Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => The Knowledge => Health & Fitness => Topic started by: bikepacker on 06 December, 2013, 12:58:27 pm
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Anyone got advice on dental implants after having them fitted? Last month I developed an abscess in the tooth that carried my front bridge. The advice of both dentists in the practice I use was that the tooth had to come out and the quicker the better as it didn't respond to antibiotics. At the moment I have temporary dentures but hate them so I was thinking of an implant. My dentists seem reluctant to recommend this route saying I should stick with dentures but I would like something more permanent.
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My mum has them, loves them. She was in a lot of pain after the op though.
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I nearly had them but changed my mind.
There was a really long story behind this also related to a failing bridge, but in the end I concluded that this was cosmetic surgery and carried risks I wasn't prepared to accept - the risks I was uncomfortable with related to the proximity to my sinuses. And there was the price. And the fact that this isn't the once and for all solution. So I decided to stick with the bridge, even though I'd spent £100 getting the implant assessment done.
But I hated the temp dentures. I knew they'd be okay in time, but I hated them. In the end I was lucky, the bridge was repairable and I think is probably in better shape than the original.
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Ask your dentist about dentures with metal plate that clip to the other teeth.
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Ask your dentist about dentures with metal plate that clip to the other teeth.
Had an abscess 35 years ago that kept on coming back. I had a apisectomy and it left the tooth and bone weak. The tooth fell out about 5 years ago and I had the metal plat thingy, that kept on coming loose. The bone of the jaw is too damaged by the apisectomy to take an implant, so I just look hard instead. Or British.
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I've got an implant for an upper front tooth which needed a bone graft. Works great, no dramas. The temporary denture was horrible and I was glad to get rid of it.
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A timely thread! I have had several over the last 2 years. They have been bloody expensive but trouble free…. until now. One of the implant sites supporting a bridge has started to throb and I suspect (remembering past throbbing from failed posts) that something has gone wrong.
This particular implant is on the front upper and required a bone graft. If it has indeed failed then a lot of repair work, a lengthy period with a plate (again) and no doubt further huge expense is ahead. I'm hoping it will be covered by the practice's 1 year post-op warranty, but knowing shysters dentists I'm sure they will try and blame me for the failure :hand:
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I'm in the process of getting an implant. I possibly could have had a bridge, but was happy to shell out the considerable expensive to get a decent job done that will, hopefully, last for decades. I had the tooth removed about six weeks ago and the the gum packed with artificial bone. The surgery, once I'd had the injections, was pain free, but the next day was pretty bad. It took a few days for the pain to go away, but since then it's been fine. The temporary denture, which is purely cosmetic, is annoying. I try to wear it as little as possible, but have to wear it for work. Eating with it is possible, but I get more enjoyment from meals eating without the denture, which can be a problem in restaurants. However, in the long run I believe it will all be worthwhile. Next stage will be the end of Feb.
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I don't know anything about implants, other than that my dentist in Burnley (http://www.brdpdentist.co.uk/dental-implants.html), who is really excellent, fits them. He has an MSc in 'implantology' and lots of very happy patients.
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I got two implants fitted about 5 years ago following a bike accident. The two implants carry 3 front teeth. The process was lengthy but worthwhile and because I lost the teeth in an accident covered by the NHS at the local dental hospital. No trouble with them since fitting although a fairly gory process.
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I'm also a 'nearly' - whilst I have a bridge at the front of my mouth (lost my front teeth after an impromptu flying lesson) I've also recently had two molars removed (upper left and right) as a result of abscesses and, to put it mildly, I find the gaps a bit annoying.
I'm lucky enough to have a very good dentist and we did discuss the possibility of having implants fitted where the two molars were (my existing bridgework is fine, so if it ain't broke etc.).
The obvious thing is the expense, particularly if you're going private - it isn't cheap (I was looking at north of £2k per tooth, although prices will vary). The second is that it isn't something that you get done immediately like a filling - according to my dentist treatment time is typically 3-6 months and there are various stages to the treatment, but then you probably know that already.
The dealbreaker for me, however, was the fact that I'm diabetic - going down the implant road would have required me to exert iron control over my blood sugars (above and beyond what I'd normally do) during the treatment phase and even then there was no guarantee that the implant would take - in the end it was decided that it wasn't worth it from both a financial and 'medical' point of view. Again, your circumstances will vary - I'm living with the gaps but at some point in the future I'll be adding to my bridgework collection (dentures were never discussed!)
Ultimately, of course, the choice is yours - discuss it with your dentist and, if you feel the need, get a second opinion.
I feel your pain with regards to dentures though - I had a plate before I had my bridgework done and I absolutely hated it (indeed, it was the main motivation behind shelling out for a 'proper' bridge)
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Implants avoid the need to cut down adjacent teeth for bridges, which is a good idea if the adjacent teeth are 'virgin' teeth. They also load the bone and help preserve its height and contour. Implants are not fit and forget items, especially when you have spent the £2K+ that they usually cost, it is imperative you look after your investment.
Many people however get on absolutely fine with dentures, many absolutely hate them. You pays your money.....
Find out what manufacturer of Implant your dentist is using, make sure it is a well recognised one (not a cheap copy or small manufacturer) and keep a record of who they are. Then if any remedial work is needed in the future and you have moved dentist you will be able to get the required replacement parts.
Just as a Halfords special will get you from A to B, paying more will get a better specc'd and engineered solution which will probably function better and last longer.
(A dentist WITHOUT a Pinerello!!)
