Start time for a 200

[Philip Whiteman]

The new flexibility is not too problematic in terms of minimum permitted speeds as the event is set at the higher band officially, so any full value riders leaving early will remain within lowest permitted band.   It is not a BRM event.

Does this mean all riders still have a recorded start time of 8am, regardless of what actual time they set off? Or are you recording each individual's actual start time?
[/quote]

I am chewing that over at the moment.  To be honest I don't think it really matters given I chose the higher speed limit.  In effect, if somebody leaves first thing and returns last thing, they would still be faster than the slowest permitted speed for events, if you get my meaning. 

[citoyen]

Yes, that makes sense. Thanks.

[Lightning Phil]

I happen to agree with this, though I aspire not to be a full-value rider myself.

That may come down to definitions and viewpoints. What’s considered full value on a 200, more than 12 hours elapsed or right on the time limit?

I don’t think anyone really aspires to be full value, but then no one aspires to be out of time. As we age our trajectory is towards the full value or out time. How steep the trajectory, down to genetics combined with how much your training slows the decline.

[citoyen]

I happen to agree with this, though I aspire not to be a full-value rider myself.

That may come down to definitions and viewpoints. What’s considered full value on a 200, more than 12 hours elapsed or right on the time limit?

I don’t think anyone really aspires to be full value, but then no one aspires to be out of time. As we age our trajectory is towards the full value or out time. How steep the trajectory, down to genetics combined with how much your training slows the decline.

In general, I take "full value" to be a facetious way of saying "in danger of finishing OTL", but I know of occasions when some riders have deliberately taken longer than they need to, with long breaks en route, and finished well past the 12hr mark.

In my early days of audaxing, I was very close to the cut-off on a few occasions. When I say I aspire not to be full value, that's pure litotes. What I mean is I'd like to be able to do a 200 inside 8 hours. I've never achieved that but was quite close a few times, when I was at peak fitness five or six years ago. But the point is, I've been at both ends of the field (I even won an audax once), and based on my own experiences, I agree with the notion that it's the slower riders who need most support, and so will bear that in mind when making plans for any event I run.

[quixoticgeek]

In general, I take "full value" to be a facetious way of saying "in danger of finishing OTL", but I know of occasions when some riders have deliberately taken longer than they need to, with long breaks en route, and finished well past the 12hr mark.

In my early days of audaxing, I was very close to the cut-off on a few occasions. When I say I aspire not to be full value, that's pure litotes. What I mean is I'd like to be able to do a 200 inside 8 hours. I've never achieved that but was quite close a few times, when I was at peak fitness five or six years ago. But the point is, I've been at both ends of the field (I even won an audax once), and based on my own experiences, I agree with the notion that it's the slower riders who need most support, and so will bear that in mind when making plans for any event I run.

I am the very definition of a full value rider. My first 200, I finished in 13:10. I have since finished one ride in 13:26 (that had 2500m of climbing and 34°C weather), I've also had a couple of 12:50, a 13:15, 13:05. etc... I've also had a 300 come in at 19:22.

I've only ever had one OTL, which was a 300, and that was because of puking after swallowing a fly, and doing 150km of the Ardennes on an empty stomach (I lost 1kg on that ride). I still finished in 21 hours.

I'm not lazing about with excessively long stops or anything like that. I am just slow. Some of these rides have had stonking headwinds as well.

hmm.  for me a 9pm start on a Friday means
-wangle trains so as to get to start for 9pm, possibly leaving work early  (but at least I'm fresh)
-finish towards 11pm (26 hours for a 400) the next evening with scant prospect of getting back home
which is why I prefer midday on a Saturday for a 400 (though the min value riders will disagree)
El supremo used to start one of his 300 so that public transport users could catch the last train down and finish plausible o'clock the same day.  a bit like the 23:59 ones

Ah yes, the UK where trains stop before 2300. Except for Groningen where the last train to Amsterdam is 2248, I can get home from about 2300 on a Saturday from most major cities in .NL. This perhaps influences my view.

If I was doing a 400 in the UK with a 2100 Friday start, I'd just book a hotel for the Saturday, but I appreciate that not everyone has that option.

I'm hoping that the travel restrictions are such that next year I can do a 300 or 400 BRM in the UK (currently eyeing Green and Yellow fields).

I'd consider Citoyen's events if they are BRM and the calendar works (hint hint :p )

J

J

[CrazyEnglishTriathlete]

I've started 200 perms at various times.  2.30am works as being able to get back in time for lunch for me, which I've done a couple of times, but that's the advantage of starting at home.   The hardboiled 300 starts at 2.00am so that riders reach the pub finish before it closes.  I've done that a couple of times, surprising the person on reception at the nearest Travelodge when I checked out at 1am.

Public transport doesn't help much in the UK because the train lines generally run into and out of London - so it's hard to get anywhere except on your line by 9am let alone 8am, so if I have to travel for a 200 I will usually stay over the night before unless its pretty close to home, in which case I'd probably ride to the start.

