Yet Another Cycling Forum

Off Topic => The Pub => Arts and Entertainment => Topic started by: Hot Flatus on 22 September, 2021, 07:21:59 pm

Title: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 22 September, 2021, 07:21:59 pm
On Netflix.

OMFG.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Beardy on 23 September, 2021, 09:57:10 am
On Netflix.

OMFG.
is that a resounding endorsement for said programme so that I must watch it at my earliest convenience or a don’t watch this utter bilge scream of despair? Asking for a friend.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 23 September, 2021, 10:02:02 am
The trailer looks promising. If you like gore, despair and dystopian fiction.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 23 September, 2021, 11:00:28 am
On Netflix.

OMFG.
is that a resounding endorsement for said programme so that I must watch it at my earliest convenience or a don’t watch this utter bilge scream of despair? Asking for a friend.

It's excellent (if you like dystopian Korean stuff)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: rafletcher on 23 September, 2021, 12:12:11 pm
On Netflix.

OMFG.
is that a resounding endorsement for said programme so that I must watch it at my earliest convenience or a don’t watch this utter bilge scream of despair? Asking for a friend.

It's excellent (if you like dystopian Korean stuff)

And if you do, try "Save the Green Planet!", and of course the recent "Parasite".  Maybe not dystopian, definitely Korean.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 25 September, 2021, 06:12:37 pm
Obviously there's Oldboy too. The Korean 2003 one, not the 2013 Hollywood remake.

Anyway just binged the whole series of Squid Game.  Very, very good TV. Gripping storyline, beautiful sets and imagery.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 30 September, 2021, 01:38:41 pm
Just finished SG. Nicely resolved. Hope the producers don't get the sequel bug and drag it out into Casa-de-Papel-esque idiocy.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Regulator on 30 September, 2021, 01:53:19 pm
No spoilers please.  I have SG on my 'To Watch' list.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 30 September, 2021, 04:02:04 pm
Oops. Sorry pardon.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: andyoxon on 02 October, 2021, 10:28:22 am
Reports of Netflix being sued by Sth Korean ISP due to massive network traffic...

Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Beardy on 05 October, 2021, 08:08:48 am
I started watching this latish last night. I really shouldn’t have stayed up to watch three episodes. It was after 2am when I crawled into my bed!
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 05 October, 2021, 08:11:13 am
Yes, it's addictive isn't it. I had very weird dreams after watching it...
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 09 October, 2021, 01:05:13 pm
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: andyoxon on 14 October, 2021, 08:07:34 am
Some primary schools around here having to send notes to parents not to let their children watch SG. 
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: PaulF on 14 October, 2021, 09:06:14 am
This is on my list too. Seems differing reports as to whether to watch it dubbed or subtitled? Any opinions?

Of course what I eventually do will be dictated by my ability to use the technology…
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 14 October, 2021, 09:19:57 am
This is on my list too. Seems differing reports as to whether to watch it dubbed or subtitled? Any opinions?

Of course what I eventually do will be dictated by my ability to use the technology…

Subtitled, always.

The voices are part of the acting.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 14 October, 2021, 09:22:46 am
Some primary schools around here having to send notes to parents not to let their children watch SG.

That is because SG is becoming a cultural meme. Its popping up everywhere including in kids online video games like Roblox.

If I hadn't known about Squid Game my kids would have told me about it. They haven't watched it, and I've told them why they shouldn't watch it, but it keeps popping up in their lives and they realise it is something both fascinating and dangerous.  The premise of Squid Games is, of course, centred on children's games.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 14 October, 2021, 09:24:19 am
+1 for subtitled.
Yes, it's addictive isn't it. I had very weird dreams after watching it...

No funny dreams after SG, but we watched The Terminal the other night and that did it.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Mr Larrington on 14 October, 2021, 09:56:42 am
I'm not sure whether this belongs in here or “Today’s Motorised Moron”… (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-58896921)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Croft on 14 October, 2021, 07:51:37 pm
This is on my list too. Seems differing reports as to whether to watch it dubbed or subtitled? Any opinions?

Of course what I eventually do will be dictated by my ability to use the technology…

Here's an opinion and an interesting one on "translator as unreliable narrator":

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2021/oct/14/squid-game-netflix-translations-subtitle-problem
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 14 October, 2021, 08:57:16 pm
This is true of any translation. Idiomatic language, subtle local cultural references, and so on. All nigh on impossible to convey.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Croft on 14 October, 2021, 09:34:02 pm
What I found interesting (apart from It being directly relevant to PaulF’s query), was the possibility there might might be a systematic bias in translation inaccuracies, and that it might be very hard to detect when that is the case if you are not a native speaker.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Auntie Helen on 15 October, 2021, 05:52:02 am
We watched it with German dubbing and English subtitles one day and English dubbing and German subtitles the other day.

