was again. Presumably the recyclist didn't want it having discovered it was broken.

I'm surprised they bothered to bring it back rather than just dumping it.

I have periodic throw-outs and I think it's time to have another one soon. My worst clutter is books. I have hundreds and I don't have space for them all. Every so often I go through them, take out the ones I know I won't read again, and list them on Amazon and GreenMetropolis (I'd rather sell them than give them away). If they haven't sold after 6 months I get rid of them via BookCrossing - The World's Biggest Free Book Club - Catch and Release Used Books .

[goatpebble]

As mentioned in another thread, I don't own a fridge. After my mother telling me about the weekly ice delivery (when a zinc or lead lined ice box was the norm) I buy a couple of bags of ice if I am having friends round. A feed bucket is loaded with ice and water, and a two or three bottles of wine are chilled much faster than a freezer.

I am not suggesting that you throw out your fridge, but a few years ago I remember  seeing a cast out ice box on an island hillside (Greek). It was exactly the same as the ice box my grandmother had until the late sixties. The lower part had a lead lined section for the ice, and a tap to drain it easily. Above was a simple two door cupboard, divided into two shelves. There was a small lower cupboard, right next to the ice, which must have kept things at near frozen temperatures.

I wonder if this system, with ice made locally, was actually more efficient than an industry selling unrecyclable and polluting appliances. Also, the local delivery of stuff, on a regular basis, and the mesh of relationships and communication that result.

Living in a very small town (a village in all but name), with local grower/sellers, butchers, fishmongers etc., you are part of something that connects you in a very different way. I am very aware that that no one is anonymous anymore, which delights or horrifies the newcomer.

The advantages are huge. You can live without storing too much. You can forget the big weekly shop, and just buy exactly the fresh things you need that day. Less waste, and a joy in being surprised by something unusual and seasonal. I have a 1 minute walk if I forget something.

Of course, the wealthy aga set who are attracted here still install kitchens that probably cost more than my flat, but real life carries on despite them.

[domesticated ape]

I just had my first go at the '7 things', I came up with 3 books (one of which has been up for grabs in the Lending Library board for a while, but with no takers), an old Sony turntable, amp and tuner, and the box that my phone came in.

On the other hand this weekend however I've aquired by various means this weekend a tandem ( ), a gigantic toolbox, 2 old drop handlebars, a plastic Brooks saddle, a pair of trainers and a pair of flip-flops! Oh well, at least I tried

[Cudzoziemiec]

Goatpebble*, could you explain what exactly you have against sofas?

When we lived in Poland, my son was clothed virtually entirely from the second hand shop. A surprising amount of it still had UK high street price labels on. 

You can clothe a child for £1 in the UK, with the exception of shoes.   I do draw the line at secondhand shoes.    The local playgroup has bric-a-brac sale, and there are mountains of kids clothes.  They're not junk either - hardly worn Gap items go for 30p, or even less at the end of the day.   Generally they are left with several binliners full of perfectly good kids clothes that go to the charity shop or for recycling.   This is Hackney as well - not exactly a rich area, and the playgroup I'm talking about isn't posh and private.   

Anyone who buys clothes for an under 5 from a proper shop has more money than sense.

Glad to hear this. But how come brand new stuff - still with its shop price labels on - is ending up in charity bins (cos I know charity shops are often the sources of these secondhand shops)?

As for practical advice, the oft given technique for clothes of putting anything you haven't worn for 6 months in a bag, and if it's still unopened 6 months later just recycle etc, would surely work with other items too? In fact, as many clothes are seasonal it might work better with other objects.

*I initially mistyped your name as "Goatpuebble" which seems amusingly close to "Goatpueblo"!

[goatpebble]

Thank you Cudzo, if I ever have the good fortune to own a house, I will call it 'Goatpeublo' !

 

I have nothing against sofas. As a single person, my small sofa never gets used, because when friends come round, the dining table has always been more active and social.

If I had a partner, I suspect I would feel quite differently. An evening just snuggling up, with a book or something, just relaxing, with the guy you love, well that would sort of change things.

However, I remain suspicious of the sheer amount of space they take up. My sofa is just 185cm long, and only 70cm deep. Despite modest dimensions, it still seems luxurious.

And if I remove the cushions, I can carry the steel frame on my own!

[goatpebble]

Today I had to think quite carefully about furniture that I had to let go of. I have sold some things, but I was faced with decisions about items that were good, but not incredibly valuable. After having tried to sell them, with little interest, I started to thing again about just giving things.

I don't want to use Freecycle, because a recent experience left me feeling that it is too open to abuse. I don't care if someone decides to sell on, but rudeness and greed are totally contrary to the ethos I expected.

I have been very lucky to find the most amazing things just when I needed them. The lady who sold me her Knoll armchairs for pennies, because we both had a passion for modern design, and the little Cassina chair, given to me because the old gentleman liked my silly ideas about urban neighbourhoods!

I hasten to add that these old chairs are the ones I am keeping!

But the other stuff, the good and useful things that are just too big, or duplicated, then I want to first look to my friends. If they really need something, then they should benefit from my surplus. If I have a conversation with a stranger, and the subject comes up, then again, perhaps I can give a gift which carries on a sense of joy in useful stuff, enjoyed  for years to come, and all the more so because it was a marvellous surprise.

[vince]

Definitely the best way of going about it. Stuff that comes with the memory of unexpected kindness is all the sweeter 

[alexb]

I love Freecycle. We use it all the time. However, I take the point about chancers who just want stuff to sell on.
However, you can pick and choose who gets the stuff and many people do just that.

Some Freecycle groups ask for feedback on collectors/donors and ban people who don't turn up or who take too much and are obviously selling on.

However, I know one or two people who by virtue of EBay/car boot sales and Freecylce are able to eke out a fairly basic living on pretty miserly levels of income or benefits and I see no harm in that.

[GruB]

I have always been an impulse buyer, but I like to think I do so with an informed decision.  I am not a trend follower - and normally only buy things that we need to 'enjoy' our life.
This was something my parents were against while I was growing up so I guess I have rebelled a bit.
Thinking about my dad and how he worked very hard all his life and really only started to enjoy it when he retired - getting back into hockey and playing for the Victorian Veterans team etc - and then leaving prematurely before he was 70 !!  - I have decided that life is for living.  We are not rich and can only afford what we can but WE ARE going to enjoy life while we have it.
Therefore living a Spartan existence does not fit into my ideal.