[citoyen]

I'd consider Citoyen's events if they are BRM and the calendar works (hint hint :p )

Ah yes, the BRM thing... that is TBC. I'll have to remind myself of the arguments for and against, but we don't need to rehash those here.

[slugbait]

Ah yes, the UK where trains stop before 2300. Except for Groningen where the last train to Amsterdam is 2248, I can get home from about 2300 on a Saturday from most major cities in .NL. This perhaps influences my view.

Actually, on Saturdays, the last train is at 2326. One of the reasons the BRM200 from Groningen starts at 9am on a Saturday is that riders from Amsterdam and Utrecht can do this audax in combination with public transport. Next year's 400 will probably start at 5pm on Saturday for similar reasons (and because the finishing times matches the opening hours of the cafe).

[Ivo]

Fnnngh, the one hour rule makes a lot of sense if there are issues with traffic or trains etc...

Thanks to the wonders of technology you can phone ahead and any decent organiser will either hang around for you or leave it under a rock or whatever.

In the past I've then told riders that they would receive their brevet card at the secret control. They just had to start and would see me there.

[John Stonebridge]

My 200km event with the relatively odd start time of 2359 took place this weekend just past. 

It was a one way event and seemed to work reasonably well.  The field appeared to be made up of folk who live close to either end of the route.  I was hoping that the proximity to railway stations at the start and finish might have tempted some folk from further afield but alas no.  I also rode the event myself (lanterne rouge +1, ahead only of the guy who had started from home at 6pm and was ECEing it into a 400 with c 100km before and after.)

I had planned to ride back home (about 5km from the start) as part of a 600 but I didnt reach the 200km mark until around 12 noon and I was by that stage very very tired.  Id have been at least another 12 hours for the next 200 so just caught the train home. 

I think Ive learned that 2359 is a good time for a 200 or a 300, but its not great for a 600 where building up a sufficient time buffer to enable sleep is required. 

[Paul H]

I have no issue with organisers starting when and where they wish, or catering for the majority of their riders.
For me - I'd do more if they started earlier or later. I've done a fair few that involve a train and a nights accommodation, but 8am starts often mean two nights accommodation which puts it out of my budget.

[davebrads]

I've entered the Velos' Indian summer secret which has a 6.00 start which suits me. It's far enough away from home to require an overnight stay even if it started at 8.00 and the early start means I should get home at a reasonable time. It's similar to when I did the Fred Whitton, although in that case I didn't start until 6.30, as far as I can remember you are allowed to start any time between 6.00 and 8.00.

[FifeingEejit]

I think Ive learned that 2359 is a good time for a 200 or a 300, but its not great for a 600 where building up a sufficient time buffer to enable sleep is required.

That start time encouraged me to attempt to ece to 400, with 65k before and 135 after being reasonably easy to find.

Of course as it turned out metal fatigue had other ideas and a DIY 300 based on the route and ece was hurriedly put together.
It seems 360km starting at 8pm, (with 1.5hrs at home sorting a spare bike out for stoker to use and DIY route) is reasonably comfortable time wise, getting home in time for tea although I decided to have it after a snooze around 6pm which resulted in my waking up hungry at 2am for the 3rd time in my relatively short audaxing career.

But I'm a creature of the night forced to awake early by the W word that's run by and for larks.

If I find I need a DIY 400 I think I know what time of day it will start.

Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk

[Lightning Phil]

I’ve started DIY 200’s at 8 or 9pm during the heatwaves.  You get a nice jacket free ride overnight, a 24hr services stop somewhere.  Then finish for breakfast.  A morning sleep ,   then you are good for the rest of the next day.

[ravenbait]

My 200km event with the relatively odd start time of 2359 took place this weekend just past. 

It was a one way event and seemed to work reasonably well.  The field appeared to be made up of folk who live close to either end of the route.  I was hoping that the proximity to railway stations at the start and finish might have tempted some folk from further afield but alas no.  I also rode the event myself (lanterne rouge +1, ahead only of the guy who had started from home at 6pm and was ECEing it into a 400 with c 100km before and after.)

I hope to join you next year. I am 20km from the end and love overnight rides.

Sam

[John Stonebridge]

My 200km event with the relatively odd start time of 2359 took place this weekend just past. 

It was a one way event and seemed to work reasonably well.  The field appeared to be made up of folk who live close to either end of the route.  I was hoping that the proximity to railway stations at the start and finish might have tempted some folk from further afield but alas no.  I also rode the event myself (lanterne rouge +1, ahead only of the guy who had started from home at 6pm and was ECEing it into a 400 with c 100km before and after.)

I hope to join you next year. I am 20km from the end and love overnight rides.

Sam

 

Provisionally Friday 3rd June 2022. 

[iroiromono]

....

Provisionally Friday 3rd June 2022.

Hopefully the tandem will be equipped with more robust wheels by then.