There were completely different sentences/ideas in the language on many occasions.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 15 October, 2021, 09:12:38 am
Best I've seen in that regard was an Italian film where figlio was consistently translated as wire.  And in that thing about Terra View vs Google they managed to translate Wahnsinn as awesome when the character really meant the literal meaning for the word, barking mad.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 26 October, 2021, 07:47:31 am
+1 for subtitled

I enjoyed it, but

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 26 October, 2021, 07:51:20 am
+1 for subtitled

I enjoyed it, but

(click to show/hide)

Realistic in that respect, though.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Croft on 26 October, 2021, 08:03:57 am
I didn't see them as arseholes, but, as you said, flawed, like all of us. It's just that circumstances amplify those flaws.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 26 October, 2021, 01:08:37 pm
I didn't see them as arseholes, but, as you said, flawed, like all of us. It's just that circumstances amplify those flaws.

(click to show/hide)

Quote
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Jakob on 27 October, 2021, 10:04:28 pm
Finished it yesterday. First 2 episodes were really good. Kinda fell apart with the introduction of the VIPs. Would have preferred a happier ending.
7/10.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 27 October, 2021, 10:15:18 pm
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSaH3sRlhqy4cnDu1dgyFZOvUrGALQjUcWwNg&usqp=CAU)
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 28 October, 2021, 02:54:03 pm
Went to the new Japanese food stall in the food arcade today. Turns out the proprietor is South Korean, not Japanese.

Yes, we discussed Squid Game. He hadn't watched it, but said he used to play Squid Game as a child 😄

Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Ham on 29 October, 2021, 11:03:57 am
I've acquired a Netflix sub almost by accident, so clicked on the Squid Game. It appears that I have the overdubbed version, which I find intensely annoying - how do I get a subtitled version? Anyone know? Do I have to find an 'ookey version?
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Jaded on 29 October, 2021, 11:08:46 am
I just changed the language in settings to Korean
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Ham on 29 October, 2021, 11:13:55 am
Ah yes.... Netfix noob error, thanks.

That's better.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Jaded on 29 October, 2021, 11:16:10 am
 :thumbsup:

It is definitely better in the original language.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Ham on 02 November, 2021, 12:52:44 pm
A few episodes in, and I am distinctly uncomfortable with this as entertainment. That is, both the proffer and acceptance of it as suitable for consumption and sensation. You could argue that it's just a grown up "Lord of the Flies", but the concept that you can postulate a world where armies of people are prepared to do their job to make evil happen, including feeding bodies into cremation ovens is deeply troubling. It's probably that which leaves me wondering whether I'll continue. After all, stories showing man's capability of descent into hell are nothing new, even if this does turn the volume up to 11.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 02 November, 2021, 01:07:56 pm
I think it is well made and the characters are believable.

It troubles me that many people seem to think that "this is great".
It seems to escape them that the principle characters have lost out in society, they all have gambling issues (gambling directly, gambling with other people's money) or have lost money and power by ripping off other people. They are dregs, tbh.   (Just to be clear, I don't put people in the category of 'dregs' because they are badly off, but because of their behaviour. One of the worst in the Squid Game is one of the wealthiest.)

Maybe there is something about the concept of ripping people off, being abusive and destructive, being rewarded that appeals to many.

As previously agreed on this thread
(click to show/hide)

What do I get out of it?  It is a good program in exactly the same sense that Lord of the Flies is a good book. All too believable extremes of human behaviour.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 02 November, 2021, 01:10:29 pm
A few episodes in, and I am distinctly uncomfortable with this as entertainment. That is, both the proffer and acceptance of it as suitable for consumption and sensation. You could argue that it's just a grown up "Lord of the Flies", but the concept that you can postulate a world where armies of people are prepared to do their job to make evil happen, including feeding bodies into cremation ovens is deeply troubling. It's probably that which leaves me wondering whether I'll continue. After all, stories showing man's capability of descent into hell are nothing new, even if this does turn the volume up to 11.

And yet cremation is a normal, daily occurrence in every town, and the most common way of disposing of bodies.

