Author Topic: Southend Cycle Town - part 2  (Read 237594 times)

2_Flat_Erics

  • 2 Flat Eric's
Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #475 on: 01 July, 2010, 02:23:42 pm »
This happened last night. Other than bruises both riders were ok.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/lSVsZSY-oeQ&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/lSVsZSY-oeQ&rel=1</a>

Both were in the centre of the path, so I call it 50/50 as to blame, but I can't help wondering if the uncut shrubbery made some contribution. (yes they should have been more cautious approaching a blind corner).

Glad they were both OK. Looks like at least one of them has a buckled wheel though.

The problem of the shrubbery along there has been reported via the counil website several times and the lack of action was raised at Mondays forum meeting. In this instance though I don't think the overgrowth played a role in the accident but still it should be cut back.
Never argue with an idot....
They just bring you down to their level
then win on experience.

2 Flat Erics You Tube Channel

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #476 on: 01 July, 2010, 04:25:13 pm »
This happened last night. Other than bruises both riders were ok.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/3I5efm4kP7o&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/3I5efm4kP7o&rel=1</a>

Both were in the centre of the path, so I call it 50/50 as to blame, but I can't help wondering if the uncut shrubbery made some contribution. (yes they should have been more cautious approaching a blind corner).

That front wheel doesnt look too clever after that  :o

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #477 on: 01 July, 2010, 10:58:15 pm »
I've watched this time and time again.

I can't get youtube paused at the correct point, but this is pretty close


The rider clandy's following is already taking avoiding action to the left and is therefore more upright.  The oncoming rider is taking avoiding action and therefore more leant over.

Even if both riders were keeping close to the left I think they may have still collided, handlebar to handlebar, with resulting falls.


I don't want to blame the cycle path, but I believe this collision was down to three main factors.
1) width (reduced by vegetation)
2) lack of sightlines (vegetation/path design)
3) coincidence leading to both riders hitting the apex of the bend at the same time.

point 2) could be mitigated by both riders slowing dramatically, but that implies bad path design since paths should be designed to be used at all reasonable speeds; and those riders weren't caning it.


I've shown this to a colleague who is a local rider, and fast but on a MTB not road bike. (I hope this gives you a clue as to his interests, he's not an out and out racer).   He said "I've blatted round there time and time again without any thought as to that happening!"

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #478 on: 01 July, 2010, 11:22:05 pm »
That's one thing I'm very wary about when I use the Milton Keynes Redways. The Redways are about as wide as that cyclepath, if not, wider, but can be overgrown. Even whe they're not overgrown, you get blind bends, just like that one.
The trouble is, as is very well demonstrated in that video, that instead of everyone keeping left, there's no guarantee that any oncoming cyclist will keep left, right, centre, or weave from left to right. There could also be pedstrians taking up the width of the path too.

I think that there was enough room for them both to pass safely. Who to blame? I don't think the chap Clandy was following was too clever. Veering to the right before the bend, then to the left to take the bend. But I reckon the one coming the other way seemed worse. I got the impression he wasn't paying attention. Looking at Clandy's video, you could see a fair way around the bend from where Clandy was as the video closed. I had something similar the other day. Someone coming around a bend towards me, not really paying attention. I saw her coming and stopped before the bend and put my foot down. If I was paying as little attention as she was, then we'd have hit each other.
I think that there is a lot of the mentality that cyclepaths are always safe to cycle on, so you don't need to pay attention to what you are doing and can use it as if it was a footpath, not needing to keep left as you would on a road. I find that the Milton Keynes Redways are a very good way of sharpening up my skills for riding within a good safety margin. You really don't know what is coming around the next corner. They can be very hazardous at times.

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #479 on: 01 July, 2010, 11:38:07 pm »
That's one thing I'm very wary about when I use the Milton Keynes Redways. The Redways are about as wide as that cyclepath, if not, wider, but can be overgrown. Even whe they're not overgrown, you get blind bends, just like that one.

.........

I think that there is a lot of the mentality that cyclepaths are always safe to cycle on, so you don't need to pay attention to what you are doing and can use it as if it was a footpath, not needing to keep left as you would on a road. I find that the Milton Keynes Redways are a very good way of sharpening up my skills for riding within a good safety margin. You really don't know what is coming around the next corner. They can be very hazardous at times.

As a user of both, the redways are wider.

