Author Topic: Items here now won't be there then  (Read 18424 times)

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #125 on: 18 August, 2021, 09:37:40 pm »
Anyway, presumably at some point you'll be fumbling with your phone or Apple watch naked with your eyes full of shampoo.

Every 5-6 transactions, you have to put in your pin when using my Dutch bankcard contactless.

In other news, the system is unable to tell the difference between a terminal with a pin pad, and one without. I discovered this when I had a very fully bladder, at a service station. I couldn't pay the 50c to pee, as I couldn't type my pin in on the non existent pinpad...

I've since had similar issues trying to buy a mars bar from a vending machine...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #126 on: 19 August, 2021, 06:10:33 am »
Most of my camp site usage has been in France and I don’t recall seeing PAYG showers. Some hotels in remote regions ran out of hot water routinely.
Move Faster and Bake Things

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #127 on: 19 August, 2021, 07:15:10 am »
Cash, the folding type at least is a simple promissory note.  There have been times that I have seen power cuts, belligerent pos machines, rejected cards, no signal, no battery, etc. resulting in cash only transactions.  In a "cashless" society people will have to revert to no trade or good old pen and paper and IOU's, otherwise known as promissory notes.  Oh, we're back to cash ...

The thing with cash is that it doesn't need an expensive device, an external network, electrickery or even a simple card, it is the ultimate and the simplest way to pay.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #128 on: 19 August, 2021, 07:23:30 am »
Most of my camp site usage has been in France and I don’t recall seeing PAYG showers. Some hotels in remote regions ran out of hot water routinely.
Agreed.  I usually camp for about 25 nights a year, in France.  Very, very rarely have there been PAYG showers, and then on very small sites.  The last was a tiny, basic (always my preference) site over in the Vosges about 6 years ago; and the one before that was about 3 years earlier just along the coast from St Malo.  So they are out there, just rare these days in my experience.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Ride adventurously and stop for a brew.
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #129 on: 19 August, 2021, 08:07:32 am »
Anyway, presumably at some point you'll be fumbling with your phone or Apple watch naked with your eyes full of shampoo.

Every 5-6 transactions, you have to put in your pin when using my Dutch bankcard contactless.

In other news, the system is unable to tell the difference between a terminal with a pin pad, and one without. I discovered this when I had a very fully bladder, at a service station. I couldn't pay the 50c to pee, as I couldn't type my pin in on the non existent pinpad...

I've since had similar issues trying to buy a mars bar from a vending machine...

J
So how are you supposed to pay to pee (surely more annoying than paying to shower) at this service station? Does it also take cash? Swipe and sign?
Riding a concrete path through the nebulous and chaotic future.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #130 on: 19 August, 2021, 08:33:34 am »
Cheap meat

Hopefully, in 30 year's time the world's obsession with eating meat, particularly red meat, will have come to an end.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

ian

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #131 on: 19 August, 2021, 09:18:38 am »
Fish, for that matter. It's a terrible, terrible industry. Imagine if you simple stripped forest bare, killing most of the life in the process, throwing away all the stuff you're not interested in and eating the rest. That's pretty much trawling.

But anyway, there won't be much fish left if the industry gets its way.

Fish farming, while it has problems, at least can be fairly sustainable.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #132 on: 19 August, 2021, 09:37:27 am »
So how are you supposed to pay to pee (surely more annoying than paying to shower) at this service station? Does it also take cash? Swipe and sign?

Well, if it's not your 6th payment since you inserted a pin, then you just do contactless... note it will only accept Dutch cards... (Maestro/v-pay only).

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #133 on: 19 August, 2021, 09:55:08 am »
Anyway, presumably at some point you'll be fumbling with your phone or Apple watch naked with your eyes full of shampoo.

Every 5-6 transactions, you have to put in your pin when using my Dutch bankcard contactless.

In other news, the system is unable to tell the difference between a terminal with a pin pad, and one without. I discovered this when I had a very fully bladder, at a service station. I couldn't pay the 50c to pee, as I couldn't type my pin in on the non existent pinpad...

