No stop strategy

[marylogic]

Or more accurately a minimal stop strategy...

I was recently reading a book by a PBP vet who advised eating on the move as stopping to feed eats into valuable sleeping time.

I thought I would trial this on Lucy's excellent Long Dark Teatime 200 to see how it went, and also to make maximum use of the daylight.

It went better than expected really - I found that the brief stops to get supplies and proof of passage were sufficient for me to feel like I'd had a break.

I also found it less antisocial than I was expecting too - I would leapfrog the faster riders at controls then have a chat as they passed me on the road again. It was certainly more sociable than riding around on my own at the back like has sometimes happened to me.

I wasn't sure if others who employed this strategy had any tips, or if it was likely to unravel attempting this at longer distances?

Thanks

[Aunt Maud]

I like to keep stops as brief as possible, but I always get off my bike and sit down to eat.

If a control is busy and there's a queue, I'll get a stamp and find a cafe or stop at a cafe and then visit the control.

[Greenbank]

My usual stopped time is about 1h per 100km, so 2h on a 200. That gives enough time to rest and eat at intermediate controls but it's certainly not brisk - there's a fair bit of faffing in that too.

I tried to keep stops to a minimum on a 200 the other year and kept it down to 45 minutes non-moving time which (for a faffer like me) is pretty good going. That, combined with being a bit faster, elicited a "what are you doing here at this time?" from the organiser at the finish.

Learning to eat effectively on the move will give you much greater flexibility in your riding. If you're up against the time limits you can save time by not having to stop at controls for so long. If you're well within time limits you get the choice of pushing on, stopping with people and watching them eat or having a smaller/lighter snack. Spreading the digestion out over the ride certainly helps, I've definitely had the odd bad patch in the hour after a big feed at a control.

For longer rides you might not be able to fully feed yourself on the move, but it should mean any required stops are shorter as you have less of a deficit to make up.

For taking it to the extreme, see zigzag's post about his total stopped time on PBP: https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=92680.msg1908856#msg1908856

[Huff n Puff]

I find that I can ride a 200 without stopping but need to eat properly for 300s and further.

[whosatthewheel]

It works up to 200, provided you can fill your pockets with enough food. For longer distances getting a break every 2-3 hours helps... especially relieving pressure on contact points for a while (feet, hands, saddle, but also back, neck...).
What works for me is to keep "control of the controls"... it's no good waiting half an hour in a cafe' to be served a glorified sandwich you could have bought in a supermarket. 20 minutes is as much as I would like to spend at a food control... anything more works against you. That's easily done in a TLC event, but more difficult to achieve in an X-rated event. In the latter case you need to choose your control wisely... typically cafes at busy times are a waste of time (not a rule, of course), while you can have more joy at takeaways, Greggs and various coffee chains.

On a sunny day, you can't beat a fish&chips and a bench with a view 

[frankly frankie]

20 minutes is as much as I would like to spend at a food control... anything more works against you. That's easily done in a TLC event, but more difficult to achieve in an X-rated event.

I would have said the exact opposite.  High-TLC controls can be an infuriating waste of time (from my point of view as a rider - the catering staff tend to be on a different planet) but X-rated you can target a service station and be in and out as quick as you like.

[Hot Flatus]

Depends what you want. There is no way I'd ever bounce the second control on Steve Poulton's Cheltenham Flyer. It's awesome.

If you want to arrive at the finish earlier then, yes, don't stop. Stopping can also make the next stage harder, especially later in the ride when the body thinks the last control is actually the finish.

[Peter]

There are no rules - only people!

[tom_e]

On the few 200s I've done I found surprisingly little difference in the overall time.  If I stopped for longer then I recovered more, rode faster afterwards, and then needed rest at the next one again.  If I didn't stop for long then I found myself riding slower in between, but to no real loss overall.

Over a day there wasn't much in it, either worked but it was a different experience.  I don't have experience of longer rides.

[DCLane]

The minimal stop approach was my method of riding LEL due to injury - stop briefly, sleep little, ride slower.

As long as you're OK managing this, and don't mind riding solo much of the time, it works fine.

[whosatthewheel]

20 minutes is as much as I would like to spend at a food control... anything more works against you. That's easily done in a TLC event, but more difficult to achieve in an X-rated event.

I would have said the exact opposite.  High-TLC controls can be an infuriating waste of time (from my point of view as a rider - the catering staff tend to be on a different planet) but X-rated you can target a service station and be in and out as quick as you like.

You are probably talking about LEL, which is massive. In your average 100-200 riders TLC event, it's perfectly possible to have a very decent meal and be on the road in 20 minutes.