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Bikepacker - on the way back from the wet tour about 3 years ago, I pulled out a crown which had replaced an incisor 35 years before, a very good job it must have been. The dentist gave me the option of a denture, a bridge or an implant. The implant looked like a couple of months of unpleasant dentists visits; the bridge looked like modifications to otherwise sound teeth just to support it; while the denture seemed the way to go being the minimal impact and I could take any other option later if I chose to. Implant would have cost £2k+, bridge I do not recall, denture cost £350.
Like you I found the denture very hard to cope with for the first few months, not least because it affects speech, but as a tight git I persevered with the cheapest option. After 6 months, next check up, I had decided that while it is not one of life's great experiences I can live with it. I've now had the denture 3 years and more, and I can appreciate that it is a good one because it is a very good fit and I can eat toothbreaker apples with confidence. What I really do not like is that I have to take them out to remove food debris after every meal, this is because they are a small partial denture so food gets caught behind and between the denture and the teeth used to support it.
I would say stick with the denture for a few months. Good luck.
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My top front four teeth are implants.
The surgery was painful and not straightforward.
I am now extremely happy.
The original implants got infected and the front of my gum sloughed away - so that the implant-teeth are much bigger that my original teeth.
Most dentists would charge by the hour for this work, so two sets of implants plus the restorative work would probably have cost me approaching £10k - however my dentist had priced it up as a fixed price job, so he took the financial hit, not me. That is something to bear in mind, because implants ain't cheap!
(The history is that I had post crown fitted originally, that became infected, had an apisectomy (?) that left shrapnel in my gum, that got infected, so I lost the post crowns, and had implants as the only acceptable option)
No I can't recommend my dentist - he's been struck off.
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I am no Latin scholar but will advise that the apex (root tip) of a tooth is removed in an apicectomy.
I have not come to implants yet but suspect I could need want one within the next decade.
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(The history is that I had post crown fitted originally, that became infected, had an apisectomy (?) that left shrapnel in my gum, that got infected, so I lost the post crowns, and had implants as the only acceptable option)
That's more or less what happened to me, resulting in the need for 7 years of remedial treatment at the Eastman (including 5 attempted apisectomies and 8 re-root canal treatments), all of which was finally unsuccessful, thus the need for the implants.
I've had some abysmal dental treatment over the years, including a drill-and-fill monster in my teens who did all the damage, and another who ground down my natural teeth to try and make some ill-fitting crowns work.
I've noticed that however bad previous work has been, it is never criticised by your current dentist. Honour amongst thieves indeed.
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I suspect many of us who are considering implants now were victims of the paid-by-piecework NHS cheap & nasty drill & fill dental monsters of the '60s & 70s.
We had no sugar rationing, cheap sweets and no fluoride in the water or toothpaste.
I refused to visit a dentist when I realised they were paid on piecework. I was 14.
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I suspect many of us who are considering implants now were victims of the paid-by-piecework NHS cheap & nasty drill & fill dental monsters of the '60s & 70s.
School dentists - 'nuff said :o
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I have booked an appointment for Friday to discuss options with my dentist. I still detect a note that they do not want me to go down the implant route but will know more after seeing them. Would my 70 year old gums be a factor?
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IANAD but I think the main issue is the quantity and quality of the bone. The bone disappears after years of toothlessness and gives little foundation.
If there have been teeth with strong roots until recently, your chances of success are higher.
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Advise from my dentist was to wait and see. She suggested I give it 6 months for my gums to settle down following the abscess and extraction, before doing anything. There are a couple of clinics she would be prepared to refer me to but wants me to wait.
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I have an implant. I've had it about 8-10 years, with no problems. It was fitted with no problems (except the dentist reciting 'righty-tighty before he managed to turn the screw in the right direction ::-)). I'm very happy with it. :)
IANAD but I think the main issue is the quantity and quality of the bone. The bone disappears after years of toothlessness and gives little foundation.
If there have been teeth with strong roots until recently, your chances of success are higher.
That's what my dentist said, which was why I decided to just go for it. :)
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IANAD but it strikes me that letting infection resolve is good. Any infection around foreign material is bad. Not much bone is lost in a year though infection can eat away much bone substance.
The lower jaw in a young adult is around 4cm from the bottom to the margin of the teeth.
An old jaw with decades of toothlessness can be around 1.5cm in depth.
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IANAD but it strikes me that letting infection resolve is good. Any infection around foreign material is bad. Not much bone is lost in a year though infection can eat away much bone substance.
The lower jaw in a young adult is around 4cm from the bottom to the margin of the teeth.
An old jaw with decades of toothlessness can be around 1.5cm in depth.
Its early loss of bone width that is the problem. With implants as small as 5mm in length, lack of bone height is becoming less of an issue.
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Decided to have implants. Scans show bone is good and should take them. Appointment made for the 17th March. I hate these dentures.
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I suspect many of us who are considering implants now were victims of the paid-by-piecework NHS cheap & nasty drill & fill dental monsters of the '60s & 70s.
We had no sugar rationing, cheap sweets and no fluoride in the water or toothpaste.
I refused to visit a dentist when I realised they were paid on piecework. I was 14.
I was in Australia during that period. Our dentist was a customer of my parents who owed my parents money. He worked off his debt in dental work. My brother and I had a lot of fillings . . .
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Decided to have implants. Scans show bone is good and should take them. Appointment made for the 17th March. I hate these dentures.
Good Luck!
Hope it goes well!
