Author Topic: Spoke Key - which one  (Read 2415 times)

Bianchi Boy

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Spoke Key - which one
« on: 09 July, 2018, 06:36:57 pm »
Hi,

I am looking for a new spoke key and do not know which size to get. There appears to be very little information on the size to get and the size required for DT or Sapim nipples.

So which one and which size to get?

BB
Set a fire for a man and he will be warm for a day, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life.

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #1 on: 09 July, 2018, 06:58:58 pm »
for sapim and DT 14g spokes, Red spokey pro is a perfect fit, and easier to work with than many other spoke keys

cheers


Torslanda

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Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #2 on: 09 July, 2018, 07:02:45 pm »
I just checked all the boxes of Sapim and DT nipples I have and the only size marking is the spoke thread and the length.

My inclination is to point you at the Cyclo triple spoke key which has the three common sizes, 3.23, 3.30 & 3.45mm. It's precise and feels good in the hand. i've never needed anything else, except when building with 12 guage (a one off electric wheel) and a universal (and v.cheap) Oxford tool coped with that admirably.
VELOMANCER

Well that's the more blunt way of putting it but as usual he's dead right.

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #3 on: 09 July, 2018, 07:19:16 pm »
I've got dozens of spoke keys but for DT and Sapim the red spokey pro is the one.

FWIW there are lots of wheels coming out of Taiwan with nipples that are ~3.28mm. No-one makes a decent spoke key that size, and spokey yellow is too big. I keep my most worn red spokey (thirty years and several hundred wheelsets old) for those; it is slightly worn over the nominal 3.25mm and fits them a treat.

cheers

Samuel D

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #4 on: 09 July, 2018, 07:52:28 pm »
I second the recommendation for the red Spokey Pro. Inexpensive, large bearing surface on the nipple, precisely sized, and quick to manipulate onto and off of the nipple.

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #5 on: 09 July, 2018, 09:53:58 pm »
I made an unplanned purchase of a red Spokey, when a slight coming together on a YACF run saw my trike suddenly six spokes short in one wheel, and I had to limp back to the nearest shop, in Cambridge, to make repairs. It instantly replaced my previous favourite (a very traditional one that my LBS sold me out of their workshop decades ago, when I wanted something a bit more professional than the old Cyclo style), and I've used nothing else since.

I made it back to join the run for lunch :thumbsup:

Kim

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Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #6 on: 09 July, 2018, 10:25:00 pm »
I quite like the Park ones, but I have a lot of small-diameter wheels, and the Spokey style can be awkward if there isn't much room.  IMHO the important thing is that they're not made of cheese, and that it's not too easy to pick it up and use the wrong size slot after you drop it on the floor for the umpteenth time.

I use the highly scientific method of trying them in order to see which one fits...

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #7 on: 09 July, 2018, 11:05:28 pm »
some things that are not perfect about the spokey are that

1) if the nipples are very short (too short) then there isn't much engagement with the square

2) if the nipple is kinked vs the length of the spoke then the key gets difficult to fit and remove (but then many spoke keys do this in fact)

3) they don't make enough different sizes


Things I like about the design are that


a) unlike all meatal keys,  the plastic doesn't mark up the rim very easily
b) you can fit and remove it without looking at what you are doing
c) it is very light and easy to handle
d) your fingers get less sore than with any other spoke key I have  used
e) there is only one jaw per key so you don't end up trying (all) the wrong size jaws until you find the right one
f) they are not terribly expensive
g) you can exert plenty of torque if you have to
h) even though the body is plastic, they seem surprisingly durable
i) the jaws make contact on three (or even all four) of the nipple flats  so that the engagement is very good; no more trapezoidally crushed nipples...

FWIW in one LBS near me they have a set of cut-down spokeys for working on small wheels with lots of spokes.

cheers

Samuel D

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #8 on: 09 July, 2018, 11:27:04 pm »
If buying a Spokey, bear in mind there are two types: the regular one and the “Pro”. The latter has about double the bearing surface area so is less likely to mar or round stubborn nipples (such as those on well-used wheels).