[Karla]

Alternative strategy: use the control as an incentive to ride faster.  Promise yourself that if you get to X control by Y time you'll have a nice sit down with TLC and a cream tea, but if you don't make it then you've got to ride on and survive on Ginsters pasties. 

[Greenbank]

I don't think "no stop" is meant quite so literally, it's not like a TT (even a 24h TT) where you are on the bike for pretty much the entire thing (if you are so inclined) as you're getting hand ups of new bottles/gels/bars/etc from a support crew.

You can train yourself (with suitable bike fit and lots of time in the saddle) to not need a break every few hours, again the 24h TT lot are a good example of that. It just takes time and effort and the gain from it (in Audax terms) is very little compared to the gains for the TTers.

Even if I want to ride on a minimal stop strategy for a 200 I don't carry food for the complete ride, I'll stop to go into a shop to buy food/water etc but the stop should be well under 5 minutes; most of that time is spent refilling bottles and unwrapping and stashing the food away. The food purchased is eaten on the bike once I get moving again.

At first I was trying to eat too much too fast (similar to the speed I'd eat it if sat in a cafe and not wanting to waste any time) but with practice I got better at slowing down a bit, taking smaller bites and sipping between mouthfuls.

Over the course of a ride an hour of eating (whilst travelling at 80% normal speed) gets you a lot further down the road than an hour of eating/sitting-in-a-cafe at 0% speed.

If you feel you "need to give your legs a rest" every few hours then this strategy may not be for you. (This is my polite way of saying you may need to train more in order to use the strategy effectively.)

Also, arriving at a control hungry increases the chances of me wanting to stop and eat something, so I'll aim to eat in the 30 minutes before arriving at a control, and I'll have a plan of what I want to do/buy for the next leg, rather than shopping on an empty stomach which results in me buying too much stuff (and more of the wrong stuff).

[Bairn Again]

I find this type of approach works quite well for me for events of up to 200km anyway. 

Its an approach that's probably evolved over many years.  Part of it is that most folk who ride Scottish audaxes will both (a) ride faster than I find comfortable and (b) spend longer in controls compared to me.  Im also very happy riding on my own as well, I don't feel that the enjoyment of an event is compromised in any way by riding solo. 

Im not fussed about times, but then i know that in most normal conditions Im going to be somewhere around the 10 hr mark, and very rarely more.  However on winter events I do like to minimise the amount of time spent riding in the dark, which Im not a fan of. 

The only thing that I do on calendar 200s (that works well for me and it surprises me how few times I see others doing the same) is to have a big feed immediately before the start of an event. I've sat in the car outside the Focus centre shovelling in home made waffles like my life depends on it a few times.  It maybe makes for a slower start but it allows me to do around 100km comfortably before stopping, with maybe only a back pocket bar or banana consumed during that time. 

A good feed around 100km is normally enough to sustain me to the finish of a 200, and I'll have another snack on the move around 150km or so.

Of course, calendar events don't have the controls at exactly the spot to match hunger so some compromise is required, and of course there is the etiquette of supporting commercial premises by actually buying something to be considered too. 

On events that are longer than 200km, I find that the need to eat is more frequent after about 200km and that while I can still follow the above up to 200km mark I'll be stopping for something substantial to eat every 50km or so after the 200km mark (and that its the rest as much as the food that is necessary)


   
 
 

[Greenbank]

Needing bigger feeds later on (and requiring resting for the body to process them) can be a sign that not enough food went in earlier on. It's easy to eat heartily whilst cycling but still work up a healthy deficit.

Again (and not trying to bang home the point), look to the long distance TTers and how they feed themselves; no specific meals, just a steady stream of mostly carbs right from the beginning of the event.

If you want to take this into Audaxing there's no need to resort to seemingly endless bottles of carb drinks, gels and energy bars, but move towards a steadier intake of food, and right from the start of the event, and it should get you a lot further down the road before you find you need to break in order to combine a bigger feed and a rest to help process it.

[rob]

Again (and not trying to bang home the point), look to the long distance TTers and how they feed themselves; no specific meals, just a steady stream of mostly carbs right from the beginning of the event.

Starting to ride TTs changed the way I approached Audax.   I moved to little and often with a focus on bars/gels eaten from a top tube bag on the go.   On a 200/300 I'll feed mostly in this way using stops to fill up bottles and have the odd snack.   The main luxury I look for on an audax is good coffee so I will stop for an espresso and cake fix if I spot somewhere suitable, otherwise I'll aim to keep moving.

I do find that I can't waste time in cafes any more as I find the average waiting time to be interminable.   Time which can be spent on the move and at home if I get round quickly.