Those I know with implants do not regret their spendy not-very-conspicuous consumption.
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Decided to have implants. Scans show bone is good and should take them. Appointment made for the 17th March. I hate these dentures.
I persevered with dentures for 4 years but have now decided to try a bridge. Like you I will be under the drill on the 17th to have my teeth shaped to suit.
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Decided to have implants. Scans show bone is good and should take them. Appointment made for the 17th March. I hate these dentures.
I had my implant fitted ten days ago. The injects were painful, but apart from that it wasn't too bad and I didn't have too much swelling. Two days after the surgery I was back to run training. I now have to wait 3½ months for the implant to settle down before a mould is taken for the new crown, so I'm stuck with the temporary denture until late June / early July.
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Decided to have implants. Scans show bone is good and should take them. Appointment made for the 17th March. I hate these dentures.
I persevered with dentures for 4 years but have now decided to try a bridge. Like you I will be under the drill on the 17th to have my teeth shaped to suit.
Hope it goes well for you. I was happy with my bridge (be careful when eating apples and French bread) but the tooth carrying it became infected so had to come out.
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Decided to have implants. Scans show bone is good and should take them. Appointment made for the 17th March. I hate these dentures.
I had my implant fitted ten days ago. The injects were painful, but apart from that it wasn't too bad and I didn't have too much swelling. Two days after the surgery I was back to run training. I now have to wait 3½ months for the implant to settle down before a mould is taken for the new crown, so I'm stuck with the temporary denture until late June / early July.
Don't want to know about the painful bit. ;D ;D
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Don't want to know about the painful bit. ;D ;D
Well once you've had the injections you won't feel any pain! (Just make sure you've got a supply of your choice pain killer at home for when the anaesthetic has worn off and ice cubes for any swelling.)
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My daughter is in the process of having implants for the front teeth she knocked out around her 10th birthday. I found the teeth and they were put back by the chap on A & E, but now, almost 18 years later, one has broken and they need to be replaced. Bloody expensive. You could get a very good bike for the price of each one!
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Implants done took about 45 minutes in total to do the two. Numbness starting to wear off so next few hours could be painful.
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mmmmmmmm
10 injections in total- 6 in roof of mouth- lovely
Oh and then 30 mins of drilling and while no pain at all the thought of what he was doing and my gum being open was not pleasant
Still £3,800 (for 2) and a few days alter and all was well.
7 years ago and no trouble
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This is all gruesomely interesting! I am just about to have a lower pre-molar LR5 extracted. The 4 is also missing, though the gap has been closed by the other teeth gradually moving. i'm concerned about being able to chew properly on that side in the future (I have all the upper Rs). I have been told by the dentist that thee are 3 possible treatments: implant, bridge or denture. I have heard that implants may be at risk if you grind your teeth - which I do, having supported Newcastle all my life. Does anyone have any thoughts about bruxism v implants?
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As I stated on an early post; I had a bridge but the tooth carrying it became infected.
I now had these two implants inserted on Monday and although my mouth is still sore I am not in any pain.
Hopefully after the 3+ months I have to wait for them to bond, I shall be enjoying two new teeth.
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The big problem with bridges is it requires grinding away large quantities of (hopefully) perfectly good teeth either side of the gap. These then have a far higher chance of failing at some point in the future (as all crowns do as opposed to natural teeth). It's largely as a consequence of failing bridge supports that I've needed the vastly expensive implant treatments outlined above - still ongoing.
I was also told I had bruxism and so would need to have a toothguard made (an extra £700) and wear it every night. I refused! No issues regarding grinding so far. I think they say this to minimise the risk to themselves of having to carry out any warranty treatment, and possibly as another revenue stream (I fully admit to being cynical as to the motives of most dentists!)
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Finally got my new teeth today. ;D ;D The whole process has taken 7 months but I am now very happy. :)
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:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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Excellent news, Backpacker!
I think my daughter is happy with hers. She definitely looks better than she did with the old teeth, which never really sat properly in her mouth. Her implants are a bit smaller as well.
Sadly, I don't think that there's anything much that can be done about her nose, which has never been the same after her bicycle accident 18 years ago.
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Sadly, I don't think that there's anything much that can be done about her nose, which has never been the same after her bicycle accident 8 years ago.
Can't blame an accident for my big nose, it just 'runs' in the family. ;)
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I suspect many of us who are considering implants now were victims of the paid-by-piecework NHS cheap & nasty drill & fill dental monsters of the '60s & 70s.
We had no sugar rationing, cheap sweets and no fluoride in the water or toothpaste.
I refused to visit a dentist when I realised they were paid on piecework. I was 14.
OMG you are spot on there and also the 50s. I can still smell the gas they used as I write this.
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I only had the gas once, nearly 50 years ago (January 1965). It's still my only GA to date.
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I had a discussion with my dentist today about my manky capped tooth. The options he gave were:
- Denture - not eveyone likes them
- Bridge - problematic because the tooth on one side is out of alignment and the one on the other has never had any work done on it so would need to be 'shaped'
- Implant - would need a referral and would be very expensive, but is the best option in the dentist's opinion
There's no particular hurry to make a decision, but the manky cap isn't going to last for ever :-\
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These were the dentists that did mine, at all stages they were brilliant. I would highly recommend them: http://www.perfectdental.eu.com/
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- Denture - not eveyone likes them
- Bridge - problematic because the tooth on one side is out of alignment and the one on the other has never had any work done on it so would need to be 'shaped'
- Implant - would need a referral and would be very expensive, but is the best option in the dentist's opinion
Those were my options when a 40 year old cap broke away a couple of years ago.