I've since had similar issues trying to buy a mars bar from a vending machine...

J
That will be down to the POS* system not being configured correctly (or having insufficient config options).
*Point of Sale, though I'm sure you called it the other use for that acronym.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #134 on: 19 August, 2021, 10:00:53 am »
Anything you don't have to pay money to use.

Soon every UK home will be fitted with exit barriers so that a charge can levied for use of the streets.
Move Faster and Bake Things

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #135 on: 19 August, 2021, 10:03:21 am »
Well, if it's not your 6th payment since you inserted a pin, then you just do contactless... note it will only accept Dutch cards... (Maestro/v-pay only).

Does that mean every sixth customer gets rejected?  Or do people do PIN transactions frequently enough to not normally encounter it? Or is it a misconfiguration by your bank?

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #136 on: 19 August, 2021, 10:28:59 am »
Fish, for that matter. It's a terrible, terrible industry. Imagine if you simple stripped forest bare, killing most of the life in the process, throwing away all the stuff you're not interested in and eating the rest. That's pretty much trawling.

But anyway, there won't be much fish left if the industry gets its way.

Fish farming, while it has problems, at least can be fairly sustainable.

Fish farming, in the sea, in a bloody terrible industry. Nearly as destructive as bottom trawling.

Hence many countries moving the fish farms to facilities on land.


Governments have a lot to answer for. The fishermen in the hebrides requested that several areas be given a special designation, banning trawling. Scottish Government refused  >:(

Hand diving for scallops, catching langoustines, lobster, crab in creels is still an industry up here.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

ian

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #137 on: 19 August, 2021, 10:48:41 am »
Fish farming in the sea can be sustainable, doesn't mean it is, but even then it occupies a small volume of the ocean so the effects are far more limited than a factory fleet of trawlers. There are, of course, lots of small scale, sustainable fishing operations that ought to be encouraged, but people want cheap fish protein (much of which goes into animal feed, so we're back with beef).

I'd quite happily eat protein grown in a vat, which ought to be the future.

Basil

  • Um....err......oh bugger!
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Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #138 on: 19 August, 2021, 11:12:34 am »
The UK.
Admission.  I'm actually not that fussed about cake.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #139 on: 19 August, 2021, 11:47:20 am »
Fish farming in the sea can be sustainable, doesn't mean it is, but even then it occupies a small volume of the ocean so the effects are far more limited than a factory fleet of trawlers. There are, of course, lots of small scale, sustainable fishing operations that ought to be encouraged, but people want cheap fish protein (much of which goes into animal feed, so we're back with beef).

I'd quite happily eat protein grown in a vat, which ought to be the future.

Major topic digression.

Problems with in-sea fish farming:
Multiple concentrated pollutants. Insecticides used to control sea lice. Elevated nitrogen levels from concentrated food.
Escaped stock - these spread disease.

The sea bed below the salmon farms become dead, sterile. All seaweed dies off. Nothing lives in it.

We had months of mussel gathering being banned in the Loch here; elevated algae levels. Too much nitrogen (it isn't from farming, there is very little fertilizer used here).
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #140 on: 19 August, 2021, 11:55:16 am »
Escaped fish don't have the natural home-finding that real fish have. There are some fish pens near here that have 100,000 fish in each one.

As mrc says, there are significant problems with fish farming in the sea.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #141 on: 19 August, 2021, 02:08:27 pm »
Coming back to card payments my experience in Brazil and a colleague's in Colombia is that virtually no one above basic income level uses cash.  We were all set with a load of Brazilian cash when we left heathrow and came back with most of it.

Both countries have moved to contactless credit cards as a way of combating fraud and to provide simple audit trails. we paid contactless for 2 caipirinhas on the beach at a small beach. This was a small bar on wheels with a terminal connected to the man's phone and the 4G system.  The need for wireless connectivity of course meant that the 4G was ubiquitous even when travelling on small roads between towns.