[Rod Marton]

I've only used this approach once on an audax: I had to get round in close to minimum time as I had another engagement after it. It was quite a lonely ride.

Back in my TT days I was quite capable of riding a 12 hour without stopping, 24 hours I generally stopped once or twice as there are certain bodily functions which are best performed off the bike. But TTs are a different game entirely. In audax I'm really not concerned too much about times, so I don't begrudge the time of a feed stop, and in fact enjoy the social aspect of it. But audaxing is broad enough so that we don't all need to ride at the same pace or style, so if you don't want to stop for more than the bare minimum, that's fine.

[Banjo]

After nearly choking on some peanuts I tend to allways stop to eat now. Being a slow rider I keep stops as short as possible .If a café looks busy I will use a shop and sit on a wall or something to eat then get plodding on.

[Philip Whiteman]

Cafe controls are a pain when riding but not wishing to stop. Given that cafes sometimes open especially for riders, then not stopping can be a problem unless an item of food is purchased for on-the-move eating.

[mattc]

Cafe controls are a pain when riding but not wishing to stop. Given that cafes sometimes open especially for riders, then not stopping can be a problem unless an item of food is purchased for on-the-move eating.

Have you tried just bribing them for the control stamp? I'm too easily tempted by a comfy seat and a cuppa, so I've never tried it, but it's clearly a win-win solution. Plus a large proportion of cafes will have *something* for sale actually by the till - either packaged flap-jacks, or kiddie treats, or some sort of charidee tat etc ...

Going back to Cafestop-vs-TLC controls: I find their speed varies hugely for both.
Some TLC controls will be virtually serve-yourself, instant hot food etc; whilst some love to take your order, tell you to make yourself comfy, cook you something luuuurvely with great care while you sit on those comfy seats over there ... ==MassiveTimeSink 
Cafes vary as much; greasy spoons probably being the fastest, on average. Helps to know the cafes in advance, of course! I suspect this is why folks often find themselves riding the same events ever faster, year-on-year ...

[Wycombewheeler]

I find this discussion quite interesting.

I've looked back over my last 4 200s and found non moving time to vary between 45 minutes and 70 minutes.

I also recognise the statement about being slower after a food stop. Riding as a group on Saturday I found it very hard to take a turn on the front just after a stop but after an hour was able to take longer turns. Blood flow diverted to digestion?

While my stomach is pretty tolerant of whatever energy source I throw in there, I do prefer to stop and eat a proper lunch on a 200 than try and push through on sugar alone while on the move.

I also agree with the statement about quicker stops on tlc events as the food is just there waiting, but I don't begrudge a reasonable wait for food in commercial controls if I want a hot meal. 10 minutes extra relaxing is not going to spoil my event but half an hour waiting I would begrudge.

[frankly frankie]

Sometimes the food is not 'just there waiting'.

Some TLC controls ... love to take your order, tell you to make yourself comfy, cook you something luuuurvely with great care while you sit on those comfy seats over there ... ==MassiveTimeSink 

"I see you're offering poached eggs on toast, that'll do nicely thanks."
[call to the kitchen] "SOMEBODY PUT ON A PAN OF WATER."
[heart sinks]

And yes, eating a hearty meal and then setting off up the Climb Of The Day is not good tactics, you will have no legs for it.

[Wobbly]

High-TLC controls can be an infuriating waste of time (from my point of view as a rider - the catering staff tend to be on a different planet)

I'm not having that.

In my experience volunteers at high TLC controls are almost always bloody marvellous. I'd like to thank each and every one of them.

[Somnolent]

I also recognise the statement about being slower after a food stop. Riding as a group on Saturday I found it very hard to take a turn on the front just after a stop but after an hour was able to take longer turns. Blood flow diverted to digestion?

Drifting off topic somewhat but try eating backwards - as in cake first, followed by main course. Or scoff a few jelly babies in the last few minutes before you arrive at the control - or even while waiting in queue at the counter.  The thinking is to get glycogen in the muscles all ready for use immediately you get back on bike.
Maybe a placebo effect but my legs always feel less heavy after a stop if I remember to do this.
And thanks to hellymedic for the original suggestion.

[itinerant]

If you are building up to 'an event' such as PBP or LEL then it's understandable to try various feeding strategies but just doing a routine audax like this is, in my view, disrespectful to the organiser, who has gone to the trouble of preparing cafes for a certain number of riders. If you want to do it as a time trial then go and do a time trial. I feel obliged to support the venue who have offered to support the event that the organiser has put on by buying food and drink. Maybe that's why I'm one of the last later finishers usually! In my experience, the vast majority of control cafes are well worth 30 minutes of my time.