I went for a denture because it is the least intrusive and I could always do something else if I did not get on with it. I gave it a fair crack of the whip, 2 years and then I had a bridge fitted. That was 6 months ago and I wish I'd done it sooner. No more rubbing on the roof of my mouth and no more food trapped under the denture. My bridge is attached on one side only and of course the supporting tooth needed to be shaped. It is attached by a particularly strong cement and I went with a design that gave maximum contact area with the shaped tooth. This is for strength. I am more interested in strength than in cosmetic appearance, although it all looks good to me and I think the lab did a fine job. The dentist says that I should have 20 years or so with no problems which suits me since I am in my mid 60s. My only complaint about the bridge is that I do not have the confidence to eat bite into crisp hard apples and have to cut them up now. With the cap or with the denture I could do that, but not now.
Perils of age. I will be sucking my gums next.
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Well, the decision has been made and the dentist is going to refer me to a mouth-mangler for assessment for a dental implant :-\
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Mine were worth every penny. :thumbsup:
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Went for an assessment this morning. The mouth mangling starts next month.
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Got the offending tooth removed today. The dentist seemed to be rather surprised by the amount of infection. I'm getting a scan in a few weeks to see if I need a bone graft before the implanting :-\
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Got a CT scan of me gob this week.
I had two options, one involving a bone graft, the other not. After being assured that normal day-to-day tooth function would be fine I have plumped for the second option.
The dentist wants to do the procedure sooner rather than later before any more bone is lost.
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I was given the same conflicting options, like you I went for the no bone graft option and everything is fine. Hope it all goes well for you. :thumbsup:
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Thanks BP.
The options weren't conflicting. The second option won't be quite as aesthetically pleasing as the first (allegedly).
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Implant installed. I'm at the sitting around feeling sorry for myself stage.
(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-wqBoE4uPRw/hqdefault.jpg)
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Got the crown fitted last week (it was supposed be two weeks before that, but the dentist wasn't happy that the gum had fully healed after the implant). It's OK & Mrs P seems quite happy with it :thumbsup:
If I found myself in a similar situation again I don't think I'd bother, though. I'd be happy enough to live with the gap given the discomfort and expense of the implant process.
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Trouble is your face will cave in. DAMHIKT.
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Trouble is your face will cave in. DAMHIKT.
I take it you mean if you don't have a tooth there?
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Yup.
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Hi bikepacker and everyone else
I just recently got 2 dental implants placed. Works and looks perfect. Treatment and recovery takes a bit of time, but it is definitely worth it. Personally, I suggest a place in London. Good prices and great staff.
Here is a link - removed by spam detecting Mods
Hope this helps someone looking for good dental implant treatment.
I like the craggy look, they did a great job considering what was there before, what do you think?
(http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/51a4c0bc69bedd0910000001/this-is-what-drinking-too-much-soda-does-to-your-teeth.jpg)
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If teeth are removed, the jaw bones are resorbed and the face caves in.
Most toothless older folk in my childhood had short, caved-in faces and pronounced chins.
It's an appearance you don't see much nowadays as people tend to retain some teeth into middle age at least.
Gone are the days when a girl would have all her teeth out and new dentures as a 21st birthday present.
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Got my scan in early January, along with a chat with the bone harvester. Lord alive I am so sick of dentures already.
The bone absorption process has been really noticeable, in that the shattered bits of my jaw were sticking out the roof of my mouth and there was a large lump. Suddenly, all the little shards disappeared, and the gap is now smooth. I suspect usually, this would be a bad thing, but the backside of my LHS front tooth socked is blown out, so a bone graft was probably inevitable.
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I've had some abysmal dental treatment over the years, including a drill-and-fill monster in my teens who did all the damage, and another who ground down my natural teeth to try and make some ill-fitting crowns work.
Sounds familiar to me.
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I've had some abysmal dental treatment over the years, including a drill-and-fill monster in my teens who did all the damage, and another who ground down my natural teeth to try and make some ill-fitting crowns work.
Sounds familiar to me.
Many of us who grew up before the '80s had this. The next generation's teeth are MUCH better. They have had:
Fluoridated water
Fluoride toothpaste
Fissure sealing
Dentists who observed rather than drilled'n'filled
Dentists who didn't probe little cracks
Better dental filling materials
Fewer sweeties and sweet shops
Dentistry that was much less brutal and painful
My sister and her husband have numerous heavily filled teeth. Their four sons have very few fillings.
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Hi bikepacker and everyone else
I just recently got 2 dental implants placed. Works and looks perfect. Treatment and recovery takes a bit of time, but it is definitely worth it. Personally, I suggest a place in London. Good prices and great staff.
Here is a link - removed by spam detecting Mods
Hope this helps someone looking for good dental implant treatment.
Glad it all went well. I regard mine as £2200 very well spent. :thumbsup:
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About 8 months ago I had root canal work done on an upper molar, followed by a crown being fitted. Unfortunately I am still getting infections with small fistulas forming once a month or so.
The specialist who did the root canal looked at it again and advised that the tooth should come out.
I saw my usual dentist today who has said that I should live with it unless it gets painful. He asked whether I wanted an implant or denture if/when it does get pulled out as that would help determine when it should come out.
So:
Should the ongoing infections concern me?
Any advice on whether an implant or a denture would be better (leaving aside costs at the moment)?
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Not sure how much help this will be but, I've seen the dentist twice this week.