My colleague in Colombia had his tip in the hotel bar refused in cash and had to do it by card.

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #142 on: 19 August, 2021, 04:46:51 pm »
Cheap meat

Hopefully, in 30 year's time the world's obsession with eating meat, particularly red meat, will have come to an end.

I reckon eating meat's going to go the same way as smoking.  A minority will continue doing it for a long time to come, but not doing so will become more socially normalised.

People will (already do) go to ABROAD, where the FOREIGNS come from, and find the different cultural attitudes to meat shocking.

Prolific meat-eating will become an iconic aspect of old films.  New historical films will dwell on the hamburgers and steaks the way a modern film might dwell on someone emptying all the ashtrays.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #143 on: 19 August, 2021, 07:17:41 pm »

Does that mean every sixth customer gets rejected?  Or do people do PIN transactions frequently enough to not normally encounter it? Or is it a misconfiguration by your bank?

I goto supermarket, buy weeks shopping, insert pin.

Buy a train ticket, contactless

Buy a mars bar, contactless

Buy a new drill at the hardware store, contactless

Buy a new inner tube at the bike shop, contactless

Buy some fries on the way home, contactless

Try to pee at a service station with no pin terminal, payment declined, enter pin...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

ian

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #144 on: 19 August, 2021, 07:34:16 pm »
Coming back to card payments my experience in Brazil and a colleague's in Colombia is that virtually no one above basic income level uses cash.  We were all set with a load of Brazilian cash when we left heathrow and came back with most of it.

Both countries have moved to contactless credit cards as a way of combating fraud and to provide simple audit trails. we paid contactless for 2 caipirinhas on the beach at a small beach. This was a small bar on wheels with a terminal connected to the man's phone and the 4G system.  The need for wireless connectivity of course meant that the 4G was ubiquitous even when travelling on small roads between towns.

My colleague in Colombia had his tip in the hotel bar refused in cash and had to do it by card.

This is the case in much of the developing world – no one trusts local currency, it's either stealable or counterfeit to start out with, so it's electronic or US dollars.

This said, it never stopped the mothership's finance drones sending me memos about defying the corporate expense policy and not using my corporate card. Nowhere takes fucking Amex, and certainly not in the middle of bloody Africa. They're fine with Visa though.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #145 on: 19 August, 2021, 07:49:53 pm »
Both countries have moved to contactless credit cards as a way of combating fraud and to provide simple audit trails. we paid contactless for 2 caipirinhas on the beach at a small beach. This was a small bar on wheels with a terminal connected to the man's phone and the 4G system.  The need for wireless connectivity of course meant that the 4G was ubiquitous even when travelling on small roads between towns.

A cashless society is a surveillance society...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #146 on: 19 August, 2021, 08:50:21 pm »
I suspect that Brazil is big enough not to be a surveillance state. I also suspect at the involuntarily off grid level of live cash is still normal. Although even this may be changing. Micro finance in Africa is already mobile phone based.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #147 on: 20 August, 2021, 09:39:59 am »
A
Both countries have moved to contactless credit cards as a way of combating fraud and to provide simple audit trails. we paid contactless for 2 caipirinhas on the beach at a small beach. This was a small bar on wheels with a terminal connected to the man's phone and the 4G system.  The need for wireless connectivity of course meant that the 4G was ubiquitous even when travelling on small roads between towns.

A cashless society is a surveillance society...

J

The internet, satellites, radar, cameras.  Watched by them all. 
Move Faster and Bake Things

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #148 on: 20 August, 2021, 09:51:10 am »
Cash is great for hiding transactions...
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Items here now won't be there then
« Reply #149 on: 20 August, 2021, 10:22:07 am »
Bitcoin

Either it won't be there or 90% of the world's computing resources and 99% of the power will be devoted to mining and ledger updates. The remaining 10% of the computing resources will be taken up with:
- News sources discussing changes in bitcoin value.
- Processing pictures of cats.
- Bitcoin-based porn.
<i>Marmite slave</i>