Bye Lance

[citoyen]

Of course, it's worth noting that the French Senate report is on doping in sport in general, not just cycling in particular. The list of positives from the 1998 TdF is merely one of the appendices...

It's also worth noting that exposing those riders is not the primary aim of the report either, nor the reason the retrospective testing was carried out.

[PatC]

Interesting that as well as the 'positives' a list of 'suspicious' test results has also been revealed.

In fact the 'suspicious' list is more interesting than the 'positives'. Stuart O'Grady (retired yesterday), Axel Merckx wonder what his dad will say?), and Frederic Moncassin (bit of a surprise)

Positives
Andrea Tafi, Erik Zabel, Bo Hamburger (twice), Laurent Jalabert, Marcos Serrano, Jens Heppner, Jeroen Blijlevens, Nicola Minali, Mario Cipollini, Fabio Sacchi, Eddy Mazzoleni, Jacky Durand, Abraham Olano, Laurent Desbiens, Marco Pantani, Manuel Beltran, Jan Ullrich (twice), Kevin Livingston (twice)

 Suspicious:
Ermanno Brignoli, Alain Turicchia, Pascal Chanteur, Frederic Moncassin, Bobby Julich, Roland Meier, Giuseppe Calcaterra, Stefano Zanini, Eddy Mazzoleni, Stephane Barthe, Stuart O'Grady, Axel Merckx

 

[Nuncio]

I'd be really disappointed, not to say stunned, if Boardman were named.

Unstunned.  No Voigt either.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Axel was taken to Ferrari by his father.

[citoyen]

Unstunned.  No Voigt either.

Was Voigt definitely among the 60 samples?

[spesh]

Interesting that as well as the 'positives' a list of 'suspicious' test results has also been revealed.

In fact the 'suspicious' list is more interesting than the 'positives'. Stuart O'Grady (retired yesterday), Axel Merckx wonder what his dad will say?), and Frederic Moncassin (bit of a surprise)

Positives
Andrea Tafi, Erik Zabel, Bo Hamburger (twice), Laurent Jalabert, Marcos Serrano, Jens Heppner, Jeroen Blijlevens, Nicola Minali, Mario Cipollini, Fabio Sacchi, Eddy Mazzoleni, Jacky Durand, Abraham Olano, Laurent Desbiens, Marco Pantani, Manuel Beltran, Jan Ullrich (twice), Kevin Livingston (twice)

 Suspicious:
Ermanno Brignoli, Alain Turicchia, Pascal Chanteur, Frederic Moncassin, Bobby Julich, Roland Meier, Giuseppe Calcaterra, Stefano Zanini, Eddy Mazzoleni, Stephane Barthe, Stuart O'Grady, Axel Merckx

That's still only 33 positive/"suspicious" samples though.

Going by what someone has posted in the re-test thread on BikeRadar:

According to some reporters samples from Boardman, Svorada, Den Bakker and two from O'Grady were negative (as posted by someone earlier). A German Eurosport person said Voigt was negative too.

Which takes us up to 39 results...

[Biff]

Another 'I only did it once', like Zabel

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/i-doped-for-1998-tour-de-france-confesses-australian-cycling-star-stuart-ogrady/story-fngr0c3f-1226684658992

[Salvatore]

Another 'I only did it once', like Zabel

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/i-doped-for-1998-tour-de-france-confesses-australian-cycling-star-stuart-ogrady/story-fngr0c3f-1226684658992

But Zabel said his 'only once' was in 1996. Hmmmm.

[Biff]

I know. He claimed that he used it to prep for the Tour but didn't like the side-effects. Obviously put up with them in 98.

[Nuncio]

Was Voigt definitely among the 60 samples?

No.  But he has was second on one of the stages.  He was one of the rider representatives that were saying that the release of the names was unfair.  Not that that necessarily implicates him.  It may have been because he is a senior rider, is respected by his peers, and that he makes a good advocate.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

All true but he also started racing in the East German system and was a quite successful racer during the heights of the EPO era. The chances of him not being involved in doping are slim.

[Veloman]

Al true but he also started racing in the East German system and was a quite successful racer during the heights of the EPO era. The chances of him not being involved in doping are slim.

Chances of being hit by lightening are slim, but it happens.

Might just be that Jens rode clean and as yet the evidence is still missing.  Might explain why he never really hit the big time as well.

Now how does Cippo's record in the Giro stand after he has been found to be a doper?

[Toady]

No.  But he has was second on one of the stages.  He was one of the rider representatives that were saying that the release of the names was unfair.  Not that that necessarily implicates him. It may have been because he is a senior rider, is respected by his peers, and that he makes a good advocate.

I don't think it implicates him at all.  I actually think he has a point.  Releasing these names with no intention, or indeed ability, to take any further action, and without any process for the rider to follow to dispute it (no B samples) does seem a bit ... I dunno ... cavalier.

And the report itself is meant to be about anti-doping in sport in general.   

[citoyen]

Indeed - it bears repeating: the list of cyclists is a tiny component of a huge document. So huge that I've still been unable to download it.

Anyway, for procedural reasons, they couldn't convict anyone based on the results of these tests even if they wanted to.

Fwiw, I choose to believe that Jens is clean despite overwhelming circumstantial evidence that he probably doped. I've voiced suspicions about him in the past but now I prefer to believe he really is as naive, trusting and good-natured as he comes across.

[Cudzoziemiec]

He might have doped because he really is as naive, trusting and good-natured as he comes across. "Now for your injection, Jens." "It's not dope, is it? I couldn't live with myself if I was cheating." "Oh no, it's just a vitamin booster. Everyone's taking it - for the good of the team, you understand." But naive, trusting and good-natured doesn't mean the same as stupid. 

[woollypigs]

First he quits then he tell us he doped.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/jul/24/stuart-ogrady-admits-doping-tourdefrance

[αdαmsκι]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/jul/24/stuart-ogrady-admits-doping-tourdefrance

Stuart O'Grady (left) in action during this year's Tour de France. Photograph: Bryn Lennon/Getty Images

Well done Guardian. That's O'Grady riding for LeopardTrek in the 2011 TdF .

[clarion]

So which other sportspersons are implicated in the document?  I'm guessing that there are plenty of athletes, footballers, tennis players, just like in Puerto.

[citoyen]

No.  But he has was second on one of the stages.  He was one of the rider representatives that were saying that the release of the names was unfair.  Not that that necessarily implicates him.  It may have been because he is a senior rider, is respected by his peers, and that he makes a good advocate.

The correct answer to my question is: he was tested in 1998 but his sample is listed as "missing".

[David Martin]

Many of the samples were not available for retesting as there was not enough material left over.

[Ham]

Many of the samples were not available for retesting as there was not enough material left over.

Someone's taking the piss

 

[clarion]

So there was only a wee bit left?

[Chris S]

So there was only a wee bit left?

Ugh. Urine trouble for that one!

[clarion]

That's only a sample of my wit.

[Peter]

Well it's a pretty poor specimen.