I had a crown fitted a few months ago and all was fine for a while. Over Christmas, it became very sensitive, first to temperature, then to pressure, then just to touch.
I got a 'turn up and wait' appointment on Monday and was given antibiotics for the infection which was causing the pain. They worked very quickly. I then saw my usual dentist on Friday. He said that there were three possibilities. One was that my bite was incorrect (which it was and he has now fixed). The other two both involved the nerve having died (so a similar situation to yours). He said that sometimes this causes no real problems and you can just live with it. Other times infections can recur and the only option then is to remove the tooth. We didn't get as far as discussing replacing it.
So it would appear that my dentist and yours agree that it there's no pain, don't worry too much.
But we must have a dentist on the forum somewhere.
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But we must have a dentist on the forum somewhere.
Is it safe? :demon:
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I am not a dentist but my understanding is that ongoing infection can increase the amount of bone loss.
This might make an eventual implant more difficult technically, as well as increase the chance of implant infection, unless there's a LONG gap between extraction and implant.
If you are unlikely to follow the implant route, I would hang on to the tooth for as long as it is tolerable.
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I had an infection in a crown on a lower molar, the gum at the side used to get a sort of spot, which I'd pop every couple of days and yellow grunge would come out. Sounds gross, I know. My dentist talked about dentures and implants and tried to talk me into the implant, but the quote was £2300, which I thought was crazy. He mentioned about bone loss etc. Not sure why, but I didn't fancy the denture.
Anyhow, this went on for five years (yes, five). It did get progressively worse (soreness and the tooth got more wobbly) so a couple of years ago, after a change of dentist, I had it pulled out. It came out really easily and almost immediately I felt generally better.
I haven't had anything put in to replace, can't really see the point.
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I (unfortunately) have extensive experience of failed root canal treatments. If fact every single root canal treatment I've ever had (7 in total) has eventually become infected and failed. This is over a 20-year period. I've had secondary root canal procedures at an NHS dental hospital - they also failed (which isn't surprising - they are known to have a poor success rate).
Either I've been exceptionally unlucky or the prognosis isn't good. As Helly said, the longer the infection remains the greater the chance of bone loss and the more complicated (and expensive) an implant becomes.
I've now had 8 implants and counting, including several bone grafts and 2 sinus lifts - and probably another 2 required. They are expensive and time-consuming but a good way of replacing missing teeth without using dentures.
I haven't had anything put in to replace, can't really see the point.
Depends whether:
a) You are concerned about your appearance (if the gap is visible)
b) It's affecting how you bite/chew your food
BTW, the root canal treatments were a result of failed crowns and bridges. Every single crown I've had has failed, requiring the root canal treatments. If I was starting out today I would go straight for an implant and cut out the subsequent crown/root canal stages, significantly cutting the net cost, not to mention time and suffering!
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For the record, I think I've had root canal treatment in 7 teeth.
None has failed, though I had one tooth extracted 2 years ago, after the second post crown fell out and the root had been split for several years; both dentist and I thought tooth had had its day.
I have crowns on 7 teeth, 6 of which have had root canal treatment.
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But we must have a dentist on the forum somewhere.
Own up, who's got a Pinarello?
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Not me
I've got four root canals and three crowns though, of which two of the root canals (both in crowned teeth) have failed. They lasted thirteen or fourteen years before failing.
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I've had a least 6 root canal treatments. The only crown I've had was a post and crown, following the Christchurch Incident where I basically cracked all the teeth on the lower right - they all failed over the following 8 or 9 months. The post and crown lasted 12 years and the dentist told me they generally last 10ish.
My feeling (& the advice from my dentist) would be to hold on to the tooth for as long as possible. I have 2 teeth which are basically stumps, the dead filled root is just a place holder to keep the bone & gum from deterioration and keep my options open.
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the root canals get filled and sealed after the treatment so they should not be infected, unless the infection is on gums? a dead tooth (i.e. without a nerve inside) becomes weak and brittle over time so the canal treatment is an interim option (for 10-15y) before the tooth needs to come out. i've had several teeth treated that way, and that was my experience. my learning* is that it's always best to look after the teeth and fix holes while they are small!
* i've only taken on board what parents and dentists were saying when i had to deal with consequences of not doing so..
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the root canals get filled and sealed after the treatment so they should not be infected, unless the infection is on gums?
Another reason would be that the root canal treatment wasn't 100% successful in removing every single last bit of infected tissue, so it stays there, locked in and slowly doing its damage. In the old days they used to put you on a course of strong anti-biotics post treatment in the hope of killing off and nasty debris but that was more in hope than expectation. Nowadays they (rightly) err towards doing the job properly with out the need for AB's.
As has been said, another common cause of failure is the posts cracking or splitting the root of the tooth. I've had several of both of these outcomes!
As I say, if you have a good few years ahead of you then maybe better to bite the bullet (!) and skip straight to an implant. That may be the eventual outcome anyway.
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I knew that the root of the twice post-crowned tooth I eventually lost in 2017 was split, for several years before things failed.
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Thanks for all the info, I am considering an implant, are they permanent or will they also fail over time?
The guy who did the root canal thinks there was probably already a crack in the tooth which just didn't show. He xrayed and also CT scanned the area and could see no cause for the infection, I was put on ABs once the infection reappeared and am still getting recurrent gum pimples.
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Thanks for all the info, I am considering an implant, are they permanent or will they also fail over time?