The mentality that they are safe is my main gripe.    Either make them as safe as they imply they are, or add details that remove that implication (signage, surfacing, etc etc etc)


You said "I find that the Milton Keynes Redways are a very good way of sharpening up my skills for riding within a good safety margin.".  I used the Southend Western Esplanade on a quiet sunday at the 'grand opening'; due to the amount of attention I needed to use to be on the ball (and i had a few near misses) I found it extremely stressful.   This is why a route I have used daily for the last ten years is now out of bounds to me.  I used to find it a good way to chill after work, now it's an extreme obstacle course only to be used when completely on the ball and fancying a challenge.  Not really what a cycle town should have achieved?!?!

Clandy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #480 on: 02 July, 2010, 11:23:51 am »
I raised this a while ago at the cycle group and was told that it was already planned to take the railings out, which I understand has now been completed.

It was raised on Monday that now that the railings have been removed the vegetation is overhanging the path and needs pruning back.  This is a good example of why!    I might forward the url to the council.


I'm glad the riders are ok!

Not all the railings have been removed. Now the boundary fence is gone, the end of the old inner boundary fence is now fully exposed, nicely camouflaged, and there to be ridden into by anyone avoiding oncoming cyclists.


montysboy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #481 on: 03 July, 2010, 09:39:30 am »
On page 2 of the Echo today a yellow tipper is pictured driving on the cycle path and reportedly forcing cyclists onto the road. Will probably go online later today/tomorrow.

Does anyone have a link to this story if it has been put online? Have checked the Echo and cannot find it.


Cheers  :thumbsup:

Iain

FatBloke

  • I come from a land up over!
Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #482 on: 03 July, 2010, 10:43:07 am »
On page 2 of the Echo today a yellow tipper is pictured driving on the cycle path and reportedly forcing cyclists onto the road. Will probably go online later today/tomorrow.

Does anyone have a link to this story if it has been put online? Have checked the Echo and cannot find it.


Cheers  :thumbsup:

Iain

Here 'tis!    :thumbsup:
This isn't just a thousand to one shot. This is a professional blood sport. It can happen to you. And it can happen again.

montysboy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #483 on: 03 July, 2010, 12:59:50 pm »
On page 2 of the Echo today a yellow tipper is pictured driving on the cycle path and reportedly forcing cyclists onto the road. Will probably go online later today/tomorrow.

Does anyone have a link to this story if it has been put online? Have checked the Echo and cannot find it.


Cheers  :thumbsup:

Iain

Here 'tis!    :thumbsup:

Thank you!

Iain

Clandy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #484 on: 03 July, 2010, 10:18:13 pm »
I suppose the idiots on the council will say this was 'stage managed' too…

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/yL6XRJL8gSs&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/yL6XRJL8gSs&rel=1</a>

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #485 on: 03 July, 2010, 10:51:10 pm »
As a user of both, the redways are wider.


Very probably, they are very wide, but can get so overgrown that only one person can get past at a time.

Quote
The mentality that they are safe is my main gripe.    Either make them as safe as they imply they are, or add details that remove that implication (signage, surfacing, etc etc etc)

Redways still leave a lot to be desired most of the time. But even at best, it's the way people use them that makes them hazardous to use. Instead of following rules like you do on the road, people tend to think that they are perfectly safe, so there's no need to keep left etc. Even on a very wide Redway, I still have to be very carefull passing pedestrians who weave about.  They're no problem, but cyclists often behave the same way and I often get situations where I'm heading straight for another cyclist coming towards me and we have to negotiate who goes where or stop.


Quote
You said "I find that the Milton Keynes Redways are a very good way of sharpening up my skills for riding within a good safety margin.".  I used the Southend Western Esplanade on a quiet sunday at the 'grand opening'; due to the amount of attention I needed to use to be on the ball (and i had a few near misses) I found it extremely stressful.  


Yes, I think that's just too much unless you cycle very slowly. It's about as hectic as my commute when I pass the kids, but that's only for about 30 yards and at <10mph with fingers ready on the brakes and eyes peeled. I'd need to lie down in a dark room for a few hours if I had to concentrate that hard for miles at a time.

