Are Google Maps OK for DIY

[inc]

I am looking at doing a DIY for my first Audax ride ( nothing in the calender around here for another month) and since I don,t have Windows can't run Garmin or MS mapping applications which leaves Via Michelin but it doesn't seem to like the Welsh names and won't produce a route ( maybe me) . Google maps instantly plotted the same route and seems accurate enough compared to my OS mapping and various gps traces but I can't see it mentioned anywhere as being acceptable for DIY permanents. Anyone know the answer.

[Chris S]

Fine for route planning - see the "current" Arrivee for details. I use it, or Mapsource.

As for distance verification, probably not. Autoroute or Via Michelin are the quoted standards I think. I only use Via Michelin for distance checking, and have still been known to be under-distance when requesting a route check from an Organiser.

[DanialW]

I use Autoroute 2007 for DIY route verification. If you want to organise a DIY through me, it has to meet the distance using this software.

I'm always happy to check a route before you ride. 

[inc]

I finally got Via Michelin to work, it must have just been a temporarily glitch. It is part of one of your rides Danial , the Cambrian I was just going to ride from Presteine to Llandioes and back Michelin makes it 102km do I now need to get this verified by you with Autoroute as your website say Via Michelin is acceptable.

[JayP]

I choose my control points for DIY rides using viamichelin. (The actual route is another matter). Danial checks them using Autoroute and we are usually in close agreement with ViaM’ tending to give very slightly higher estimates.
The big problem I have, or used to have, is the instability of online mapping programs. They just keep on crashing. I mentioned this to my son, who has come a long way since we bought him that fabulous 32K Oric, and he said that the problem is not with the mapping software. It’s Internet Explorer that’s to blame. Apparently it runs too much ‘silverware’. He downloaded for me Googles own browser called Chrome. It really is much better. I would definitely recommend it if you want to route plan using on line software.

[innesh]

I choose my control points for DIY rides using viamichelin. (The actual route is another matter). Danial checks them using Autoroute and we are usually in close agreement with ViaM’ tending to give very slightly higher estimates.
The big problem I have, or used to have, is the instability of online mapping programs. They just keep on crashing. I mentioned this to my son, who has come a long way since we bought him that fabulous 32K Oric, and he said that the problem is not with the mapping software. It’s Internet Explorer that’s to blame. Apparently it runs too much ‘silverware’. He downloaded for me Googles own browser called Chrome. It really is much better. I would definitely recommend it if you want to route plan using on line software.

Thanks, that's a top tip if it works.  ViaMichelin is next to useless for me most of the time.

[inc]

I haven't used MS crapware for over six years, I don't understand why anyone who has a choice uses it, Via Michelin seems OK , no better than Google maps but that seems to be unacceptable for DIY Audax, not sure why, it's distances seem to correspond well to the OS mapping I use, my Garmin gps my cateye and my Polar, but rules is rules. and I accept that. Although there is no way I would ever use MS Autoroute let alone buy it or why Audax is tied to a proprietary mapping system.  Chrome is OK it is based on WebKit, the same open-source rendering engine used by Apple's Safari, but Firefox is still considered the best all round browser followed by Opera.

[JayP]

Heh inc. Prestiegn to Llanidloes you say. You’ll be going via Bwlch y Sarnau then. I am reliably informed that the locals pronounce this as ‘Bullsarny’ which may also describe your nutritional requirements for the ride. Enjoy

[frankly frankie]

Chrome is very fast with Google Maps, but hard to like in many other respects - hopeless UI.  I used it for a while as a dedicated Google Maps tool, but eventually uninstalled it.

I think AUK should at least include Google Maps as one of the standard options - its much easier to use than ViaMichelin.

[Ian H]

The only problem with Google Maps is that you have to manually set the shortest route between controls. A large monitor makes this easier. But you'd be amazed at the number of people who fail to understand the concept of shortest.

[D0m1n1c Burford]

What would happen in the event that a route is cheked using one application by the rider, then the organiser or validation secretary disputes the distance because they have used another application?  For example, say I create my route using Google Maps and gives a distance of 201km.  The validation secretary checks it with Autoroute and gets 199km.  Which distance is taken to be the correct one?

[Greenbank]

What would happen in the event that a route is cheked using one application by the rider, then the organiser or validation secretary disputes the distance because they have used another application?  For example, say I create my route using Google Maps and gives a distance of 201km.  The validation secretary checks it with Autoroute and gets 199km.  Which distance is taken to be the correct one?

Some DIY organisers don't use shortest route anyway. They use Quickest route in MS Autoroute with the speeds set to 8kph for motorways and limited access roads, and 31kph for major/minor/lanes. This gives longer routes than purely setting it to Shortest.

If the 199km route is a valid route (i.e. no motorways) then surely it has to be taken as the shortest by definition. In this case I'm sure you'd still be ok as there's generally a 3% allowance for DIY rides (it looks like it is 5% for Calendar rides according to Sheila's comments about LEL in the latest Arrivee). So you'd be fine down to 194km as the implication is that the actual road route will differ to the strictest shortest route and be longer.

I check my DIY rides with multiple tools to make sure I won't get tripped up. Plus I tend to make them about 10% over distance anyway.

Google maps on "walking" mode may make some interesting routes though, haven't tried it.

[Greenbank]

I just checked with Google Maps. My DIY 200 route up to Cambridge via Broxbourne comes out as 96.3km each way on walking mode. That's 192.6km return.

This route (well, those controls) has been validated as 200km, and ridden many times by me. The shortest I've ever managed it is 206km and this is a cycle computer that usually tallies well with calender event distances. Backed up by GPS.

[The Mechanic]

Maybe it goes places that bikes can't go in walking mode, such as one way streets, pedestriance areas etc.

[Greenbank]

Maybe it goes places that bikes can't go in walking mode, such as one way streets, pedestriance areas etc.

Nope. I checked over the whole route and it is fine.

I do two short cuts on my route that take off about 1km in Hoddesdon. First bit is cutting over from Essex Road (by the big roundabout) into Stortford Road. The second is going down Rye Road which is doable by bicycle but blocked off to cars by barriers by the water works.

However, this puts me on the more wiggly road up through the Hadhams, Pelhams, Meesden, Langley, Chrishall rather than the straighter B158/B1368 (which isn't the nicest road to cycle up).

Anyway, these ramblings were to point out several things:-

1) There's some leeway and common sense to be applied to routes.
2) Not all mapping tools are equal.
3) Rider honesty should come into it. If I planned a DIY 200 and only did 195km I'd hope I'd be honest enough not to submit the card for validation.

[DanialW]

If the 199km route is a valid route (i.e. no motorways) then surely it has to be taken as the shortest by definition. In this case I'm sure you'd still be ok as there's generally a 3% allowance for DIY rides (it looks like it is 5% for Calendar rides according to Sheila's comments about LEL in the latest Arrivee). So you'd be fine down to 194km as the implication is that the actual road route will differ to the strictest shortest route and be longer.

For clarity, I'd like to point out that I allow no tolerance for DIY events.

[DanialW]

I finally got Via Michelin to work, it must have just been a temporarily glitch. It is part of one of your rides Danial , the Cambrian I was just going to ride from Presteine to Llandioes and back Michelin makes it 102km do I now need to get this verified by you with Autoroute as your website say Via Michelin is acceptable.

Yes, you really need to verify your routes with me first.

I know this all makes me look like an awkward bugger, but I have to check about 30 cards and routes a week. I find Autoroute fast and simple to use. Google maps and viamichelin are, relatively speaking, a pfaff.