2 quick questions for organisers

[CountrySickness]

I am a hemi-bureaucrat by profession, so sorry for the dull post as these don't seem to be covered in the handbook:

Is there a minimum age limit for entries provided an over 18 is riding with them? I've just had a query from someone wanting to take 14-15 year olds on my event (which is full anyway - yay for me breaking even, but a shame not to introduce some youngsters to audax)

If one rider has entered other riders via paypal (I assume with their consent) do the people he has entered need to sign an entry form as they have not ticked the online box in lieu of their signature?

Cheers/Diolch
CS

[Somnolent]

I believe riders as young as seven have completed some AUK BP events.
IIRC my youngest did his first 100k at nine (as stoker on tandem) with his older brother (11, maybe 12 at the time) on solo bike.

[Manotea]

TBH, checking whether it was the rider who made the online entry or another party is not something I've thought to specifically check for. I don't believe it happens but it is an inconsisency/something that the AUK website might highlight.

Until recently the online registration process didn't record the riders emergency contact details so what I used to do was ask riders to sign on at the event HQ with the   event regulations on display. I've discontinued this now the online registration process collects this inforemation (though that doesn't mean the information is provided).

We'll have to ask John Hamilton for a definitive ruling.

[Veloman]

While there may not be a minimum age, there should be some guidelines and requirements for organisers which would give advice on who is responsible for said child.  This policy document should be produced by AUK and issued to organisers.  Good starting point is the BC policy on children participating in club runs or coaching.  IMO, no parent or authorised guardian then no ride.  I believe there is a bit about consent on the bottom of the application form.

[Manotea]

All good points Veloman. The Organisers handbook (AUKWebsite/organisers/documents/Handbooks and Guides) states:

Child Protection Policy

For any entrants accepted under the age of 18, organisers need to ascertain that:
- A parent or legal guardian signs the Parental Consent section of the entry form (see Entries).
- Where sleeping accommodation is provided, there is separate provision for minors.

It is recommended that
- Entrants under the age of 14 should be accompanied by a responsible adult acting ‘in loco parentis’.
- Adults (other than a parent or legal guardian) do not transport minors in a motor vehicle unless a second adult is present.

[Peter]

Slightly off-topic

On the Season Of Mists, Chris Crossland's superb 100 from Hebden Bridge last Sunday, I watched young Isaac Lees (accompanied by his dad) ride up the steep climb out of Thursden to the Packhorse with a style that made me feel very old indeed.  They were doing the 50k event (with AAA points).  Isaac is 8.

[Marmitegeoff]

I get the adult to bring a signed entry form to the start for under 18's.  But we could do with a definitive ruling, on this.

Geoff

[Veloman]

............  It is recommended that
- Entrants under the age of 14 should be accompanied by a responsible adult acting ‘in loco parentis’.
- Adults (other than a parent or legal guardian) do not transport minors in a motor vehicle unless a second adult is present.

A good start for Child Protection Policy, but why 14 and not 15?  No criticism intended, but any child protection policy should reflect the law whenever practicable.  I know it's crazy that at age 17 someone can legally drive a car, have sex and then a cigarette but is still a child in the eyes of the law for some aspects of life, but up to 16 is different.

Also, 'recommended' is not the same as 'shall' and the difference is quite marked in a legal sense.

I get the adult to bring a signed entry form to the start for under 18's.

Requirement of entry and good practice for online entry systems.

But we could do with a definitive ruling, on this.

I think it is essential for AUK to have a coherent and definitive policy for organisers when considering young riders and would hope the new Board consider it without delay.

[mikewigley]

I think it is essential for AUK to have a coherent and definitive policy for organisers when considering young riders and would hope the new Board consider it without delay.

Such as?

[Ian H]

The current CPP is lifted from the CTC. This makes sense because many audax events are run by CTC groups.

[Veloman]

I think it is essential for AUK to have a coherent and definitive policy for organisers when considering young riders and would hope the new Board consider it without delay.

Such as?

It appears there is a policy document based on what CTC produced.  They have documents for 'Child Participation Policy' and 'Policy and Procedures for the Protection of Children and Vulnerable Adults'.

I assume CountrySickness was not aware of it and raised the question in this thread.  (No criticism of CountrySickness implied)

CTC policy appears to allow unaccompanied riders from 13-17 with parental consent.

The current CPP is lifted from the CTC. This makes sense because many audax events are run by CTC groups.

Agreed and thank you for providing that information which adds clarity.  I also note CTC adopt the BC document for Policy and Procedures for the Protection of Children and Vulnerable Adults.

[U.N.Dulates]

Current AUK policy is as stated in the Organisers Handbook. Under 18s need parental consent. Under 14s should be accompanied. As IanH has said, this was derived from CTC's child participation policy (at the time that was 14 but seems to have changed since from to 13).

When it comes to online entry, the AUK online entry system does not provide for parental consent, so under 18s need to enter by post (although online payment plus a hard copy entry form with the parental consent signed should be equally acceptable). BC's online entry system provides parental consent so clearly a signature is not a requirement - a suitable disclaimer/acknowledgement on the entry process that the entrant is either over 18 or the parent/guardian of the entrant. This is on the System Manager's list of things to be done.

If one rider has entered other riders via paypal (I assume with their consent) do the people he has entered need to sign an entry form as they have not ticked the online box in lieu of their signature?

Not something I've considered before but I'd have to say that you can never assume with any entry that the person being entered is the same as the person carrying out the entry process. In which case I'd say that the person doing the entry must be considered as accepting the T&Cs/signing the disclaimer on behalf of the entrant.

[CountrySickness]

Thanks for your responses

I was rather unaware of the issues relating to youngsters taking part, especially given the rarity of anyoneunder the age of 35 on an audax. I've only had a couple of father&son combinations on my events so far, so always best to ask.