But...I know where you are coming from with this. I too wondered whether it was a direct reference to the Holocaust, but I'm not sure. I genuinely don't know if the Holocaust is a reference point in South Korea in the way that it is in the west. Experience of the far east suggests possibly not. Just as there is general ignorance of south Korean history here, I suspect there is ignorance of our history there. It may be that the Holocaust does not have the same resonance.

The coffins resemble presents. The metaphor is that death is a gift. The participants chose to be there, and it was purely in the first game that they were unaware that all but one would die. They elected to remain in the full knowledge of this, preferring the likely odds of a violent death over the life they had outside the game.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Ham on 02 November, 2021, 02:10:37 pm
I don't think I have a problem with the participants, after all there's the established (possibly flimsily) moral background that for them life is hell outside at least inside the game they can feel masters of their own destiny. The Evil Mastermind is no real problem, either. Where I struggle is with the enablement by the innumerable support cast, the desensitising implicit with that set up, with the cremation scenes joining the dots. That's the "special" kind of evil that happened in the holocaust, and so many other atrocities throughout history. Is it worse than hordes of stormtroopers zapping the good guys to death? It certainly feels so, and I suggest it was intended to. Yes, I agree with you that in Korea there may be different attitudes to death, the holocaust is unlikely to figure in the national consciousness, but I don't buy that it wasn't immediately obvious to the Producer and Director. According to that Wiki-thing

Quote
....he had initially written it in 2009, he was unable to find a production company to fund the idea until Netflix took an interest around 2019 as part of their drive to expand their foreign programming offerings.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Hot Flatus on 02 November, 2021, 02:49:37 pm
Certainly it will have been obvious to Netflix producers, I agree. I guess the point is that it may not have been burnt into the consciousness of the Korean writer in the way that is of us in the west. The Koreans have their own tragic history etched in their souls, as do the Cambodians, the Indonesians, the Rwandans and so on, as you suggest. Yes, it's a "special" kind of evil.

But you've made me reflect here, because probably for about 20 years I've been unable/unwilling to watch certain kinds of film, whereas prior to that I had no issue. I saw Schindler's List on release. I can't say I enjoyed it, but I found it moving, troubling of course. But I wouldn't watch it again. Nor any film of that sort that depicts things that actually happened. Even war films.

Fantasy violence? Sure, no problem, so that is probably why Squid Game is viewable for me. I didn't enjoy the killing and cremation, and I found the series profoundly disturbing, but in an a priori sense rather than empirically. That shit didn't happen. Somebody made it up, so I can cogitate on the metaphor without being troubled by realities.

I think the turning point for me probably was going to Cambodia in the 90s, and seeing the Killing Fields (actually, they were everywhere. There wasn't just one) and the S21 torture centre.  Both were ordinary and banal, but horror lay not so far underneath. The S21 was a re-purposed school. Looked like any other city school. The Killing Fields looked like a park or a memorial garden, up until the point I tripped on something, looked down, saw that it was a bone poking out of the soil, at which point I noticed all the little fragments of fabric embedded in the soil, visible in between the blades of grass. I was standing right on top of mass murder.

Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: Ham on 04 November, 2021, 03:08:20 pm
Well, I got over myself. It is after all a morality play. A rather odd and offbeat modern morality play, but just the same. Excellent acting and editing carrying the story, somewhat heavy handed event semaphore, possibly for their American audience? - but oddly entertaining none the less. My previous disquiet still stands, but as an artefact of our times it is just part of the story; having watched through the whole thing, the workers appear to be a crossover between Metropolis and Stormtroopers, the Metropolis reference strengthened by those Escher staircases.

There's an awful lot to unpack and far more subtlety than first appears. I'm not sure I would watch again in a hurry, and I'm going to watch Metropolis again, first (which happens anyway every few years) as I can't make up my mind whether there's more Metropolis buried there or not.

I don't agree with all of the Graun's article on the subtitling (https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2021/oct/14/squid-game-netflix-translations-subtitle-problem) as I think that many times the acting and directing conveys subtlety that the words miss. But, it has pointed me to Lupin which I am trying to watch in the original - the 0.75x playback speed helps a lot in that respect.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: rogerzilla on 03 December, 2021, 02:07:04 pm
I've started watching it and enjoyed the first two episodes   it's unintentionally funny in a Bond movie way, more so than The Hunger Games (which suffered rather from J. Law's plastic appearance and acting).  I sort of want to visit South Korea now.
Title: Re: The Squid Game
Post by: T42 on 13 January, 2023, 10:49:11 am
Finally persuaded MrsT to try it, and she's enjoying it.