The guy who did the root canal thinks there was probably already a crack in the tooth which just didn't show. He xrayed and also CT scanned the area and could see no cause for the infection, I was put on ABs once the infection reappeared and am still getting recurrent gum pimples.
From your (all too familiar) symptoms, Claire, I'd say the tooth is on its way out. Pimples, pustules and abscesses are sure-fire signs that things are pretty bad down below. In my experience the tooth will have to come out sooner or later. It's also not good for your general health to have infection present anywhere in the body.
Regarding implants - they have a pretty good life expectancy if you look after them. My implant guy always tells me "they are not fit and forget!". I use interdental brushes and a waterpic on a regular basis alongside fairly meticulous general hygiene and brushing. So far so good - not a single issue with any of them going back around 10 years.
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I had a root canal 20 years ago. This year a little white bump showed up on the gum. Showed the dentist he said there was nothing he could do. However by making sure I flossed, brushed and hit the listerine, targeting the tooth specifically after every meal, it went away. I'm now resigned to doing this for the rest of my life. Implants seem to be very spendy.
What shocked me was that root canals only have a 75% chance of working, so I've been very lucky all this time.
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I'm very surprised by this statistic. All my root canals have been successful and I had around a quarter of a century's mileage from the canal treated tooth I eventually lost.
I know I needed very many visits to the Dental Hospital when I had some of these teeth treated when I was a student in the early '80s (which are still doing fine, touch wood!) and rather fewer for some of the teeth treated by private dentists later.
I'm of the view that meticulous attention to detail (unsurprisingly) pays off in terms of long-term success and that not all dentists are equally painstaking.
I am aware of commercial/budgetary considerations...
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I've had a total of 8 crowns most of which also had root canal treatments, the longest lasting of them must be nearly 30 years old now.
One failed when a new dentist decided the old crown needed replacing and she ended up cracking the root in the process, meaning that the subsequent crown kept coming off. Eventually had tooth extracted and replaced with an implant, only other option was a single denture plate. It was a front incisor so bit of a nuisance eating/biting with temporary denture during implant process but rock solid now with completed implant.
One other crown failed in a similar fashion to OP's after about 20 years, dentist sent me to specialist to assess for 'apical resection' and he said that clinically they should do it but pragmatically it would probably be ok to live with it as it was, so we left it. About a year later the tooth started to get a bit loose and had to be extracted by another new dentist, it was a second premolar so I just left it as a gap and its not an issue, could have had a bridge but that would have meant playing around with another existing crown and also crowning a tooth that was fine anyway.
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So option for root canaled canine on it's way out, is apparently Maryland bridge or dental implant. The difference between NHS & Private bridge here is ~£300 vs ~£800, with 'different metal mixes'. Implant £2-3K.
Anyone with knowledge / experience of these options?
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I had to have my two front teeth removed due to an infection. Not wanting dentures I went down the implant route. The two alternatives I was offered were: One implant and a bridge costing around £1500 or Two implants costing £2200. Most advice I got favoured the later so that what I did. The implants were done by Perfect Profiles in Wolverhampton https://www.perfectprofilesclinics.co.uk/. Very happy with the results and it was well worth the cost.
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Having had multiple root canal treatments, bridges & implants I would recommend just going for the implant.
Every root canal treatment I've had (8+) have all failed at some later point, be it a year or 5. The next step suggested by many dentists, certainly before implants became common, was for a bridge. The trouble with bridges is you are grinding down 2 otherwise healthy teeth to retain the bridge. As with crowns, this allows for infection to enter under the join, particularly with a bridge as there is more movement and forces at play, and decay can set in to the previously good teeth.
The result? More teeth lost! Out of 5 bridges I've had fitted, 4 have failed and required more extractions, and finally implants.
Honestly, I would just cut to the chase and get implants if you can afford it. It may well be cheaper in the long run (and certainly less nuisance) than going down the root canal / bridge / implant route.
Don't forget there is a time window in which to implant on an extraction site of 6 - 24 months. Any longer and you may require bone grafts to replace the bone lost post-extraction. Not a big deal - I've just had the bovine powder which seems to work fine but it's an added expense.
Don't ask me about sinus lifts - that was another circle of hell altogether ::-) ;D
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Thanks both, for the info. :) The grinding down good teeth was mentioned, as next-to incisor has no fillings & in excellent nick - 'minimal abrasive prep' was talked about, but I guess this raises the risk of attachment falling off (also limited numbers of reattachments 'parently). I guess I need to try and find out about how to 'shop around' for implants re. prices & expertise locally-ish. 2 implants for just over £2200 seems like a reasonable deal, given what was mentioned to me.
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2 implants for just over £2200 seems like a reasonable deal, given what was mentioned to me.
That seems bloody cheap! Either prices have come down or my dentist has a certain type of bike ;)
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That was all I paid and that included two post treatment inspections. If you take up their offer of a free initial consultation they will provide you with a detailed assessment and a fully costed plan of treatment. I forwarded mine to my dentist she could not find any fault with it. They still advertise a basic price of £750 per implant.
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Just for an alternative view.
I lost a front tooth due to an impact with a kerb in a bunch sprint in a race somewhere. It got put back on a post for a while, but was never very satisfactory.
I’ve had a false teeth plate ( other teeth have succumbed to crashes and wear over time) for over 30 years now. I’m entirely happy with it, and I’d never think of replacing it with an implant or anything. It’s no trouble, and I’ve got no awareness of it except that I have to remember to clean it when I brush my teeth.