Bianchi Boy

  • Cycling is my doctor
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Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #9 on: 10 July, 2018, 06:58:06 am »
I have just ordered a Spokey Pro. I have been finding that the Park tools red that I have can round some the odd nipple during the final tensioning.

BB
Set a fire for a man and he will be warm for a day, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life.

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #10 on: 10 July, 2018, 08:56:13 am »
2) if the nipple is kinked vs the length of the spoke then the key gets difficult to fit and remove (but then many spoke keys do this in fact)

I've found this to be a big problem on the (very standard) wheels I've built. With the spoke key engaged on the nipple the body tends to contact the spoke and jam against it, making it hard to remove. It's extremely annoying, and seems to be worse on the Spokey pro due to the larger engagement surface it has over the regular Spokey.

It seems like this should not be an issue with other keys that grip on 3 corners so long as they are v-shaped/have a cutout in the middle, such as the DT swiss key:



I might switch to this kind of design if anyone has found them better?

frankly frankie

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Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #11 on: 10 July, 2018, 09:58:40 am »


I had a bit of a shock when I picked up Old Faithful and tried to wrap it round a Mavic-style splined spoke nipple ...

when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #12 on: 10 July, 2018, 10:01:26 am »
I got the all-sizer one off Planet X and painted the bit with my spoke size on it with red nail varnish so I can easily find the right pair of holes quicker.
 
YACF touring/audax bargain basement:
https://bit.ly/2Xg8pRD



Ban cars.

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #13 on: 10 July, 2018, 10:40:45 am »
I agree that the 'pro' spokey is slightly worse vs nipple kinks and that the DT design (which is similar to the 'Unior' one in fact) looks good from that POV. However the metal end may more easily scratch rims.  I try to avoid building wheels with big kinks at the nipple, because it can cause all kinds of problems. This type of key

might be OK but I have not used one so sizing or quality may be poor.


BTW I did try a ('Fat Spanner', four-size) spoke key

with a different slot design, in which the slot had all four corners present and entry was in the middle of a flat face. You need to slip the key over the spoke and slide it upwards (a bit like the spokey) but the entries were not perfectly sized so it didn't actually fit over 13g spokes without some fettling.  The slot design worked (an improvement over a basic square slot for sure) but the fit needed to be much better (than with a corner entry 'diamond slot') on the nipple in order that the key drove well and that particular key also scratched spokes if there was the slightest kind of nipple kink.  I may yet cut it in half and make two smaller keys out of it. Probably this will require some welding to extend the parts of the key that are held.

Traditional circular keys

with many square slots tend to round off nipples if the fit is poor (like any key with a square slot will) and also scratch spokes up if there is any nipple kink.  I find building with a key like that peculiarly frustrating, in that one tends to lose track of which slot is being used, resulting in much wasted time. However since I cannot buy better key designs in all sizes, I still end up using these from time to time. The Park tool three slot key is a slight improvement in terms of losing track of the slot only, but then it has far fewer slots to start with...


Note also that nipples vary quite a lot, not just in square size. Plenty to be found with slightly rounded corners on the square. Obviously these round off more easily than most and you need a well-fitting key to drive them reliably.

cheers




rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #14 on: 19 July, 2018, 08:05:06 pm »
If you can get one, Pedro's.  You need the black one for most spokes.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

dat

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #15 on: 19 July, 2018, 08:13:37 pm »
Hi,

I am looking for a new spoke key and do not know which size to get. There appears to be very little information on the size to get and the size required for DT or Sapim nipples.

So which one and which size to get?

BB
If you choose park ones you can have all 3 of mine for a tenner posted. I hate them, switched to spokey.

Re: Spoke Key - which one
« Reply #16 on: 19 July, 2018, 09:22:54 pm »
I had problems with generic circular keys and DT nipples they did just not like each other. I had to buy a set of Park keys which I am very happy with and carry at all times.
Get a bicycle. You will never regret it, if you live- Mark Twain