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #486 on: 05 July, 2010, 05:36:28 pm »
I was unsure if I should start a new thread for this, but instead thought I would put it in with the Southend stuff even though it happened in Great Wakering which is under Rochford Council afaik.
This has taken a bit of detective work by me as the quality of the video didn’t capture the company name etc.
That and being away for a week, this happened about three weeks ago. Anyway I was out having a ride on Saturday morning when I came across the lorry parked on the side of the road. I have emailed the business concerned, but as of yet I have had no reply. It was one of the web based forms rather than e-mail so I am not sure if they will ever gets it.
At the time of the incident something kicked in with me as I approached the junction, very glad it did.
If you want to circulate the video to local cyclists please feel free to do so. This person is a liability and in my opinion should not be on the road.

http://www.youtube.com/user/2FlatErics#p/u/0/8Cb-5sWwCQY

Clandy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #487 on: 05 July, 2010, 10:08:47 pm »
On page 2 of the Echo today a yellow tipper is pictured driving on the cycle path and reportedly forcing cyclists onto the road. Will probably go online later today/tomorrow.

Does anyone have a link to this story if it has been put online? Have checked the Echo and cannot find it.


Cheers  :thumbsup:

Iain

Here 'tis!    :thumbsup:



… and yet today:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/AZBkvZLwKL0&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/AZBkvZLwKL0&rel=1</a>

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #488 on: 06 July, 2010, 08:34:31 am »
I could be wrong but...
That tipper is for off road use only! It has no number plate. I doubt it's legal on the beach let alone the pavement, cycle path, or road.

Clandy


Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #490 on: 07 July, 2010, 10:22:20 am »
A good idea by Bristol. There isn't enough parking in the right places in SoS and changing a few car parking spots to bike parking wouldn't hurt.


2_Flat_Erics

  • 2 Flat Eric's
Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #491 on: 07 July, 2010, 07:51:34 pm »
A good idea by Bristol. There isn't enough parking in the right places in SoS and changing a few car parking spots to bike parking wouldn't hurt.



That looks like it is outside Thamesgate House.

I worked for Thus in Thamesgate house for several years. Most people who cycled in locked bikes to the railings on the ramps at the front of the building. Then the building managers painted the railings and told all tenants that any bikes locked to the railings would be cut off and removed.

I kicked up a big fuss and riled up all the other cyclists in the office. The company could not persuade the building managers to change their minds. Eventually Thus gave up a couple of their car parking spaces underneath the building and installed bike racks inside a locked cage.
Never argue with an idot....
They just bring you down to their level
then win on experience.

2 Flat Erics You Tube Channel

Clandy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #492 on: 08 July, 2010, 08:36:30 pm »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/697jEsat_zw&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/697jEsat_zw&rel=1</a>

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #493 on: 08 July, 2010, 08:52:46 pm »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/697jEsat_zw&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/697jEsat_zw&rel=1</a>

Electric scooters/bikes. Afaik no number plate or licence required.

Clandy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #494 on: 08 July, 2010, 09:25:17 pm »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/697jEsat_zw&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/697jEsat_zw&rel=1</a>

Electric scooters/bikes. Afaik no number plate or licence required.


As far as I'm concerned if it has an engine it's a motorbike and shouldn't be in the cycle lane.

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #495 on: 08 July, 2010, 09:36:06 pm »
Electric scooters/bikes. Afaik no number plate or licence required.
As far as I'm concerned if it has an engine it's a motorbike and shouldn't be in the cycle lane.
If they have pedals and the motor cuts out at 12mph then they are bicycles and allowed on the path, AFAIK. If the motor takes them over 12 mph then I think they become mopeds and you need licence, VED (possibly), and proper motorcycle helmets. AFAIK.

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #496 on: 11 July, 2010, 06:07:06 pm »
A classic welcome to Southend on Sea. A Cycling Town!  :facepalm:


Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #497 on: 12 July, 2010, 01:09:02 pm »

nicknack

  • Hornblower
Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #498 on: 12 July, 2010, 02:15:31 pm »
Quote
David Ewings, in mitigation, said Nash had some mental health problems, and asked for an adjournment for a pre-sentence report.

Presumably then, having mental health problems doesn't actually make you unfit to drive - just gives you an excuse if you "accidentally" kill someone.
There's no vibrations, but wait.

Clandy

Re: Southend Cycle Town - part 2
« Reply #499 on: 15 July, 2010, 12:24:05 pm »
Southend Council are asking for input on the latest Transport Plan for the Borough:

Share your views on new transport strategy for Southend (From Echo)