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I have a front upper tooth on a post, which needed a bone graft. No major issues for the decade+ that I’ve had it, other than the cap coming unglued from the post in the middle of a 600 brevet early on. Luckily I didn’t lose or swallow the cap and kept it to refit.
The dentist wasn’t too pleased when I asked for the specification for the adhesive used to refit the cap, since it failed previously. He asked if I was a dentist. No but I am an engineer and understand adhesives.
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Scared of competition, innit?
It would not be a great technical challenge to DIY reglue IF you had the right glue and means of prepping the site.
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Ive got one gap from an extraction. An abscess damaged a good bit of bone so it would need a bone graft for an implant that has no guarantee of taking. So now its just a place to store a spare hazelnut.
All my other teeth have been filed down and veneered with porcelain. I had a good set when younger but unfortunately reflux (from dietary issues) damaged them badly to the point that by the time I reached my 50's they were falling apart.
Ive head the veneers for about 5 years and have had very little trouble since.
It was mind blowingly expensive though.
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It was mind blowingly expensive though.
Those Pinarellos ain't cheap ;)
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Isn't the dental glue of choice fuji iX?
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Was wondering about using a peroxide mix as a mouth wash, 3 parts fluoride to one part peroxide to treat gingivitis as I have bleeding when I brush my teeth.
What does the panel think?
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No. Just use Chlorhexidine.
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Not sure that chloro is easily available here, the mouth washes seem to be more of the whitening type with peroxide or fluoride.
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Will attach a photo showing a set of shelves of mouth washes, in an attached to a supermarket pharmacy, and only two with chloro.. and each was different strengths. There were four different moustache waxes!
There were many more peroxide whitening mouth washes.
If my teeth or tongue goes brown Im going to blame you BOAB.
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Chlorhexidine: It works, as long as you don't want to taste anything for the next 6 hours or so.
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Chlorhexidine: It works, as long as you don't want to taste anything for the next 6 hours or so.
Go argue with fboab, seems that teeth staining and brown tongue are a thing too. So maybe this is better at night and peroxide after the first brush of the day.
EDIT: That line comes accross as rude, am sorry i wasn't meant that way.
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Chlorhexidine: It works, as long as you don't want to taste anything for the next 6 hours or so.
Go argue with fboab, seems that teeth staining and brown tongue are a thing too. So maybe this is better at night and peroxide after the first brush of the day.
Chlorhexidine is what I've been told to use after my implant surgery. It does stain the teeth, but my were already stained from using it to control the infections I was getting in the tooth that was taken out and triggered the need for implant surgery. Fortunately there was enough good bone to anchor the implant
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I think staining would be fairly low on my list of concerns. If I've got an infection that merits chlorhexidine, I want it to work quickly, which it generally does.
The loss of taste is less of a problem if it already hurts to eat.
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Chlorhexidine is what I've been told to use after my implant surgery. It does stain the teeth, but my were already stained from using it to control the infections I was getting in the tooth that was taken out and triggered the need for implant surgery. Fortunately there was enough good bone to anchor the implant
Suspect that there might be a higher strength than over the counter job.
Have used the dentist stuff in the past and found that my tongue went brown.
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I think staining would be fairly low on my list of concerns. If I've got an infection that merits chlorhexidine, I want it to work quickly, which it generally does.
The loss of taste is less of a problem if it already hurts to eat.
Sorry for the rude comment.
Haven't got an infection, I think. Can't even trace the source of the blood after brushing. Doesn't hurt to eat.
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Are dentures a state of mind? Can they become acceptable after a while? As other much worse stuff?
According to 2 dentists (this 69 year old dog, slow to learn new tricks) had no realistic other options for 3 smack dab in the middle lower front ex teeth.
Lower jaw bone sufficiently rotted, meaning only possible alternative is bone reconstruction - always mentioned in a less than convincing fingers crossed, maybe? manner, not to mention with lots of sucking through their young dentists' lovely teeth. Hinted at costs would be impossible to meet any road up.
So, had an NHS 3 tooth jobbie done in June = £245. Gave it 3 months enduring endless adjustments almost weekly. Everything sort of fine apart from gobbing and sneezing and eating. The former two were scary like there could be a hair triggered weapon in me mouth, ready to launch without any safety catch. The latter, food instantly stuck under plate = uncomfortable and totally minging :sick:
After further discussions, went down a replacement private denture (BUPA) £1024 route - was told it would be better. It was fitted last week and whilst it is a lot less bulky, cosmetically very superior and more securely fitted, eating is still distressing and just as minging :sick:
Can I adapt?
Or have I just spaffed a load of dosh and dare not complain too much cos one does not want to lose any dentist in these current times?
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Are dentures a state of mind? Can they become acceptable after a while? As other much worse stuff?
According to 2 dentists (this 69 year old dog, slow to learn new tricks) had no realistic other options for 3 smack dab in the middle lower front ex teeth.
Lower jaw bone sufficiently rotted, meaning only possible alternative is bone reconstruction - always mentioned in a less than convincing fingers crossed, maybe? manner, not to mention with lots of sucking through their young dentists' lovely teeth. Hinted at costs would be impossible to meet any road up.
So, had an NHS 3 tooth jobbie done in June = £245. Gave it 3 months enduring endless adjustments almost weekly. Everything sort of fine apart from gobbing and sneezing and eating. The former two were scary like there could be a hair triggered weapon in me mouth, ready to launch without any safety catch. The latter, food instantly stuck under plate = uncomfortable and totally minging :sick:
After further discussions, went down a replacement private denture (BUPA) £1024 route - was told it would be better. It was fitted last week and whilst it is a lot less bulky, cosmetically very superior and more securely fitted, eating is still distressing and just as minging :sick:
Can I adapt?
Or have I just spaffed a load of dosh and dare not complain too much cos one does not want to lose any dentist in these current times?
I’ve had a plate with a front and a couple of other teeth for my upper teeth.
Originated after chewing a kerb in a race sprint.
I’ve been totally happy with it from day one, over 40 years I think.
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Are dentures a state of mind? Can they become acceptable after a while? As other much worse stuff?
I can only relate Mrs M's experiences with dentures. She was introduced to their delights about 4 years ago (when she was 62). She is not what I would class as adaptable or stoic.
Her denture thingy is more of a back teeth whatsit with a length of scaffolding anchoring it to adjacent teeth.
She was persuaded to go with the expensive non-nhs version due to the size and likelihood of greater acceptance.
She got used to it remarkably quickly, and is now very happy with the thing.
I still think it looks like a medieval torture device
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It's also not good for your general health to have infection present anywhere in the body.
Yep, periodontitis is linked to all manner of other problems.
I'm currently undergoing treatment for periodontitis (I'm taking the long road, not that I knew it. Long story) I was in danger of losing 17 teeth apparently though that number has come down. What the current prognosis is for me on implants (or whatever) is, I don't know. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. The costs for the treatment so far are high enough so I can't see me paying more for implants. My dentist only has a Cannondale.
I really don't like the thought of my jaw being drilled and bits screwed in. The thought makes me a feel a but icky tbh.
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An implant (front incisor) has worked for me. I hated my temporary denture.
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I really don't like the thought of my jaw being drilled and bits screwed in. The thought makes me a feel a but icky tbh.
D feels the same but is having preliminary implant work next week on ^7.
I wish I'd had the option 40 odd years ago when I lost my ^7. I have little bone and little on which to chew there.
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Osseointegrated implants - either for teeth or hearing aids - certainly sound like type 2 fun. But having grown up with my dad's denture[1] grumbles, and known barakta for some time now, I've become convinced that they're lower effort and generally less minging than the alternative.
[1] He lost incisors in a ballsports accident in his yoof, and proceeded to lose/break the dentures on an irregular basis throughout his adult life.
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I really don't like the thought of my jaw being drilled and bits screwed in. The thought makes me a feel a but icky tbh.
D feels the same but is having preliminary implant work next week on ^7.
D had initial surgery to place a post on Friday 16/12/22.
He refuses to take analgesics but seems to have slept well without but aches during the day.
He was given quite extensive paperwork to read and sign but had no aftercare leaflet. He's on antibiotics, which he takes as prescribed and regularly rinsing his mouth in salt.
Online postop advice seems somewhat contradictory.
The 'no dairy' thing is news to me and doesn't seem to feature on UK sites.
D is taking things fairly easy, doesn't smoke, vape, drink fizzies, drink alcohol or use straws anyway.
We're mostly eating soft stuffs anyway.
Advice about electric brushes is contradictory. D is using his but there's a dressing over the site and I'm sure he's gentle.
Is there anything SPECIFIC we should/should not be doing in the 2-7 days after surgery that yacfers who've had implants can suggest?
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Looking at my calendar, I seem to have lived life pretty much as usual post implant surgery. It was on a Monday and I had a full week of work including evening events on the Tuesday and Thursday, did a club run on the following Sunday, and a week later did a stupidly hilly 300km in atrocious weather. But from memory, the actual implant surgery was not as bad as the surgical extraction of tooth-1. I might just have got lucky. It was also done by a dentist who could afford dentists' bikes.
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Looking at my calendar, I seem to have lived life pretty much as usual post implant surgery. It was on a Monday and I had a full week of work including evening events on the Tuesday and Thursday, did a club run on the following Sunday, and a week later did a stupidly hilly 300km in atrocious weather. But from memory, the actual implant surgery was not as bad as the surgical extraction of tooth-1. I might just have got lucky. It was also done by a dentist who could afford dentists' bikes.
Similar to my experience - except I skimped on the salt mouthwash and ended up with a horrible infection.
My dentist sorted the sloughed off gum and reconstructed the mess within the original quote.
He too could afford the sort of carS he owned.
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Looking at my calendar, I seem to have lived life pretty much as usual post implant surgery. It was on a Monday and I had a full week of work including evening events on the Tuesday and Thursday, did a club run on the following Sunday, and a week later did a stupidly hilly 300km in atrocious weather. But from memory, the actual implant surgery was not as bad as the surgical extraction of tooth-1. I might just have got lucky. It was also done by a dentist who could afford dentists' bikes.
Similar to my experience - except I skimped on the salt mouthwash and ended up with a horrible infection.
My dentist sorted the sloughed off gum and reconstructed the mess within the original quote.
He too could afford the sort of carS he owned.
I didn't skimp on the mouthwash. The implant was installed at an angle as there was quite shadow on the gum at the root (pardon the pun) of the trouble with the old tooth and some narrowing of the underlying jaw - probaby as a result of repeat infections over the previous years. However, he packed the hole with shavings from the implant hole and according to the x-rays the jaw is almost back to normal now. Perhaps the hardest thing to get used to was chewing on that side again (once I had the crown fitted), after having avoided it for several months. I also had a degree of ache on the opposite (top) jaw once the crown had been fitted, partly for the same reason.